We have detected that cookies are not enabled on your browser. Please enable cookies to ensure the proper experience.
Results 1 to 4 of 4
  1. #1

    current captain feedback useless and underwhelming captain traits

    Well since we might be getting some class attention the comming year, it might be an idea to shine some light on what currently feels pretty bad in the trait trees, as I guess that's where most changes will be done:

    bad to useless traits:

    blue: both capstones:
    * reform the lines ( basically you kill yourself for a heal that's completely underwhelming, rallying cry probably heals for more).
    * valour (the heal is maybe 1000),

    red:
    * restraint (up to -12% power usage on melee skills), completely useless in current gameplay where power doesn't play a role

    yellow:
    * call them out (5 point for 10% more bleed dmg, it's already very bad to get this in dps line if you really want to max bleeds, in yellow there's no point)
    * elendil's fury (capstone), some people pointed out it doesn't even work, but even if it would it's useless due to all the partial bpe's you get that trigger a response anyway, even getting a crit on db or pa in tanking spec is more reliable


    underperforming traits for investment

    blue
    * rallying roar (up to +10% RC healing) 5 points for 10% compared to 3 points for 15% all aoe healing on relentless optimism
    * blue banner (600 heal)

    borderline: skilled hands / dignified spectacle, i'd still take those, but they're not really anything to get excited about.
    red:
    * deafening shout (up to +6% light dmg)
    * grievous wound (up to +10% dmg on grave wound for 5 points, given, the inc healing debuff has situational uses)
    * heightened allies: problem here lies more with base dmg of pets than the skill itself, but as they are now, it's pretty bad
    make them bleed: up to 20% bleed dmg, still nothing compared to bleeds of other classes
    * impactfull blows: up to +6% 2-handed dmg

    yellow:
    * stand tall 2nd and 3rd point: cd reduction rarely does anything worthwhile, +10 sec duration on first point is good though.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    288
    Quote Originally Posted by Arotharrr View Post
    Well since we might be getting some class attention the comming year, it might be an idea to shine some light on what currently feels pretty bad in the trait trees, as I guess that's where most changes will be done:

    bad to useless traits:

    blue: both capstones:
    * reform the lines ( basically you kill yourself for a heal that's completely underwhelming, rallying cry probably heals for more).
    * valour (the heal is maybe 1000),

    red:
    * restraint (up to -12% power usage on melee skills), completely useless in current gameplay where power doesn't play a role

    yellow:
    * call them out (5 point for 10% more bleed dmg, it's already very bad to get this in dps line if you really want to max bleeds, in yellow there's no point)
    * elendil's fury (capstone), some people pointed out it doesn't even work, but even if it would it's useless due to all the partial bpe's you get that trigger a response anyway, even getting a crit on db or pa in tanking spec is more reliable


    underperforming traits for investment

    blue
    * rallying roar (up to +10% RC healing) 5 points for 10% compared to 3 points for 15% all aoe healing on relentless optimism
    * blue banner (600 heal)

    borderline: skilled hands / dignified spectacle, i'd still take those, but they're not really anything to get excited about.
    red:
    * deafening shout (up to +6% light dmg)
    * grievous wound (up to +10% dmg on grave wound for 5 points, given, the inc healing debuff has situational uses)
    * heightened allies: problem here lies more with base dmg of pets than the skill itself, but as they are now, it's pretty bad
    make them bleed: up to 20% bleed dmg, still nothing compared to bleeds of other classes
    * impactfull blows: up to +6% 2-handed dmg

    yellow:
    * stand tall 2nd and 3rd point: cd reduction rarely does anything worthwhile, +10 sec duration on first point is good though.
    blue: both capstones:
    * reform the lines ( basically you kill yourself for a heal that's completely underwhelming, rallying cry probably heals for more).
    * valour (the heal is maybe 1000),

    blue
    * rallying roar (up to +10% RC healing) 5 points for 10% compared to 3 points for 15% all aoe healing on relentless optimism
    * blue banner (600 heal)


    Reform the lines can crit, its actually quite nice.
    Valour heal is indeed underscaled like I mentioned, that everything is, I basically already stated this by saying that the whole line has fallen into under
    Rallying roar + AOE healing stack up together, please see what AOE healing affects.
    like I said again, a lot of this line is underscaled.





    borderline: skilled hands / dignified spectacle, i'd still take those, but they're not really anything to get excited about.
    red:
    * deafening shout (up to +6% light dmg)
    * grievous wound (up to +10% dmg on grave wound for 5 points, given, the inc healing debuff has situational uses)
    * heightened allies: problem here lies more with base dmg of pets than the skill itself, but as they are now, it's pretty bad
    make them bleed: up to 20% bleed dmg, still nothing compared to bleeds of other classes
    * impactfull blows: up to +6% 2-handed dmg
    red:
    * restraint (up to -12% power usage on melee skills), completely useless in current gameplay where power doesn't play a role


    6+ light dmg is ok for shadow's lament
    Inc heal debuff is extremely nice in PvMP, you've no idea about what you're talking judging from this.
    heightened allies is useless because pets are being useless.
    Impactful blows is fine, the problem of captain dmg is the base dmg being low.
    Restraint is nice too, because captains have always suffered from power issues, especially in long fights for the ettenmoors.




