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  1. #126
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    290

    Post

    Hey folks, Vastin here.

    We're definitely still iterating on the ratings changes and tweaking some DPS/morale pool values.

    Unfortunately, the big ratings rework we did for palantir a while ago didn't make it to bullroarer until this last drop due to a propogation error - so, sorry about that dropping on you at the last minute.

    Anyway, we're making substantial adjustments for the next bullroarer (there will definitely be at least one more). Overall the gear ratings will be getting stingier - I simply didn't adjust it enough to compensate for the fact that mastery is no longer an infinite stat dump in many builds.

    I also normalized the different stat values too much on the first pass. DPS/Healer builds simply don't care deeply about as many stats as the tank builds do, so the dps stats will be getting comparatively more expensive to cap on gear - all the new curves and caps remain unchanged, it's just the gear stats themselves that will change.

    The main stats on gear are not being reduced, so they'll be better comparatively than they were - though I doubt most builds will be interested in throwing in main stat essences even then. They are mostly intended to provide a stat floor for various key character ratings rather than to act as a power stat.

    On the morale pool side I'm making some minor tweaks to cap level mobs, and bumping up the lower level (50-105) mobs somewhat.

    We are in a position to iterate on these values quite rapidly - but we need detailed feedback on order to make those changes more effective. When posting balance feedback please include salient details like Character Level, general class/build (I don't need full tree breakdowns, 'blue loremaster with a splash of red' is fine), average equipment iLevel, enemy types/levels, and of course what instance and tier you are running (if any).

    Without these details for context, it is very hard to squeeze any meaning out of responses.

    -Vastin

  2. #127
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Russia
    Posts
    38

    Thikil-Gundu

    Thikil-Gundu Feedback:

    - trash pools are too long
    - too much morale for t2 mode
    - boss 1 looks good, but it could be a bit harder for t2
    - boss 2 is very easy, even with mechanics that u add in beta#5
    - boss 3 is good, but you should better make it much harder on t3
    - whole run took about 2.5 hours, with 2 hunters and rk, that is too long for 6man t2 (even not t3) (whole run of AoM t2c took not more than 2 hours)

    About classes:

    Rk's damage is terrible and you need to give some love to rk's dps.
    Increasing dots up to 70-100% would change it.

    Warden's dps is very good now, animation is perfect, thx for that very much!

    Beorning's healing is very good, but please do something with battle res or it doesn't make sense to take beorn vs mini.

    It's hard now to do mits cap for mini for example , cause u need to cap crit, but if you do crit cap you get 30% phys mits and ~25% mits cap.


    Main problem of instances is very high morale pull of mobs in t2 6man for example, you need to do smth with this if you don't want to increase dps of hunters/rks and others.

    Decrease morale pull of trash mobs or it take ages to clear this 6man.
    Change yourself.

  3. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post

    We are in a position to iterate on these values quite rapidly - but we need detailed feedback on order to make those changes more effective. When posting balance feedback please include salient details like Character Level, general class/build (I don't need full tree breakdowns, 'blue loremaster with a splash of red' is fine), average equipment iLevel, enemy types/levels, and of course what instance and tier you are running (if any).
    Hey, Vastin!
    I have one question just to sort things out before posting further feedback:
    Overall DPS of lvl 120 beta characters (with offensive stats close to cap) is lower than current live lvl 115 chars, is it intended or not?
    Xolla;Tishina\Arkenstone

  4. #129
    Thx for this respons Vastin, i know how hard it is to learn from feedback, when its without context. I really like the approach of keeping the players away from capping all Stats to easy and with the Changes of Fines, some DD's
    should consider besides taking Critt/Mastery also some Finesse in their Builds.

    But one stat was in my Eyes to hard to get and this was crit (in build 1-4). Please keep in mind, that classes like Hunter/Champion and Burglar relay on critts way more then other classes. Make at least the first 15-20% easy accessible. I got with my Champ in Build 4, with t2 Gear and 10 Essences of critt, just 17% rating, including 5% from the red tree, so a base value of 12%. Thats way to low, Build 5 looked in this way much better (same build and 24% critt).

