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  1. #1
    Date d'inscription
    juillet 2010
    Messages
    186

    Question Discussion on Erebor Raiding Captain Traits

    I recently reached level 85 on my captain. I've raided for quite a long time on a primarily healing runekeeper and semi-decent loremaster in the past, but I'm looking to be able to be a decent cappy for my kinship... Our cappies keep seem to leave for greener pastures. I've really enjoyed the class so far in 3-mans and 6-mans: But, let's face it, there isn't much challenge in those fights right now, unless you purposefully handicap yourself. Once I acquire some decent gear (not to mention virtues above r2 :/), I really need to work on my traits. Soloing and small grouping, I've found myself running 5r/2b or 4r/3b for obvious reasons. I'm fairly certain this won't cut it in BfE t2c, for example. I've asked other cappies and been thrown a wide variety of 'this is the best trait setup' with very few explanations as to why they made those choices. So.

    For those experienced with the relatively challenging raids: What traits to you find yourself running for the Erebor raids situationally and why?

    ((I realize there HAVE to be other threads similar to this... But my searches tend to come up with gear build comparisons or outdated, non-situational, info. If you have links to applicable threads, feel free to post them.))
    [b]Lythiea of Dwarrowdelf[/b], Member of [url=http://dd-asylum.info][b]Asylum[/b][/url] - R8 85 RK
    [b]Alts:[/b] Selenicereus, 85 guard, Castria, 85 cap, Fiordiligi, 82 LM, Minilyth, 75 mini, and Lythfiler, r6 filer.

  2. #2
    Date d'inscription
    septembre 2010
    Localisation
    Watertown, MA
    Messages
    2 910
    In Erebor, I tend to run 5B/2R most of the time. Neither BfE nor Smaug are really DPS races in the usual sense, so I find the extra healing to be more useful.

    When doing BfE with Inferno, I take Oathbreaker's Shame. I don't use it with Blood Brothers because of the risk of unbalancing the two trolls; it's probably handy for a T2C attempt if both Captains have it, though. It might also be good in Fires of Smaug, to make the most of the small windows of time when the Grim is actually vulnerable to damage.

    As for Virtues, I go with the standard Morale/Vitality + Tactical Mitigation setup I always use for raids. There's a lot of tactical damage flying around, especially with BfE Infero, so mitigating that is a no-brainer.
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

  3. #3
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Sweden
    Messages
    466
    In general I go 5b/2y.

    Always
    I always keep Relentless Optimism and Now for Wrath slotted (even when soloing). Relentless Optimism makes our heals go from good to awesome, and Now for Wrath let's you use Shield Brother without the need for a LM to share power.
    I keep Fellowship-brother traited whenever I'm in a 6-man or raid.

    BFE
    I'd say the most important thing here is Blood of the Numenor. Once Inferno hits you don't want to rez anyone with low morale, too big risk they will die straight away again.

    Smaug
    Doesn't really matter how you trait here really. You'll mostly be running up and down to valves as a captain, and SotD doesn't reduce the reflected damage from the firetenders. Defiance for a longer last stand and Strength from Within for a self-heal when running can be good traits to slot.

    Flight
    This depends a bit. You might be asked to offtank one or several mobs, so it can be worth slotting some threat traits, as long as they don't hamper your healing too much. OB is practically worthless in here since there is no real high-morale mobs, but SotD can really save the day. Make sure you have a emblem with the SotD cd reduction legacy with you!
    [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8C8nLy2okg[/url] Saruman 6-man
    [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj4h-CF9log[/url] Warden Survival
    [url]http://tftgb.wordpress.com/[/url]

  4. #4
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Messages
    1 813
    It takes a lot for me to switch from my basic 5b/2r mega-healing setup (4 Hyt Healer/2 Perseverance/high crit and might).
    Legendaries are F-Bro, Hands of Healing and IDOME. I may switch out IDOME in Flight T2 or BFE T2 for Shield of the Dunedain if the tanks requested it.
    I tried 5b/2y for a bit but it threw my rotation out of whack and healed less - not a good price to pay for an extra couple of seconds of Last Stand.

    Re furtim's sig above - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuBZWzsSi0c = Orthanc T1 full run 6-manned in 1hr 20mins with me and the LM doing the healing.
    105s: Aedfrith (HN), Aldnoth (CP), Brai (RK), Hrolfdan (MN), Aeldfryd (WD), Morriarty (CH), Aednoth (LM), Mishhar (BR), Hraldan (GR), Rummbold (BG). Tinies - Rumbelina (MN), Aenghus (CP)
    Rangers of Eriador (officer), ex-Snowbourn now Laurelin - A Noob for All Seasons

  5. #5
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Belgium / Russia
    Messages
    1 163
    My raid setup differs strongly from my solo/fellowship traits where I run almost exclusively 5r/2b or 5b/2r with a corresponding capstone.

