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Discussion: Can anyone explain?

  1. #1
    Date d'inscription
    novembre 2008
    Messages
    94

    Can anyone explain?

    Can anyone tell me why in this update 11.2 that the Burg's skill Addle (Improved Addle) was getting a 5sec increase in CD.
    What was it doing before to make such a change that caused so much pain, anger or annoyance?
    I don't understand that change?!?
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/072060000001a3e91/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    I GOT MILK.

  2. #2
    Date d'inscription
    septembre 2011
    Localisation
    Meldos shed
    Messages
    260
    Not the first time it has been changed to 20s (and then changed back to 15s).
    First time it was because of PVMP.

    edit: one old thread of that same nerf http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...ombat-incoming
    Dernière modification par arghh ; 24/07/2013 à 09h47.
    argio r11 burglar | trytofarmme r10 reaver | trytoloveme r10 spider | ikissedafreep r10 blackarrow | roargh r9 warleader | trytocatchme r9 warg |

  3. #3
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    South Africa
    Messages
    236
    A couple of updates ago Turbine decided to lower some creep interrupt cds and raise some freep interrupt cds to bring them in line at around 10s each. Freepside that was clobber and addle with max legacy. So at this point addle was broken and the unlegacied skill given a 20s cooldown.

    In an update inbetween the skill was fixed and the cd returned to 15 seconds.

    Turbine have decided to break it again this update.

    Hope that clears it up though I'm fairly sure it won't.
    [CENTER]Weezl R8 Champ, Pherret R11 Rvr, Lagard Fullretaard R8 Burg "retired" ;), Wellharder R7ish DPS WL
    TBP, reluctant leader of Northern Warriors
    [IMG]http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/s377/nmdturner/Forum%20sig_zpsp8qf4oix.jpg[/IMG]

    [/CENTER]

  4. #4
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2010
    Localisation
    Wales, UK
    Messages
    1 871
    Back in Update... 9 I believe, all the classes were changed so that no single class could have an interrupt with a cooldown of lower than ten seconds. This was done to encourage more 'tactical' use of them instead of spamming to cut animations which is what most players seemed to use them for.

    Evidently the cooldown was accidentally lowered again at some point since then, and it has now been put back up. This is simply a balancing fix really.

  5. #5
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Messages
    394
    Citation Envoyé par Nyrion Voir le message
    Back in Update... 9 I believe, all the classes were changed so that no single class could have an interrupt with a cooldown of lower than ten seconds.
    Incorrect.

    Guardians with 4 Blue traits, the Stamp trait and Maxed Legacy could get 5 second Interupt CD.

    On another note. This sucks that they nerfed addle again. Turbine please stop messing about so much with the players. This might be a simple skill change to you but for High DPS/animation Burglars this is a rework of skill bars and rotations.

    CHange something, stick to it. Stop playing cat and mouse
    [IMG]http://lux-hdro.de/generator.php/Laolos/2/9/3/7/85/Wiping+As+Intended/0/2/1/11/10/1/6/8/8/8/8/8/8.png[/IMG]

  6. #6
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Hoarhallow
    Messages
    999
    10sec cooldown legacied is intended since interupt changes in u9. They changed Addle's cooldown back to 5(15)seconds accidently with the last update and now fixed it.

    Guardians with 4 Blue traits, the Stamp trait and Maxed Legacy could get 5 second Interupt CD.
    This was fixed some time ago. It should also have a cooldown of 10 seconds now. (Don't know if they also accidently changed it back though )
    Dobb - Hobbit Burglar
    Thar - Dwarf Guardian
    ...
    [DE-RP]Belegaer
    R.I.P [DE]Anduin
    Visit my YouTube-Channel!

  7. #7
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2010
    Localisation
    Wales, UK
    Messages
    1 871
    Citation Envoyé par Lao10 Voir le message
    Incorrect.

    Guardians with 4 Blue traits, the Stamp trait and Maxed Legacy could get 5 second Interupt CD.

    On another note. This sucks that they nerfed addle again. Turbine please stop messing about so much with the players. This might be a simple skill change to you but for High DPS/animation Burglars this is a rework of skill bars and rotations.

    CHange something, stick to it. Stop playing cat and mouse
    Afraid not, the Stamp trait was changed so it reduces the cooldown by 10 rather than 15 seconds. Fully lowered, that puts it at 10s.