    I would rather prefer, making it much harder to hit Mastery Cap then Crit Cap, maby make capping Mastery cap nearly impossible, so that a good Dps build has around 130-160% mastery, with high End raid gear maby 180%-190%.
    Gertes

  5. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by Gertes View Post
    I would rather prefer, making it much harder to hit Mastery Cap then Crit Cap, maby make capping Mastery cap nearly impossible, so that a good Dps build has around 130-160% mastery, with high End raid gear maby 180%-190%.
    On Build 5 my RK with t2 gear was able to reach 195% TM with 20% CR and undercapped mits (but both were above/around 35%). I was using the T2 gear from Moose, the teal boots from Dwarf-holds (btw, PLS REMOVE THE CAP FOR MARKS OF THE LONGBEARDS, seriously, makes no sense to have one), and teal jewellery (embers). All my slots, but one, were filled with TM mithrin essences
    Main: Laurelinarien (LM) Council of the Elder Lords
    Other lvl caps: Feantura (RK), Laergwend (Mini), Taurtaren (HNT), Morwinne (CPT), Furcifer (Beorn), Seregeth (WDN), Dagnirion (Champ) & Kitiarya (Burg).
    Lowbies: Brynhilt (GRD) & Daerris [High-Elf CPT]

  6. #131
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    Nov 2017
    Location
    The Netherlands
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    Just coming from the Beta and having a couple of ''fights'' in the moors.
    Against capped (120) Freeps the fights seemed to be rather even. As far as I could tell since I've only had about 3 fights with capped players and the other ~10 players there were all level 105 one shotting anything that mapped in or walked into range.

    Level Scaling is absolutely broken!

    Here's some damage numbers I received in my time on BR. All these players are level 105.

    Warden
    Banaul scored a critical hit with Big Bleed on Urundus for 66,141 Common damage to Morale.
    Banaul scored a hit with Big Bleed on Urundus for 31,124 Common damage to Morale.
    Banaul scored a hit with Big Bleed on Urundus for 33,871 Common damage to Morale.

    Banaul scored a critical hit with Medium Bleed on Urundus for 62,031 Common damage to Morale.
    Banaul scored a critical hit with Medium Bleed on Urundus for 59,963 Common damage to Morale.
    Banaul scored a hit with Medium Bleed on Urundus for 25,540 Common damage to Morale.
    Banaul scored a hit with Medium Bleed on Urundus for 24,689 Common damage to Morale.

    Banaul scored a critical hit with Spear of Virtue - Light Damage over Time on Urundus for 75,710 Light damage to Morale.
    Here's some tooltips I managed to capture while this warden was fighting a warg.


    Burglar
    Aldon scored a devastating hit with Coup De Grâce on Urundus for 84,018 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a devastating hit with Coup De Grâce on Urundus for 39,784 Westernesse damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a devastating hit with Coup De Grâce on Urundus for 112,899 Common damage to Morale.

    Aldon scored a devastating hit with Double-edged Strike on Urundus for 51,233 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a devastating hit with Double-edged Strike on Urundus for 18,938 Westernesse damage to Morale.

    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 26,921 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 27,692 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 28,463 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 29,235 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 29,235 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 30,006 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 23,004 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 23,004 Common damage to Morale.
    Aldon scored a critical hit with Devastating Improved Cunning Attack on Urundus for 23,580 Common damage to Morale.
    And in case you're not convinced yet.

    Hunter
    Runboy scored a critical hit with Heart Seeker on Urundus for 254,164 Beleriand damage to Morale.

    Runboy scored a critical hit with Barrage of Light on Urundus for 101,469 Light damage to Morale.

    Runboy scored a critical hit with Imp. Penetrating Shot: Pierce the Darkness on Urundus for 60,592 Light damage to Morale.

    Element scored a critical hit with Imp. Penetrating Shot: Burn Through on Urundus for 83,853 Fire damage to Morale.
    Element scored a critical hit with Imp. Penetrating Shot: Burn Through on Urundus for 99,567 Fire damage to Morale.

    Element scored a critical hit with Improved Swift Bow: Ablaze on Urundus for 85,788 Fire damage to Morale.

    Element scored a critical hit with Searing Blood Arrow on Urundus for 164,392 Fire damage to Morale.
    Element scored a critical hit with Searing Blood Arrow on Urundus for 187,095 Fire damage to Morale.

    Element scored a critical hit with a ranged attack on Urundus for 19,828 Beleriand damage to Morale.
    Element scored a critical hit with a ranged attack on Urundus for 18,204 Beleriand damage to Morale.
    All these were without the use of Burn Hot btw

    And last but not least, also without Burn Hot:

    Reydlayn scored a critical hit with Improved Merciful Shot on Urunluk for 412,417 Beleriand damage to Morale.

