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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeviternus View Post
    I absolutely think burglars need to be nerfed, but this statement is nonsensical. Red burglars should be able to DPS in a raid as much as any DPS spec. Just because your personal preference says that they shouldn't, doesn't make it right. You cannot give a single justification for why a red burglar should objectively be any less viable of a DPS than a red hunter. You can try, and fail, if you wish, but this statement is purely an opinion, and yet you try to pass it off as a fact.
    Good reasonable point as to why not DPS

    So, let me ask you why not leave things as they are?

    A justification then?

    I personally 100% convinced that burglar DPS is NOT strongest, it just became real instead of a joke that it was for years

    So, all the people that have all other class as pic come to here (burglar class subforum) and demand nerf.

    Class envy based on what?

    All that mysterious image of burglar class. Well it kept us gimped for years as least played class of the game. Now we are better and you are upset?

    Some things can not be helped
    Last edited by Areyekuwe; Jun 10 2019 at 05:40 PM.
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  2. #27
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    For last two years I have posted in forums that Burglar class is stuck in the past and not a good version of the past, is too weak and needs a boost.

    There was overwhelming support for boost in damage output during past year burglar class feedback. All sorts of forums are full of these type of threads.

    Now that damage boost has arrived people that did not participate in any of these discussions are here and demand a nerf.

    This is really disheartening.
    I still stand by my opinion that there are 2 ranged DPS classes that DPS higher and more sustained and not from melee range.
    And based even simply on that we are in a good spot.
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  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeviternus View Post
    I absolutely think burglars need to be nerfed, but this statement is nonsensical. Red burglars should be able to DPS in a raid as much as any DPS spec. Just because your personal preference says that they shouldn't, doesn't make it right. You cannot give a single justification for why a red burglar should objectively be any less viable of a DPS than a red hunter. You can try, and fail, if you wish, but this statement is purely an opinion, and yet you try to pass it off as a fact.
    oh sorry my bad, i was just quoting him, he is the one who said that... i don't mind burg being able to dps in raid, as i said and everyone who actually do t2/t3 raid not just landscape quests, burg is already the best ST dps, and best 3 man aoe dps... what i do mind is them having so much utility while doing the most ST dps, it was exactly like fire RKs back in abyss before the nerfs. having armor debuff/fire debuff/DNFs while doing the most damage is just stupid. now burg is doing the most damage while having so many defensive skills that basically makes him unkillable and good CC as well. KO a skill with 1m 15s cd that reduces the incoming damage by 85% , and you can reset that with ready and able... like what the actual #### + provoke on a 6s cd of course , in combat stealth, TnG ... even with a 5m cd, you can still reset it as well. and even 5 min cd is not that high for lotro. not to mention the mezzes/addle and all this is in redline. nerf those and keep the burg #1 dps, imo they should be. or keep those but nerf the dps, they can't just have both.
    Please Listen to the feedback

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Good reasonable point as to why not DPS

    So, let me ask you why not leave things as they are?

    A justification then?

    I personally 100% convinced that burglar DPS is NOT strongest, it just became real instead of a joke that it was for years

    So, all the people that have all other class as pic come to here (burglar class subforum) and demand nerf.

    Class envy based on what?

    All that mysterious image of burglar class. Well it kept us gimped for years as least played class of the game. Now we are better and you are upset?

    Some things can not be helped
    sounds like you were the one envious of other class and were really bitter.
    Last edited by wretchesandkings; Jun 10 2019 at 11:53 PM.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by wretchesandkings View Post
    sounds like you were the one envious of other class and were really bitter.
    Thanks. You can say whatever you like and I will respect it as you opinion.

    However I have never asked for a nerf to ANY class at all.

    Let alone ones i do not regularly play.

    So, sure bitter and envious. -According to you.

    Passionate about having strong class to play. -According to me. (talking about Burglar Class)

    Cheers
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  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperPowers View Post
    as i said and everyone who actually do t2/t3 raid not just landscape quests, burg is already the best ST dps, and best 3 man aoe dps...
    This is just too much to go through.