    The choice of Captain traits really depends on the group you play with. In groups which I was joining lately extra healing from 5b traits + capstone was not needed. This dictates my choice of 4b/1r/2y or 3b/2r/2y traits for nearly any raid. If I am asked to tank/agro something, I go 3-5 yellow depending on the task. In most cases I prefer to have SoTD slotted rather than any capstone and my typical choice of legendaries for Erebor raids is FB/IDOME/SoTD. If healing suddenly becomes an issue I would switch to 5b/2y.

    Like Vr00mie above, I prefer to have 2y in most raids. It is nice to keep the mark up on every trash mob which has to be killed and without 2 yellow traits it is not possible. This counts for both BfE t2c and Flight t2c raids where mobs have to die fast. For Smaug it really does not matter what you trait.
    Ishtarien - Captain
    Ishtarel - Hunter / Lunasa - Minstrel
    Ishtaridas - LRM 105 / Ishtari - RNK 105 / Ishti - BRG 105 / Cabernetta - GRD 105 / Medovinus - BRN 105
    The Mellowship || Eldar -> Evernight

  6. #6
    Date d'inscription
    janvier 2008
    Messages
    608
    I know i'll probably be different, as I keep my trait setup from how it was in RoI. For my cappy, no matter what raid it is, generally I will keep 4r/3b. The capstones to me aren't that important in the Erebor raids. To me captain "dps" is still useful, regardless if its lower than others or not. Our healing even without the capstone is still quite impressive I've found. I just make sure to keep Relentless Optimism, Now for Wrath, and whichever one gives Words of Courage more healing. Then I just use red traits to up my damage. Even though I know these aren't dps races, its just my preferred style. I prefer to be a jack of all trades rather than just a healer or a buffer. Is it the best way to go? Who knows, but that's just what works for me.

    If less familiar with your playstyle/keep things on the safe side, then in Erebor I would go for more blue traits.

    Eodread, Earendel, Isilmacil - Horizon
    Thattickles, Thangorodread - Table Smashers


  7. #7
    Date d'inscription
    octobre 2010
    Localisation
    Hamilton, NY
    Messages
    3 699
    Citation Envoyé par Isilmacil Voir le message
    I know i'll probably be different, as I keep my trait setup from how it was in RoI. For my cappy, no matter what raid it is, generally I will keep 4r/3b. The capstones to me aren't that important in the Erebor raids. To me captain "dps" is still useful, regardless if its lower than others or not. Our healing even without the capstone is still quite impressive I've found. I just make sure to keep Relentless Optimism, Now for Wrath, and whichever one gives Words of Courage more healing. Then I just use red traits to up my damage. Even though I know these aren't dps races, its just my preferred style. I prefer to be a jack of all trades rather than just a healer or a buffer. Is it the best way to go? Who knows, but that's just what works for me.

    If less familiar with your playstyle/keep things on the safe side, then in Erebor I would go for more blue traits.
    Fear No Darkness. That's usually my go-to third blue as well, though I don't trait non-capstone builds much nowadays.

    (Side note, your signature image is way too big. It needs to be no larger than 350x125.)
    [CENTER][IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v341/tindragon/Base.png[/IMG]
    Steam: Sneakeh Snake[/CENTER]

  8. #8
    Date d'inscription
    avril 2008
    Messages
    3 203
    Citation Envoyé par Isilmacil Voir le message
    I know i'll probably be different, as I keep my trait setup from how it was in RoI. For my cappy, no matter what raid it is, generally I will keep 4r/3b. The capstones to me aren't that important in the Erebor raids. To me captain "dps" is still useful, regardless if its lower than others or not. Our healing even without the capstone is still quite impressive I've found. I just make sure to keep Relentless Optimism, Now for Wrath, and whichever one gives Words of Courage more healing. Then I just use red traits to up my damage. Even though I know these aren't dps races, its just my preferred style. I prefer to be a jack of all trades rather than just a healer or a buffer. Is it the best way to go? Who knows, but that's just what works for me.