  8. #8
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    South Africa
    Messages
    236
    Sorry but why are we slagging one another off about getting a few details wrong regarding the skills of arbitrary classes when we should be slagging off Turbine for screwing us again
    [CENTER]Weezl R8 Champ, Pherret R11 Rvr, Lagard Fullretaard R8 Burg "retired" ;), Wellharder R7ish DPS WL
    TBP, reluctant leader of Northern Warriors
    [IMG]http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/s377/nmdturner/Forum%20sig_zpsp8qf4oix.jpg[/IMG]

    [/CENTER]

  9. #9
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    UK
    Messages
    485
    Citation Envoyé par Weezl Voir le message
    Sorry but why are we slagging one another off about getting a few details wrong regarding the skills of arbitrary classes when we should be slagging off Turbine for screwing us again
    Totally agree , yet another nerf to a class that Turbine have made practically redundant . Creep whining in the moors no doubt but seriously what was the new Burg developer doing when this came in ?

  10. #10
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2008
    Localisation
    Mukilteo, Washington
    Messages
    209
    Interrupts:

    Addle
    Riddle
    Exploit Opening
    Marbles
    Trip
    Exposed Throat (when it drops a FM)

    I know this isn't what people want to hear, but there are other options to interrupt that guy that wants to kill you. I know Gorothul and the first boss in the Sword Halls didn't appreciate my Exploit Opening interrupt.

  11. #11
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Cornwall, UK
    Messages
    1 383
    Citation Envoyé par Jeffythequick Voir le message
    Interrupts:

    Addle
    Riddle
    Exploit Opening
    Marbles
    Trip
    Exposed Throat (when it drops a FM)

    I know this isn't what people want to hear, but there are other options to interrupt that guy that wants to kill you. I know Gorothul and the first boss in the Sword Halls didn't appreciate my Exploit Opening interrupt.
    True, but it works both ways. Everytime Turbine messes about with the game, changing things arbitrarily or for some reason nobody (or a very small minority) cares about but them, they are just kicking themselves in the Goodwill. If they have to do these things, they need to explain why or accept the fact that they have just made players hate them some more. OK, so there are alternatives, but that doesn't help when a Burglar is cursing them for messing with an important part of their skill rotation and how they play the game!

  12. #12
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2008
    Localisation
    Mukilteo, Washington
    Messages
    209
    Oh, I agree. I remember when Burgs were uber, and now they're kind of an "also ran" class.

    I was hoping to share the fun with induction interruptions, and hopefully offering an alternative to confound the fools in the moors.

    (ok, I'll stop now...)

  13. #13
    Date d'inscription
    mars 2010
    Messages
    29

    This doesn't bring tings in line at all.

    Even with the +50% addled induction length legacy, 10 secs is still way too long of a cooldown to prevent a creep from getting off the induction, I have tried this with both 10 and 5 second cooldown, maybe 5 secs makes it impossible for them to get off an induction, but 10 secs makes addle far far less useful to a point of making it impossible for a burg to go up against a healer, even if you are hitting it as soon as they start induction.

    Also, wasn't an induction skill that was stopped supposed to get a 4 second delay to create balance to the 10 second cooldown when this was first changed? What happened to that delay? I see creeps do the induction skill right after I use addle, not delay, they go right back into it, and there is no way I can try to addle again that induction even with me legacy making it a longer induction. The amount that can be healed by 1 induction skill could mean the creep is back to max. If it was 7 seconds, maybe 8 seconds maxed out, It would be much more balanced. Hey Sapience, tell everyone, thanks for the pointless nerf. Really doesn't make any sense why in pve this would matter, it is just to nerf burgs in pvp.

  14. #14
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2009
    Messages
    1 275
    Citation Envoyé par BerenCamlost Voir le message
    Even with the +50% addled induction length legacy, 10 secs is still way too long of a cooldown to prevent a creep from getting off the induction, I have tried this with both 10 and 5 second cooldown, maybe 5 secs makes it impossible for them to get off an induction, but 10 secs makes addle far far less useful to a point of making it impossible for a burg to go up against a healer, even if you are hitting it as soon as they start induction.

    Also, wasn't an induction skill that was stopped supposed to get a 4 second delay to create balance to the 10 second cooldown when this was first changed? What happened to that delay? I see creeps do the induction skill right after I use addle, not delay, they go right back into it, and there is no way I can try to addle again that induction even with me legacy making it a longer induction. The amount that can be healed by 1 induction skill could mean the creep is back to max. If it was 7 seconds, maybe 8 seconds maxed out, It would be much more balanced. Hey Sapience, tell everyone, thanks for the pointless nerf. Really doesn't make any sense why in pve this would matter, it is just to nerf burgs in pvp.
    Perhaps the creep is doing a different induction? I know I've seen my inductions interrupted and go on the 4s CD.