    For AOE i will just nominate Yellow Champ as much stronger.

    BTW, why are you going on making things up?

    And the utility: Our support spec is different from our DPS spec. So, no we can not have it all. Seems fair to me.
    Last edited by Areyekuwe; Jun 11 2019 at 12:39 AM.
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  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by SuperPowers View Post
    oh sorry my bad, i was just quoting him, he is the one who said that... i don't mind burg being able to dps in raid, as i said and everyone who actually do t2/t3 raid not just landscape quests, burg is already the best ST dps, and best 3 man aoe dps... what i do mind is them having so much utility while doing the most ST dps, it was exactly like fire RKs back in abyss before the nerfs. having armor debuff/fire debuff/DNFs while doing the most damage is just stupid. now burg is doing the most damage while having so many defensive skills that basically makes him unkillable and good CC as well. KO a skill with 1m 15s cd that reduces the incoming damage by 85% , and you can reset that with ready and able... like what the actual #### + provoke on a 6s cd of course , in combat stealth, TnG ... even with a 5m cd, you can still reset it as well. and even 5 min cd is not that high for lotro. not to mention the mezzes/addle and all this is in redline. nerf those and keep the burg #1 dps, imo they should be. or keep those but nerf the dps, they can't just have both.
    Oh right, I see now, I read the thread backwards so I didn't read the post you quoted, my mistake. I agree with you entirely.
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  8. #33
    The reason why people think Hunter and RK are stronger than Burglar (and Champion) is because most raid groups are bad at supporting melee/physical dps

    When you properly debuff physical damage mitigation the same way you support fire damage (which RKs and Hunters do) single target dps is: Burg>Hunter>Champ>RK

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arandour View Post
    Making burglars (a mostly support class) the most damaging class its just stupid.Champions and hunters should make that dps at single not burglars unless you think that Bilbo was stronger than Gimli and Legolas.Burglars update was completely fail they should get some dps so they can be able to do 3 man instances and offer some more dps to an entire group raid but not make them so overpowered.
    What he said ... us Champions are unwanted because of this
    .

    I bring word from Lord Elrond of Rivendell. An Alliance once existed between Elves and Men. Long ago we fought and died together. We come to honor that allegiance.

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by eanamdar View Post
    What he said ... us Champions are unwanted because of this
    Burglar can't tank in anvil t2. Champion yes !

  11. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    This is just too much to go through.

    For AOE i will just nominate Yellow Champ as much stronger.
    For 3 enemies... no, burg is stronger, champ and warden only outperform burg against 4+ enemies.
    And the utility: Our support spec is different from our DPS spec. So, no we can not have it all. Seems fair to me.
    [/QUOTE]
    You have the following support in full red line available:
    -Reveal Weakness.
    -Trip.
    -Exploit opening.
    -Dust in the eyes/enrage depending on traiting.
    -Riddle (1 min cd 30s duration).
    -Marbles.

    If those skills aren't support... I don't know what support means for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris91
    The reason why people think Hunter and RK are stronger than Burglar (and Champion) is because most raid groups are bad at supporting melee/physical dps

    When you properly debuff physical damage mitigation the same way you support fire damage (which RKs and Hunters do) single target dps is: Burg>Hunter>Champ>RK
    agree 100%

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Papou_sous_la_montagne View Post
    Burglar can't tank in anvil t2. Champion yes !
    burgs cant tank, because they have no taunts or other high-threat skills. thats it. Their traitlines would be nearly tanky enough otherwise, if one traits for it.
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  13. #38

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    I personally 100% convinced that burglar DPS is NOT strongest, it just became real instead of a joke that it was for years
    I feel just one joke here, you.
    Last edited by Yuzuriha_EN; Jun 13 2019 at 11:31 PM.
    [Creep status: Ultra casual] | [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | LotRO since March 30, 2007 - Proud Game's Founder

  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    Thanks. You can say whatever you like and I will respect it as you opinion.

    However I have never asked for a nerf to ANY class at all.

