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  1. #1

    Ethics in the moors and lack of 120 pvp grear (state of the moors currently)

    I would appreciate a dev or gm explaining this and discussing their thoughts on this

    Ethics and the ettenmoors

    Their are wargs in gv ba's defilers and reavers that i have personally witnessed and reported. I have heard others say they have video of this. Why is this allowed? what ethical/rational explanation for this? (yes ive heard freeps have gotten into grams and they should be dealt with just the same) Then we have macro wargs doing insane damage chainstunning freeps.

    Multiboxing lagging the moors out

    Their are now multiple boxers ive seen out in the moors they are creating horrific lag people cannot get skills off or move. Ive filed tickets in the past about this and ive heard the term "bad sportmanship" and its allowed well when they eventually start crashing the server here and costing ssg money i hope something is done then. If no one can move and on top of that they have no chance against 14 spiders or wargs using botting software why should one go to the moors?

    Lack of pvp gear

    Freeps are expected to pay to go the moors but there is no 120 pvp gear? Imagine this was pve or doing anvil and theres no gear...This is like having a cover charge to get into a empty bar with a drunk a machine gun and you in a t shirt.

    The moors is not designed or made for pve gear.

    Ost gilith is primarily used by rank farmers. The gigantic opportunity wasted with this map is really depressing. OSG is just a hallway your fighting over this could have really been something.

    Scaled freeps this is a really bad idea these people cannot defend themselves the creeps know it and target them heavily. You should be 115 or higher to go the moors. What kind of impression do we want to give to new freeps? They are useless cant participate or do much and on top of it they cant even get gear at cap so what is the incentive for new freeps to go out in the moors?

    Ba's are getting more kills with snares then arrows the ones that do spam barrage

    ttk (time to kil) with the lack of 120 pvp gear even with top end pve gear freeps are going from being 1 shotted to 2 to 3 shotted at best

    So i ask a developer here or gm anyone that will listen. Why would anyone want to go the moors? If you cant move from a boxer or get 1 shotted or chainstunned and have no 120 pvp gear or get ganked inside gv i dont see many people paying for this or staying especially in a zone that you have to pay to go to.....

  2. #2
    In 8 years, I have never seen a single person enter grams or gv while I was playing, so cant speak to it and would venture to say this, if true, is beyond rare. No new freep pvp gear for years is sadly a result of a few reasons in my opinion, the developers don't really care about it, have other things to do they do care about, and it's not a priority. I lag by myself killing norbogs with not a soul around so the multibox induced lag you speak of is kind of irrelevant to me. Again, I don't see many and if so, they seem to not stick around long. heck, if somebody wants to put the effort into rolling out 12 spiders and it's not illegal via game rules, it's their subscription and more power to the them.

    The osgiliath map was an epic fail, they ignored feedback, they never updated it, and offer zero incentive to be there. Throw in some barter stuff only acquired there for freep gear and something to entice creeps via barter (new skins, perks, etc), boost the inf/ren, change a few things, and people would play it..

    Hard to call out certain skills and judge them broken or op if one doesn't include every class op skill or all "the make no sense skills" across the board. If a freep is getting one shot, there is a deficiency in their set up, gear, etc. in my opinion. I only play creep pvp and admittedly biased in opinion, but if you haven't played creep and dealt with u22, then you don't know what being 1 shotted really means. You know what is worse than getting one shot, 17 ticks of a burg bleed at 25k per that you can't do a thing about. This happens now. The end result is the same, you die by 1 button. There are many more class skills across the board that will always be utilized if they're more powerful. It's the gamer mentality, always searching for an edge of some sort.

    The state of Lotro PVP is like it's been for a while now, gone are the old days of roaming the map and fights in random locations or hot spots, gone is the RvR action for hours on end. I believe that the raid leaders of the past have moved on. The end gamers on freepside, due to insane grind with gear, LI's, builds no longer have multiple alts they play. This means that group make ups cant be adjusted. New Freep pvp gear that can you must use changes this. Here is the rub, it has to be balanced, offer certain bonuses that make sense and aren't ridiculously OP or a piece of toilet paper. It will need updating along the way. Unfortunately, I don't believe this would happen.