    When they last did a moderate combat revision in Update 9 regarding interrupts all of them were to be at 10s minimum time (Guardians were fixed later). They even DID change Addle from 15s CD to 20s. http://www.lotro.com/en/game/article...mbat-revisions

    At some point it was unintentionally reduced (last Update?). Update 11.2 simply returns it to the intended and former 20s CD.

  15. #15
    Date d'inscription
    novembre 2008
    Messages
    94
    I think my point was missed by some.

    I am wondering what was the point of the change? One skill, changing... and not for the better.
    (Nerfs should be a last resort, perhaps turbine you should change the skill by taking something, but also giving something in return back to that skill.)

    Some have mentioned it has changed before "swings and round -abouts".
    It's logic eludes me.

    In a pve world what was the point in a 5s gimping? Help the burg, I mean they are becoming an unloved class.
    (I have to work alot harder on my burg than any other class I play to make a difference in groups). Though still not my point.
    If the issue is in pvp, would the problem be better resolved by creating changes in skills upon entering the moors? much like when skills change when mounting war-horses.

    Anyway, why bother changing a skills' cd by 5s?
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/072060000001a3e91/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    I GOT MILK.

  16. #16
    Date d'inscription
    juillet 2011
    Messages
    13
    Citation Envoyé par HomingEagle Voir le message
    I think my point was missed by some.

    I am wondering what was the point of the change? (some other text.)

    Cutting through all the other stuff, heres the basic point for the change. what does addle doing its core essence? its an interrupt skill.
    The reason turbine did the changes to interrupt skills was 1) make interrupts more even-footed in moors. and
    2) make it so that no 1 class is able to keep some boss in pve land perma-interrupted, and hence requires coordination regarding interrupts. Think SG last boss. (SG is sammath gul btw.)

    Its not some dev with an agenda to screw with burgs who btw are still in a great spot st-dps wise.

  17. #17
    Date d'inscription
    mars 2010
    Messages
    29
    Citation Envoyé par FundinStrongarm Voir le message
    Perhaps the creep is doing a different induction? I know I've seen my inductions interrupted and go on the 4s CD.

    When they last did a moderate combat revision in Update 9 regarding interrupts all of them were to be at 10s minimum time (Guardians were fixed later). They even DID change Addle from 15s CD to 20s. http://www.lotro.com/en/game/article...mbat-revisions

    At some point it was unintentionally reduced (last Update?). Update 11.2 simply returns it to the intended and former 20s CD.
    How many induction heals do defilers and warleaders get? And it is not even enough, a 7 or 8 second cooldown would make it where I have to have near perfect timing to keep them from getting it off, which considering the difficulty in getting that addle off in that near perfect timing, it seems pretty even to me. 10 seconds is way to long. So in theory, lets say, I hit addle, prevent the big heal induction, they heal a little with the next induction, I try to stop it, I miss getting it off in time, now they can induction the big heal and I have no chance at all of preventing it, meaning a potential heal from 8k to 25k for some creeps. Sorry, that is a problem and it is immensely unbalancing. My burg has, and should be able to solo warleaders, with an addle on a 10second cooldown, that is not very likely anymore.

  18. #18
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Hoarhallow
    Messages
    999
    Citation Envoyé par BerenCamlost Voir le message
    How many induction heals do defilers and warleaders get? And it is not even enough, a 7 or 8 second cooldown would make it where I have to have near perfect timing to keep them from getting it off, which considering the difficulty in getting that addle off in that near perfect timing, it seems pretty even to me. 10 seconds is way to long. So in theory, lets say, I hit addle, prevent the big heal induction, they heal a little with the next induction, I try to stop it, I miss getting it off in time, now they can induction the big heal and I have no chance at all of preventing it, meaning a potential heal from 8k to 25k for some creeps. Sorry, that is a problem and it is immensely unbalancing. My burg has, and should be able to solo warleaders, with an addle on a 10second cooldown, that is not very likely anymore.
    You want to faceroll every Defiler/WL without it getting off an induction?

    10 seconds cooldown feels perfectly fine for me. And it's not like Addle is a burg's only way to interrupt an induction.
    Dobb - Hobbit Burglar
    Thar - Dwarf Guardian
    ...
    [DE-RP]Belegaer
    R.I.P [DE]Anduin
    Visit my YouTube-Channel!

 

 

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