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  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Mukor View Post
    Every 600k with a champ you need 1 minute longer and this is far to much
    10k dps difference between rk and champion...

    we needed ~3:30 for id1 T2, ...10.000 dps x 210 sec = 2.100.000 dmg which a rk would have dealt more than a champion.

    our raid had in 3:30 of time ~700.000 dps. -----> 2.100.000 dmg / 700.000 dps = 3 seconds

    so we would be 3 seconds faster if he would have taken another rk over our one champion.

    if a hunter deals lets say 30k more dps than a champion und you switch them it would be 9 seconds difference
    Hecki Hecki Pateng ~ Soldurii ~ Thelyn Ennor ~ Banditos // Vanyar & Gwaihir (EU-DE)

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    95
    Quote Originally Posted by Zariliv92 View Post
    10k dps difference between rk and champion...

    we needed ~3:30 for id1 T2, ...10.000 dps x 210 sec = 2.100.000 dmg which a rk would have dealt more than a champion.

    our raid had in 3:30 of time ~700.000 dps. -----> 2.100.000 dmg / 700.000 dps = 3 seconds

    so we would be 3 seconds faster if he would have taken another rk over our one champion.

    if a hunter deals lets say 30k more dps than a champion und you switch them it would be 9 seconds difference
    I'd really appreciate a couple of pictures of these parses.
    Teucros/Psorokostaina/Ippokratis/Kervertros.
    Officer & Raid Leader for The Aegean Eagles, Evernight {EU}.
    http://aegeaneagles.forumotion.com
    https://theaegeaneagles.shivtr.com

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,384
    Quote Originally Posted by Zariliv92 View Post
    10k dps difference between rk and champion...

    we needed ~3:30 for id1 T2, ...10.000 dps x 210 sec = 2.100.000 dmg which a rk would have dealt more than a champion.

    our raid had in 3:30 of time ~700.000 dps. -----> 2.100.000 dmg / 700.000 dps = 3 seconds

    so we would be 3 seconds faster if he would have taken another rk over our one champion.

    if a hunter deals lets say 30k more dps than a champion und you switch them it would be 9 seconds difference
    Guessing normal line up.
    Normal would be tank, 2heals, 1 lm which 4 dps you can ignore. 2 cappies, 1 burg which would make 30-50k dps.
    So left are 5 dps spots.
    5 spots filled with hunter which do 20% more you win a whole spot compared to use only champs as dps.
    Lowest dps to highest must maximum 5% if there aren't any other mechamicwise disadvantages. Which champs normally have, Well not in this raid bit normally, so they must be the topdps to rqualize this disadvantages.
    Not to forget that they get the most dmg in a group.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    95
    Quote Originally Posted by Mukor View Post
    Guessing normal line up.
    Normal would be tank, 2heals, 1 lm which 4 dps you can ignore. 2 cappies, 1 burg which would make 30-50k dps.
    So left are 5 dps spots.
    5 spots filled with hunter which do 20% more you win a whole spot compared to use only champs as dps.
    Lowest dps to highest must maximum 5% if there aren't any other mechamicwise disadvantages. Which champs normally have, Well not in this raid bit normally, so they must be the topdps to rqualize this disadvantages.
    Not to forget that they get the most dmg in a group.
    Burglar dealing 30-50k DpS? In yellow? Now i'm really interested.
    Teucros/Psorokostaina/Ippokratis/Kervertros.
    Officer & Raid Leader for The Aegean Eagles, Evernight {EU}.
    http://aegeaneagles.forumotion.com
    https://theaegeaneagles.shivtr.com

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,384
    Quote Originally Posted by Demosthenes11 View Post
    Burglar dealing 30-50k DpS? In yellow? Now i'm really interested.
    Then Set this three to cero too. So you're at 700 k for each of the five spots for dps which are in average 140 k dps.
    Which means a lot of the dps were helped by the other dps for the champ.
    So champs are just lucky that the fights aren't so hard that we've puffer to take them with us out of mercy.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Athens/Greece
    Posts
    151
    For a champion to achieve on single target only 10k dps less than an a good RK or Hunter must not wearing any mitigation must have a very good cpt on him always and every help from burglar LM beorning and still....
    Guys i play all dps classes when i have to spend at least 5 slots for mitigation's in my champions armour and just only 2 and thats occasionally on my range classes even with numbers its impossible to achieve only -10k dps and i am not willing to go glass cannon with my champion and make my healer suffering for try to keeping me up he have a lot of work to do with other more important classes in there.
    Arandour Champion Rank 12-Nerien Hunter Rank 11-Runendir RK Rank 7
    Narzul Lore Master-Ruarin Guardian-Gorgeous Minstrel
    Borzol Reaver Rank 12-Mauhnakh BA Rank 9-Varcolac Stalker Rank 9
    Sumnor Spider Rank 8-Orcapo Defiler Rank 8.

  7. #57
    Maybe time to erase minstrel and champion from server ?

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Arandour View Post
    For a champion to achieve on single target only 10k dps less than an a good RK or Hunter must not wearing any mitigation must have a very good cpt on him always and every help from burglar LM beorning and still....
    .
    Thats exactly how the highest parses are coming together. Without all that support nobody does the insane parses. To maximize on DPS everyone needs to be buffed up at all times. Sure red champ cant compete with Hunter and RK on ST damage but especially Hunter brings nothing but damage, red champ has utility outside of that. Not talking about RK's since DNF is pretty huge on a damage dealer. Thats a pretty big thing they have going for themselves.
    About mitigations.. when your role is to DPS and theres no unavoidable damage that kills you, you always go full glass canon. And if there is you raise mits to a threshhold that allows to survive. And with unavoidable I mean unavoidable, if theres any way to dodge that damage you figure out how and execute.So if you as champ HAVE to wear mits your hunters will probably have to do so too. Except for T3 Thrumfall theres no Instance thats not completable for a Champ of any spec. Even T3 Thrumfall is/was, but unreasonably hard and shouldn't be attempted. Champs are always good for interupts and anti corruption just to throw that out. The ST parses are sufficient and if your Group fails BECAUSE there was a Champ in it, it is not the fact that there was a Champ but that the Group didnt execute properly. Sure everything that can be Zerged from range one by one its always easier to go heavy ST, that doesnt exclusively make them viable. And if youre in a toxic envoirement like that im sorry for you, I know that feeling. A lot of people who are barely good enough to attempt T3 / T2C and don't care for minmaxing and getting good try to compensate with the easiest Strats available.

    What i'd be asking of SSG is to scale Rend and Horn debuff properly also Flurry crit rating, or make it % that goes beyond 30%. Also fix the red line bleed and make it have an impact dmg so reapplying it is actually benefitial. Another thing that would synergize well that I never see anyone ask for is an AOE crit def debuff on any of our skills. That could have been a sick set bonus to increase that and would be highly benefitial to the whole group.

    Not trying to deny that there was heavy Melee unfriendliness going on in Mordor, just saying it definately got better again and Champs can shine when they are allowed to.

 

 
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