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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    2,187

    Please make an effort to clean up and make NPCs relevant again

    Over the years the # of NPC's that sell/barter/do anything has increased drastically. In my opinion, the best days were Shadows of Angmar, you had class trainers, bards, reputation vendors, and when you got to end game you could trade in certain tokens for Rift, Helegrod, Carn Dum, or PvMP gear (I'm sure I'm missing a lot).

    Today, NPC's are overwhelmingly confusing, and the ones you do encounter which should be useful are either pointless or become pointless as soon as you hit level 50.

    My request is simple, that we get back to the basics and make core NPC's relevant again. People should want/need to visit core game NPC's like class trainers, bards, town criers, etc. even at L120.

    The extremely long list of barter NPC's should be cleaned up too. In Minas Tirith alone, you have a whole host of NPC's in TWO version of Minas Tirith (before/after battle) that give you various armour sets. I would wager that close to 0% of people will barter for those armour sets, so the NPC's just serve to confuse.

    I know I'm not giving specific direction as to how this problem should be fixed, but overall I think the # of NPC's and their functions needs to be streamlined heavily, and that NPC's should play a vital role in the game even at L120.
    Erendil 50 Hunter Rank 7, Mavellen 45 Warden; Officers of Disciples
    Ragaroth Warleader Rank 7, Marhawk Stalker Rank 5; Members of Cuddle Squad
    Other Characters: Arthilius - Captain, Arthilias - Guardian,
    Claireth - Runekeeper, Harbuckle - Burglar, Lothlirien - Hunter

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    226
    Quote Originally Posted by Strider5548 View Post
    Over the years the # of NPC's that sell/barter/do anything has increased drastically. In my opinion, the best days were Shadows of Angmar, you had class trainers, bards, reputation vendors, and when you got to end game you could trade in certain tokens for Rift, Helegrod, Carn Dum, or PvMP gear (I'm sure I'm missing a lot)
    Yeah I agree with this Idea. why have certain NPC's in game if we have no more need for them...such as Class Trainers

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by farmhand99 View Post
    Yeah I agree with this Idea. why have certain NPC's in game if we have no more need for them...such as Class Trainers
    I agree to an extent that some NPCs serve no real purpose anymore, but Class trainers are useful, especially to new players, and can't be removed. They start the level 15/30 class quests (yes, you can go to the quest NPC directly too), sell the 45 trait point quest items, not to mention basic class items (for example, you can't get Oil wash anywhere else), recipes for consumables (that would give a new player an idea of what their class uses as support); they can offer barter gear in some regions... Players can also preview not yet unlocked skills. Finally, they also offer helpful advice if you bother to read the tiny text in their popup

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    2,187
    Quote Originally Posted by Gothrir View Post
    I agree to an extent that some NPCs serve no real purpose anymore, but Class trainers are useful, especially to new players, and can't be removed. They start the level 15/30 class quests (yes, you can go to the quest NPC directly too), sell the 45 trait point quest items, not to mention basic class items (for example, you can't get Oil wash anywhere else), recipes for consumables (that would give a new player an idea of what their class uses as support); they can offer barter gear in some regions... Players can also preview not yet unlocked skills. Finally, they also offer helpful advice if you bother to read the tiny text in their popup
    Yea, I agree completely, and I'm not at all suggesting we get rid of class trainers. In fact, I want to see class trainers, bards, etc. revitalized so that people do in fact use them at L120. I still go to my class trainer for oils, but they are the same oils I used at level 30, there should be new upgrades/skills/books/everything else that we used class trainers for at level 50.
    Erendil 50 Hunter Rank 7, Mavellen 45 Warden; Officers of Disciples
    Ragaroth Warleader Rank 7, Marhawk Stalker Rank 5; Members of Cuddle Squad
    Other Characters: Arthilius - Captain, Arthilias - Guardian,
    Claireth - Runekeeper, Harbuckle - Burglar, Lothlirien - Hunter

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    1,059
    I feel sorry for the armour/weapon vendors who sell white quality gear for silver. Almost no-one buys anything from them, but instead they have to pay huge sums of gold every day for player characters' trash items.

    In DDO there's this neat idea that you can sell magic items within certain value scale to ordinary vendors for a fixed price (on which your Charisma modifiers can affect), and similarly, other players can buy those for a fixed price too. I always liked that, because it let new, low level players buy some interesting stuff for a reasonable amount of currency, without the need to resort to extreme AH price tags. And it also gave more experienced players a convenient way of getting rid of "better-than-trash" gear for a "better-than-vendor" price, and at the same time provide the items to those who need them, without using AH slots or advertising their freebies on /world.

    I don't know how well that would work in this game, or what kinda data resources it would need. I was thinking of a vendor price multiplier based on item quality, as an easy implementation. So that if you sell a yellow item to said vendor, you'd get, e.g. 4x "vendor price" back. Purple = 8x and so on. And the buyer would need to pay some more than that. I dunno. Here you can "farm" purple items way easier than in DDO, so that could lead to issues, even if the amount of silver gained wasn't high. But if they have done it in their other game, I'm sure they could figure that out, if they found it reasonable effort to begin with. Probably not.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    2,187
    Quote Originally Posted by TharbadThief View Post
    I feel sorry for the armour/weapon vendors who sell white quality gear for silver. Almost no-one buys anything from them, but instead they have to pay huge sums of gold every day for player characters' trash items.