  3. #3
    In addition

    Level scaling is not an issue in my opinion. It's no different than a rank 1 creep, they too will get targeted first and get destroyed. If anything, it gives one a taste of pvp and may make them motivated to gear up, rank up, and buy those precious keys in the store. Funny, but the opposite was true where being scaled was actually a benefit due to set bonuses. skills. We are well past the point of trying to make good impressions on people. New creep rolls out grams, kills a slug, gets a lootbox and thinks "cool, I wonder what is in it". They then realize it cant be opened and cant even spend money on a key to open it. They then say "that is the dumbest thing i've ever heard of" and the impression is formed.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    312
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    I would appreciate a dev or gm explaining this and discussing their thoughts on this
    Stop right there bucko, that's wishful thinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ethics and the ettenmoors

    Their are wargs in gv ba's defilers and reavers that i have personally witnessed and reported. I have heard others say they have video of this. Why is this allowed? what ethical/rational explanation for this? (yes ive heard freeps have gotten into grams and they should be dealt with just the same) Then we have macro wargs doing insane damage chainstunning freeps.
    1. It's "allowed" because this game has low quality customer service, so whenever you send in a ticket about a "warg inside GV killing people at the rez", the GM barely knows what you're talking about.
    2. Are you really using the words "macro" and "warg" consecutively and you expect people to take you seriously? omegalul

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Multiboxing lagging the moors out

    Their are now multiple boxers ive seen out in the moors they are creating horrific lag people cannot get skills off or move. Ive filed tickets in the past about this and ive heard the term "bad sportmanship" and its allowed well when they eventually start crashing the server here and costing ssg money i hope something is done then. If no one can move and on top of that they have no chance against 14 spiders or wargs using botting software why should one go to the moors?
    Is it the boxer's fault that this ancient client cannot support more than 40 players in 1 location? If less than 50 people crash the server, imagine if this game wasn't dead and there were 200 people in PvP. It would be unplayable. Let's look at the root problem.

    Secondly, it is allowed within the Terms of Service for you to multibox as long as you are at the keyboard actively controlling your characters. 3rd party software is not allowed to control your characters only if the software plays the game for you, for instance hitting skills while there is no one at the keyboard.
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Lack of pvp gear

    Freeps are expected to pay to go the moors but there is no 120 pvp gear? Imagine this was pve or doing anvil and theres no gear...This is like having a cover charge to get into a empty bar with a drunk a machine gun and you in a t shirt.

    The moors is not designed or made for pve gear.
    The developers have proved time and time again that whatever PvP gear that they release is going to have garbage stats and audacity only helps healers with crowd control duration. Even when there was lvl 115 audacity gear, only players who had no hopes of completing the raid wore it, and healers. Everyone else wore raid gear or PvE gear simply because it was much better than the PvP gear.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ost gilith is primarily used by rank farmers. The gigantic opportunity wasted with this map is really depressing. OSG is just a hallway your fighting over this could have really been something.
    Agreed, this map should be deleted since it was just another copy/paste venture gone wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Scaled freeps this is a really bad idea these people cannot defend themselves the creeps know it and target them heavily. You should be 115 or higher to go the moors. What kind of impression do we want to give to new freeps? They are useless cant participate or do much and on top of it they cant even get gear at cap so what is the incentive for new freeps to go out in the moors?
    The incentive is that those suckers will pay mithril coins or a VIP subscription, which is what SSG wants. Too bad the pvp is underdeveloped, so most of them visit the Ettenmoors only to come to the realization that pvp in this game sucks and they never go back there again.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ba's are getting more kills with snares then arrows the ones that do spam barrage
    This is perfectly balanced, only a fool would disagree.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    ttk (time to kil) with the lack of 120 pvp gear even with top end pve gear freeps are going from being 1 shotted to 2 to 3 shotted at best
    You obviously haven't seen any top end PvE geared freeps, since someone with 200k morale isn't going to be 3-shotted. Unless if you meant oneshotted by the spider boxer, in which case that is not a one-shot since there are 14 spiders there.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    So i ask a developer here or gm anyone that will listen. Why would anyone want to go the moors? If you cant move from a boxer or get 1 shotted or chainstunned and have no 120 pvp gear or get ganked inside gv i dont see many people paying for this or staying especially in a zone that you have to pay to go to.....
    And yet there are still people paying a subscription to go to the moors. I guess they all put false hope in the game that denied them attention for the last 4 years. Or they have mental issues. Or they just stopped caring how bad the game is and they just log in for the social experience. Or they genuinely believe that GV/Grams shuffle is good pvp action.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    2,599
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    I would appreciate a dev or gm explaining this and discussing their thoughts on this

