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Discussion: Defiler vs Warleader

  1. #26
    Date d'inscription
    août 2007
    Messages
    3 595
    Citation Envoyé par Squelcher Voir le message
    When it comes to survivability, defiler can be better because they have excellent heal on the move capabilities compared to WLs.
    I've gotta agree with this part. Whether they're solo or grouped I can absolutely melt a WL who isn't getting outside heals when I'm on my warden, their one stun really doesn't slow me down all that much. With a defiler, between the stun, fear, HoTs and the ability to do some healing on the move, its a significantly longer process to bring a good one down.

  2. #27
    Date d'inscription
    mars 2008
    Messages
    576
    Citation Envoyé par spelunker Voir le message
    I've gotta agree with this part. Whether they're solo or grouped I can absolutely melt a WL who isn't getting outside heals when I'm on my warden, their one stun really doesn't slow me down all that much. With a defiler, between the stun, fear, HoTs and the ability to do some healing on the move, its a significantly longer process to bring a good one down.
    Hm, I guess the potential is there to last longer, but the defiler stun hits for maybe 15% of the time. Fear hits maybe 50% of the time, and if it does, it's potted. Defiler has two HoTs on the move. That basically leaves kiting using LOS to buy time, get a couple inductions off. And to what endgame? Not to win but just to extend the fight? I've been there, done that, at this point I'd rather just take my melting.

    To the original question, creepside is built on teamwork, so it's hard to say WL or defiler is better. WL is great for emergencies (bubble/rez), defiler HoTs are the backbone of a group's healing (efflo/hots), but really either one only shines when it has the other supporting it.

  3. #28
    Date d'inscription
    août 2007
    Messages
    3 595
    Citation Envoyé par Sniz Voir le message
    Hm, I guess the potential is there to last longer, but the defiler stun hits for maybe 15% of the time. Fear hits maybe 50% of the time, and if it does, it's potted. Defiler has two HoTs on the move. That basically leaves kiting using LOS to buy time, get a couple inductions off. And to what endgame? Not to win but just to extend the fight? I've been there, done that, at this point I'd rather just take my melting.

    To the original question, creepside is built on teamwork, so it's hard to say WL or defiler is better. WL is great for emergencies (bubble/rez), defiler HoTs are the backbone of a group's healing (efflo/hots), but really either one only shines when it has the other supporting it.
    Everything is situational, but since those are HoTs, you still can heal your group to an extent while on the run. Obviously either fight is a losing proposition if you are purely solo and no support is coming. I'm fairly confident going against most WL/dps duos, going into the same fight with a good defiler instead of WL my chances of winning go down significantly, and require a much different (and more challenging) strat. Just my perspective, and I can't add much when we get to full group or raid situations.

  4. #29
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Waterford, Ireland
    Messages
    3 401
    Citation Envoyé par spelunker Voir le message
    Everything is situational, but since those are HoTs, you still can heal your group to an extent while on the run. Obviously either fight is a losing proposition if you are purely solo and no support is coming. I'm fairly confident going against most WL/dps duos, going into the same fight with a good defiler instead of WL my chances of winning go down significantly, and require a much different (and more challenging) strat. Just my perspective, and I can't add much when we get to full group or raid situations.
    I don't duo nearly as much as I used to because 99% of the time if we find a solo freep, a load of freeps will turn up to zerg the hell out of us. Not only that, freeps are far more powerful than they were when I duo'd actively, and it can take way too long to kill a single freep.

  5. #30
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Messages
    114
    Citation Envoyé par Equendil Voir le message
    Efflorescence stronger ? It's the best healing skills defilers have ! I can see a lot of defiler skills that could use an upgrade before efflorescence, like, all of them really.
    erm I don't no wat planet your on suggesting that lol but that's not true at all. most cases u don't get time to use it anyways

    all healing skills need an update wen freeps get there gear and first ages the burst dps is insane if ur the only defiler around and u have 2 hunters n champ u got no champ keeping things up,

    skills that needed to be improved that never was, is blight damage seriously it only doe slike 80 a tick on some classes so kiting is #### small situations
    as for dps ive always said that needed a to bring a dps stance in

  6. #31
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    France
    Messages
    749
    Citation Envoyé par crockett1986 Voir le message
    erm I don't no wat planet your on suggesting that lol but that's not true at all.
    On my planet, Efflorescence gives my lowly R6 defiler roughly 8k worth of healing per application without Fungal Spores even applied, is a group heal so you can multiply that by the number of recipient creeps, can be used again just 15s after it expires, and of course, only gets better with higher ranks & incoming healing.

