We have detected that cookies are not enabled on your browser. Please enable cookies to ensure the proper experience.
Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 155
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    2,483

    Race Changes + New Race Idea

    Two things one post:

    1) I've heard rumblings about the ability to change your race in the future. Can anyone confirm this? I personally would love to do this, I RP a half-elf, so I picked a man hunter, but at the time the game was a lot more balanced and having a sturdy hunter actually made sense (even in end game). Today, the lack of 5% bow damage is killing me, and I would love to switch to an Elf, especially considering I'd still be a half-elf . Needless to say, SSG would charge for this if it was available, and I would happily pay for the service.

    2) For selfish reasons, I'd love to see a Half-Elf race in LOTRO. I'm certainly not a lore expert, but from what I know it seems half elves are entirely possible in Middle Earth. Though there would not be home city that we could consider a 'Half Elven' city, the home city for a Half Elf could potentially be any Elf or Man kingdom.
    Erendil 50 Hunter Rank 7, Mavellen 45 Warden; Officers of Disciples
    Ragaroth Warleader Rank 7, Marhawk Stalker Rank 5; Members of Cuddle Squad
    Other Characters: Arthilius - Captain, Arthilias - Guardian,
    Claireth - Runekeeper, Harbuckle - Burglar, Lothlirien - Hunter

  2. #2
    1. Race change tokens are confirmed and will be available "soon"; an exact date is unknown. They have shown up on the beta server, however, so it is likely that they are nearing completion.
    2. While half-elves are technically "possible" in Middle-Earth, they were so rare that you can basically count every one that ever existed on two hands (lore nerds can correct me if I'm wrong). Elrond's lineage was known as Half-elven due to their mixture of elf and man blood, and Arwen continued this lineage by wedding Aragorn. Since your player character cannot be any of these famous lore figures, than I really can't see stretching the lore so far as to have a bunch of half-elves running around. (RPing is totally fine, but to make a separate race makes it seem too "official").
    Besides, we already have two variations of elves and two variations of men available. The next race will be river-hobbits.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    126
    Race changes were announced as coming at GenCon last year. What we were told then and since are:

    • They'll be a token, likely sold in the store - no price point has been mentioned at all
    • You won't be able to change class (so this excludes Beornings)
    • You won't be able to change to a race your class can't currently play (i.e. hobbit captain, elf burglar)
    • Gender changes should be possible - with the caveat that there might be more work needed to get OG dwarves to allow for both genders/pronouns the way all the other races do
    • You will be able to change your name if you want but aren't required to (i.e. you won't lose your name)
    • You will be able to then create the character using the origins/appearance options of that race


    This of course is with the usual caveat that it's still in development, so Things Can Change (tm).

    As for the lore of it... there's the lore that SSG's allowed to use per their license (limited to The Hobbit, the LotR trilogy, and the appendices), and the extra lore included in The Silmarillion and the History of Middle-earth series that they're not allowed to use. Through those limitations, I would be VERY interested to see if/how SSG could finesse around the 'only three marriages between the two kindreds' issue - while acknowledging that Imhrahil's line has elf blood in it somewhere - or people thought they did due to their fairness (fairness as in being pretty/handsome, not fairness versus unfair). I don't see them doing it, to be honest, due to the lore rarity of the notion. However, I'd say if you want to RP it, have at it. People have been RPing their OG Elves as High Elves for the past 13 years anyway.

    As for a half-elven home... the choice is obvious: Rivendell.

    Finally, about river-hobbits (or river-folk as some call them)... the funny thing is that when I pitched that question to Severlin when I interviewed him back in early March (which feels like a million years ago), citing how the other three OG races got a new variant 'race'... he didn't actually SAY that was coming next. He didn't actually straight up confirm it. And there's no mention of them in the producer's letter published today. However, I think it's a safe bet AND I'll lay my money on it coming with the Gundabad-themed xpac next spring.
    Shhh. Listen. Listen to the sound of suffering. Resolve to relieve it. Lift others up. Be kind.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    158
    To be lore-picky, the closest thing there is in LotRO to a "half-elven race" is the Dunedain, and that's not because they're related to elves (though some of them obviously are--forty generations later, Elros must have had *a lot* of descendants). And there are issues with the writing which makes Dunedain a difficult option to make as a racial choice. Nevermind that most people think "Ranger of the North" when they think Dunedain, rather than "Probably Half of Gondor, Umbar, the Corsairs, and the Black Numenoreans, on Top of the Pure Northern Dunedain"

    Tolkien's legendarium doesn't *have* "half-elves", not really. It has 100% Men and 100% Elf decedents of the unions of Men and Elves. That's because the difference between an Elf and a Man is one is immortal and the other is not. Everything else about Elves and Men flows directly from their (im)mortality. There do seem to be minor physical differences, enough to pick up in Imrahil's family, but his family is 100% Mannish.