    Ethics and the ettenmoors

    Their are wargs in gv ba's defilers and reavers that i have personally witnessed and reported. I have heard others say they have video of this. Why is this allowed? what ethical/rational explanation for this? (yes ive heard freeps have gotten into grams and they should be dealt with just the same) Then we have macro wargs doing insane damage chainstunning freeps.

    Multiboxing lagging the moors out

    Their are now multiple boxers ive seen out in the moors they are creating horrific lag people cannot get skills off or move. Ive filed tickets in the past about this and ive heard the term "bad sportmanship" and its allowed well when they eventually start crashing the server here and costing ssg money i hope something is done then. If no one can move and on top of that they have no chance against 14 spiders or wargs using botting software why should one go to the moors?

    Lack of pvp gear

    Freeps are expected to pay to go the moors but there is no 120 pvp gear? Imagine this was pve or doing anvil and theres no gear...This is like having a cover charge to get into a empty bar with a drunk a machine gun and you in a t shirt.

    The moors is not designed or made for pve gear.

    Ost gilith is primarily used by rank farmers. The gigantic opportunity wasted with this map is really depressing. OSG is just a hallway your fighting over this could have really been something.

    Scaled freeps this is a really bad idea these people cannot defend themselves the creeps know it and target them heavily. You should be 115 or higher to go the moors. What kind of impression do we want to give to new freeps? They are useless cant participate or do much and on top of it they cant even get gear at cap so what is the incentive for new freeps to go out in the moors?

    Ba's are getting more kills with snares then arrows the ones that do spam barrage

    ttk (time to kil) with the lack of 120 pvp gear even with top end pve gear freeps are going from being 1 shotted to 2 to 3 shotted at best

    So i ask a developer here or gm anyone that will listen. Why would anyone want to go the moors? If you cant move from a boxer or get 1 shotted or chainstunned and have no 120 pvp gear or get ganked inside gv i dont see many people paying for this or staying especially in a zone that you have to pay to go to.....
    Same thing happens on freepside. I was killed afk in Grams a couple of weeks ago by a well known d-bag loremaster on Ark. I didn't even bother reporting it. They don't care.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    246
    I agree with you, the moors ethics of the past are clearly not shared by all today. Though this is not a bad thing. I stroll by good grim and see a creep with low moral from a fresh 1v1, and then I remember that creep was inside GV the night before killing freeps while they were loading into the rez circle... yeah no pass for you. Or if a creep is at GV sharing a friendly emote session, and then I remember that creeps was spam healing the spider boxer while it killed 6 people with the push of a single button... yeah no pass for you either. I realize the lack of morals doesn't apply to all creeps. They are in the minority though, so it's just easier to lump everyone together. This is unlikely to change unless both sides start policing their own. Either way it doesn't matter to me.

    In U22 the moors was filled with creeps who failed to adapt. The game was such that creeps could no longer roam around without fear of being "one shot" if they had no mits in. The fix action... put some mits in. Most just utterly refused to do this and cried like babies instead. It's U23 and the sound of creep tears falling can still be heard. I lost count of the amount of times I cdg'd a creep with mits in, watched it's moral drop by 1/3, then they hit a pot and the fight commenced. I have witnessed this with every single creep class. Those creeps adapted, and others did not. It's what separated the average from the exceptional. It is also worth mention that some creeps claimed they were "one shot" while traited for full mits. I can promise, from experience, this was not possible. 9 times out of 10 they were being cdg'd by 3 of us but only saw the defeat response from 1. It was easy for me to see because I was the one doing it. That same thing applies in U23 as well. Creeps that claim they are mitted out and still get "one shot" just got hit by 4 of us at one time.

