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  1. #1
    Date d'inscription
    août 2013
    Messages
    5

    Premium player nickle & diming on new characters

    Hi all,

    Returning founder here after a 2 year break from lotro (on & off). I have a higher level Warden on this 2nd account, which I've parked, and have now started a new LM, which was always my 1st love (I had a founder account way back in 07 which I passed onto a friend a couple years in after I took a break; he then passed that onto his Mrs & started a new one for himself; I started a new one with them on their server & got my Mrs onto the game with a 2nd account as well...long story, eh . They are now VIPs & have been for 3-4 years continually, and obviously only due to my generosity & introduction to the game (I gave up a 1/2 dozen mid-high levels chars on my original account/server just quietly, but that was my choice alone in not insisting on taking it back after my mate leveled a number of his own chars on the new server, eh).

    Anyway, as I'm leveling my LM I've now hit several nickle&dime issues, especially around traits & the currency cap. I had about 1300+ store points left over from my Path of the Fellowship purchase a few years ago & used that to buy the shared vault (no-brainer) & have since spent the rest on trait slots pretty much for this LM. I thought it was only virtues, but have now hit the same roadblock with race/class slots as well, which has annoyed me no end, being a premium player, so I just had to post this. Even more so, I hit the 5G currency cap & now I *continually* get the pop-up telling me I have overflow cash. Not amused....even after I sent some of it to the warden as she appears to be exempt from all the caps & annoying limits/pop-ups, that a premium player should not have to put up with across the entire account imo! I can only assume she (& 1 other lower level char presumably) are exempt because they were created while I was an active subscriber for the few months all those years ago. Just silly really...

    This entire system of nickle&diming is borked for a F2P premium player & is grating enough that I will most likely stop playing the game soon, as I approach the limit walls & 30th level with the LM (and God knows what other paywalls I'll hit fom here on in!). What do I (or rather Turbine) need to do to get around this in the simplest/easiest/cheapest way possible? I want to support the game but can't right now financially (for various reasons), and as a founder (albeit on another account) and a subscriber of many years, being treated like a complete froob on my alts is unacceptable, not to mention unaffordable right now. I simply won't be pressured into buying more store points for utility stuff I should have across the entire account, but I was gladly going to buy more quest packs when I got some money, especially as I need the higher zones/expansions that weren't included in the original base+Moria+POTF packs I got. So, over to you guys & Turbine - your choice how you treat founders & long time subscribers in this regard (and thanks in advance for all the 'don't let the door hit you' & 'don't be a scrooge' & 'suck it up' comments from all those with a mile high horse under them ;-p).

  2. #2
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2007
    Messages
    35 622
    All you have to do is sub for one month. Create all the character that you want to play. Log the characters into the game once to get the trait slots and all the other goodies that your Warden has.I do understand that you do not have the dollars at the moment to subscriber for a month.

    Turbine needs our dollars in order to pay the service operating expenses and the salaries of the Game Masters, Developers and other folks working on Lotro. You are running into the anti free loader aspect of the game. You want to play without paying. You going to have spend hours completing deeds to earn Turbine Points. Turbine is hoping that you will get frustrated with the no pay option:

    1) Give Turbine some dollars - preferred by Turbine
    2) Quit - that way Turbine is not having pay dollars to support a customer that is playing for free.
    Dernière modification par Yula_the_Mighty ; 31/08/2013 à 01h43.
    Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.

  3. #3
    Date d'inscription
    août 2013
    Messages
    5
    Citation Envoyé par Yula_the_Mighty Voir le message
    All you have to do is sub for one month. Create all the character that you want to play. Log the characters into the game once to get the trait slots and all the other goodies that your Warden has.I do understand that you do not have the dollars at the moment to subscriber for a month.

    Turbine needs our dollars in order to pay the service operating expenses and the salaries of the Game Masters, Developers and other folks working on Lotro. You are running into the anti free loader aspect of the game. You want to play without paying. You going to have spend hours completing deeds to earn Turbine Points. Turbine is hoping that you will get frustrated with the no pay option:

    1) Give Turbine some dollars - preferred by Turbine
    2) Quit - that way Turbine is not having pay dollars to support a customer that is playing for free.

