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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Newcastle-Upon-Tyne
    Posts
    28

    Some Burg Questions RE Trait Lines and Legendary Weapons

    Hey all,

    So I just hit level 105 as a burglar and I have some questions I am hoping you guys can answer:

    1. If a legendary weapon legacy affects a base skill, does it also affect the specialised skill? So for example Lucky Strike becomes Gambler's Strike in Blue Line. Does a legacy that affects Lucky Strike's crit chance also affect Gambler's Strike?

    2. I have always been Blue Line. I enjoyed the survivability and options it gave me. However, now I am heading into late game I find that I am killing things too slowly. I've built my entire playstyle around applying bleeds. Is this still viable in Red Line or is it all about burst damage?

    3. I really like PVMP. I have a Rank 7 Warg who I enjoy, but have no freepside experience. A major part of deciding to play Burglar was to take him to PVMP and play freepside too. As a solo Burglar in Ettens, should I go Red or Blue? And are there any tips or strategies to recommend?


    Thank you in advance

    Fyrn
    Yoshpot- Rank 7 Warg - "Dissapear is not just a skill but a way of life"
    Fyrnir - Warden- "It was 40 on 1. They should have brought more than 40..."

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Moscow, Russia
    Posts
    3,143
    In end game content, burgs use red line for DPS or yellow line for instances, depends on what RL wants.

  3. Quote Originally Posted by Vodhr View Post
    Hey all,

    So I just hit level 105 as a burglar and I have some questions I am hoping you guys can answer:

    1. If a legendary weapon legacy affects a base skill, does it also affect the specialised skill? So for example Lucky Strike becomes Gambler's Strike in Blue Line. Does a legacy that affects Lucky Strike's crit chance also affect Gambler's Strike?

    2. I have always been Blue Line. I enjoyed the survivability and options it gave me. However, now I am heading into late game I find that I am killing things too slowly. I've built my entire playstyle around applying bleeds. Is this still viable in Red Line or is it all about burst damage?

    3. I really like PVMP. I have a Rank 7 Warg who I enjoy, but have no freepside experience. A major part of deciding to play Burglar was to take him to PVMP and play freepside too. As a solo Burglar in Ettens, should I go Red or Blue? And are there any tips or strategies to recommend?


    Thank you in advance

    Fyrn
    I'm in much the same boat as you are, though I have played and enjoyed all of the specs so far. My sense is that for grouping PVE, red and yellow are the only games in town, and I can only recommend LOTRO HQ for suggestions.

    https://lotrohq.com/red-burglar/
    https://lotrohq.com/yellow-burglar/

    For PVMP, I would like to hear the community's tips as well. I haven't got any sense of what is optimal right now. Blue *seems* like it would be great if built for it, but I don't want to invest in a set of PVMP legendaries that aren't going to do the job.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    396
    Quote Originally Posted by seyahat View Post
    I'm in much the same boat as you are, though I have played and enjoyed all of the specs so far. My sense is that for grouping PVE, red and yellow are the only games in town, and I can only recommend LOTRO HQ for suggestions.

    https://lotrohq.com/red-burglar/
    https://lotrohq.com/yellow-burglar/

    For PVMP, I would like to hear the community's tips as well. I haven't got any sense of what is optimal right now. Blue *seems* like it would be great if built for it, but I don't want to invest in a set of PVMP legendaries that aren't going to do the job.
    The red line is better in pvp.
    The yellow line is better in raid as a support.
    The blue line is broken on the healers (a tip, forget this trait)

    Healing is ridiculous on a level 130

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Elmagor View Post
    In end game content, burgs use red line for DPS or yellow line for instances, depends on what RL wants.
    This is the answer most people will give you, but I don't think most burgs have seriously tried to play a blue line burg for DPS. (Everyone they ask tells them they "should" be playing red for dps)
    Yellow is definitely the way to go for raid support but blue does as much or more damage than red and gives heals and some debuffs. BLUE > RED for DPS

    DPS
    I do 150k - 160k dps totally unbuffed in a 3 min parse on a training dummy in blue line (By unbuffed I mean: No damage buffs on my character, not even a hope token)
    This is actually about 5k dps higher than I typically get from an unbuffed red line parse on a training dummy. (Without using All In to artificially boost the first 30s of the parse...)
    I do 400k+ dps with group raid buffs in a 3 min parse on a training dummy in blue line

    HEALS
    The heals from blue primarily come from the green gamble. A tier 5 green gamble will return 5% of all damage dealt to the target. This is significant for DPS classes.
    If a dps class is doing 200k+ dps in a fight that means they are healing 10k per second from your tier 5 green gamble. Not earth shattering but its a nice boost to the group on top of your dps.
    For extra healing fun: drop a green gamble on multiple targets while a champ is doing AOE...
    (I NEVER use cash out for damage, but if you use it to remove a green gamble its a nice self heal every 20s)


    DEBUFFS
    The blue gamble isn't a great debuff (Yellow line disable is MUCH better), but a Tier 5 blue gamble reduces damage, attack speed and miss chance by 10% each. Not great, but not horrible when you add it to the dps and heals your are adding to the group.

    PVMP?
    I used to PVMP a lot on my burg, but I haven't really been to the moors in a long time. (The few times I have been out to the moors on Gladden in recent memory the place has been DEAD! Oh for the good old days....) For PVMP I think you would be hard pressed to beat red line (burst DPS, knives out, and hips cd are really sweet in red line)

    I know many who haven't really worked on the blue line will disagree but IMO blue line burg>red line burg for everything except burst DPS, conj generation, and PVMP.