    If less familiar with your playstyle/keep things on the safe side, then in Erebor I would go for more blue traits.
    IMHO the most powerful raid setup for capts these days has HOH captstone, 4 pieces of Hyboldt Healer, and 2 Perserverence. The Valiant Strike healing is really nice, and the VS reset from hyboldt healer (you often have 7 targets with a LM pet out) is, well, pretty awesome. The strong AOE heal of HOH+VS helps out the main healers when inferno is going, so it is particularly helpful in Erebor (not so useful in FOS, though nice for killing tenders, awesome in Road).

    Exactly how much is your extra DPS 4/3 anyway? You get the 5% crit from the 4 bonus, which is the real gem of the red line, but you don't get the ungated Shadow's Lament from the red captstone. You add maybe a few hundred DPS in a raid where hunters are dumping in 3K each? Dunno. Each to their own though.

  9. #9
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Messages
    1 864
    Citation Envoyé par DelgonTheWise Voir le message
    IMHO the most powerful raid setup for capts these days has HOH captstone, 4 pieces of Hyboldt Healer, and 2 Perserverence. The Valiant Strike healing is really nice, and the VS reset from hyboldt healer (you often have 7 targets with a LM pet out) is, well, pretty awesome. The strong AOE heal of HOH+VS helps out the main healers when inferno is going, so it is particularly helpful in Erebor (not so useful in FOS, though nice for killing tenders, awesome in Road).

    Exactly how much is your extra DPS 4/3 anyway? You get the 5% crit from the 4 bonus, which is the real gem of the red line, but you don't get the ungated Shadow's Lament from the red captstone. You add maybe a few hundred DPS in a raid where hunters are dumping in 3K each? Dunno. Each to their own though.
    Indeed, I wouldn't bother with 4r/3b simply because of the loss of Shadows Lament, the extra DB/PA's from SL makes a lot of difference IMO.
    Same goes for 5b vs 4b, the extra healing + -30s cooldown on VS is really helpful.

  10. #10
    Date d'inscription
    octobre 2010
    Localisation
    Hamilton, NY
    Messages
    3 699
    I could see a good argument for a 4r/3b setup if you don't have Perseverance, which I do not on one of my cappies. Since you can only use RC every 15 seconds, the extra defeat responses from ungated SL chain doesn't really help generate any extra heals, whereas the third blue will generate a decent amount of extra heals on our only targeted heal. Probably not a great way to go for BfE, but I could see it coming in handy for Smaug or Flight. Doubt I'd give up the HoH capstone for this setup if we really needed the heals, but I could see shedding the LtC capstone.
    [CENTER][IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v341/tindragon/Base.png[/IMG]
    Steam: Sneakeh Snake[/CENTER]

  11. #11
    Date d'inscription
    avril 2008
    Messages
    3 203
    Citation Envoyé par TinDragon Voir le message
    Probably not a great way to go for BfE, but I could see it coming in handy for Smaug or Flight. Doubt I'd give up the HoH capstone for this setup if we really needed the heals, but I could see shedding the LtC capstone.
    For Smaug it doesn't really matter all that much how you trait if Captains are runners in any case -- you won't be able to get VS off too often except against the tenders. For Flight, you are better of with 4 hyboldt, 2 helegrod (since you specify no perseverence), +HOH. There are so many defeat events in Flight and lots of damage taken, the constant VS and RC seems to me to be much more helpful than a marginal DPS bump...

  12. #12
    Date d'inscription
    janvier 2008
    Messages
    608
    All valid points about the potency of captain heals.

    Personally, I don't like relying so much on either Helegrod or Perseverance (which I do have the pvp pieces), as to me, thats not the only skill (besides VS) that a raid should rely on. Like I mentioned, its just the style that I'm use to with 4r/3b. It might just be stubbornness, but I haven't been in a group of late that has needed me to trait full HoH and use that gear. Probably have to thank the raids I've been in for that, haha.

    Regardless, I will agree that with the above mentioned setups, is very reliable to help everyone out.

    Eodread, Earendel, Isilmacil - Horizon
    Thattickles, Thangorodread - Table Smashers


  13. #13
    Date d'inscription
    avril 2008
    Messages
    3 203
    Citation Envoyé par Isilmacil Voir le message
    Personally, I don't like relying so much on either Helegrod or Perseverance (which I do have the pvp pieces), as to me, thats not the only skill (besides VS) that a raid should rely on.
    That is a reasonable enough point of view in most content. In content where defeat events are going to be guaranteed to be < 15 seconds apart repeatedly, such as Road to Erebor, it seems to me like perseverance/helegrod sets are really really desirable.

 

 

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