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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    This isn't the case. We do have a lot of quests that involve earning the trust of the Dunedain, though, so it might require a lot of reworking to get everything to make sense.
    You mean like my Lothlórien Elves having to earn Reputation to actually enter Lothlórien? There is a lot in regards to the reputation system that doesn't make sense with character heritage, this wouldn't be anything new.

    But I'm with others here, first get your servers back to a decent stage before you add anything new. Playing right know is a pain in the butt.

  2. #27
    Ent Runekeeper, please.

  3. #28
    What we REALLY need is a halfling-beorning! Can you imagine how cute the bear-form would be?? Like a bear cub or a koala - that cute! *Squeeeee*

    And I'm sure MoL could develop a most interesting storyline about how halflings and beornings in the Vales of the Anduin came to pick posies together...

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    This isn't the case. We do have a lot of quests that involve earning the trust of the Dunedain, though, so it might require a lot of reworking to get everything to make sense.

    MoL
    That what I was thinking, all those quests where everyone *knows* you're not a Dunadan would be really weird if your character *was*. More weird than Caras Galadhon pincushioning Lothlorien Elves, anyway, as that's obviously a gameplay mechanic relic, not a repeated, ongoing writing theme

    Gondorians make perfectly good Dunedain for all practical purposes anyway. Gondor is swimming in Dunedain, after all. Shorter, not as long lived, Dunedain.

    *votes for Hobbit Captain, cuz Merry is totally a Captain of Hobbitses*
    Last edited by Starsmith; Jan 14 2020 at 01:35 PM.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    This isn't the case. We do have a lot of quests that involve earning the trust of the Dunedain, though, so it might require a lot of reworking to get everything to make sense.
    MoL
    Make sense? Make sense?
    My Elf, who is a Kindred to Rivendell, Galadhrim and Malledhrim, and got a horse to show for it, shows up at Felegoth, which IS populated by Malledhrim (that I am kindred to), and the vendor is like, who the heck are you, go clean up some wine spills or something before I allow you to buy anything! And that #### Legolas whose derriere I been covering in Lihngris not a month ago, mowing down hordes of spiders while he mainly hid in the bushes, stands not 5 feet away smirking, within earshot of his daddy's thone, and won't say a thing!

    If THAT makes sense, then all those NPC Dunedain treating a Dunedain player about the same as an average orc should be just peachy.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by scorrp10 View Post
    Make sense? Make sense?
    My Elf, who is a Kindred to Rivendell, Galadhrim and Malledhrim, and got a horse to show for it, shows up at Felegoth, which IS populated by Malledhrim (that I am kindred to), and the vendor is like, who the heck are you, go clean up some wine spills or something before I allow you to buy anything! And that #### Legolas whose derriere I been covering in Lihngris not a month ago, mowing down hordes of spiders while he mainly hid in the bushes, stands not 5 feet away smirking, within earshot of his daddy's thone, and won't say a thing!

    If THAT makes sense, then all those NPC Dunedain treating a Dunedain player about the same as an average orc should be just peachy.
    To be fair, they do that to *everyone*, elf or no elf. It's not in the quest writing saying to your elf, "Well, you're not an Elf, but we'll let you see this specific Elf-Only thing because you've gained our trust", as there are in some Ranger quests. Which is why a Dunadan race would be hard from a writing standpoint, rather than a weird game mechanical where *everyone* has to gain reputation trust.

    ETA: Not that it isn't silly or jarring, for sure! "I AM CELEBRATED IN MINAS TIRITH, TURGON, NO IT ISN'T MY FIRST TIME HERE."
    Last edited by Starsmith; Jan 14 2020 at 06:19 PM.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by scorrp10 View Post
    Make sense? Make sense?
    My Elf, who is a Kindred to Rivendell, Galadhrim and Malledhrim, and got a horse to show for it, shows up at Felegoth, which IS populated by Malledhrim (that I am kindred to), and the vendor is like, who the heck are you, go clean up some wine spills or something before I allow you to buy anything! And that #### Legolas whose derriere I been covering in Lihngris not a month ago, mowing down hordes of spiders while he mainly hid in the bushes, stands not 5 feet away smirking, within earshot of his daddy's thone, and won't say a thing!