    PS: A note on gamble chances
    I know I'm using tier 5 gambles in my examples above, but I think that's reasonable since a geared burg gets tier5+ gamble more than half the time.
    With the blue line raid set and 31.2% gamble chance legacy on your burg bag the % chance for gamble levels is:
    Tier 1 = 0%
    Tier 2 = 11.47%
    Tier 3 = 16.67%
    Tier 4 = 20.49%
    Tier 5 = 22.22%
    Tier 6 = 29.16%
    Last edited by Mystarr; Mar 08 2021 at 04:44 PM.
    Merridan - Burglar lvl 130 (Rank 12)
    Mystarr - Loremaster lvl 130 : Gormadan - Minstrel lvl 130 : Traldan - Captain lvl 130 : Celebdan - Weaver (Rank 11)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Copenhagen, Denmark
    Posts
    41
    Cheers to you, Mystarr!

    I have been looking for this kind of information for ages, but blue line is just shrugged off, without any real data (which to some degree is fair given the effort to level a blue set at endgame).

    Do you have a build or rotation for blue, you want to share?

    Also, I know blue performed admirably in the Moors but that was prior to Bob and Weave nerf and I've had a hard time finding blue burgs since.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Offenberg View Post
    Cheers to you, Mystarr!

    I have been looking for this kind of information for ages, but blue line is just shrugged off, without any real data (which to some degree is fair given the effort to level a blue set at endgame).

    Do you have a build or rotation for blue, you want to share?
    Build:
    Trait blue line with a lot of red (all the way down to flashing blades) I usually throw in dust from yellow. Don't waste blue line points helping the pathetic bob and weave heal.
    Max out Crit Rating (630k+) and Phys Mastery (850k, I usually stop around 820k from gear because scrolls, food, etc will do the rest)
    Weapon Legacies: Gamble damage, crit chain skill crit multiplier, crit response skill damage, bleed damage, cunning attack bleed damage, subtle stab damage, (remaining legacy varies)
    Bag Legacies: Positional damage, skills crit mult, reveal weakness, All In damage, gamble chance, (remaining 2 legacies are personal pref. I like stealth speed, and addle debuff)

    Rotation:
    In my experience the best blue line rotation is pretty much the same as the standard red line rotation:
    All In-Addl-GS
    Then: BA-ss-(Aim?)-FB-DES-(Addl when its off cd)-ss-CA-(GS?)...repeat rotation

    A few notes on Gamblers Strike (GS?)
    - I hit GS again if my damaging gamble is below T5. (If its T5+ I let it ride as long as possible)
    - I always hit GS again near the end of my All In buff and then let the gamble ride (Even a low tier damaging gamble with All In beats almost any gamble I would get without All In)
    - NEVER use GS when you are in the 10s penalty from All In (This would put a really weak damaging gamble on the mob that you are just going to need to replace)

    Some thoughts on Provoke and Exposed Throat:
    I know most people like to use provoke right before flashing blades. (Extra crit chance for FB, and great defensive buff), but on a training dummy I actually find it slows my rotation down and I usually end up with slightly less DPS. (In order to maximize my FB-DES damage, I try to keep the total length of a "cycle" of my rotation under 8s. 6s would be ideal, but I cant usually seem to achieve this). NOTE: In actual fights I usually go ahead and hit provoke right before FB when its off cd because I want the defensive buff

    The same reasoning goes for exposed throat. I usually find it better to skip it so I can get back around to flashing blades sooner

    A Few Notes on Positional Damage Bug
    All burg skills that are received as a trait line bonus currently gain NO POSITIONAL DAMAGE BONUS
    (Gamblers Strike, Quite a Snag, Improved Feint Attack, Disable, Cash Out, Blind Bet, Hedge Your Bet)
    Positional damage is HUGE for a burg so as a blue line burg this means you NEVER use Cash Out, Blind Bet, or Hedge Your Bet for DPS

    What are Cash Out, Blind Bet, and Hedge Your Bet good for?
    Hedge Your Bet = Use it to put a healing gamble on the target for all the groups DPSers
    Cash Out with Blue Gamble = Nice way to get an 8s stun (mainly in solo play)
    Cash Out with Green Gamble = Decent self heal (I think its a 10k hot that ticks 6ish times?)
    Blind Bet = If you want debuffs in the fight, use this once every 30s to refresh the blue gamble. It will stack with dust in the eyes and yellow burg debuffs (The yellow burg is probably using disable or enrage). I doubt that bosses in raids can miss, but I know that bosses in 3mans (I'm looking at you shadow king) can miss and I assume bosses in 6mans can miss too (but I haven't really tested it)

    Fun with Even the Odds
    If you put gambles on 3 targets (For Example: diversion from stealth, open with SS from stealth on another target, tab to another target and hit GS) then every time you hit DES you can hit 3 targets with gambles on them so you get 3 of the random Even the Odds buffs (-15%ish attack speeds, +40kish phys mast, +40kish crit rating, +80kish evade)
    These buffs stack and I have been able to get 9 of them stacked on me... Its not earth shattering (since my phys mastery and crit are over capped anyways) but it definitely brings a smile to my face to watch all those buffs pile up!!!
    Last edited by Mystarr; Mar 12 2021 at 10:06 AM.
    Merridan - Burglar lvl 130 (Rank 12)
    Mystarr - Loremaster lvl 130 : Gormadan - Minstrel lvl 130 : Traldan - Captain lvl 130 : Celebdan - Weaver (Rank 11)

 

 

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