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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
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    275

    Sick of Monster play characters influence on outside of moors.

    Creeps and moors should just be either COMPLETELY reworked or deleted, as it is, it is 100% unhealthy emotional drama filled place for very select few people. It just does not work / fit into current state of the game, at all.

    Two paths:

    #1. Delete the whole monster play.

    #2. Update monster play to be available to non VIP accounts.
    -Make area and monster play classes available through LP just like Warden, RK, Beorning.

    -Open all landscape for all monster play classes. Keeping City landscapes and other "safe areas" (where there are quest or guard NPC of any Freep type present) Monster play characters free. Something like all the guards could have an insta kill on all creeps they see, anywhere.

    -Make PvP on all Freeps and Creeps a toggle option. If it is not on: you can not fight them.

    Option Number two would give a HUGE (it is 6!!) number of classes to the game. Would open up landscape to the existing players that play on that side and make them happy? (if it is possible).

    As a result the game could suddenly have 16 classes in place of 10 plus unknown to most PvMp.




    Why I am posting this here?
    I play Burglar class. I have never really gone to Moors even though I run VIP most of the time.

    People that run Monster play characters all the time come into Burglar subforums and demand nerf to Burglar class.
    - I am very unhappy with this personally because i ever came to moors to use the practice dummy.

    It is however clear to me that Monster play is EXTREMELY narrow very gimped affair in a tiny area.

    Monster play characters should be a more or less mainstream characters as i describe before. With obvious limitations, obviously. (They should never want or stand at the sount gate of Bree town) Also PvP option of the game should be a toggle on/off and if you meet one in the landscape, you should still be able to go on with your epic quest.

    With Best regards,
    -Looking for resolution to this long standing clearly a problem, for some that influences the rest of the game in a negative way.

    Bottom line:

    Monster characters should either be in or out. This is not right or wrong, just my humble opinion.
    dadislotroguides.com -Burg Guide
    Den of Thieves -All Burglar kin on Brandywine
    Areyekuwe on LOTRO wiki -link to the LOTRO wiki
    lotrointerface.com -LOTRO plugins

  2. #2

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Boring stuff
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhTiJEYqqY8
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  3. #3

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Magnumum View Post
    The problem
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rver8vjc04U
    Last edited by Yuzuriha_EN; Jun 13 2019 at 11:29 PM.
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Shire
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    Monster Play Characters / area are completely STUCK.

    The recent talk of a "New Class" in light of Monster Play Classes (all 6 of them) ignored is really not smart. These classes are coded, built, played and abandoned.

    They need to in as many ways come to Freep side proliferation in the game. They just more or less HAVE to become regular classes. Not that they would be able to do Epic Book Quest or go to Elrond's Library. But that is not the point is it?

    They could still kill bears and slugs in landscape if they want to. Like what Slugs in some marsh land have done to any of Freeps? - Nothing, yet we get a "deed" for killing them.
    dadislotroguides.com -Burg Guide
    Den of Thieves -All Burglar kin on Brandywine
    Areyekuwe on LOTRO wiki -link to the LOTRO wiki
    lotrointerface.com -LOTRO plugins

  5. #5

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    I don't realise I'm boring
    yaaawn
    Last edited by Yuzuriha_EN; Jun 13 2019 at 11:29 PM.
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by Yuzuriha_EN View Post
    yaaawn
    You do not imagine how much I play PvP , ((plz play on zerg creeps)) ....

  7. #7

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Magnumum View Post
    You do not imagine how much I play Hello Kitty Online.
    PS1: yaaawn

    PS2: read the fabulous manual, good night.
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by Yuzuriha_EN View Post
    PS1: yaaawn

    PS2: read the fabulous manual, good night.
    Xd When you have a warg at rank 15, you sign me ...... you play like a noob in blackarrow with a skill (Bravo) deserved m8 , snare , snare and snare ^^

  9. #9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Magnumum View Post
    Xd When you have a warg at rank 15, you sign me ...... I play like a noob in burglar ^^


    Assuming Evernight is the Only Server? k3k

    PS: Show me your warg

    PS1: yaaawn

    PS2: Go bed, zS
    Last edited by Yuzuriha_EN; Jun 11 2019 at 09:02 PM.
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    204
    You smoked ... it's not my warg .