    If THAT makes sense, then all those NPC Dunedain treating a Dunedain player about the same as an average orc should be just peachy.
    My pet peeve with npc quest lines are the Rangers in Enedwaith sitting by camp fires and having you do errands after you went all over Ereiador listening to their tales and doing their errands just to get them to leave Eriador. Talk about a bunch of ungrateful(lot of bad words go here)......

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidmeetHal View Post
    My pet peeve with npc quest lines are the Rangers in Enedwaith sitting by camp fires and having you do errands after you went all over Ereiador listening to their tales and doing their errands just to get them to leave Eriador. Talk about a bunch of ungrateful(lot of bad words go here)......
    It's my personal head canon that eventually, Halbarad lined up the entire Grey Company and then rode down the line with his hand extended, just so he could slap them all with maximum efficiency

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatty View Post
    We've had Three races added to the game since launch, which correspond to Three of the four original races (Beorning - Man, High Elf - Elf, Stout-axe - Dorf). Can we realistically expect an eighth race to be added? The logical would be some sort of Hobbit-kin, in case, but are there any that could realistically be added, lore-wise? Possibly an Enedwaith Hobbit? Barring that, are there any other races that could realistically be added lore-wise? Dunedain, possibly?
    A new Hobbit sub-race would be ideal for a Scouring of the Shire expansion, which should be a couple years from now.

    And yes, they definitely need to be Lore-masters. I'd instantly roll one if so.
    Arda Shrugged - Elendilstone / Landroval / Anor

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starsmith View Post
    It's my personal head canon that eventually, Halbarad lined up the entire Grey Company and then rode down the line with his hand extended, just so he could slap them all with maximum efficiency
    I'm so glad that no one was in my office to see me laugh lol!

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    This isn't the case. We do have a lot of quests that involve earning the trust of the Dunedain, though, so it might require a lot of reworking to get everything to make sense.

    MoL
    Thanks for clarifying - at least there is no legal hurdle then!
    Aldosi - Ithil; Aldowine - Arkenstone; Aldogost - Landroval

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Echoweaver View Post
    That'd get me to shell out for a race change....
    Any idea what the official name for the race change token is or how much it costs? I haven't been able to find it in the lotro store...

  13. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I think they must be, to have survived this long!

    MoL
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidmeetHal View Post
    That's actually a very good point. And they aren't very well liked by the general populace also.
    Very much true! And, incidentally, it is hard to be liked when you demand free services as proof of good faith every time someone meets you.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by WorrBinpike View Post
    I hope they do nothing in this direction. This game has a lot of more important problems to solve.
    Agree 100%. When the game is suffering from more problems than you could sake a hobbit at, wasting development time on superfluous fluff such as yet another player race is bonkers.

  15. #40
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    personally i d preffer rolling a new class than a new race
    especially those subraces we ve got .........
    as i ve said in the past(so many many times), dwarves is the most neglated race, even with the stouts.......
    anyone can see this!
    having the capn class open to them is a good move,
    tho i d prefer something new and there are some good suggestions,
    offered by members of this community, latelly, just before the last expansion........
    i believe the Dev's will have something for the hobbits ths time in mind,
    as it looks like the scouring will be part of the next expansion.......
    hoping i will see something new cos the suggested classes to open for the hobbits,
    (capn, champ, lolmaster), does not fit their race at all!!!!
    meanwhile or along with the hobbits, i d love to see a new class coming out for the dwarves!!!!
    another matter that troubles the community is the class balance.......
    personally i believe that only a few details need to be made, especially rebalancing the champions 3 lines, ofc the red line needs to lot of care.....
    maybe adding a shield to him again!(the light version of the capn would be great!)
    at last there are 1 or 2 more things i d like to see.......
    the 1st is more new neighborhoods after the release of the rohhirc style.....
    one with the style of Dale AND Lake town,(could be compbined into one by building a neighborhood close to the lake Esgaroth or to any other lake)........
    the second one is opening all the seaside areas from anfalas to Lindon, shire's southfarthing and southern road areas......
    lotr enthousiast since 1996, 12 years lotro player, lifetimer, Loyal member of the Spartans Kinship and leading Steward atm, now in Evernight imigrants from Eldar

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Valakircka View Post
    i believe the Dev's will have something for the hobbits ths time in mind,
    as it looks like the scouring will be part of the next expansion.......