    In DDO there's this neat idea that you can sell magic items within certain value scale to ordinary vendors for a fixed price (on which your Charisma modifiers can affect), and similarly, other players can buy those for a fixed price too. I always liked that, because it let new, low level players buy some interesting stuff for a reasonable amount of currency, without the need to resort to extreme AH price tags. And it also gave more experienced players a convenient way of getting rid of "better-than-trash" gear for a "better-than-vendor" price, and at the same time provide the items to those who need them, without using AH slots or advertising their freebies on /world.

    I don't know how well that would work in this game, or what kinda data resources it would need. I was thinking of a vendor price multiplier based on item quality, as an easy implementation. So that if you sell a yellow item to said vendor, you'd get, e.g. 4x "vendor price" back. Purple = 8x and so on. And the buyer would need to pay some more than that. I dunno. Here you can "farm" purple items way easier than in DDO, so that could lead to issues, even if the amount of silver gained wasn't high. But if they have done it in their other game, I'm sure they could figure that out, if they found it reasonable effort to begin with. Probably not.
    It would be amazing if vendors took our stuff, paid dynamic values for it, and resold those items for a given amount of time. People would actually go to NPC vendors to see what new items are available.
    Erendil 50 Hunter Rank 7, Mavellen 45 Warden; Officers of Disciples
    Ragaroth Warleader Rank 7, Marhawk Stalker Rank 5; Members of Cuddle Squad
    Other Characters: Arthilius - Captain, Arthilias - Guardian,
    Claireth - Runekeeper, Harbuckle - Burglar, Lothlirien - Hunter

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Strider5548 View Post
    It would be amazing if vendors took our stuff, paid dynamic values for it, and resold those items for a given amount of time. People would actually go to NPC vendors to see what new items are available.
    I seem to remember something like that in Acheron's Call, always a huge amount of players checking out what was "in store". That was 16 years ago for me though. It was what each vendor had so you checked them all out but nothing much was bound like we have these days. They should have the code knocking around somewhere

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    656
    Quote Originally Posted by Strider5548 View Post
    It would be amazing if vendors took our stuff, paid dynamic values for it, and resold those items for a given amount of time. People would actually go to NPC vendors to see what new items are available.
    Yup that is how Everquest vendors work. Vendor mining is a national pastime. In old times vendor prices depended heavily on one's rep standing (affected by race, religion and quested faction) as well as charisma, but modern hub zones got all-neutral vendors.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    14
    Just imagine: I had started again at a new Char after a longer break and surprise: i can not learn any skill at my class´s trainer. All are learned already but some rohan stuff. How can learning a skill being accountwhide please? And who had thought it is a good idea? Warden.

    Ok 1 point why it maybe haves to be like this: I have got plenty of accountwhide skills and premium stuff which is boosting my chars. Re learning them is not possible so fast.
    So yes: 50% yes for an skill npc and accountwhide premium skills no re learning please. It would take forever each toon.

    For the lots of traders: i love them. But how to getting rid of traders which are important for an good rpg - feeling please?
    You can but then it will be a: all are seling the same *yawn* or ghost towns.. *boooring*

    Ps.: if someone can fix this skill riddle and allowing me to skill learned stuff at an class npc again it would be awesome. But only if it is an new main. So the twinks can stay instant skilled. I had missed the learning and this progress at the new start.
    Last edited by Androhir; Feb 12 2019 at 11:22 PM.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Gallifrey. I need a Jelly Baby.
    Posts
    20,606
    I would like to have guards that actually guard instead of watching you fight mobs inside what ever they are supposed to be guarding.
    Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, totally worn out & proclaiming "WOW, what a ride!"
    Continuing the never ending battle to keep Lobelia Sackville-Baggins in check

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymphonic View Post
    I would like to have guards that actually guard instead of watching you fight mobs inside what ever they are supposed to be guarding.
    So signed. AI? Whats that? At an RPG The guards shall protect their peoples. Ok If someone is trying exploiting this then 0 ep for this mob(s) at a mainly guards kill as malus.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    226
    I should have clairfied better. It would have been better for the game and players if the Class Trainers had not been gutted like they were when the trait system came out. I loved going back to the Class Trainer to learn new skills this made the game feel some what real in a sense. I believe they could have adopted the Class Trainer to do something simular in the trait trees. Such as learning new skills in each line but to onlock them you need/have to go to the Class Trainer....They have something like this for Skirmish Soldier training especally when you change to a different soldier you need to pay for all the skills. They could have taken that approach with the 3 trait line and the Class Trainers.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    4,280
    Quote Originally Posted by farmhand99 View Post
    Yeah I agree with this Idea. why have certain NPC's in game if we have no more need for them...such as Class Trainers
    You still have to buy things from them, such as the level 39 class deed books. They COULD put all of those on ONE vendor, but having them on a CLASS vendor makes it easy to identify them, so you don't accidentally buy one that isn't for your class. They also sell class specific items such as oil wash for hunters that want to swap from fire to light, etc...

    The trainers still have some limited use for bug or "feature" fixes as well.... there have been a few times in the past where due to a bug or a change gone wrong, certain classes had to go back to their class trainer and get a "fix it" item of some sorts or whatever if I remember correctly.... or buy a tome that fixes things if you did a valar upgrade or something or another.

    I agree though that it does get overwhelming. They really should figure out in-game currencies too, every expansion, every zone a new currency, a new grind, a new currency cap.... I don't know if that is something that all MMO's have to deal with, but it seems to me it could be easier.
    Moved from Riddermark to Arkenstone on 9/29/2015!
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    Disclaimer: The definition of "Soon™" is based solely on SSG's interpretation of the word, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "Soon™" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

 

 

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