  11. #11

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Magnumum View Post
    I'd dream of that warg
    I am not aware that I have a stolen account. Go to sleep, do yourself a favor
    Last edited by Yuzuriha_EN; Jun 13 2019 at 11:28 PM.
    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Game's Founders Club

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    204
    kiss lol

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    #1. Delete the whole monster play.
    No. They need to fix it. It's not hard. Most of the classes are still at base 85 just scaled improperly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    #2. Update monster play to be available to non VIP accounts.
    -Make area and monster play classes available through LP just like Warden, RK, Beorning.
    Great idea. If you never ever want to moors. Moors will always be dual logged with level 10 freeps and will be closed to people who want to fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    -Open all landscape for all monster play classes. Keeping City landscapes and other "safe areas" (where there are quest or guard NPC of any Freep type present) Monster play characters free. Something like all the guards could have an insta kill on all creeps they see, anywhere.
    Okay this is actually a relevant idea. I like it. Only thing is people would complain about being camped in low level places by super high level monster players. Only issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    -Make PvP on all Freeps and Creeps a toggle option. If it is not on: you can not fight them.
    As my last comment, this would go hand in hand with that. Not a toggle option, but a level gated thing. Like say 1-5 levels in between. The hobbits didn't choose to go to isengard themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Option Number two would give a HUGE (it is 6!!) number of classes to the game. Would open up landscape to the existing players that play on that side and make them happy? (if it is possible).
    Alright. This is extremely dumb. You don't need more classes to be good at a game, you're fine with 6. That's plenty to choose from. Adding more only causes issues like with the bear. We all agree its extremely overpowered in anything it does? Perfect. Moving on. That being said, PvP is not PvE. Nobody wants to go around a map killing cows at GTA when there's freeps at TR. Why. You're crazy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    People that run Monster play characters all the time come into Burglar subforums and demand nerf to Burglar class.
    - I am very unhappy with this personally because i ever came to moors to use the practice dummy.

    It is however clear to me that Monster play is EXTREMELY narrow very gimped affair in a tiny area.
    This is the whole problem. Monsterplay was abandoned by GMs and Mods a long time ago. They tried to make it more appealing to PvE'ers giving them audacity and reasons to PvE in a PVP ZONE. People complained because they kept dying and didn't know how to play their classes effectively and efficiently so they cried for nerf. This is the circle of issues that begins.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    With Best regards,
    -Looking for resolution to this long standing clearly a problem, for some that influences the rest of the game in a negative way.
    Simple. Remove Audacity, scale mobs, bring back hotspots, scale creep classes, possibly remove run speed buffs and horses, problem solved. No extra maps needed. Just the ONE we have.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Creeps and moors should just be either COMPLETELY reworked or deleted, as it is, it is 100% unhealthy emotional drama filled place for very select few people. It just does not work / fit into current state of the game, at all.
    Your premises are entirely correct, but the conclusions aren't. It's always been filled with drama, like just about every PvP aspect of a game. That doesn't mean it needs to be removed, or doesn't fit in the game. It fits in the game perfectly fine, and has for years.

    Two paths:

    #1. Delete the whole monster play.
    This doesn't make sense. No one forces you to come anywhere near the Ettenmoors if you do not wish to. Deleting an entire aspect of the game, just because you do not like it, is the most selfish thing that I've read in a long time.

    #2. Update monster play to be available to non VIP accounts.
    -Make area and monster play classes available through LP just like Warden, RK, Beorning.