    Err what! You have my attention. Do you have a source for this bit of info?
    Università degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" Sapienza University of Rome

    Graduate PhD con lode Scienze della Politica

  17. #42
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    While I would love Enedwaith Stoors, instead of Captains or LMs they should have a new light armor melee class.
    Come join House of the Heavenly Arch, a Discord server for LGBT Fans of LOTR: https://discord.gg/9QfKMPJ
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  18. #43
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    My vote would be no on a new hobbit-race. Stoor is already one of the options upon character creation, so that would have to be removed. The lore-historical Stoors got absorbed into the southeast Shire hobbits (Farmer Maggot / Brandybucks). It's already a major stretch to encounter actual Stoors in Enedwaith.

    I am in favor of more hobbit classes, though. If a hobbit can be a truth-and-justice spear-and-javelin Warden superhero class, they can be captain for sure. Runekeeper is harder to justify lore-wise, and I suspect there's an issue with loremaster because staff-weapons are enormous compared to hobbits XD

    ...also this may be unpopular but I'm really hoping we don't get Scouring of the Shire. They'd have to create a new post-war Shire region that would just be depressing as hell- worse than Mordor, seeing the Shire wrecked. On top of that, it'd be really boring. A defeated, powerless Saruman in charge of a few human thugs. Hard to make it end-game-worthy. In the books the whole point was that the hobbits had to do the work themselves to put their home back in order. It's silly to imagine an army of humans/elves/beornings/dwarves/loremasters/captains/etc running around helping Frodo and Sam kick the butts of a few cowardly ruffians.
    Last edited by Halphast; Jan 15 2020 at 12:14 PM.

  19. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    ...also this may be unpopular but I'm really hoping we don't get Scouring of the Shire. They'd have to create a new post-war Shire region that would just be depressing as hell- worse than Mordor, seeing the Shire wrecked. On top of that, it'd be really boring. A defeated, powerless Saruman in charge of a few human thugs. Hard to make it end-game-worthy. In the books the whole point was that the hobbits had to do the work themselves to put their home back in order. It's silly to imagine an army of humans/elves/beornings/dwarves/loremasters/captains/etc running around helping Frodo and Sam kick the butts of a few cowardly ruffians.
    Yes I get what you are saying. It was just terrible having...


    Mobs of Elves hanging out in the 21st hall of Moria.

    Hoards of Dwarves running unhindered throughout Lothlorien.

    Parades of Hobbits galavanting merrily through Ithilien.

    A sleuth of Bears dancing through Mordor.



    Terrible I tell ya. Just a travesty



    Why would it be so boring?

    The Scouring of the Shire tells more about what Hobbits represent in Tolkien's world then the entirety of Frodo and Sam's journey. Hobbits as a race, as a people. Their resiliency. Their forgiveness and their absolutes to unhindered freedom and choice. This chapter(s) in the book become full circle and show how through adversity even the meekest of people can prevail through unity of family and friend. The Scouring of the Shire story and its reclaiming is the true reward with the destruction of the Ring. The Elves, Dwarves, and Men are but the vehicle to tell the Hobbit story.

    In case people forget. It was Gandalf whose very reason to take up the quest to lead the fellowship was, he believed it to be the small acts of kindness that made Middle Earth worth saving from the evils of Sauron. I'd say it was a good chance he had Hobbit Folk in mind in this belief. They gave Gandalf the desire and will to do so.

    As terrible as it may be seeing the Shire scoured. That it would seem equally, if not more so, to see it become beautiful again. Not only in its land but its people as well. The Scouring of the Shire needs to be told. Not because I'd want it. Because it is part of the story.