    That said, roleplay the child of an Elf and a Man all you want; it could be that an Avari Elf and a Man had a kid somewhere and Tolkien didn't write about it. He didn't write much at all about the Avari. Or just do what you like

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Starsmith View Post
    That said, roleplay the child of an Elf and a Man all you want; it could be that an Avari Elf and a Man had a kid somewhere and Tolkien didn't write about it. He didn't write much at all about the Avari. Or just do what you like
    The yardstick isn't that Tolkien just didn't happen to write about something, it's whether it sounds like something he might have written. And that doesn't because he wasn't casual about Men intermarrying with Elves (any Elves, it doesn't matter what sort). If it happened at all, it happened for a reason - the idea was to spin a thread of nobility into some lines of Men, be that the Line of Kings like Aragorn and his ancestors, or those descended from the Lords of Dol Amroth like Imrahil and Faramir (Faramir was Imrahil's nephew) - and such characters stand out. It isn't something to throw into a character bio just to give it a bit more zip.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    158
    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    The yardstick isn't that Tolkien just didn't happen to write about something, it's whether it sounds like something he might have written. And that doesn't because he wasn't casual about Men intermarrying with Elves (any Elves, it doesn't matter what sort). If it happened at all, it happened for a reason - the idea was to spin a thread of nobility into some lines of Men, be that the Line of Kings like Aragorn and his ancestors, or those descended from the Lords of Dol Amroth like Imrahil and Faramir (Faramir was Imrahil's nephew) - and such characters stand out. It isn't something to throw into a character bio just to give it a bit more zip.
    In the case of roleplay, and my policing of same, the yardstick is: Are they enjoying it, and are the people they are playing with enjoying it? Then they can do whatever they damned well please.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Starsmith View Post
    In the case of roleplay, and my policing of same, the yardstick is: Are they enjoying it, and are the people they are playing with enjoying it? Then they can do whatever they damned well please.
    It's not 'policing' to just talk generally about RP here, and it's certainly not policing to point out that a Half-elf character is vanishingly unlikely and that dragging the Avari into it wouldn't make the least difference to that. Way to dole out bad and lazy advice.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    326
    Quote Originally Posted by Starsmith View Post
    Tolkien's legendarium doesn't *have* "half-elves", not really. It has 100% Men and 100% Elf decedents of the unions of Men and Elves.
    This is exactly why I don't see half-elves being a thing. The children are always one race or another- even Elrond "Half Elven" had to choose one or the other, and after that the kids don't even get to choose. As far as I can remember, Aragorn and Arwen only had human children. Seems Man is a dominant gene as the age of the elves ends and the dominion of men begins. So there really wouldn't be half-elves.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    This is exactly why I don't see half-elves being a thing. The children are always one race or another- even Elrond "Half Elven" had to choose one or the other, and after that the kids don't even get to choose. As far as I can remember, Aragorn and Arwen only had human children. Seems Man is a dominant gene as the age of the elves ends and the dominion of men begins. So there really wouldn't be half-elves.
    That's not it, because Arwen does get to choose. It's not that the children are always one race or the other, it's that if a Half-elf chooses to become mortal, then any children they have after that are mortal by default. It was Elros' choice that was binding on all his descendants, not Elrond's. The whole deal with Arwen is that she has to choose to become mortal in order to marry Aragorn, echoing the choice that Luthien had made in order to be with Beren. So there were still three 'real' Half-elves, Arwen, Elladan and Elrohir. We never find out what choice Elladan and Elrohir made. Only those special few got that choice, though (by decree of the Valar) - anybody else wouldn't get any choice at all, the children would simply be mortal just like Imrazor's children were. So if someone insists on RPing a character as a Half-elf, the one absolute rule about it lore-wise is that they'd be mortal, with no choice in the matter. Fate decreed that no more of the 'special' Half-elves would be born, hence why Arwen had to become mortal in order to marry Aragorn - if she'd chosen to be counted among the Elves, she'd have had to leave Middle-earth instead.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    326
    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    That's not it, because Arwen does get to choose. It's not that the children are always one race or the other, it's that if a Half-elf chooses to become mortal, then any children they have after that are mortal by default....
    I always had the impression Arwen and her brothers were full Elves- their father was "half-elven" but had made the choice to become immortal (i.e. a full Elf), and their mother was a full Elf also. Arwen outlived Aragorn and eventually died of grief- which according to the lore is one of the two ways an Elf can die. Everything about her lore says, to me, that she was an Elf her whole life- except the odd wording about "choosing mortality" to marry Aragorn. But this seems more like it's describing her inevitable grief-death once her husband died.