    -Open all landscape for all monster play classes. Keeping City landscapes and other "safe areas" (where there are quest or guard NPC of any Freep type present) Monster play characters free. Something like all the guards could have an insta kill on all creeps they see, anywhere.

    -Make PvP on all Freeps and Creeps a toggle option. If it is not on: you can not fight them.

    Option Number two would give a HUGE (it is 6!!) number of classes to the game. Would open up landscape to the existing players that play on that side and make them happy? (if it is possible).

    As a result the game could suddenly have 16 classes in place of 10 plus unknown to most PvMp.
    What world do you live in? This isn't realistic. If those are your two options, you haven't thought hard enough.

    Why I am posting this here?
    I play Burglar class. I have never really gone to Moors even though I run VIP most of the time.

    People that run Monster play characters all the time come into Burglar subforums and demand nerf to Burglar class.
    - I am very unhappy with this personally because i ever came to moors to use the practice dummy.

    It is however clear to me that Monster play is EXTREMELY narrow very gimped affair in a tiny area.
    Creep players are entirely justified in asking for nerfs to burglars. Just because their perspective is one that originated in PvMP, doesn't make their view any less valid. The exact same is seen in PvE. Burglars have too much utility, on top of survivability, on top of the highest ST DPS in the game. This makes them the single strongest DPS class in the game, and nowhere is that more evident than in PvMP, where all of these tools are combined.

    Pretending like numerous changes have been made in the past as a result of creeps' complaints is silly. PvMP has been entirely ignored for years, and any balance changes made are made on the basis of PvE, not PvMP.

    Monster characters should either be in or out. This is not right or wrong, just my humble opinion.
    This has no relation to the title of this thread, or your main message, which is pointless anyway, because SSG do not care about PvMP.
    Feailuve, Akabath, Failure - Evernight
    Also known as Giliodor

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    East USA
    Posts
    477
    If PVMP comes into normal zones, even with a toggle, I'll quit for good. The OP has good ideas, right up to this stinker of an idea. That drama and play style was separated by design, and that was a huge component in my decision to play this game.
    .

    I bring word from Lord Elrond of Rivendell. An Alliance once existed between Elves and Men. Long ago we fought and died together. We come to honor that allegiance.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by eanamdar View Post
    If PVMP comes into normal zones, even with a toggle, I'll quit for good. The OP has good ideas, right up to this stinker of an idea. That drama and play style was separated by design, and that was a huge component in my decision to play this game.
    Frankly, the OP doesn't have any good ideas.
    Feailuve, Akabath, Failure - Evernight
    Also known as Giliodor

  17. #17
    -Hate PVP drama
    -Make one on forums

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    USA
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    174
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    *inserts small text wall*
    You must not come to PvMP forums a lot. First and foremost rule of the LOTRO forums: If you want to have a post be utterly ignored, make a post in the PvMP forums. No other facet of the game has been ignored more than PvMP over the years.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
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    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Creeps and moors should just be either COMPLETELY reworked or deleted, as it is, it is 100% unhealthy emotional drama filled place for very select few people. It just does not work / fit into current state of the game, at all.

    Two paths:

    #1. Delete the whole monster play.
    In any game PvP always equals to some form of drama, it's just how it goes. I must say though, that the drama in this game is absolutely nothing compared to some of the big/competitive titles out there. Deleting PvP just because you don't like drama is definatly not the way to go. Just don't PvP if you don't like it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    #2. Update monster play to be available to non VIP accounts.
    -Make area and monster play classes available through LP just like Warden, RK, Beorning.
    Reading this makes me think that you have never ever even touched creepside. Creepside is entirely "free". Reaver can be played for free, and the 5 other classes can permanently be unlocked (bought) with LP. You can buy all trait slots with LP as well. Being VIP frees up all classes for the duration, but will permanently unlock trait slots.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    -Open all landscape for all monster play classes. Keeping City landscapes and other "safe areas" (where there are quest or guard NPC of any Freep type present) Monster play characters free. Something like all the guards could have an insta kill on all creeps they see, anywhere.

