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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
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    94
    Ah okey :/

    Quote Originally Posted by NovaT View Post
    Not just outside US. I am on the east coast U.S. and I play with a friend on the west coast U.S. several times per week and we consistently get skill lock/ lag at exactly the same time.

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Posts
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by StinkyGreene View Post
    They are tiny, obviously. Whether or not they can or cannot afford better equipment is the age old small business owners’ dilemma.
    I've played on WoW private servers run by a small group of people with way better performance than what SSG is "capable" of, even with similar/bigger playerbase.

  3. #28
    Oh I agree Socratic, I used to run a variety of colocated servers for Quake 3 Arena (and many many variants). Paid for nice equipment and premium bandwidth, but I would certainly hard cap our player base on a per server situation. Who knows what game companies do these days.

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    112
    Quote Originally Posted by HeliStorm View Post
    This is for outside US and EU-players. Alot of players are complaining and pissed. You should do something.
    Nah... It's all across the U.S. as well.

    It seems the majority of the player base has been feeling the pain for a while now. There appear to be a few outliers, but not many.

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,895
    Quote Originally Posted by HeliStorm View Post
    This is for outside US and EU-players. Alot of players are complaining and pissed. You should do something.
    Australian player here. Beyond the usual 200ms (because I have to connect from LA to Boston) there's very little "lag" on my end.

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,895
    Quote Originally Posted by thinx View Post
    Yesterday I leveled on landscape (Minas Morgul) with my champ and a guardian from my kin. We usually pull all mob groups in an area and fight them in one go (20+ mobs). In this configuration we get the following behavior:
    • guardian reactive events vanish before they are executed
    • battle frency goes from active to CD without executing (no fervour generated)
    • skill delay in the order of 5 seconds per skill, for a period of 30 seconds+
    • Mobs dropping from full health to defeat in an instant
    • rubberbanding across large distances (comparable to warsteed experience) when running

    One may of course say that collecting that many mobs is not foreseen, but doing them one by one has almost the same issues.

    In addition

    • "already in use" on almost every interactive object for multiple times (we try to use the objects after one another)
    • quest popup delay in the order of 10 seconds
    • crafting delay of ~1 second at result generation
    • vault delay
    • ash deconstruction delay of up to 10 seconds


    All of that is confirmed by other people from our kin that are in a different country, use different computers, different providers.
    It is even independent of time, i.e. I get the same problems even on Sunday morning 7 AM UTC, with ~150 non-anon players (in comparison to 800-900 at prime time) or later morning (when US players have typically gone to sleep). This delay was introduced in multiple steps, with the largest one being the database "update" to Postgre. By now even server restarts do not make things better.

    With yesterdays experience (major lag in the multiple 10 second range at almost every fight) it will not take long until I need to stop playing. Of course we can still get through the content on landscape, but doing higher instance tiers requires to *react* to mob skills/corruptions/fields. It does not work if the computer says "no".
    We have reached a point where simple landscape play has become a turn based game. This needs to change or people will quit. Even whales need a population of smaller fish around them.

    Sounds like package loss between client and server.

    Whichever server you're own probably needs looking at.

    Anor is having very few issues.

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,895
    Quote Originally Posted by Socratic11 View Post
    I've played on WoW private servers run by a small group of people with way better performance than what SSG is "capable" of, even with similar/bigger playerbase.
    WoW private servers don't have to host anywhere near a much account data. LOTRO also has a server architecture that clearly causes more harm than good (but after 12+ years deep it's too late to redo the entire thing).

    Quote Originally Posted by StinkyGreene View Post
    Oh I agree Socratic, I used to run a variety of colocated servers for Quake 3 Arena (and many many variants). Paid for nice equipment and premium bandwidth, but I would certainly hard cap our player base on a per server situation. Who knows what game companies do these days.
    FPS servers operate dramatically different to MMORPG servers. You don't have to also host item/player/account databases nor dungeon/instance servers alongside the regular game server.

  8. #33
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    1,710
    "The majority of the player base...", really?

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,679
    Quote Originally Posted by Hallandil View Post
    Sounds like package loss between client and server.
    Hard to say. Lotro uses TCP and UDP. TCP is aware of packet loss, UDP is not. The TCP loss (and time) is reported by LOTRO, UDP cannot be reported.
    Still there is not only packet loss, but also packet drops.
    Just because a packet has arrived at the server does not mean it has actually been processed and answered. There is most probably some kind of management that drops requests if input queues become too full.

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Hallandil View Post
    Sounds like package loss between client and server.
    Nah. Packages loss explains behaviour like a skill going on cooldown, but never being executed. (The information "I used that skill" didn't reach the server in that scenario.) But all of this:

    Quote Originally Posted by thinx
    "already in use" on almost every interactive object for multiple times (we try to use the objects after one another)
    quest popup delay in the order of 10 seconds
    crafting delay of ~1 second at result generation
    vault delay
    ash deconstruction delay of up to 10 seconds
    is the server putting your request into some kind of queue, then taking extremely long to actually execute it. These things are supposed to work within a tenth of a second, but take ten seconds instead. That's a factor of 100 too long we're talking about.

    Similar, I encounter complete freezes inside of three man instances. I cannot move or fire skills, my kinnies also can't (yelling "laaag" over TeamSpeak), but the mobs also stop fighting and stand around. This isn't connection delay. Connection delay wouldn't affect mobs (they would continue attacking us). This is the server putting the complete instance on hold, because it hasn't enough CPU power to process it at that moment.

    Some weeks ago, I turned in a quest. Two Sigils of Imlad Ithil popped up in my inventory. I was confused, because I own the premium wallet, Sigils are supposed to go in there. I waited a bit longer. Then, the Sigils disappeared and were added to those in my wallet. The whole process took several seconds. I think this is how it works every time when you get something that is intended to go to the wallet - it is put into your inventory first, then moved to the wallet immediately. If that process takes several seconds instead, something must be really wrong.

    Playing on Belegaer.

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Bangladesh
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    2,339
    The question is: did SSG / Turbine reacted on one of the other Lag-Threads?
    I don't like this lags either. And I don't think that SSG will react here in this thread with a little statement what they're thinking about.

    I have lost hope of playing LOTRO without such delays.
    We can only tolerate and / or accept these delays knowing that it can only get worse.
    .

  12. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    3,588
    Quote Originally Posted by Hecki View Post
    The question is: did SSG / Turbine reacted on one of the other Lag-Threads?
    I don't like this lags either. And I don't think that SSG will react here in this thread with a little statement what they're thinking about.

    I have lost hope of playing LOTRO without such delays.
    We can only tolerate and / or accept these delays knowing that it can only get worse.
    Hope dies at last.

    And what do you mean by con only get worse, it gets worse with each update atm. I will not think about the new raid t3, 10s freeze->wipe.

  13. #38
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,535
    Quote Originally Posted by Pontin_Finnberry View Post
    I don't lag much, very little here, but i do notice when crafting there's hitch every time i create something last only for half a second, becomes more noticeable when crafting stacks of items as you see it a lot more of it.
    Crafting lag (delay at end of each craft) has become more strongly pronounced when they implemented auto-sourcing from carry-alls. It feels as if each time they query an external data source.

  14. #39
    To me it seems like there just isn't enough bandwidth between the server and client. This forces your client to either standstill, or behave virtually, which is what you experience on warsteeds when you dismount and travel back in time and discover you were actually stuck on a rock. It's not just warsteeds, I have seen it in dungeons where you try to attack but it won't go through because you and the enemy are not actually aligned. I have seen poisons register late for you, but not to someone watching, and I have fought a boss where everything is fine then a stutter and we are all dead and not where we just were.

    If they could increase the bandwidth or decrease the response time they would. Seems to be an imbedded limitation. Some of that bandwidth is lost in preventing exploits. Some is lost in asking for missing packets, and some is lost in their error correction algorithms (where a packet can be reconstructed, but only by increasing the size of the initial packet). I think a lot more could be done virtually on the client side. It's jarring when it's wrong (warsteeds) but if in short bursts it could smooth over high server requests. Somehow we need our clients to do more, without opening up exploits.

    Some of it I think is layered Terrain. MT being the worst, has corners that will reliably freeze your game. I wonder why it can't be left to the client to know which layer to load (before/after battle) without asking the server and just progressively begin to load the entire static terrain of the whole map as soon as you enter. Maybe you can exploit it, but to what end?
    Last edited by Armitas; Jan 17 2020 at 10:58 AM.
    .


  15. #40
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Posts
    766
    Quote Originally Posted by Schmidster View Post
    "The majority of the player base...", really?
    Every player I have been playing with inside new instances gets the lag at exactly the same time. We talking about seconds of skill delay. This happens to everyone in the group, no matter if they are EU or US players.

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    South/ Central Texas
    Posts
    56
    Happening in Texas. Crafting stacks causing half second or more delays per item, sliding around on warsteed across the map, character floating as a T I stead of running, huge delays in item use. While I don't have the greatest computer, I can participate in huge map-wide meta events in Guild Wars 2 without issues. Solo play in LOTRO shouldn't be this taxing. Crickhollow server.
    Crickhollow server: Argwerael (LM 100), Leofcwyn (Champ 86), Pearblossom (Mini 77), Gwilithil (Hunter 58), Hrorgrim (craft alt 40), Verdani (Beorning, 40), Mapleblossom (Burg 30), Esgalnoril (RK 27)

  17. #42

    Thumbs down

    How sad is that we are in 2020 and we still talking about Server lag of the game...i know its 12+ years old but thats not supposed to be our problem...!we playing a game that sometimes we need more than 6-7 sec to do a skill! nothing to do with fps lag or anything else! before the update for example in moors we had 35 sec delay on skills...YES 35 sec delay on skill...and still SSG trying to milk money out of it! instead of fixing their servers! they introduce new update new 6 mans new raid new new...they cant understand that if they fix the server lag the income will be higher than now...we manage to send massive tickets to fix it after 2-3 days GM came and did restart to the server and he thinks like that can solve issue! also said that if we continue sending tickets about lag he will ban us...Thats lotro gms work i guess! and still none from SSG have replied about those kind of forum problems!
    Robiros Mini R13
    Mpempis Defi R12

  18. #43
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    SW, US
    Posts
    139
    [QUOTE=Armitas;7986543 ... Some of that bandwidth is lost in preventing exploits. ...[/QUOTE]

    And this is not working correctly either. Several times since th last server restart I've observed the alleged anti-exploit question marks above a mob head when I'm right in front of it - 19m to 26m - on level ground. Last night I even got the UI pop-up when the mob was right there in front of me.

    On another note, that is perhaps related to this, on Brandywine at Kheledul collecting storage boxes when a multi-boxer came through dragging three alts. Intent on my quests I didn't realize until turning the quest in that the multi-boxer, level 14 (I had clicked on the leader always do to see if it's a high level deeding), was shooting the mobs from non-warsteeds in a non-mount-battle zone.

    I was stunned to realize that, but it was too late and I didn't think to screenshot it.
    Irritating people? USE the Ignore feature under Community > Friends & Contacts > Edit Ignore List and ADD THEM there. Or, click this - EDIT IGNORE LIST. Btw, MMO never meant "all together now". It simply means a server capable of supporting simultaneous play of hundreds or even thousands of players. Anything else is false narrative.

  19. #44
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    40
    Quote Originally Posted by Antelino View Post
    How sad is that we are in 2020 and we still talking about Server lag of the game...i know its 12+ years old but thats not supposed to be our problem...!we playing a game that sometimes we need more than 6-7 sec to do a skill! nothing to do with fps lag or anything else! before the update for example in moors we had 35 sec delay on skills...YES 35 sec delay on skill...and still SSG trying to milk money out of it! instead of fixing their servers! they introduce new update new 6 mans new raid new new...they cant understand that if they fix the server lag the income will be higher than now...we manage to send massive tickets to fix it after 2-3 days GM came and did restart to the server and he thinks like that can solve issue! also said that if we continue sending tickets about lag he will ban us...Thats lotro gms work i guess! and still none from SSG have replied about those kind of forum problems!
    As we ride across Pelennor we take bets on whether we will be dumped in the river, face planted in the wall, stand motionless for seconds or watch our speeds go from 16 to zero 10 times along the ride. Will it be 30 seconds 'til we can hit an Uruk, how long will he be standing there figuring out that he's dead? Already in use, already in use haunts our dreams. No wonder the CM have jumped passed this area and refuses to craft or enter the poorest of performing spaces. If he can't answer the technical questions, have someone else come explain stuff, not paid to be "economical" I guess. Each maintenance stoppage has the performance degraded. The restarts barely give us a few hours of improvement. But it's been years and years of development with little concern for actually those who have to play in these areas. The CMs that stream play it so dreadfully, why even bother? Learning curve? Flat-lined more like.