    In any case, however we choose to define the race of Elrond's children, "Half-Elves" would still be extremely rare. Arwen's children were all Men, and presumably so would be any children that came from Elladan or Elrohir if they married human women. Where would a new playable race of half-elves come from- especially given the time period of the game?

    And since every example of a "half elf" in the lore is 100% Elf-like in their appearance and behavior, it's hard for me to imagine significant differences in a playable race. So how do you imagine half-elves differing from Elves in the game?

  11. #11
    Paredhil (Half-even) is a bit of a stretch, because we talking of a very particular blood lines.

    But from my part, I have no problem with it. If we can have Beornings, I don't see why not Half-elven.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    London
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    I always had the impression Arwen and her brothers were full Elves- their father was "half-elven" but had made the choice to become immortal (i.e. a full Elf), and their mother was a full Elf also. Arwen outlived Aragorn and eventually died of grief- which according to the lore is one of the two ways an Elf can die. Everything about her lore says, to me, that she was an Elf her whole life- except the odd wording about "choosing mortality" to marry Aragorn. But this seems more like it's describing her inevitable grief-death once her husband died.
    It is as you described above, plus due to the waning power of the Elves in Middle-Earth, she did not give up her immortality in any way by choosing to stay in Middle-Earth (nor does that choice make you mortal).

    There is room for conjecture, however, in that the descendants of Elrond would be Elves (as such by his choice to become Immortal), and the descendants of Elros would be Human but blessed with long life (as such by his choice to become Mortal). I'm not sure what kind of Children rejoining the two lines would produce, it is suggested that Aragorn and Arwen's son is Human? Would he live longer than his father, as such a purification of the Numenor/Dunedain blood-line?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Paredhil (Half-even) is a bit of a stretch, because we talking of a very particular blood lines.

    But from my part, I have no problem with it. If we can have Beornings, I don't see why not Half-elven.
    But, Beornings and the Beorning race actually exist? So this is not the same.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephburz-2 View Post
    It is as you described above, plus due to the waning power of the Elves in Middle-Earth, she did not give up her immortality in any way by choosing to stay in Middle-Earth (nor does that choice make you mortal).

    There is room for conjecture, however, in that the descendants of Elrond would be Elves (as such by his choice to become Immortal), and the descendants of Elros would be Human but blessed with long life (as such by his choice to become Mortal). I'm not sure what kind of Children rejoining the two lines would produce, it is suggested that Aragorn and Arwen's son is Human? Would he live longer than his father, as such a purification of the Numenor/Dunedain blood-line?



    But, Beornings and the Beorning race actually exist? So this is not the same.
    I had numbers in my mind in a sense that in 3rd age we have more Half-elfs than Beornings, as far as we are informed. Like with everything else, our imagination can take us further. Is it Half-elf a temporary state until the choice to be counted among men or among elven folk is made, or is it calculated and decided by races % in a blood lines? Is it 50-50 scenario or it can be some other ratio? I remember seeing (reading) various cases...

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    London
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    I had numbers in my mind in a sense that in 3rd age we have more Half-elfs than Beornings, as far as we are informed. Like with everything else, our imagination can take us further. Is it Half-elf a temporary state until the choice to be counted among men or among elven folk is made, or is it calculated and decided by races % in a blood lines? Is it 50-50 scenario or it can be some other ratio? I remember seeing (reading) various cases...
    I don't know where you're getting those numbers from? But that is patently false.