    Let alone ones i do not regularly play.

    So, sure bitter and envious. -According to you.

    Passionate about having strong class to play. -According to me. (talking about Burglar Class)

    Cheers
    You don’t have to play other classes to be envious, you just have to compare yourself to them. You definitely do it, you have been doing it the whole thread.

    Nerf and buffs should be done according to which is easier or less costly. It’s certainly easier to buff/nerf one class than having to nerf/buff everything else to compensate. But people cry about nerfs to their own class no matter the circumstance

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by wretchesandkings View Post
    You don’t have to play other classes to be envious, you just have to compare yourself to them. You definitely do it, you have been doing it the whole thread.
    You don't have to. You have to. Who appointed you the boss?

    Sure i compare, in my imagination of this imaginary game.

    But the real question is, do I go to their sub forums to demand nerf?
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  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yuzuriha_EN View Post
    I feel just one joke here, you.
    Sure, as long as you are entertained. - Joke is on you.

    Thank you :P

    (oh and BTW, set these feelings aside mate, it's just a game that kids refuse to play ever since it came out)
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  17. #42
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    Creep side of this game is something that attracts just the strangest crowds.

    Why not delete the whole Monster Play. It has never gotten any real interest among the 99% of the game.

    Just look at this Burglar Sub Forum Thread: Who is asking for nerfs?

    One signature for your consideration:

    Farruquita (R13 Blackarrow) - Isabelpantoja (R12 Warg) - Laprimaderiesgo (R10 Reaver) - Exxuverancia (R10 Defiler) - Shakirah (R10 Warleader) - Sthlysia (R8 Spider) [Creep status: Ultra casual] | Yuzuriha (R10 Guardian) - Fresita (R7 Burglar) [Freep status: Retired since 2011] | EVERNIGHT - BASHING NOOBS SINCE BETA
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  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kander View Post
    You have the following support in full red line available:
    -Reveal Weakness.
    -Trip.
    -Exploit opening.
    -Dust in the eyes/enrage depending on traiting.
    -Riddle (1 min cd 30s duration).
    -Marbles.

    If those skills aren't support... I don't know what support means for you.


    agree 100%
    Thank you. I love it when people tell me that I got MARBLES.

    Now get off your marshmallows and go ahead list all abilities you can think of, in all trait trees of entire class. (it will look like you got marbles too)
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  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oelle View Post
    burgs cant tank, because they have no taunts or other high-threat skills. thats it. Their traitlines would be nearly tanky enough otherwise, if one traits for it.
    But Hello. You and me but heads in this forum for a couple of years now.

    In this instance no other know it all Burg Class players showed up yet. - Welcome to the creep complain board.

    And in regards to your comment. Sorry, these kinds of statements are just too intelligent. Too much common sense. Some one told me in the message above that the class needs to be nerfed because we got MARBLES. Just what do you say to people like that. (I say, I got marbles and you dont. Want some? -have to play my game :P )
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  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris91 View Post
    The reason why people think Hunter and RK are stronger than Burglar (and Champion) is because most raid groups are bad at supporting melee/physical dps

    When you properly debuff physical damage mitigation the same way you support fire damage (which RKs and Hunters do) single target dps is: Burg>Hunter>Champ>RK
    Your reply has too much of the game mechanics thrown into it.
    And it's all about other classes.
    You supposed to say: Burglars got MARBLES.
    Then you say: I want marbles!

    I have hunted with every class there is. Every class has stronger and weaker sides. For years Burglar class was least played, thought of as most "complex" class and the rest. For a year Burglar class players filled these forums pointing out obvious areas where to improve our class. Devs buffed DPS. We have asked for it, for a long time.

    Now is Burglar class strongest single target DPS? - I do not think so.
    Range DPS will always be able to attack many times over before we even get to the target, that coupled with VERY strong DPS classes in game (that I have seen "at work") does not put Burglar at the top, never will.

    AoE we got is limited to 3 targets on 2 crit chain skills (with some cool down as well) if you in red line. If you are RK, Champion, Warden or even LM, this tiny aoe is NOTHING to worry about.