    -Make PvP on all Freeps and Creeps a toggle option. If it is not on: you can not fight them.

    Option Number two would give a HUGE (it is 6!!) number of classes to the game. Would open up landscape to the existing players that play on that side and make them happy? (if it is possible).

    As a result the game could suddenly have 16 classes in place of 10 plus unknown to most PvMp.
    That's not going to work. It's like an entire new game added to the existing game.
    If there's no capacity to tweak some creep skills once every few years, there's definitely no capacity to overhaul the entire game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Why I am posting this here?
    I play Burglar class. I have never really gone to Moors even though I run VIP most of the time.

    People that run Monster play characters all the time come into Burglar subforums and demand nerf to Burglar class.
    - I am very unhappy with this personally because i ever came to moors to use the practice dummy.
    This makes it clear you don't PvP, yet you are here complaining about it...?
    Creep don't "come all the time to demand nerfs". Nowadays there rarely are PvP related threads, most PvP players have either given up on the game or stopped asking for changes (including myself) because all will fall on deaf ears. PvP'ers aren't looking to nerf every single class into the ground. What they are looking for is some form of recognition, some form of confirmation concerning the current state of PvP and it's utter lack of updates. Creepside hasn't had any "major" changes in years, and with "major" I mean tweaking skills and traits, nothing outrageous IMO. Reaver and Warleader are both stuck at level 75 cap and are nothing but fodder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    It is however clear to me that Monster play is EXTREMELY narrow very gimped affair in a tiny area.

    Monster play characters should be a more or less mainstream characters as i describe before. With obvious limitations, obviously. (They should never want or stand at the sount gate of Bree town) Also PvP option of the game should be a toggle on/off and if you meet one in the landscape, you should still be able to go on with your epic quest.
    Like I said before, if they can't manage some tweaks or fixes to creep characters every few years, there's no way we're going to see something like open world PvP. But, just to touch on this a little bit. Does this mean creeps are also capable of toggling? Or not? And if major hubs are safe places for freepside, what about creepside? Will there be safe places for them that freeps can't reach? What would you even consider a hub? Every single city? This entire thing is a lot bigger that you make it seem, and we're just talking about general design, not even going into code or how creeps are essentially NPC's bound to a certain zone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    With Best regards,
    -Looking for resolution to this long standing clearly a problem, for some that influences the rest of the game in a negative way.

    Bottom line:

    Monster characters should either be in or out. This is not right or wrong, just my humble opinion.
    Rather strange conclusion here. Lets sum it up.
    • PvP zone that's entirely separate from landscape and you willingly have to enter to participate;
    • Ettenmoors not being updated in years;
    • Creep classes not being updated in years;
    • No recognition/acknowledgement for PvP whatsoever by the developers or the CM so far.

    Yet you claim that PvP is influencing this game in a negative way? Give me a break.
    To me it sounds like you're not satisfied with the burglar changes and are looking for a scapegoat, which is creepside/PvP.
    You're not the first, and you definitely won't be the last.
    High Chieftain Urundus
    Cohorts of the Red Legion
    Arkenstone

  20. #20
    SSG changes creeps to adjust to freeps (laughable i know). NO freep changes are made with consideration to the impact on PvMP.

    Monster play has ZERO influence outside the moors, about the only thing usefull from there that you can use outside the moors is SoE's that you can earn with comms, comms are the only thing you can earn on a creep that could affect pve

    PvMP is pretty much dead in this game anyways so no worries brother
    .

    Mortem Tyrannis

  21. #21
    That burg thread wasn't even about pvmp.
    Last edited by wretchesandkings; Jun 12 2019 at 09:11 PM.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Shire
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    Thanks for reading my thread. -Some of you.

    Some of you responded with misunderstanding. Others said "keep things the way they are" oh just make it good.