    "Elros chose to be counted among mortals, and became Tar-Minyatur, the first king of Númenor. He finally took his death at the age of five hundred years. The heirs of Elros were not given this choice, but their lifespan was enhanced many times that of normal Men, and they had the freedom to take death when they willed"

    "The children of Elrond and Celebrían were also given free choice of kindred, and therefore Arwen could choose to be counted amongst the Edain even though her father had chosen to be counted as Elven. She exercised this option, marrying Aragorn II Elessar, king of the Reunited Kingdom, and finally dying at the age of 2,901 years. Their son Eldarion and their daughters were not counted as Half-elven, but rather as Dúnedain restored."

    ==

    Half-Elven is not a term that is applied to Man/Elven children, it is a term applied to those who have the choice of an immortal/mortal life, the choice of which was only offered to 7 notable people:

    Earendil / Elwing
    Elrond / Elros
    Arwen / Elrohir / Elladan

    ==

    In terms of the Beornings,

    "Gandalf thought the Beornings might have originated in the Misty Mountains. During the Third Age they guarded the Ford of Carrock against the Orcs and Wargs (in The Lord of The Rings, Gloin complained that their tolls were high) and they also aided the Elves in defending their kingdom in northern Mirkwood. During the War of the Ring, while wearing the One Ring at Amon Hen upon the seat of seeing, Frodo Baggins saw many things from afar, including the land of the Beornings aflame. This hints at an attack by Sauron's forces upon the Beornings, though the outcome of this attack is unknown."

    So, in terms of numbers I really don't understand where you are coming from.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    I always had the impression Arwen and her brothers were full Elves- their father was "half-elven" but had made the choice to become immortal (i.e. a full Elf), and their mother was a full Elf also. Arwen outlived Aragorn and eventually died of grief- which according to the lore is one of the two ways an Elf can die. Everything about her lore says, to me, that she was an Elf her whole life- except the odd wording about "choosing mortality" to marry Aragorn. But this seems more like it's describing her inevitable grief-death once her husband died.
    An Elf couldn't simply decide to become mortal, as that wasn't their fate. Luthien had only been given the choice to become mortal after she'd already died of sorrow over Beren's death and had then appealed directly to Mandos, singing him a song so sorrowful that even he was moved to pity. Arwen gets to make that same choice - to become mortal to be with the man she loves, and to share his fate after death - only because she's one of the Half-elven and it's her birthright. If she hadn't died of grief, Arwen might have lived for several more centuries even as a mortal, just like Elros had after he'd chosen mortality.

    Choosing mortality was more significant than it might first appear because it meant Arwen would be forever sundered from her people - her fate after death would become that of Men, instead. An Elf who died of sorrow would go to the Halls of Mandos for a time before eventually being re-embodied and being able to dwell forever in Valinor among their kin. By contrast, the spirits of Men left the world entirely and went somewhere else. That's why Arwen's parting with her father was so sorrowful - becoming mortal meant she'd never see him again, that they'd be parted for all eternity.

    In any case, however we choose to define the race of Elrond's children, "Half-Elves" would still be extremely rare. Arwen's children were all Men, and presumably so would be any children that came from Elladan or Elrohir if they married human women. Where would a new playable race of half-elves come from- especially given the time period of the game?
    You don't need to convince me, it's an obvious non-starter lore-wise but as usual, that won't stop people asking (especially if they don't know why it'd be super lore-breaking here, and are simply thinking of Half-elves in D&Dish terms).

    And since every example of a "half elf" in the lore is 100% Elf-like in their appearance and behavior, it's hard for me to imagine significant differences in a playable race. So how do you imagine half-elves differing from Elves in the game?
    I don't imagine any such thing, myself but I guess they could have different passive skills.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephburz-2 View Post
    In terms of the Beornings,

    "Gandalf thought the Beornings might have originated in the Misty Mountains. During the Third Age they guarded the Ford of Carrock against the Orcs and Wargs (in The Lord of The Rings, Gloin complained that their tolls were high) and they also aided the Elves in defending their kingdom in northern Mirkwood. During the War of the Ring, while wearing the One Ring at Amon Hen upon the seat of seeing, Frodo Baggins saw many things from afar, including the land of the Beornings aflame. This hints at an attack by Sauron's forces upon the Beornings, though the outcome of this attack is unknown."

    So, in terms of numbers I really don't understand where you are coming from.
    I do not mind being wrong and corrected but as far as I remember, Beornings were in a very small number. Majority in the area were the Woodmen. Just like in the past they lived with the Northmen.