    For the raids if Burglar is not helping whole group that would mean they are not thinking of the whole group, or simply not helpful. Yellow line does not have much DPS and works with buffing damage of the group or debuffing damage that target outputs towards the group. Remember we are talking about group of 12 or 24? (That would mean that at least 8 people are DPS and in yellow line Burglar has a chance to help them all)

    But I am explaining things in this joke of a thread. Should never be done.
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  21. #46
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    *Sniff Sniff* It smell like creep in here. Although currently end game, the Anvil raid is old content by comparison to the recent burg changes. The instance wasn't made with them in mind as the changes didn't exist for months after the raid came into being. The burglar was just among the first to get an overhaul with future game content in mind. More than likely a makeover of other classes will follow in the coming months... but by all means lets complain and cry like babies about the state of things now without giving any consideration to the state of things to come. smh

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  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by jljohnson4 View Post
    *Sniff Sniff* It smell like creep in here. Although currently end game, the Anvil raid is old content by comparison to the recent burg changes. The instance wasn't made with them in mind as the changes didn't exist for months after the raid came into being. The burglar was just among the first to get an overhaul with future game content in mind. More than likely a makeover of other classes will follow in the coming months... but by all means lets complain and cry like babies about the state of things now without giving any consideration to the state of things to come. smh
    I have spend the same amount of time with creep and freep so my anger for this matter is not cause i was one shot from burglars while i was playing my creeps.That was happening anyway some times before the boost.I can understand ofc their anger on this matter especially those that play only creeps anymore.
    Champions was in a very bad position and now after burglars update things are even worst.That boost should be given to champions not to burglars,we have been asking for it since Mordor we got a small update tho but was not enough.
    I want to be fair and I am one of those that wanted a dps buff for classes like burglars and captains so they can do and be more welcomed at 3 man instances and give some more dps to the whole group in a raid but not like this.
    I say it before and i will say it again, to make burglars a mostly support class the most powerful dd in this game makes no sense at all.
    So if they dont nerf them, then in near future (like you said) i expect a huge dps boost for my class and some more for RKs and Hunters so we can have some balance.
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  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Areyekuwe View Post
    But Hello. You and me but heads in this forum for a couple of years now.

    In this instance no other know it all Burg Class players showed up yet. - Welcome to the creep complain board.
    According to the forums, you joined just a year ago. How can there have been anything between us for a couple of years, then?
    And if there was something going on between the two of us, you should know, that I dont creep at all... and couldn't care less, if the moors were closed for good. Yet, I want a balanced game and show up whereever things are unbalanced... in this case, burgs dps is too high. If everyone that plays the game for hardmodes tells you that... just maybe they might be right?
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arandour View Post
    So if they dont nerf them, then in near future (like you said) i expect a huge dps boost for my class and some more for RKs and Hunters so we can have some balance.
    From what I've seen, the burgs that are dropping 200k dps are using glass cannon builds with 380k+ Crit rating and no moral or mit essences to be seen. As it stands T2 Anvil is Unique in that a burg can take almost no damage in most boss fights unless it gets selected directly through an eye mechanic. To think adding or subtracting dps is the only way to achieve balance is pretty narrow minded. Think outside the box. For example they could make bosses throw out some multi hit melee aoe attacks. Perhaps attacks that only hit characters behind the target (tail swipes and such). Watch those glass cannon burgs go bye bye. Like I said before, the current raid was not designed with the current burg status in mind.

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  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oelle View Post
    According to the forums, you joined just a year ago. How can there have been anything between us for a couple of years, then?
    And if there was something going on between the two of us, you should know, that I dont creep at all... and couldn't care less, if the moors were closed for good. Yet, I want a balanced game and show up whereever things are unbalanced... in this case, burgs dps is too high. If everyone that plays the game for hardmodes tells you that... just maybe they might be right?
    Cheers mate. You are really so serious. I just can't keep it up in the same way. So i will take a pass on discussion of these things.
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