    But I digress. Now it is the freeps' turn. Gone are the days where the average freep can cap every important stat and roam around solo. A choice has to be made between tanky or destructive. Get camped at GV steps, or group up. Is it as easy as it used to be? No. But the action over the past two weeks has begun to pick up substantially. So I have high hopes. As for the creeps that get in GV. Throw tracks out when you can. Call it out if you see it. I know I'll show up if I'm around. It'd need to be a couple with a healer to last very long in there. Dealing with the boxer will take some group effort yes. Could be with 6 hunters double Rain of Arrowsing from stealth, 5 LMs throwing some lightning storms, 4 RKs dropping some combustion, or heck use your imagination. 5 champs with Cappy shields would be fun to watch.

    One thing I've noticed over the past few months, is the seemingly endless supply of commentary from those who don't even play the game. These people can just flat out be ignored. It's easy to critique the game play of others from the sidelines. The chances are high they are among those that failed to adapt. So they quit not because they no longer care about the game (you still see them constantly commenting in here), but because they simply lack what it takes to thrive in the game as it exists today. Lastly... anyone who uses the word "omegalul" is definitely a troll and can be ignored without a second thought. I have experience with this as they seem to follow me like flies.
    Last edited by jljohnson4; Feb 26 2019 at 01:35 PM.

    Rastlyn: Burglar, Naltsar: Guardian, Reistlin: Hunter, Reistlan: Runekeeper

  7. #7
    The boxing may be allowed but if it continues the way its going it will crash the server and they will have to rethink this b/c if people cant get skills off or move and 1 person is bringing the server down or 2 to 3 depending on the boxers there gonna have to do something and i highly doubt they will buy new servers to accomadate boxers lol.

    Yes i said macro wargs ive seen creeps only talking about it and telling others how to do it as well (not all wargs macro just fyi)


    As ive said the moors isnt a pve geared zone ive seen people with 200k morale and higher get wrecked just as fast all high end pve gear is a buffer for being 2 to 3 shotted instead of 1 and if a ba gets a snare off or 2 snares with those snares doing the damage they do it aint much difference.

    i dont file the ticket like that lol i explain in full detail the wargs ba's reavers names i mention i have ss of it others have video this is an exploit pure and simple freep or creep doing it

    perfectly balanced LOL i cant take this seriously








    Quote Originally Posted by xxSniperxx View Post
    Stop right there bucko, that's wishful thinking.


    1. It's "allowed" because this game has low quality customer service, so whenever you send in a ticket about a "warg inside GV killing people at the rez", the GM barely knows what you're talking about.
    2. Are you really using the words "macro" and "warg" consecutively and you expect people to take you seriously? omegalul


    Is it the boxer's fault that this ancient client cannot support more than 40 players in 1 location? If less than 50 people crash the server, imagine if this game wasn't dead and there were 200 people in PvP. It would be unplayable. Let's look at the root problem.

    Secondly, it is allowed within the Terms of Service for you to multibox as long as you are at the keyboard actively controlling your characters. 3rd party software is not allowed to control your characters only if the software plays the game for you, for instance hitting skills while there is no one at the keyboard.

    The developers have proved time and time again that whatever PvP gear that they release is going to have garbage stats and audacity only helps healers with crowd control duration. Even when there was lvl 115 audacity gear, only players who had no hopes of completing the raid wore it, and healers. Everyone else wore raid gear or PvE gear simply because it was much better than the PvP gear.


    Agreed, this map should be deleted since it was just another copy/paste venture gone wrong.


    The incentive is that those suckers will pay mithril coins or a VIP subscription, which is what SSG wants. Too bad the pvp is underdeveloped, so most of them visit the Ettenmoors only to come to the realization that pvp in this game sucks and they never go back there again.


    This is perfectly balanced, only a fool would disagree.


    You obviously haven't seen any top end PvE geared freeps, since someone with 200k morale isn't going to be 3-shotted. Unless if you meant oneshotted by the spider boxer, in which case that is not a one-shot since there are 14 spiders there.


    And yet there are still people paying a subscription to go to the moors. I guess they all put false hope in the game that denied them attention for the last 4 years. Or they have mental issues. Or they just stopped caring how bad the game is and they just log in for the social experience. Or they genuinely believe that GV/Grams shuffle is good pvp action.

  8. #8
    And those freeps along with the creeps doing should both be banned



    Quote Originally Posted by DrRabbitfoot View Post
    Same thing happens on freepside. I was killed afk in Grams a couple of weeks ago by a well known d-bag loremaster on Ark. I didn't even bother reporting it. They don't care.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    948
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Their are wargs in gv ba's defilers and reavers that i have personally witnessed and reported. I have heard others say they have video of this. Why is this allowed? what ethical/rational explanation for this? (yes ive heard freeps have gotten into grams and they should be dealt with just the same) Then we have macro wargs doing insane damage chainstunning freeps.
    They don't care anymore, simple.

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Multiboxing lagging the moors out

    Their are now multiple boxers ive seen out in the moors they are creating horrific lag people cannot get skills off or move. Ive filed tickets in the past about this and ive heard the term "bad sportmanship" and its allowed well when they eventually start crashing the server here and costing ssg money i hope something is done then. If no one can move and on top of that they have no chance against 14 spiders or wargs using botting software why should one go to the moors?
    Multiboxing has always been allowed, champs go yellow, lms drop lightning to 1 shot them or close enough, let the renown flow

    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Lack of pvp gear

    Freeps are expected to pay to go the moors but there is no 120 pvp gear? Imagine this was pve or doing anvil and theres no gear...This is like having a cover charge to get into a empty bar with a drunk a machine gun and you in a t shirt.
    They haven't been good at updating anything pvp related for years
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    The moors is not designed or made for pve gear.
    True, do they care no.
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ost gilith is primarily used by rank farmers. The gigantic opportunity wasted with this map is really depressing. OSG is just a hallway your fighting over this could have really been something.
    Map runs terrible, waste of resources
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Scaled freeps this is a really bad idea these people cannot defend themselves the creeps know it and target them heavily. You should be 115 or higher to go the moors. What kind of impression do we want to give to new freeps? They are useless cant participate or do much and on top of it they cant even get gear at cap so what is the incentive for new freeps to go out in the moors?
    Their own fault for going scaled, creeps start off low ranks too and are just as useless
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ba's are getting more kills with snares then arrows the ones that do spam barrage
    Move out of the snares/traps, don't let them drop them right on top of you
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    ttk (time to kil) with the lack of 120 pvp gear even with top end pve gear freeps are going from being 1 shotted to 2 to 3 shotted at best
    Geared freeps are not 1 shot, also can just group up and adapt like creeps at 115, bring a healer and move away from GV(safepath)
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    So i ask a developer here or gm anyone that will listen. Why would anyone want to go the moors? If you cant move from a boxer or get 1 shotted or chainstunned and have no 120 pvp gear or get ganked inside gv i dont see many people paying for this or staying especially in a zone that you have to pay to go to.....
    You answered it yourself, almost no one 99% of servers moors are dead.

    Korthillion-1 R10 RK ,Kortahl R7 CPT, Kornslimedonyoface R11 Defiler, Kornbootysplitter R9 WL,Korndoggystyle R8 WRG +other low rank Korns

  10. #10
    Ethics? Moors?

    There hasn't been any honor or ethics in the moors since Riders of Rohan lvl 85 cap.
    The Black Appendage of Sauron

  11. #11
    im talking about the companys ethics not players as far as players are concerned agreed


    Quote Originally Posted by Saruman_Of_Numbers View Post
    Ethics? Moors?

    There hasn't been any honor or ethics in the moors since Riders of Rohan lvl 85 cap.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    2,599
    Quote Originally Posted by jljohnson4 View Post
    I agree with you, the moors ethics of the past are clearly not shared by all today. Though this is not a bad thing. I stroll by good grim and see a creep with low moral from a fresh 1v1, and then I remember that creep was inside GV the night before killing freeps while they were loading into the rez circle... yeah no pass for you. Or if a creep is at GV sharing a friendly emote session, and then I remember that creeps was spam healing the spider boxer while it killed 6 people with the push of a single button... yeah no pass for you either. I realize the lack of morals doesn't apply to all creeps. They are in the minority though, so it's just easier to lump everyone together. This is unlikely to change unless both sides start policing their own. Either way it doesn't matter to me.

    In U22 the moors was filled with creeps who failed to adapt. The game was such that creeps could no longer roam around without fear of being "one shot" if they had no mits in. The fix action... put some mits in. Most just utterly refused to do this and cried like babies instead. It's U23 and the sound of creep tears falling can still be heard. I lost count of the amount of times I cdg'd a creep with mits in, watched it's moral drop by 1/3, then they hit a pot and the fight commenced. I have witnessed this with every single creep class. Those creeps adapted, and others did not. It's what separated the average from the exceptional. It is also worth mention that some creeps claimed they were "one shot" while traited for full mits. I can promise, from experience, this was not possible. 9 times out of 10 they were being cdg'd by 3 of us but only saw the defeat response from 1. It was easy for me to see because I was the one doing it. That same thing applies in U23 as well. Creeps that claim they are mitted out and still get "one shot" just got hit by 4 of us at one time.

    But I digress. Now it is the freeps' turn. Gone are the days where the average freep can cap every important stat and roam around solo. A choice has to be made between tanky or destructive. Get camped at GV steps, or group up. Is it as easy as it used to be? No. But the action over the past two weeks has begun to pick up substantially. So I have high hopes. As for the creeps that get in GV. Throw tracks out when you can. Call it out if you see it. I know I'll show up if I'm around. It'd need to be a couple with a healer to last very long in there. Dealing with the boxer will take some group effort yes. Could be with 6 hunters double Rain of Arrowsing from stealth, 5 LMs throwing some lightning storms, 4 RKs dropping some combustion, or heck use your imagination. 5 champs with Cappy shields would be fun to watch.

    One thing I've noticed over the past few months, is the seemingly endless supply of commentary from those who don't even play the game. These people can just flat out be ignored. It's easy to critique the game play of others from the sidelines. The chances are high they are among those that failed to adapt. So they quit not because they no longer care about the game (you still see them constantly commenting in here), but because they simply lack what it takes to thrive in the game as it exists today. Lastly... anyone who uses the word "omegalul" is definitely a troll and can be ignored without a second thought. I have experience with this as they seem to follow me like flies.
    Didn't read your post. You're everything that is and ever was wrong with the 'moors.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by DrRabbitfoot View Post
    Didn't read your post. You're everything that is and ever was wrong with the 'moors.
    Umm rude. Care to elaborate?

    Rastlyn: Burglar, Naltsar: Guardian, Reistlin: Hunter, Reistlan: Runekeeper

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post


    Lack of pvp gear

    Freeps are expected to pay to go the moors but there is no 120 pvp gear? Imagine this was pve or doing anvil and theres no gear...This is like having a cover charge to get into a empty bar with a drunk a machine gun and you in a t shirt.
    Why not just run anvil? It's easy not to mention it will make you (a freep) op against pretty much any creep and put you back in that 115 state you love so much :^)
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    Ba's are getting more kills with snares then arrows the ones that do spam barrage
    Pretty easy to kill a BA, specially if you are RK/Burg
    Quote Originally Posted by J2theMul View Post
    ttk (time to kil) with the lack of 120 pvp gear even with top end pve gear freeps are going from being 1 shotted to 2 to 3 shotted at best
    I'd be suprised if a creep one shot my 120 toon with if I had throne gear lmao.
    PVP is fairly balanced, creeps are weaker then freeps with raid gear while pretty well balanced against freeps without raid gear, enough QQ adapt


    Btw that rastlan post was an omegalul.
    44 Bulldog

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    288
    Nah its broken cause a ba can perform this rotation and typically always win especially if the creep cannot react in time.


    Headshot. Steadfast. Vital target followed by snare. O.o melee stun which a range shouldn't have on a 10 sec CD then traps if they survive that. This sounds like a lot but that's a 10 second rotation or less abusing broken skills

 

 

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