    There was Idril and Tuor also that needs to be mentioned. Half-elf must have something to do with mixed marriage. I do not know any example where that is not the case. I am no wiser as to why some had a choice and some don't. I remember some Tolkien scholars working on percentage idea... don't know if they came to anything conclusive.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Hephburz-2 View Post
    In terms of the Beornings,

    "Gandalf thought the Beornings might have originated in the Misty Mountains. During the Third Age they guarded the Ford of Carrock against the Orcs and Wargs (in The Lord of The Rings, Gloin complained that their tolls were high) and they also aided the Elves in defending their kingdom in northern Mirkwood. During the War of the Ring, while wearing the One Ring at Amon Hen upon the seat of seeing, Frodo Baggins saw many things from afar, including the land of the Beornings aflame. This hints at an attack by Sauron's forces upon the Beornings, though the outcome of this attack is unknown."

    So, in terms of numbers I really don't understand where you are coming from.
    It's not quite as straightforward as that, as there were two sorts of Beornings:

    - the men of Beorn's line, who could skin-change like him;

    - the "many sturdy men" who'd taken to following first Beorn and then his son Grimbeorn.

    The game simplifies this, if we were being accurate then most Beornings would be ordinary Northmen and the skin-changers would be their ruling clan. But even then, I imagine that as it had been several generations of Men since Beorn's day, there'd be a fair size extended family of Beorn's kin and since there were only three Half-elves, it's pretty likely there were more skin-changers about. But obviously there weren't really meant to be many of them either.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    It's not quite as straightforward as that, as there were two sorts of Beornings:

    - the men of Beorn's line, who could skin-change like him;

    - the "many sturdy men" who'd taken to following first Beorn and then his son Grimbeorn.

    The game simplifies this, if we were being accurate then most Beornings would be ordinary Northmen and the skin-changers would be their ruling clan. But even then, I imagine that as it had been several generations of Men since Beorn's day, there'd be a fair size extended family of Beorn's kin and since there were only three Half-elves, it's pretty likely there were more skin-changers about. But obviously there weren't really meant to be many of them either.

    Yes. And fair point about numbers. I am counting more than three but could be just language thing and what one considering under the particular concept... There is also mention of an Elven bloodline in Prince Imrahil.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    2 Long Street, Corstead, Bree-land Homesteads, Crickhollow, Sweden
    Posts
    3,206
    We have half-elves. Not just Elladan, Elrohir and Arwen but orcs.

    They are bred from goblins(?) and elves captured in the wars of the 1st age.

    http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Orc#Origin
    While Tolkien originally saw all Orcs as descended from tortured Elves, later comments of his indicate, according to Christopher Tolkien in Morgoth's Ring ("Myths Transformed, text X"), that he began to feel uncomfortable with the theory that orcs were descended from Elves. However, Tolkien died before he could complete his upheaval of the cosmology, and in the published version of The Silmarillion, the Elvish origin of Orcs was adopted.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orc#In-fiction_origins
    Basically same as above.
    The Elruthrim Brethren of Crickhollow
    Malancil CHN, Historian Calchiar CPT, Explorer Sturmdrang WDN, Woodsman Anancite GRD, Armourer Tarostel HNT, Armsman Angredeth HNT, Tinker Dromarong GRD, Dwarf

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Marancil View Post
    We have half-elves. Not just Elladan, Elrohir and Arwen but orcs.
    Not really. Originally there were the tormented and broken Avari whom Melkor and Sauron used as breeding-stock for the first Orcs but it's stretching things past breaking point to suggest that somehow makes Orcs "half-elves". Back then, Melkor was so powerful he could create almost anything he wanted apart from true life (which was something only Iluvatar could create), so he only took what he needed from those hapless Elves and then threw the rest away. The end result was a twisted mockery, not half anything.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    2 Long Street, Corstead, Bree-land Homesteads, Crickhollow, Sweden
    Posts
    3,206
    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    Not really. Originally there were the tormented and broken Avari whom Melkor and Sauron used as breeding-stock for the first Orcs but it's stretching things past breaking point to suggest that somehow makes Orcs "half-elves". Back then, Melkor was so powerful he could create almost anything he wanted apart from true life (which was something only Iluvatar could create), so he only took what he needed from those hapless Elves and then threw the rest away. The end result was a twisted mockery, not half anything.
    Well, we are all stretching it thin here... a few relations that can be counted on the fingers on one hand, for all we know, and someone want's a whole race.
    The Elruthrim Brethren of Crickhollow
    Malancil CHN, Historian Calchiar CPT, Explorer Sturmdrang WDN, Woodsman Anancite GRD, Armourer Tarostel HNT, Armsman Angredeth HNT, Tinker Dromarong GRD, Dwarf