    But what is one person's opinion, in the way for progression of extended tales being told elsewhere in uninmagined lands far off to the East?
    Università degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" Sapienza University of Rome

    Graduate PhD con lode Scienze della Politica

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by sapienze View Post
    Yes I get what you are saying. It was just terrible having...
    Mobs of Elves hanging out in the 21st hall of Moria.
    Hoards of Dwarves running unhindered throughout Lothlorien.
    Parades of Hobbits galavanting merrily through Ithilien.
    A sleuth of Bears dancing through Mordor.
    Terrible I tell ya. Just a travesty
    Ok ok you made me smile with this. XD Just to be clear- I'm not saying other races shouldn't be allowed in the Shire. It's way too late for that!

    My main point is that the Scouring is about the Hobbits solving their own problems, saving their own country. Gandalf didn't come back with them- the rest of the Fellowship didn't come back with them. That's why it would spoil things to see a fellowship of glowing-Morgul-armor-clad Elves running around doing it for them. The Scouring is all about the hobbits saving the hobbits.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapienze View Post
    Why would it be so boring?
    Because the threat was supposed to be something un-trained hobbit farmers were able to overcome. De-powered Saruman (who didn't even participate in the fighting) and a handful of lazy, cowardly brigands. Imagine the brigands from Old Odo's Leaf Farm and Narrowcleeve being the enemies- but they were. The fight was underwhelming and pathetic- sorrowful that both Men and Hobbits died, but the four Fellowship Hobbits simply led the locals (NPCS) in overpowering what was largely just a psychological enslavement. That's why I say adding it to LOTRO now would (and should) be very dull- it's impossible to stay true to the original, or even the spirit of the original, while trying to make the Scouring into "end-game" content. What could they do? Surprise- Saruman wasn't REALLY de-powered? Yet another zombie dragon? Shelob secretly escaped and ran to Buckland? More likely it'll just be brigands and Grima Wormtongue with 100 Million morale.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapienze View Post
    As terrible as it may be seeing the Shire scoured. That it would seem equally, if not more so, to see it become beautiful again. Not only in its land but its people as well. The Scouring of the Shire needs to be told. Not because I'd want it. Because it is part of the story.
    I agree with you about the importance of the scouring to the original story. But within the story of LOTRO, the way its story has been told as a game, the subtle value of the Scouring I don't think means as much (again, especially with level 140(?) characters of all races, fresh out of Minas Morgul, coming to the hobbits' rescue).

    An interesting note- I think the "scouring" refers not to the way Saruman spoiled it, but "scouring" as in deep-cleaning or scrubbing with an abrasive, like scouring out a dirty pot. The Scouring is what Frodo et al. did to clean up the Shire after it was spoiled. I used to think of it the other way until recently.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniyel View Post
    Any idea what the official name for the race change token is or how much it costs? I haven't been able to find it in the lotro store...
    I don't think it's available yet. We assumed it was coming at the same time as Minas Morgul since it was talked about at the same time as that announcement, but they're still working on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    ...also this may be unpopular but I'm really hoping we don't get Scouring of the Shire. They'd have to create a new post-war Shire region that would just be depressing as hell- worse than Mordor, seeing the Shire wrecked. On top of that, it'd be really boring. A defeated, powerless Saruman in charge of a few human thugs. Hard to make it end-game-worthy. In the books the whole point was that the hobbits had to do the work themselves to put their home back in order. It's silly to imagine an army of humans/elves/beornings/dwarves/loremasters/captains/etc running around helping Frodo and Sam kick the butts of a few cowardly ruffians.
    The entire game is one extended exercise in suspension of disbelief. Of course there weren't dozens of Elves running around the Shire killing wolves, Hobbits invading Mordor and killing Belryg, etc. You play the story as if your character is unique on these adventures though you may find a few fellows along the way for certain events. For every major event in the books, our characters are either present or follow closely behind the book characters and deal with what came next. The Scouring would be no different. Although the books don't mention any Elves, Dwarves, Men, or Beornings aiding the Hobbits in taking back their homeland, that's almost certainly exactly what we will be doing at some point. And I for one can't wait for it!
    Arda Shrugged - Elendilstone / Landroval / Anor