    If my defiler was stranded on a desert island with just one skill to keep, that'd be the one.
    Dernière modification par Equendil ; 01/09/2013 à 14h36.

  7. #32
    Date d'inscription
    août 2010
    Localisation
    GMT -5
    Messages
    150
    As a R6 Defiler with capped Aud I can solo out heal most Guardians and Wardens, every Minstrel, and many Loremasters and Burglars. For every other class it depends on their skill and gear, but I have managed to outheal every class out there at some time or other.
    We could use a bit of a buff on some skills.

    My Suggestions:
    A 10% boost to the initial heal of Fungal Bloom and a removal of its cooldown.
    Increase the +inc damage of Curse of the Rotten Flesh to 10% (7 would be fine as well)
    Increase the crit magnitude on Tenderize by 50%
    Increase the power drain on flies by 50% (100% would be better)
    Reduce the CD on Curse of the Melancolic Heart to 30s
    Increase the cooldown on Constant Pain to 1m
    Shorten the channel to 10s
    Make the skill AoE Damage and do 500-600 a tick damage (maybe 10 - 15m range? and 300 a tick healing (Raid wide or just heal everyone in the area would be great)

    This would go a long way to make defilers stonger. They would have a heal they could spam to try and keep someone up and their tactical use would increase as well.

    As far as my R6 WL, I have not had much chance to face people with my stances, but it seems that stance dancing could be absolutely devastating if done right. My only suggestion would be for the instant cast heals to be usuable on the move.

    As far as traits, I would say Turbine should make all of the +armor or +morale class traits simply passives at that rank and get some more trait to choose from.

  8. #33
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Waterford, Ireland
    Messages
    3 401
    Citation Envoyé par drfacts Voir le message
    stance dancing could be absolutely devastating if done right.
    It sounds good in theory but it is impossible because of the animation time for changing stances, and simply because the stances are rubbish. If you use Commander's Stance in a 1v1 then you're going to either lose or have an endless battle, assuming you don't win after a few hours by attrition.

  9. #34
    Date d'inscription
    mars 2013
    Messages
    113
    Citation Envoyé par Squelcher Voir le message
    It sounds good in theory but it is impossible because of the animation time for changing stances, and simply because the stances are rubbish. If you use Commander's Stance in a 1v1 then you're going to either lose or have an endless battle, assuming you don't win after a few hours by attrition.
    Against a few classes I find stance dancing to be viable, almost always switch to commanders if I need to use either r9 heal or recover after a string of crits. The stun from shield bash and slow from Intimidating usually gives you enough time to do it without great penalty.

  10. #35
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Waterford, Ireland
    Messages
    3 401
    Citation Envoyé par CreepHiveMind Voir le message
    Against a few classes I find stance dancing to be viable, almost always switch to commanders if I need to use either r9 heal or recover after a string of crits. The stun from shield bash and slow from Intimidating usually gives you enough time to do it without great penalty.
    The great penalty is that switching to Commander's effectively stops all your DPS for the duration that you are in it. 1v1 as a WL is often a race against time to defeat the opponent before you become permanently short on power.

  11. #36
    Date d'inscription
    juin 2011
    Localisation
    Grams Rock - Complaining!
    Messages
    1 071
    Defiler wins hands down in my opinion.

    My R11 WL although i really enjoy playing the WL in a 6 man group, we are usually targetted first, and with zero survivability we normally die very easily to focused fire, plus if a burg even looks at us the wrong way or a warden breathes near us, with our inductions we are usually in trouble.

    Commander Stance, as good as the heals can be again we get the inductions issues, and the fact eventually every skill from DPS to Heals will be on CD and we have to run about for a few seconds doing sod all.

    Our pros i can see are the Bubble of course and the AEO Rez. The uruk heal isnt the best but its not bad, its a life save at times. IMHO we need a bit more defenses, we need to be sturdy and take hits, but at the same time, since in my experiances we are targetted first we need better crit defense as a base stat, not OPing, but enough that we can take a beating and wont melt like chocolate.

  12. #37
    Date d'inscription
    avril 2011
    Messages
    268
    Citation Envoyé par MessyR Voir le message
    My R11 WL although i really enjoy playing the WL in a 6 man group, we are usually targetted first, and with zero survivability
    How is a defiler any sturdier than a warleader? Between CC and warden heal debuff they melt just as easily..

    Imho, Warleaders are better than defilers because defilers don't have any burst heal or a defensive cd(blessing really doesen't count).
    In teamfights unless you pre HoT someone no matter how hard you heal he's gonna die, specially with the warden behind your back.

    I think doesen't matter if you think warleaders are better than defilers or viceversa, any freep healer is twice or more than that.

 

 
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