    As I said, I've already forked out $100s to Turbine over the years & brought 2 or 3 other ppl into the game directly, so more like $1000s in contributions in real terms...that aside, I also said I intend to buy more expansions/quest packs at higher levels once I get there again with my LM & I have some disposable income.

    Sooo...no, I don't want to grind deeds in low level zones (can I even do so if the mobs are grey?) just to get around the ridiculous limitations on what is supposedly a *premium* account, NOT a totally freebie/froob player/account. Your suggestion to just sub for a month & unlock everything - that still won't unlock my current main LM char now will it, as I created that while I was off sub...? In any case, can you not see how silly the whole set up is, and how it stuffs around long term subs & loyal fans of the game? I certainly didn't expect to have some chars that were created later hit with silly limits in-game (in fact I don't think it used to work this way...?), just because I was off sub at the time. I still got 5 bags for all the newer chars, so why make me waste my hard-earned/paid-for points on this kind of drek? Clearly it makes (former & possibly future) paying customer very irate when they discover this kind of thing too late *sigh*.

    So, pay for a month & the current limited chars will be unlocked permanently...or only newly created chars while the sub is active? Or grind low-level deeds in other starter zones (do grey mobs give kill credits for those kind of deeds?) to waste my time on a ridiculously badly set up system designed only to annoy???
    LOTRO should have gone B2P instead of F2P, ala GW2 - you pay once (& I've paid a number times on a number of accounts now already!) & you play ALL core content forever (minus expansions obviously). Nickle & diming, as I said - nothing makes sensible mmo players leave more quickly!

    (I also think it's clearly disingenuous to premium players to not show the lock icons on traits until you get within one slot of them - again, designed to pull the wool over you eyes & hopefully squeeze some dollars out of you once you've already leveled a char well into the 20s...not nice at all .)

  4. #4
    Date d'inscription
    avril 2008
    Localisation
    The Highlands of Scotland
    Messages
    5 416
    Citation Envoyé par Borrob Voir le message
    Your suggestion to just sub for a month & unlock everything - that still won't unlock my current main LM char now will it, as I created that while I was off sub...?
    Yes it will. Any character that logs in while you are VIP will retain some of the benefits such as the gold cap removel, etc, when you drop back down to premium.

    Your choice is simple. Either pay a subscription, or accept that Turbine needs to have a way to generate some income from you, which you characterize as "nickel and diming". (I suppose that would make the subscription "dollaring").

    Or you can play completely F2P and not spend a penny more. It is flexible as you want it to be.

    You may have spent plenty in the past, but Turbine in turn spent that also in the past. They need to keep generating revenue in the present and the future to which you apparently do not want to contribute.

    Dropping from VIP to Premium allows you to retain benefits on your existing characters. Expecting to also have them on new ones is unreasonable, IMHO.

    The only way this happens is if you bought a lifetime sub, and I nsuspect that if Turbine known they would be going F2P one day, that option either would not have existed or would have been priced much, much higher.
    TANSTAAFL

  5. #5
    Date d'inscription
    août 2013
    Messages
    5
    Citation Envoyé par mjk47 Voir le message
    You may have spent plenty in the past, but Turbine in turn spent that also in the past. They need to keep generating revenue in the present and the future to which you apparently do not want to contribute.
    .
    For the 3rd time, I absolutely want to further support the game financially in the near future (when I can), once I get to higher levels post-Moria & need to purchase more content. But I take everything else you've said on board, though I still think the system in non-intuitive, unclear & most annoying to premium players who have a mixture of pre-subbed, subbed & post-subbed characters (clearly). The benefits/disadvantages should be more clearly spelt out up front & should be account wide across all characters equally, regardless of chronology, even if they are reduced to some degree. I'd rather that then this unclear mish-mash of bits & pieces available/not available per character, bleh.