    yellow:
    * call them out (5 point for 10% more bleed dmg, it's already very bad to get this in dps line if you really want to max bleeds, in yellow there's no point)
    * elendil's fury (capstone), some people pointed out it doesn't even work, but even if it would it's useless due to all the partial bpe's you get that trigger a response anyway, even getting a crit on db or pa in tanking spec is more reliable
    yellow:
    * stand tall 2nd and 3rd point: cd reduction rarely does anything worthwhile, +10 sec duration on first point is good though.


    the 10% bleed dmg is for cross traiting when being redline, which is ok cuz you have lots of AOE bleeds.
    Elendil's fury is useless cuz it doesnt always proc. But using elendil on the last second of hardened state is good, because it allows you a 20% reduction tick in that gap before going back into 15% reduction (hardened)
    Stand tall is fine, nothing to add.


    Overall you complain toomuch, if the devs would replace everything thats being "useless" in your opinion and *underscaled* would cause a captain to become overpowered(going for red and yellow), because they're already very strong in some aspects. Though for blue line you're right, it's underscaled.

  3. #3
    I have the feeling there's not a lot respect for other opinions and unfounded insinuations of ignorance, let's keep this constructive shall we.
    I'll admit my wording choice of "useless" was exaggerated.
    Also, my observations come from the PvE aspect of the game, I guess I should have mentioned that at the start if it wasn't clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteGoliath View Post

    Rallying roar + AOE healing stack up together, please see what AOE healing affects.

    Of course rallying cry is aoe too and the traits stack. I'm pointing to the huge difference in "bang for the buck" on traitpoints here:
    3 points for 15% on all aoe healing
    5 points for 10% on 1 aoe healing skill

    Everyone (including me) likes the fact that for 3 points I get a lot more effectiveness for my investment than for 5 points (yes you can use 8 to get both).
    This however makes the 3 point trait a lot better compared to the 5 point trait where they both have the same goal (increase aoe healing).

    Inc heal debuff is extremely nice in PvMP, you've no idea about what you're talking judging from this.

    Outside of PvP, the short heal debuff has a few edge cases where it's usefull (first boss in abyss comes to mind, there's a few more).
    However my point wasn't the heal debuff, but bang for the buck as well :
    5 points for 20% dmg on all bleeds (we only have 4, of which 2 are nearly irrelevant if it comes to the bleed aspect( Elendil dot + noble mark))
    5 points for 10% dmg on 1 bleed skill (yes it can be aoe, but that also counts for the 20% trait)
    10 points for 10% on all bleeds when you're in red (from yellow line where it doesn't seem to belong).

    Restraint is nice too, because captains have always suffered from power issues, especially in long fights for the ettenmoors.

    I don't think any captain needs to trait this in PvE or runs out of power outside of obscure boss effects (only Lieutenant BG comes to mind + maybe ghosts in Throne twins).
    And even on those, the use of inspire (or RC) is usually enough to get you (and your fellowship) maxed again in no time.
    If you are not in melee range (can't use inspire), the -power cost on melee skills won't have an effect either.


    Elendil's fury is useless cuz it doesnt always proc. But using elendil on the last second of hardened state is good, because it allows you a 20% reduction tick in that gap before going back into 15% reduction (hardened)

    While a bit clunky to use, I agree the 20% has it's uses. That's a yellow line bonus however (Elendil's boon).
    It's the capstone fury of elendil itself I find redundant, even if it would always proc:
    5 BPE's give defeat event on using blade of elendil + BoE does a little more dmg ( haven't really checked this more dmg part, if someone has numbers on this feel free to share, weird effect for a tanking capstone however).
    Since getting BPE's also means you're likely getting a lot of partial BPE's, you're already swimming in defeat events from that alone, so one more from BoE won't change much.
    Saving it up isn't really effective either (if that's even possible), since you still need to get into melee and get the skillchain going to have BoE up. Slotting Time of Need will probably be more reliable if an on demand defeat event is really needed.


    Overall you complain toomuch, if the devs would replace everything thats being "useless" in your opinion and *underscaled* would cause a captain to become overpowered(going for red and yellow), because they're already very strong in some aspects. Though for blue line you're right, it's underscaled.

    That will depend how they change it. If they increase base potency on many skills, tweaking the trait numbers might not be needed.
    If they don't, I don't think getting double the current values in the ones I listed will suddenly make the captain overpowered, most of these matter only for personal dmg, which is currently very low in dps line in relation to other classes.
    I would like to have them start with the capstone skills however.

    OB and SotD are currently very strong and class defining, and hopefully remain as good. (although I won't mind them solving the "must have LI swappy" requirement for doubling SotD's value).
    Elite companions (16k armour debuff from pets), is ok.

    Reform the lines is the strange one, some people dislike it, some people can live with it.

    Valour and Fury of Elendil don't feel like worthwhile traits, much less capstones.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    700
    I am all for captains being decent heals in blue line....But Revealing mark needs to go. Change it in some way, it offers too much for one skill. With decent healing and RM they would be too OP.

    They need to lose the in-combat rez in red and yellow line also, just the same as the other classes should.

    Buff Captain dps at the cost of FS buffing being self buffs only. Buff the Pet dps for the Captain and the Lore-master whilst your at it.

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload