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  1. #1

    Update 23.3.1 for healing RKs

    Well, healing RKs just got sclewed in update 23.3.1.


    "Our Fates Entwined has been adjusted. Its cooldown has been increased from 60 to 90 seconds, its damage redirect has been reduced from 60% to 20%, its aura radius has been reduced from 10 meters to 7 meters, and the skill now applies a 20% damage reduction effect to the caster that stacks with the runestone's aura."


    Fates stone just got nerfed, Hard. It was OP and need to be toned down a bit. But, as an RK's only real 'Oh ####!' skill, nerfing the heck out of it w/o fixing anything like BI issues or anything else will be very unwelcomed in the RK community!
    Casinoari - Rank 15 RK
    Malakorou - Rank 10 Defiler
    Casinari - Original Challenger of Saruman Minstrel

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    134
    Quote Originally Posted by Nouri View Post
    Well, healing RKs just got sclewed in update 23.3.1.


    "Our Fates Entwined has been adjusted. Its cooldown has been increased from 60 to 90 seconds, its damage redirect has been reduced from 60% to 20%, its aura radius has been reduced from 10 meters to 7 meters, and the skill now applies a 20% damage reduction effect to the caster that stacks with the runestone's aura."


    Fates stone just got nerfed, Hard. It was OP and need to be toned down a bit. But, as an RK's only real 'Oh ####!' skill, nerfing the heck out of it w/o fixing anything like BI issues or anything else will be very unwelcomed in the RK community! Btw, anyone wonder whatever came of the talked about the RK redesign that was supposed to happen?
    Well, this was kind of expected, SSG did say they want to move away from "OP Group Buffs/Boss Debuffs". Does SSG not realise that nerfing a skill into the ground on a class that is mostly defined by that one particular skill will make the entire class/spec useless? They haven't announced any compensation for this nerf.

    It appears that SSG simply does not learn from their mistakes, the same thing happened to Burglar's "Reveal Weakness". The class only was viable in raids because of this one ability. They nerfed it into the ground and now nobody will ever consider taking a Red Burglar into the Raid group. They then "compensated" this nerf by adding about 2-3% more DPS to the class (which still makes the class worse than any other in Raids/Groups).

    Heal Runekeepers were completetly fine ... now sadly they are no longer an option for the Raid. It would be nice to hear why SSG decided to drastically nerf the skill without announcing a decent compensation.
    Last edited by Snobs; Feb 12 2019 at 07:31 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    948
    Find a different mmo. The devs here are incompetent who destroy class lines and make others hugely OP update after update. You have to be high to remove one of the only things keeping a class line even relevant.
    hurrdurrrdurr lets remove fates so only minis/bears are healers and rks are just dps. Silly how 1 skill nerf can shatter something. If devs even played the RK healer you wouldn't destroy fates without buffing other heals/animation times

    Ministrel - Yes should be a reactive healer better at AOE healing
    RK - Should be better at single target healing/proactive but an ALTERNATIVE option to Minstrel (Not better than Minstrel but not worse either)
    Cappy - Should be able to backup heal/hybrid master of none but should be needed in every group
    Bear - why is this even a class, remove it, there is already healers with broken heal lines and this just added yet another class while they struggle to balance all the others ( Bear they've tried to make another hybrid but we already have captains)

    Korthillion-1 R10 RK ,Kortahl R7 CPT, Kornslimedonyoface R11 Defiler, Kornbootysplitter R9 WL,Korndoggystyle R8 WRG +other low rank Korns

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    725
    I do not get this either.

    Every healer was taken to raid for different Set ups or tactics ..
    It was not like Minis were Not taken because rks were op...

    Why also a longer cd???? At least leave the CD alone..

  5. #5
    Yes. I am infuriated by this change. If you are going to make this skill completely useless for RK then you have absolutely got to compensate for it somehow. I just started playing again on Legendary after years of time off. Mini got hit recently, and even though they are better healers than before the update the animations are so contorted and out of line with the accompanying sounds that I no longer enjoy healing on my mini. It's just a stilted awkward healing class now. Now this to RK, my other main. I can't believe the incompetence of SSG. Mindless nerfing without any counterbalancing. I don't think I want to play this game anymore.
    Gaii (105 RK) / Shokti (105 Minstrel) / Cybele (105 LM)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    948
    Ever since they introduced the trait trees theres been problems, really was a mistake.

    Korthillion-1 R10 RK ,Kortahl R7 CPT, Kornslimedonyoface R11 Defiler, Kornbootysplitter R9 WL,Korndoggystyle R8 WRG +other low rank Korns

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by dsltn07 View Post
    I think yellow bear was supposed to originally be a cross between a yellow LM and blue cappy, but it was never properly finished so it was hodgepodged into a semi captain/minstrel healer so that it could be released. It almost seemed like whoever did the initial work was let go and then it got picked up by someone that didn’t care to finish building it. Yellow bear is the weakest healer since the mini rework now btw.
    For another 12 hours maybe - don't think that the RK is going to be doing much healing after this... At least until the next "Balance" pass.

  8. #8

    Just why?

    I have been playing RK for almost 4 years now and I have been healing on it since that last 3 years. RK heals were never that 'huge' compared to what minis and bears could do. But, they were known for one thing- The damage reduction. The fates stone was THE THING that kept RK healers unique. My RK does 22k mending verse when crit which is one of my sustained heal and my hps in raids varied from 25k to 30k. This is nothing compared to mini's 90k bolster with about 60k to 80k hps or bear's 100k Encouraging Roar with 80k-100k hps. And to be honest, RKs were never about the HPS either. While Minis and bears needs to be reactive, RKs needed to be proactive to heal good. And the fates stone was the crucial element to being proactive. Now that its brought down to be useless and with the kinda of HPS and heal numbers that an RK gets, I don't think my RK is a viable healing choice for raids anymore. Please fix this. give us a compensation in increased heals at least.

  9. #9
    Something like this should have been done when the RK rebalance was done. Doing it now, w/o any rebalancing, is just a really poor decision!
    Casinoari - Rank 15 RK
    Malakorou - Rank 10 Defiler
    Casinari - Original Challenger of Saruman Minstrel

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Nouri View Post
    Well, healing RKs just got sclewed in update 23.3.1.


    "Our Fates Entwined has been adjusted. Its cooldown has been increased from 60 to 90 seconds, its damage redirect has been reduced from 60% to 20%, its aura radius has been reduced from 10 meters to 7 meters, and the skill now applies a 20% damage reduction effect to the caster that stacks with the runestone's aura."


    Fates stone just got nerfed, Hard. It was OP and need to be toned down a bit. But, as an RK's only real 'Oh ####!' skill, nerfing the heck out of it w/o fixing anything like BI issues or anything else will be very unwelcomed in the RK community!

    It's the end of a very short life of healing RKs. There is no compensation for a huge nerf! The hots are not enough to keep anyone alive when tehy are getting hit for 150-180k hits! without burst heal, that stone was the only way to recover from burst damage; now there's no reason to bring rk healer to raids, we have no oh-sh*t skills anymore because the bubbles are a joke! they don't scale at all and are popped half a second after we use them! so the % reduction dmg goes away with them.

    If you are going to change something, at least balance it out because right now, RK healer was in a good spot competing with bear and mini for healing spot in raids, depending on situation. Time to gather dust again on blue line rk!

    Awful change.

  11. #11
    Wow the squeaky minstrels got the grease. The minstrel outcry over beornings leaked over into rk's and infected them too. Reminds me of how hunters complained when rk's were top single target dps but this seems to be much swifter. I guess now that the population has dwindled devs just give players anything they want. Hmm

  12. #12
    gotta love how they sneak this stuff in there without so much as a bugfix on the many broken or outdated heal RK elements.
    The Black Appendage of Sauron

  13. #13
    Reminds me of eye gouge nerf tbh, SSG just proving that they have no clue how any class works, simply looking at raiding videos and saying "Oh there's a strategy I do not like, lets get rid of it". SSg literally wants this raid to be as my way or the highway with mechanics and it's sad, part of the reason why it's the worse raid ever created imo, 0 strat diversity between kins, and the raid has only been out 1 week....

    Quote Originally Posted by dsltn07 View Post
    I can support longer cooldowns on panic skills, but the rest of the game must also be adjusted away from this one-shot kill meta game.
    ^^This right here...you know you screwed up as a dev when half of the mechanics in your raid is "Just die"
    Last edited by Smapper; Feb 12 2019 at 08:42 PM.
    44 Bulldog

  14. #14
    Yeah...You have to also love the wording used, "Our Fates Entwined has been ADJUSTED".

    Adjusted? I think 'DESTROYED' is a more fitting word.
    Gaii (105 RK) / Shokti (105 Minstrel) / Cybele (105 LM)

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Smapper View Post
    ...you know you screwed up as a dev when half of the mechanics in your raid is "Just die"
    surprisingly also very applicable to PVP.... too many situations end up where death is either guaranteed or impossible (on both sides)
    The Black Appendage of Sauron

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Shizuku View Post
    I guess now that the population has dwindled devs just give players anything they want. Hmm
    A former dev explained it best tbh

    I realized that she had gone to the forums fishing for some easy change she could make that could be said to be addressing 'player concerns'. And that wouldn't be the last time by a long shot that I, as an active and socially connected player, would be told by a dev who didn't play LOTRO themselves 'what players want'. So...yeah whenever I hear Turbine claiming it changed this or that based on 'feed back', I tend to roll my eyes.

    (Source http://jaq.guildlaunch.com/forums/vi...php?t=10796464 ) great read.
    44 Bulldog

  17. #17
    As one of the few rk who almost exclusively heal (I know most dps but heal only if needed) since lvl 65, I must say this is one of the worst nerfs to ever happen to heal rk since helm's deep trait trees.
    RK lost nearly all of its damage reducing skills (pot effect prevention, elemental protection, meaningful bubbles and constant fates entwined toggle skill) when trait trees came with helm's deep, and the only time I really could enjoy being considered a "true healer" since then was since lvl 120 till today. That's it, so basically less than half a year of being a raid-worthy healer in the last 5 years (I mean I healed throne, mordath and that stuff but basically minis were 2x as good healers as rks if you ask me). That's simply terrible.
    Fates entwined stone was truly not intended, and certainly shouldn't be a skill that literally allow your entire fellowship to ignore most of the mechanics of some fights BUT... and it's a big BUT, it's the ONLY EMERGENCY SKILL that rk have right now, bubbles of 20k morale are nothing to a tank, epic for the ages is just a rotation skill and heal is ridiculously low. And honestly, if you nerf one skill to 1/3 of its magnitude... do you really think increasing the cooldown by 50% is also required?, and reducing radius? if anything the radius should have been doubled! If you have a 20% damage reduction on the fellowship... I'd say just nerf it to 10% and make it a toggle skill like it used to be that would be 100% uptime. As it is right now it's gonna be just useless.

    I really think you should listen the community and please just take back fates entwined changes for the moment and just do it as a part of a class rebalance update in which you give something to rks to compensate for that loss, something like multiplying x3 the heal of epic for the ages... making rousing words useful. And maybe in combat rezz, changing how bubbles work, or something like that: Only removing this skill from game will just be removing heal rk from endgame. Why bring a rk into a raid if healing is similar to minstrels but minstrels got anthems, got rezz, got better emergency skills and can reduce inc damage of the fellowship 100% uptime?

    DON'T DESTROY A CLASS JUST BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T PUT A 200M DAMAGE HIT ON BOSS SO THAT NO DAMAGE REDUCTION SKILL COULD MITIGATE IT, OR SIMPLY MISSADVENTURE... FATES ENTWINED IS NOT THE PROBLEM ON HRIMIL, JUST PUT MISSADVENTURE DEFEAT IF YOU GET CAUGHT OUT OF SHELTER AND FIXED.

  18. #18
    Hahahahahhahah what a joke of a company.I am amazed people still pay for sub with changes like this.Meanwhile classes are still waiting years for simple fixes on traits.Literaly bunch of incompetent insert you know what word here.Pathetic.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Kander View Post
    ... DON'T DESTROY A CLASS JUST BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T PUT A 200M DAMAGE HIT ON BOSS SO THAT NO DAMAGE REDUCTION SKILL COULD MITIGATE IT, OR SIMPLY MISSADVENTURE... FATES ENTWINED IS NOT THE PROBLEM ON HRIMIL, JUST PUT MISSADVENTURE DEFEAT IF YOU GET CAUGHT OUT OF SHELTER AND FIXED.
    "See, guys, the rc with one hand is still doing its job !!!! He helps the raid ... LET'S LET US CHOOSE BETTER HANDS !!!! Without hands, it will definitely become useless !!!!

    SSG, but after all, apart from this raid there are other instances where you needed (WAS !!!) RC!
    Generally in whose inflamed brain came such a stupid idea to spoil the character, who is so weakly healed in the area!!!
    Last edited by PepsUS; Feb 12 2019 at 10:25 PM.

  20. #20
    That almost makes rks a non viable healer now. Fatestone was broken and needed to be fixed, but just removing it leaves runekeepers in a bad spot. Worse even than minstrels were a few weeks ago. At least they brought some good utility. And why, because people use it to get past hrimil? It's the only way to do t3 because they don't even give you shelter 75% of the time on hrimil T3. Even if they wanted to hotfix it, they didn't need to take it this far. increasing the cooldown by 50%, reducing the radius by 30%, and reducing the damage reduction by 67% is absurd. It's barely stronger than our group bubble at this point, it can't really be called a cooldown anymore. They basically removed fatestone entirely and left us with a second essay of exaltation. that is an insanely huge nerf with zero compensatory buffs and is exactly what the runekeeper forum was warning against doing.

    I was main healer for all of my kins anvil progression T2 and T3, and I really don't see any reason why a T3 raid would want to bring a healing RK at this point. We don't do more hps single target than bears or minstrels, we have no cooldowns to save the tank now, bad in combat revive (as healer revives go. I am aware our revive is busted in dps spec). Our only dps buffing ability requires us to wear level 105 gear, and be in melee range. There is nothing that a runekeeper does better than a bear or a minstrel now.

    edit: also, Runekeepers have no big heals. Epic for the ages is 15-20k base heal (before incoming healing modifiers), and even that is quite a long induction. It takes away our ONLY useful reactive ability.
    Last edited by Fasin; Feb 13 2019 at 12:30 AM.
    .
    Gruid-Level 65 Burglar. Trebon-Level 65 Minstrel. Foilfang-Level 60 Hobbit Warden. Stiric-Level 56 Man Champion.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Moria
    Posts
    209
    We will overcome this. Let's submit feedback through the proper channels in a mature manner. We can get this changed if we handle this right.
    Varkking - Dwarf Rune-Keeper - Syndicate - Anor Server
    Moderator of Lord of the Rings On Prime Subreddit.

  22. #22
    If a tank was taking 10,000 damage per second, fatestone would block 120,000 damage per minute pre nerf, 360,000 damage in 3 minutes. Post nerf it would block 40,000 damage instead of 120,000 over the same 20s, but it also has had its cooldown increased by 50%, meaning it would block 80,000 damage in 3 minutes. a 78% nerf to the effectiveness of fatestone, even ignoring the radius nerf (why would you nerf the radius?).
    .
    Gruid-Level 65 Burglar. Trebon-Level 65 Minstrel. Foilfang-Level 60 Hobbit Warden. Stiric-Level 56 Man Champion.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Fasin View Post
    If a tank was taking 10,000 damage per second, fatestone would block 120,000 damage per minute pre nerf, 360,000 damage in 3 minutes. Post nerf it would block 40,000 damage instead of 120,000 over the same 20s, but it also has had its cooldown increased by 50%, meaning it would block 80,000 damage in 3 minutes. a 78% nerf to the effectiveness of fatestone, even ignoring the radius nerf (why would you nerf the radius?).
    Exactly. Just imagine what would happen if minstrels get bolster or triumphant spirit nerfed by 80% and given nothing in exchange...

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Germany
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    510
    It's just a dot.do.dot.Update. SSG will adjust it soon, I think. You have to see it long term.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Thurinuor View Post
    It's just a dot.do.dot.Update. SSG will adjust it soon, I think. You have to see it long term.
    This is what worries me.

    Nerfed LM's anti-stun - and released instances with stun spam mechanics.
    Nerfed burglar Reveal Weakness - and gave no real compensation.
    Nerfed AOE heals for minstrels and bears, and now RKs - and increased AOE spike damage.
    Unpottable and uncurable fears, wounds and CC effects everywhere.

    Comments from Vastin suggest instance design via spreadsheet. All of this smacks of a "you will use THESE SKILLS ONLY for this fight" approach to instance design, heavily reliant on RNG, rather than allowing players to be creative, as (say) Orion would have done.

    What next?
    105s: Aedfrith (HN), Aldnoth (CP), Brai (RK), Hrolfdan (MN), Aeldfryd (WD), Morriarty (CH), Aednoth (LM), Mishhar (BR), Hraldan (GR), Rummbold (BG). Tinies - Rumbelina (MN), Aenghus (CP)
    Rangers of Eriador (officer), ex-Snowbourn now Laurelin - A Noob for All Seasons

 

 
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