    I leveled the LM into the 20s with all other apparent benefits (as per the original Warden), before I saw my 1st virtue padlock symbol; I thought/hoped it was only virtues, but then the class & race trait slots had padlocks appear as well, as I also now expect Legendary slots will do. If you can't understand why this is so annoying, I don't know how to explain it any other way. Now I wonder if the LM is worth investing more time on as I've already wasted 300-400 store points on her (which in hindsight I certainly should not have had to) & will have to waste as many more into the higher levels, just to get an 'unlock' I already have on 2 other characters on the same account. There has to be a better way, other than spending $15 for a month just to get a temporary unlocks/access, some of which may or may not persist after the sub expires (e.g. if I do half the quests in Angmar with a char say, do I then lose access to the rest of them after dropping back to premium...?). Again, I would reasonably expect to be treated better & more transparently than this as a long-time subscriber & contributor to LOTRO/Turbine, otherwise they should just drop the whole fake 'premium' account type & terminology altogether & just have F2P & VIP accounts, imo.

  6. #6
    Date d'inscription
    novembre 2012
    Messages
    197
    Citation Envoyé par Borrob Voir le message
    There has to be a better way, other than spending $15 for a month just to get a temporary unlocks/access, some of which may or may not persist after the sub expires (e.g. if I do half the quests in Angmar with a char say, do I then lose access to the rest of them after dropping back to premium...?).
    Yes, unless you have bought the Angmar quest pack, as soon as you drop subscription, the rest of the quests will be locked.

    As for losing things when dropping or on new characters after dropping, if they didn't do that everyone would sub 1 month then never have to sub again.

    As for how much you've paid, think of it like renting a house. We aren't buying things, we're just renting them.

    And if you want preferential treatment because of that founder account you had, maybe you should of kept it. Especially since it's against the terms of service to transfere ownership of accounts.

  7. #7
    Date d'inscription
    janvier 2011
    Messages
    4 293
    A couple comments here.

    1. You mention you gave away an account. This is against the rules... and can cause you trouble

    2. Turbines free to play / premium system though annoying at times is one of the best I have seen in any game. You can (with a little work) play the game completely free. Although I disagree with people doing this (as Turbine does need revenue) it can be done.

    3. Getting those trait slots is actually relatively easy by grinding the deeds in the low level zones. Yes you can get the deed completed (for slyer deeds) if the enemy is gray. in fact, whenever I am in a pinch for TP, I usually roll a newbie alt and grind out the Ered Luin deeds. This takes about 3 hours and grants ya a couple hundred TP.

    4. Subbing for a month is always the best route. I can if you like in PM reccomend a few internet survey sites that actually pay cash for each survey and you can earn 30 bucks within a few weeks to pay for a 3 month sub (hey its how I subbed for 18 months and no money came out of my pocket)

    5. It really isnt confusing on what you get and do not get when you drop to premium. Its actually simple. When you drop to premium.. all toons created while VIP will retain everything except quest packs and rest exp. All newly created toons are treated as free to play. Simple
    Welcome to Maitenance Mode
    Please Add Draigoch Scales to the Skrimish Camp or Rep Barter Vendors in Dunland We are 30 Levels Past that Content
    And when the Devs make fun of how buggy it is in Bingo that should tell you something
    Peace Love and Tacos

  8. #8
    Date d'inscription
    septembre 2009
    Messages
    12
    That is how I do it, pay one month every time new major content rolls out (about once a year). Last time was Rohan, next time will be Helm's Deep. By timing it that way all my toons get their level caps and craft guild caps lifted, and travel restrictions opened up. New toons created since the previous month of VIP get their full complement of traits and the gold cap disappears permanently. I save my TPs to spend when things get discounted in the store: content, toon slots, legendary slots and storage.

    Look at http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Account_Types for a discussion of the things you lose on the downgrade VIP to Premium so you can plan what to spend your precious TPs on. I was surprised at the amount of content unavailable to Premium players. I have almost enough TPs saved up to buy Helm's Deep from the store.

    I started doing this as soon as F2P came out, it saved my budget a lot. Times are tough and it is nice that LoTRO's F2P conditions are actually fairly generous compared to some other online games.

 

 

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