  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Namma View Post
    On another note, that is perhaps related to this, on Brandywine at Kheledul collecting storage boxes when a multi-boxer came through dragging three alts. Intent on my quests I didn't realize until turning the quest in that the multi-boxer, level 14 (I had clicked on the leader always do to see if it's a high level deeding), was shooting the mobs from non-warsteeds in a non-mount-battle zone.

    I was stunned to realize that, but it was too late and I didn't think to screenshot it.
    Persistent beyond any known measured lag, the player remained on a non combat mount issuing ranged attacks?



    It is possible for an observer to have slow rendering suggest this situation but to have it be persistent is clearly not intended.
    Università degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" Sapienza University of Rome

    Graduate PhD con lode Scienze della Politica

  21. #46

    do they even care?

    It would be awesome (or respectful?!) to get an official reaction by a blue name or SSG employee whether they even care about the players - or just their money.

    Lags make the game painful to play. Very sad, because game and atmosphere is great.

    Please let us know, if you plan to do something about this major issue. It kills this Beautiful game.

    Regards

  22. #47
    Lag has always been part of the game. If you object to this type of fun, you're not a true Tolkien fan.
    “ädvëntürës ärë nöt äll pönÿ-rïdës ïn mäÿ-sünshïnë.”

  23. #48
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    94
    Tolkien must've had alot of lag then. I've played since cap lvl 65 and codemasters, there was nowhere near this kinda lag. For me tha lag started get worse when Rohan came and Warsteed. And then Minas Tirith was extreme. And now Morgul.

    Quote Originally Posted by NeebPlayer View Post
    Lag has always been part of the game. If you object to this type of fun, you're not a true Tolkien fan.

  24. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by HeliStorm View Post
    Tolkien must've had alot of lag then. I've played since cap lvl 65 and codemasters, there was nowhere near this kinda lag. For me tha lag started get worse when Rohan came and Warsteed. And then Minas Tirith was extreme. And now Morgul.
    You see, I started playing in RoR, so all I ever knew was lag. I thought it was part of the lore or something, but now people are basically acting like it's not intentional. I don't know how to process that. I might need to seek help.
    “ädvëntürës ärë nöt äll pönÿ-rïdës ïn mäÿ-sünshïnë.”

  25. #50
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    SW, US
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by sapienze View Post
    Persistent beyond any known measured lag, the player remained on a non combat mount issuing ranged attacks?


    It is possible for an observer to have slow rendering suggest this situation but to have it be persistent is clearly not intended.

    Except that ALL of the players (three of them behind the leader) were on horses and ALL were shooting. They were taking down groups of mobs and then riding to the next group.

    It's odd, but the only reason I can think of that I didn't instantly think "wth?" was because I am used to riders shooting things up over on Evernight where I've progressed into mounted battle for some time now.

    They weren't war-steeds, which wouldn't have normally allowed mounted combat in a low level area anyway.

    Imho, someone was exploiting something. I have no idea how or what, but I know what I saw. If I see it again I will take a screenshot and send it in.
    Irritating people? USE the Ignore feature under Community > Friends & Contacts > Edit Ignore List and ADD THEM there. Or, click this - EDIT IGNORE LIST. Btw, MMO never meant "all together now". It simply means a server capable of supporting simultaneous play of hundreds or even thousands of players. Anything else is false narrative.

 

 
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