    All I have to say to you is there is wow where one can fly on the bird and drop into the middle of "Creep region"

    Currently moors and creep side are not in any way are relevant or updated. Just look at the whole map and the moors map, notice the size difference?

    Based on that on top, the disproportionate amount od drama that comes from that tiny area is strange.

    However to my thoughts, LOTRO has PVP (well it is called pvmp, which is a 1st "departure") but LOTRO has never embraced that pvp.

    My 1st reply up above does not even understand what I say about 6 new classes. (These are the creep classes that sit in the cage of moors)

    Then some one told me that when i write that i don't do moors, that is clear to them that i don't do moors, yes it is what I said. How it is possibly not clear?

    BTW, moors is only available to VIP. My proposed solution to this was open up pvp to all characters everywhere and make people just "play creep characters". SSG could make some basic creep classes and some to be purchased like RK and Warden and such.

    With lack of interest from the game at large and lack of follow up from devs (surely because of lack of interest) whole Monster Play has to be brought dramatically up or it just wastes hard drive space.

    All of the above should not be implemented as any kind of change to Freep side levelling, zones, quests. It should be totally a choice to pvp never a necessity.

    wow and daoc are excellent cases to study.
    dadislotroguides.com -Burg Guide
    Den of Thieves -All Burglar kin on Brandywine
    Areyekuwe on LOTRO wiki -link to the LOTRO wiki
    lotrointerface.com -LOTRO plugins

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    London
    Posts
    531
    Here is my understanding;

    Creeps are essentially 'stuck' they were based off NPC coding, which is why you can note some similarities between the session play instances in volume 1 (Where you play as an Angmarim blood-letter) to a newly created creep. It is also the reason I'm given to understand is the reasoning behind why they are confined to the old trait system and as such any major overhaul would take too much time and effort.

    With that in mind; it is also not currently possible to travel between Eriador and Rhovanion (Unless the new passage-way between Misties and the Vales of Anduin has changed this), and likewise between Rhovanion and Gondor (iirc) without entering some interior location. So this in itself would be a hurdle to creeps, unless of course you propose giving them access to the Walls of Moria & likewise Moria etc.

    You can currently purchase time in the ettenmoors on the store (Or via Mithril Coins which is basically the same thing, so).. But I agree in the respect that what players actually get for being VIP is... very little in comparison to most other games, and whilst that may be the case, no, the Ettenmoors should probably no longer be gated behind having to be VIP - especially considering if you play a creep you can just buy 100% access via buying the class of your choice, and as such will never be restricted, yet freeps are...

    Ultimately, Creeps are at a fundamental disadvantage based on a design flaw that was never rectified, this may have further reaching implications into their limitations more than you or I am aware, and any change would ultimately require too much manpower and time for an already struggling company who have said many times that PvMP won't be touched until their 'ongoing' class balance is finished (AKA Never).

  24. #24
    Just stop talking, you don't know what pvpers want, hell even pvpers themselves don't know what they want, but at least they have a general direction. The issue lies in balance and lag, but you're suggesting something completely different and irrelavent. Osgiliath was Turbine's attempt at expanding pvmp, and it was eventually completely abandoned. In hindsight, was a complete waste of money.

    And stop bring up pvmp on that burg thread. Other people aren't discussing it, but you're the one who keeps bringing it back. The guy you quoted literally said nothing about pvmp, but you brought it back up because of what, his signature?

    I'll give you one thing though, pvmp should be free because of as it is, it doesn't deserve to be a vip feature.

  25. #25
    [QUOTE=Areyekuwe;7939775]Creeps and moors should just be either COMPLETELY reworked or deleted, as it is, it is 100% unhealthy emotional drama filled place for very select few people. It just does not work / fit into current state of the game, at all.

    Two paths:

    #1. Delete the whole monster play.
    seems you cause the drama , never come to ettens or
    delete your account .
    My humble opinion./

 

 
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