    And these were just the ones I could bother finding in the combat log and copy/pasting.
    I case you're not convinced yet. Here's all the damage parses I took a screenshot of. Link.

    I still don't get why we need level scaling in the moors to begin with. I never see an actual level scaled player other than some players that stuck with 105 for a while to use certain gear sets.
    To me it only seems to be another mechanic that can be misused. I'd rather see it removed entirely and either not scale in the moors at all, or disabling access to the moors unless you are at level cap.

    Oh, and obligatory plug in for creep consumables to be scaled to 120.
    Last edited by Urundus; Sep 28 2018 at 05:22 PM.
    High Chieftain Urundus
    Cohorts of the Red Legion
    Arkenstone

  7. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Urundus View Post

    I still don't get why we need level scaling in the moors to begin with.
    Level scaling is good idea in theory.

    it would let people who decide to stick around a certain past cap/run old content to continue to participate in PVP or those with lots of alts to choose which classes to play without having to worry about grinding them all up to cap.


    However, after these global stat changes, it seems to have gone completely off the rails across the board, not just in PVP.

    Some old content is now ultra trivial to on-level people, and certain things scale up waaaay farther than they should, while others don't scale at all.
    The Black Appendage of Sauron

  8. #133
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
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    Toronto
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    743
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Hey folks, Vastin here.

    We're definitely still iterating on the ratings changes and tweaking some DPS/morale pool values.

    Unfortunately, the big ratings rework we did for palantir a while ago didn't make it to bullroarer until this last drop due to a propogation error - so, sorry about that dropping on you at the last minute.

    Anyway, we're making substantial adjustments for the next bullroarer (there will definitely be at least one more). Overall the gear ratings will be getting stingier - I simply didn't adjust it enough to compensate for the fact that mastery is no longer an infinite stat dump in many builds.

    I also normalized the different stat values too much on the first pass. DPS/Healer builds simply don't care deeply about as many stats as the tank builds do, so the dps stats will be getting comparatively more expensive to cap on gear - all the new curves and caps remain unchanged, it's just the gear stats themselves that will change.

    The main stats on gear are not being reduced, so they'll be better comparatively than they were - though I doubt most builds will be interested in throwing in main stat essences even then. They are mostly intended to provide a stat floor for various key character ratings rather than to act as a power stat.

    On the morale pool side I'm making some minor tweaks to cap level mobs, and bumping up the lower level (50-105) mobs somewhat.

    We are in a position to iterate on these values quite rapidly - but we need detailed feedback on order to make those changes more effective. When posting balance feedback please include salient details like Character Level, general class/build (I don't need full tree breakdowns, 'blue loremaster with a splash of red' is fine), average equipment iLevel, enemy types/levels, and of course what instance and tier you are running (if any).

    Without these details for context, it is very hard to squeeze any meaning out of responses.

    -Vastin
    Vastin pls consider reverting these stats back to the way they were at build #4, at build for everything was a lot more stable and reasonable, the only broken things were literally crit (the cap was too high compared to the essence yield) and Outgoing healing was terrible, other then that everything was great, another benefit of reverting the stats back to build #4 would be that PVMP WOULD BE BALANCED AND A LOT MORE ENJOYABLE. Also, pls get rid of lvl scaling in the moors it is broken (when someone enters the moors at a lower lvl then 120 they get scaled)

  9. #134
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    291
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Hey folks, Vastin here.

    We're definitely still iterating on the ratings changes and tweaking some DPS/morale pool values.

    Unfortunately, the big ratings rework we did for palantir a while ago didn't make it to bullroarer until this last drop due to a propogation error - so, sorry about that dropping on you at the last minute.

    Anyway, we're making substantial adjustments for the next bullroarer (there will definitely be at least one more). Overall the gear ratings will be getting stingier - I simply didn't adjust it enough to compensate for the fact that mastery is no longer an infinite stat dump in many builds.

    I also normalized the different stat values too much on the first pass. DPS/Healer builds simply don't care deeply about as many stats as the tank builds do, so the dps stats will be getting comparatively more expensive to cap on gear - all the new curves and caps remain unchanged, it's just the gear stats themselves that will change.

    The main stats on gear are not being reduced, so they'll be better comparatively than they were - though I doubt most builds will be interested in throwing in main stat essences even then. They are mostly intended to provide a stat floor for various key character ratings rather than to act as a power stat.

    On the morale pool side I'm making some minor tweaks to cap level mobs, and bumping up the lower level (50-105) mobs somewhat.

    We are in a position to iterate on these values quite rapidly - but we need detailed feedback on order to make those changes more effective. When posting balance feedback please include salient details like Character Level, general class/build (I don't need full tree breakdowns, 'blue loremaster with a splash of red' is fine), average equipment iLevel, enemy types/levels, and of course what instance and tier you are running (if any).

    Without these details for context, it is very hard to squeeze any meaning out of responses.

    -Vastin

    Please look at the lv 75 stats specially that Tower of orthanc is fun and challenging for lv 75 Chars.
    Please look at Wardens, due to the scaling the bleeds are broken!
    Please look at stats in General, we should not be able to easy cap mastery. Tbf:With the start of an update you shouldnt get more then 120/130% when the cap is 200%.
    Please look at many bugged items like captain banner(210k mastery), scrolls(giving more physical mastery then tact mastery)….
    Please look at main stats: 2 mastery/mainstat is weak OR boost the mainstat essencs/Food usw....
    Please look at pvp and creep stats. BR Build 4 was really good there. ( i am fine if pvp gets addresses with u23.1)

  10. #135
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    291
    Quote Originally Posted by Siddharta View Post
    Hey, Vastin!
    I have one question just to sort things out before posting further feedback:
    Overall DPS of lvl 120 beta characters (with offensive stats close to cap) is lower than current live lvl 115 chars, is it intended or not?
    Are you sure about that?
    With my burgler i do around 90k dps on live on the galrev dummies and with lv120 i do around 100k.

    With the last br build of u22.x what was equal to live i did several 3min parses on the new dummy and did average 60-62k dps on burg while with lv 120 i do 65-70.

    With my hunter i did during that lv115 u22.x build a few parses around 65-70k while a lv120 hunter can do 75-80k(from what i saw from bammy).


    I would say 120 freeps are stronger then the 115 freeps on live.

  11. #136
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    Jan 2017
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    290

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Urundus View Post
    Just coming from the Beta and having a couple of ''fights'' in the moors.
    Against capped (120) Freeps the fights seemed to be rather even. As far as I could tell since I've only had about 3 fights with capped players and the other ~10 players there were all level 105 one shotting anything that mapped in or walked into range.

    Level Scaling is absolutely broken!
    Absolutely correct. Broken as hell for LI's. I can now see that it's been like that for a long time - it just got worse with each progressive update.

    We fixed some level scaling bugs for regular gear, but unfortunately LI scaling still apparently has... issues, and those issues were exacerbated when I extended the LI damage tables well into the future. Basically the scaling system is doing some kind of bogus lookup for LI's and grabbing some arbitrary level value from somewhere well above the level it is supposed to. In other words, because LI damage uses its own unique level progression, the scaling system doesn't know what to do with it.

    On the plus side, the quick fix is easy - all those theoretical 'future' LI damage values I added are now the same as cap, so it doesn't matter where it looks up, it should never go above the 120 (LI 58) cap value (for now).

    Real Fix - engineering has to slog through the scaling code and figure out how to make it play nice with LIs.

    -Vastin

  12. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Drizzels View Post
    Are you sure about that?
    With my burgler i do around 90k dps on live on the galrev dummies and with lv120 i do around 100k.

    With the last br build of u22.x what was equal to live i did several 3min parses on the new dummy and did average 60-62k dps on burg while with lv 120 i do 65-70.

    With my hunter i did during that lv115 u22.x build a few parses around 65-70k while a lv120 hunter can do 75-80k(from what i saw from bammy).


    I would say 120 freeps are stronger then the 115 freeps on live.
    Ok let's say it is close to similar for B5, some classes are worse, i mean i want to know what is the goal for Vastin, how big should the difference be compare to live and in which direction?
    Xolla;Tishina\Arkenstone

  13. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Absolutely correct. Broken as hell for LI's. I can now see that it's been like that for a long time - it just got worse with each progressive update.

    We fixed some level scaling bugs for regular gear, but unfortunately LI scaling still apparently has... issues, and those issues were exacerbated when I extended the LI damage tables well into the future. Basically the scaling system is doing some kind of bogus lookup for LI's and grabbing some arbitrary level value from somewhere well above the level it is supposed to. In other words, because LI damage uses its own unique level progression, the scaling system doesn't know what to do with it.

    On the plus side, the quick fix is easy - all those theoretical 'future' LI damage values I added are now the same as cap, so it doesn't matter where it looks up, it should never go above the 120 (LI 58) cap value (for now).

    Real Fix - engineering has to slog through the scaling code and figure out how to make it play nice with LIs.

    -Vastin
    As a software engineer I appreciate you posting this and giving us an idea of what's going on! Love detailed communication like this.
    The Black Appendage of Sauron

  14. #139
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    Level 74 Landscape Solo Red Line Champ U23.5 Results

    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Hey folks, Vastin here.

    On the morale pool side I'm making some minor tweaks to cap level mobs, and bumping up the lower level (50-105) mobs somewhat.

    We are in a position to iterate on these values quite rapidly - but we need detailed feedback on order to make those changes more effective. When posting balance feedback please include salient details like Character Level, general class/build (I don't need full tree breakdowns, 'blue loremaster with a splash of red' is fine), average equipment iLevel, enemy types/levels, and of course what instance and tier you are running (if any).

    Without these details for context, it is very hard to squeeze any meaning out of responses.

    -Vastin
    Note that Gear Levels are 66 to 74

    Major Changes to Stats:

    Stat Live U23.5 U23.5 No Armour
    Morale 6662 14088 9633
    Armour 4310 9607 0
    Might 1165 2526 1354
    Agility 234 510 442
    Vitality 997 2526 1536
    Offense Crit 3726 5188 3378
    Tactical Mastery 11468 4023 2722
    Parry 5680 10935 6896
    Physical Mitigation 5407 10704 1097
    Tactical Mitigation 2311 3370 1449

    Observations:
    The Level 75 Shakh-Hai Warrior / Archer / Woodcutter (As found in Nan Curunir near Isengard) is very easy to defeat.
    They do very little damage (90 to 236, Avg 153) and their morale (8890) is much less than mine (14088 for U23.5).
    My normal damage ranged from 194 to 1032, with an average of 618 and the critical hits ranged from 1309 to 2125 with an average of 1673.
    With their low damage attacks and low health, relative to mine, it is no wonder they are so easy.

    The level 75 Elite Stone Troll, found in the same area, is also easy to defeat.
    The troll does more damage (241 to 686, Avg 392) and with a morale of 44451 the fight lasts longer.

    To better understand the effect of armour, I removed all of my armour (the jewellery remained) and fought the troll. My morale dropped to 2500 before the troll succumbed.
    At least I had some sense of danger from an elite monster.

    I hope that this helps.

    Thanks for your posts, I feel some of your pain.

    Regards

  15. #140
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    May 2007
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    Bring A Mote Trader 7 Worthy Crafts

    There is some remaining work to be done with this quest.

    "Bring A Mote Trader 7 Worthy Crafts"
    "Craft Worthy Items and Exchange them for Motes of Enchantment at a Mote Trader in Bree, Galtrev or Moria's 21st Hall."

    Please provide a list of these "worthy" crafts.

    The quest giver provides no further information.
    The crafting panel provides no further information.

    Just what constitutes a "worthy" craft? (This will be needed when it goes live.)

  16. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siddharta View Post
    Hey, Vastin!
    I have one question just to sort things out before posting further feedback:
    Overall DPS of lvl 120 beta characters (with offensive stats close to cap) is lower than current live lvl 115 chars, is it intended or not?
    That’s because the mastery % went from 400 to 200. It’s lower than CURRENT 115 characters (live) but would be higher than 115 characters on the ongoing builds of update 23. Not even covering all the changes to enemy health and stat values.

  17. #142
    @DEVs @CORD
    Devs please fix that brainless 190k mastery captains banner before it goes to live server!

  18. #143
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Absolutely correct. Broken as hell for LI's.
    Thanks for the detailed update.
    << Co-founder of The Firebrands of Caruja on Landroval >>
    Ceolford of Dale, Dorolin, Tordag, Garberend Bellheather, Colfinn Belegorn, Garmo Butterbuckles, Calensarn Nimlos, Langtiriel, Bergteir


  19. #144
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    Botlike, stop acting like a fool.

    I see plenty of people on the DDO forums saying the same thing, only it's them wondering if Lotro is getting more attention.

    If you think that the team that works on lotro is the same that works on DDO, you are sadly mistaken.

    Do you really expect them to drop everything happening on 1 of their games just so they can focus on pleasing you ? Grow up.

  20. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Drizzels View Post
    Please look at Wardens, due to the scaling the bleeds are broken!
    Please look at stats in General, we should not be able to easy cap mastery. Tbf:With the start of an update you shouldnt get more then 120/130% when the cap is 200%.
    Please look at many bugged items like captain banner(210k mastery), scrolls(giving more physical mastery then tact mastery)….
    Please look at main stats: 2 mastery/mainstat is weak OR boost the mainstat essencs/Food usw....
    Please look at pvp and creep stats. BR Build 4 was really good there. ( i am fine if pvp gets addresses with u23.1)
    About warden bleeds I think you're extrapolating a bad level scaling in Moors only to pve. I leveled my warden in warg pens, maxed LIs, maxed stats, and though the bleeds and critical magnitude were up by a decent amount... it's nowhere near the situation you're all claiming. Warden don't have bleed tooltip broken, at least not out of bad level scaling ettenmoors.

  21. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post

    Real Fix - engineering has to slog through the scaling code and figure out how to make it play nice with LIs.

    -Vastin
    OR create pvp weapons that aren't LIs :3 You want to change the LI system anyway so you don't need to spend too much time on this ;P



    - by "fixing" the warden bleeds pls don't nerf it to the ground again
    - pls take a look at traits in the trait tree that didn't age well...It's an error, it doesn't make sense and imo has nothing to do with class balancing

  22. #147
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    Just give creeps their own LI and problem solved

  23. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saruman_Of_Numbers View Post
    Level scaling is good idea in theory.

    it would let people who decide to stick around a certain past cap/run old content to continue to participate in PVP or those with lots of alts to choose which classes to play without having to worry about grinding them all up to cap.


    However, after these global stat changes, it seems to have gone completely off the rails across the board, not just in PVP.

    Some old content is now ultra trivial to on-level people, and certain things scale up waaaay farther than they should, while others don't scale at all.
    Yes, in theory, the idea is good. I agree with that. But in practice, so far, it just hasn't worked.
    When, on the rare occasion, I do see an actual scaled player that is somewhere between level 20 and 90 orso, this player does no dps, has very little morale compared to capped players and dies like a fly. But at the same time, scaled 105's had higher stats than most capped players when Mordor hit. For a long time (at the start of 115) we had a large influx of level 105 burglars, staying at level 105 just to keep using the Throne raid set which resulted in absurd dps numbers.
    So when actual players that need to be scaled get poor scaling, and others that don't really need it get scaled too much, if it can't get fixed properly I'd rather see it removed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Absolutely correct. Broken as hell for LI's. I can now see that it's been like that for a long time - it just got worse with each progressive update.

    We fixed some level scaling bugs for regular gear, but unfortunately LI scaling still apparently has... issues, and those issues were exacerbated when I extended the LI damage tables well into the future. Basically the scaling system is doing some kind of bogus lookup for LI's and grabbing some arbitrary level value from somewhere well above the level it is supposed to. In other words, because LI damage uses its own unique level progression, the scaling system doesn't know what to do with it.

    On the plus side, the quick fix is easy - all those theoretical 'future' LI damage values I added are now the same as cap, so it doesn't matter where it looks up, it should never go above the 120 (LI 58) cap value (for now).

    Real Fix - engineering has to slog through the scaling code and figure out how to make it play nice with LIs.

    -Vastin
    Thank you for the reply and the insight Vastin. Always interesting to hear about what's going on behind the scenes.
    So essentially one of the reasons scaling is broken is because the tier tables for legacies got extended for future updates, and somehow character scaling is pulling a certain value for its legacies from the table that is way over the cap it's supposed to be at?
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  24. #149
    CaerArianrhod's Avatar
    CaerArianrhod is offline Rohirrim Scout
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Anyway, we're making substantial adjustments for the next bullroarer (there will definitely be at least one more).
    -Vastin
    This is the very first thing since the first beta, that make me feels a little bit better.
    Take your time! Really! I don't care about anything else than as balanced stats/game-play as possible. I'm rather willing to wait for it, than for hotfixes and patches.

  25. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Kander View Post
    About warden bleeds I think you're extrapolating a bad level scaling in Moors only to pve. I leveled my warden in warg pens, maxed LIs, maxed stats, and though the bleeds and critical magnitude were up by a decent amount... it's nowhere near the situation you're all claiming. Warden don't have bleed tooltip broken, at least not out of bad level scaling ettenmoors.
    Basicly this.Level 120 warden is almost same as lvl 115 ward.With tooltip of some dots even lower.Extra dps compared to live seems to mostly come from crit magnitude.And if what Vastin said about lis is correct that is whats probably breaking dots when you scale in pvp.

 

 
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