  22. #47
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    While Hobbits are busy handling the ruffians, we the brave adventurers will be in the nearby forest, holding off a horde of orcs and a dragon from coming to the ruffians' aid.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by scorrp10 View Post
    While Hobbits are busy handling the ruffians, we the brave adventurers will be in the nearby forest, holding off a horde of orcs and a dragon from coming to the ruffians' aid.
    There is a new Level 50'ish area that was discovered along the Brandywine, a bit north of the Brandy Hills in the area of the map closed off by 'mountains'. It's not accessible yet though. Can't see any Orcs or Dragons either. :O
    << Co-founder of The Firebrands of Caruja on Landroval >>
    Ceolford of Dale, Dorolin, Tordag, Garberend Bellheather, Colfinn Belegorn, Garmo Butterbuckles, Calensarn Nimlos, Langtiriel, Bergteir


  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by gildhur View Post
    The entire game is one extended exercise in suspension of disbelief. Of course there weren't dozens of Elves running around the Shire killing wolves, Hobbits invading Mordor and killing Belryg, etc. You play the story as if your character is unique on these adventures though you may find a few fellows along the way for certain events. For every major event in the books, our characters are either present or follow closely behind the book characters and deal with what came next. The Scouring would be no different. Although the books don't mention any Elves, Dwarves, Men, or Beornings aiding the Hobbits in taking back their homeland, that's almost certainly exactly what we will be doing at some point. And I for one can't wait for it!
    This would be different. The Scouring isn't a "big event" like the great battles of the war, it's purposely low-key, the hobbits cleaning house in a way that they could and fighting enemies that they could feasibly deal with by themselves - it's *their* story, not ours, nor that of any of the rest of the Fellowship. The point Halphast made was a very good one - none of the rest of the Fellowship were there, Gandalf having gone off by himself after they'd visited Bree, so there is absolutely no plausibility to our characters continuing to trail along after them like dogs on a leash when nobody else does. Story-wise, Gandalf had to be elsewhere so as to not dominate what happened, but you think it'd be okay for us to be there and dominate the whole thing instead? The best thing the devs could do would be either (a) have the whole thing as session play, with our characters out of the way entirely or (b) we have a parallel side-story that allows the events of the Scouring to play out as they should while we still help in some way, i.e. without us being seen to intervene in a way that would be so obtrusive as to make the whole thing our story.

    I can't see quite what you're imagining we should be doing, if we just piled in there alongside Merry and Pippin. If the thugs were made so threatening as to be a challenge to our characters, then they should already have crushed the resistance the Tooks had been putting up and turned that part of the Shire into a charnel house. It'd look even more daft if there were monsters roaming around. And how about Saruman, if he were anything more than a bitter old man at that point then that would be total and utter fail (as if Gandalf were such a n00b that he couldn't make a proper job of stripping him of his powers). So go on, do tell, just what do you imagine there being in the Shire that's such a threat that it requires mighty heroes in shining armour to deal with it?

  25. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Halphast View Post
    An interesting note- I think the "scouring" refers not to the way Saruman spoiled it, but "scouring" as in deep-cleaning or scrubbing with an abrasive, like scouring out a dirty pot. The Scouring is what Frodo et al. did to clean up the Shire after it was spoiled. I used to think of it the other way until recently.

    I always seen the name for that part of the book to have a dual meaning. Looking at it from both perspectives allows the word scour to be equally applicable. Imo Saruman didn't think highly of the Hobbits and saw the Shire as an infestation. Clearing the Shire out to serve his purposes. Alternately, Frodo and Sam returning home discovering their visions were real and cleaning up the strife caused by Saruman and his henchmen.


    Session play throughout the story has been very limited and lacking in many regards. Having this segment of the story downgraded to session play would be boring. Having a dual layer scaled might offer a better solution. Neither one works all that great.

    I expect players will see The Scouring of the Shire to be a series cut scenes played out by going to those relevant roles in the Shire. A story by each character until each has told their part. Finalizing by seeing Sam with his family and a background of a new Shire.
    Università degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" Sapienza University of Rome

    Graduate PhD con lode Scienze della Politica

 

 
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