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Marancil View Post
    Well, we are all stretching it thin here... a few relations that can be counted on the fingers on one hand, for all we know, and someone want's a whole race.
    Not so much. The OP did, but they didn't know what the deal was.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    167
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Paredhil (Half-even) is a bit of a stretch, because we talking of a very particular blood lines.

    But from my part, I have no problem with it. If we can have Beornings, I don't see why not Half-elven.
    With the very noticeable difference that Beornings definitely exist in LotR (they are mentioned in passing by Gloin -IIRC- in Fellowship), while the only Half-Elf mentioned is Elrond, and that was just a moniker, while he himself was pretty much Elf. Likewise, all instances of Elves and mortals having an offspring results in the children becoming one or the other, never a mix of the two. So an entire race of Half-Elves would definitely be a stretch, while a race of Beornings definitely isn't. Could we please leave all this "Beornings are not in the lore" behind once and for all?

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Bristol, England
    Posts
    8,449
    Quote Originally Posted by Damrod_Freason View Post
    With the very noticeable difference that Beornings definitely exist in LotR (they are mentioned in passing by Gloin -IIRC- in Fellowship), while the only Half-Elf mentioned is Elrond, and that was just a moniker, while he himself was pretty much Elf. Likewise, all instances of Elves and mortals having an offspring results in the children becoming one or the other, never a mix of the two. So an entire race of Half-Elves would definitely be a stretch, while a race of Beornings definitely isn't. Could we please leave all this "Beornings are not in the lore" behind once and for all?
    Not quite - Elrond's complicated ancestry actually makes him three-eighths Edain, not 'pretty much Elf'. All three of his kids were Half-elves and until Arwen married Aragorn, none of them had chosen which kindred to be counted among so no, they hadn't all become one or the other. Now yes, sure, anybody else with mixed ancestry would just be mortal because while the Valar had given the 'famous' Half-elves a choice, that' didn't extend to just anybody and so the best you could ever get would be maybe some few guys like Imrahil and his ancestors, a little bit Elvish but mortal. And of course Imrahil was a really fancy-pants Dunedain lord (besides being Denethor's brother-in-law and Faramir's uncle) and so guys like him aren't playable either. Obvious NPCs. And no Elf would marry just any mortal, it'd have to be someone truly extraordinary.

    As for the Beorniings, the thing about the skin-changers was that they weren't really a race in that sense, it was just the men of that one family, those directly descended from Beorn so that'd be a small clan at most (unless you imagine Beorn having roamed the Northlands getting busy with every maiden he could find). They had lots of followers, but not so many big fierce guys who could turn into bears. And they should really be in the Vales of Anduin and Mirkwood fighting to defend their lands, not wandering about being adventurers because they'd been having to work real hard to protect their lands since long before the war started and so they sure didn't have to go looking for trouble, they had plenty right at home. It's not that they simply exist, it's that they've been brought into the limelight rather than just being way off in the background.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Damrod_Freason View Post
    With the very noticeable difference that Beornings definitely exist in LotR (they are mentioned in passing by Gloin -IIRC- in Fellowship), while the only Half-Elf mentioned is Elrond, and that was just a moniker, while he himself was pretty much Elf. Likewise, all instances of Elves and mortals having an offspring results in the children becoming one or the other, never a mix of the two. So an entire race of Half-Elves would definitely be a stretch, while a race of Beornings definitely isn't. Could we please leave all this "Beornings are not in the lore" behind once and for all?
    I wish you read all my comments. Both exist and I never said otherwise. My point was that both are in very small numbers, and both very particular blood lines. Rest is addressed elsewhere in this thread...

    Hence lore wise, both are a stretch, and yet I never spoke against it, having in mind that the game is one of the adaptations and I want people to have fun and enjoy it, hopefully in a reasonable manner, which is subjective as we know already.

 

 
Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload