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  1. #1

    New Featured Instance Gear - Minimum Level 120

    With u23 launch it would be good if we could get a new set of featured instance armour, minimum level of 120 bartered with newfound coins.

    This would give us an additional gearing choice from the outset (current FI Gear is max 119) compatible with new essences, which would be greatly appreciated.
    Players will still heavily farm T1/T2 instances for additional armour, jewellery, embers of enchantment, barter coins etc. as well as T3 for better gear etc. when it comes out.
    Knight | Captain | Arkenstone | Rainbows & Unicorns

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight.Arkenstone View Post
    With u23 launch it would be good if we could get a new set of featured instance armour, minimum level of 120 bartered with newfound coins.

    This would give us an additional gearing choice from the outset (current FI Gear is max 119) compatible with new essences, which would be greatly appreciated.
    Players will still heavily farm T1/T2 instances for additional armour, jewellery, embers of enchantment, barter coins etc. as well as T3 for better gear etc. when it comes out.
    The problem with this is that people already have stockpiles of newfound coins. This means that on day 1, people could have 6 pieces of T2 gear, which for some classes would possibly be BiS because of the set bonuses (until the raid sets comes out). Note that the gear would be obtainable without setting foot in one of the new instances and using currency acquired at the previous level cap. Kind of the same reason they created newfound coins and didnt rehash long-lost coins.

    If they do decide to continue the FI gear it will most likely be obtained with a new currency

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkcraft27 View Post
    The problem with this is that people already have stockpiles of newfound coins. This means that on day 1, people could have 6 pieces of T2 gear, which for some classes would possibly be BiS because of the set bonuses (until the raid sets comes out). Note that the gear would be obtainable without setting foot in one of the new instances and using currency acquired at the previous level cap. Kind of the same reason they created newfound coins and didnt rehash long-lost coins.

    If they do decide to continue the FI gear it will most likely be obtained with a new currency
    Or they convert them to LLC and update old FI vendor.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Hallandil View Post
    Or they convert them to LLC and update old FI vendor.
    How does that change anything? That would just be replacing 1 currency people have stockpiled with another (even older) currency that people have stockpiled.

  5. #5
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    Nice idea!
    That way people couldn't be geared from day 1 (if the 120 FI gear is obtained with Newfound coins and the coins are reset). I think that's what Hallandil meant.
    LotRO player and Doer of Great Deeds on Sirannon [FR] since August 15, 2011.
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  6. #6
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    Judging from recent history, they would have to release a NEW set of Featured Instance coins for level 120. That way people couldn't get all the gear they want before doing any of the new (old) content.

  7. #7
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    If you add a new currency, how are people going to earn newfound coins to get the existing cosmetic pets and mounts?

    I would bet they keep newfound coins but don't add new FI gear until the raid is out. Still some reason to do challenge box runs for cosmetics in the meantime, but no instant cap gear from your stockpile of coins.

  8. #8
    Reason for proposal was to explore additional gearing options from u23 launch in preparation for farming instances for better armour and jewels.
    We need to factor in item level for FI armour and where it sits in comparison to other u23 armour.

    In a stream, Cordovan stated that item levels for u23 gear, subject to change would be something like:
    Item level 367 +-5 ........ lootbox gear
    Item level 370 +-5 ........ T1 instance gear
    Item level 375 +-5 ........ T2 instance gear
    Item level 380 +-5 ........ T3 instance gear

    Perhaps, developers could take one of the three approaches to FI Gear :

    • An alternate to ash/lootbox system for introductory gearing upon launch (min level 120 required, FI gear on par with lootbox gear, item level 367)
    • An alternate gearing option after raid has been released sitting firmly on par with T2 instance gear (item level 375), but not as powerful as raid gear
    • 2 variants: Item level 367 approx. with no set bonuses upon launch (20x newfound coins per armour) aimed at being slightly higher than landscape gear but less than instance gear. Then introduce something like item level 375 with set bonuses after raid is released (40x newfound coins per armour or a new currency) which aligns itself with T2 instance armour.


    In terms of newfound coins vs a new currency I am open to both.

    However, let's be clear: no one is gearing up immediately on day 1 using only newfound coins as FI gear is only armour and players still need to work towards jewels and essences. Besides, drop enough money into the game or spend enough time farming black steel keys in advance and you can be all kitted out in essences, jewels and armour day 1 so I don't really see the harm in giving players an alternate gearing route, simply to be able to enter instances with.
    Last edited by Knight.Arkenstone; Sep 09 2018 at 03:54 PM.
    Knight | Captain | Arkenstone | Rainbows & Unicorns

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkanur View Post
    Nice idea!
    That way people couldn't be geared from day 1 (if the 120 FI gear is obtained with Newfound coins and the coins are reset). I think that's what Hallandil meant.
    This. Similar to the same way Embers and Motes are designed to work.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilan View Post
    If you add a new currency, how are people going to earn newfound coins to get the existing cosmetic pets and mounts?

    I would bet they keep newfound coins but don't add new FI gear until the raid is out. Still some reason to do challenge box runs for cosmetics in the meantime, but no instant cap gear from your stockpile of coins.
    They did away with ways to earn Long Lost Coins for level 105 FI stuff once Mordor came out. Dont get your hopes up.

  11. #11
    Remember back in RoI when they expressed a goal of getting rid of all the various convoluted barter options and consolidating down to Marks, Medallions, and Seals? As I recall, the intention was for seals to be required for top-end gear and for them to be converted down to marks/meds any time new gear was released (to prevent instantly being able to buy it). This, plus deed locks on barter meant you needed to do the raid to get the raid gear, but you didn't have to do the raid exclusively to work your way to its gear.

    No reason the same principles couldn't apply to all the other types of barter currencies and rewards. So deed locks mean you have to do the content you want to get rewards from and seals are required for the highest tier rewards. Back in RoI, seals were only available from t2c content, but for the purposes here you could get them from any instance or specific landscape content set up to reward players with all those different barter currencies currently. Rate of currency accrual would be based on the time investment required to complete the content (So a 5 minute landscape quest gives 1/2 the rewards of a 10-min 3-man, gives 1/2 the rewards of a 20 min 6-man, gives 1/2 the rewards of a 40-min Raid).

    I haven't played in ~3 years and my barter wallet scroll still is a mile long, not to mention all the stuff eating up actual inventory space, without having touched anything past Old Anorien. As I'm wrapping my head around how to get new gear I see these convoluted barter systems are even more frustrating than ever.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Knight.Arkenstone View Post
    I don't really see the harm in giving players an alternate gearing route, simply to be able to enter instances with.
    Currently you jump into the new instances with nothing but quest/landscape gear and be just fine. Are you suggesting that you want a way for people to get gear to do the instances without having to do the quests in the new area?


    Quote Originally Posted by Knight.Arkenstone View Post
    You could even do 2 variants: something like item level 367 with no set bonuses upon launch (20x newfound coins per armour) aimed at being slightly higher than landscape gear but less than instance gear.
    Newfound coins are (currently) gated behind T2C content. Doing T2C content to get gear that is slightly better then landscape gear and worse then new T1 gear seams silly to me. Aside from that, the players capable of doing FI T2C will have no issues doing the new instances (if the past bullroarer is any indication, even if you cant do the FI T2C you wont have any issue with the new instances). So there would be no point doing the T2C FI if you could just run a T1 new instance and get better gear.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by mkcraft27 View Post
    Currently you jump into the new instances with nothing but quest/landscape gear and be just fine. Are you suggesting that you want a way for people to get gear to do the instances without having to do the quests in the new area?
    Not at all what I'm saying. In order to unlock those new instances you have to complete quests in the new region and also hit level 120.
    I am simply proposing additional gearing choices upon launch to give some diversity to gear choices rather than everyone only having one or two gearing routes.

    Furthermore, I would also hope instances in beta #3 are significantly more demanding then they were in beta #2, but this is to be seen. Part of me suspects that if you know your class well enough, you are going to get away with farming T2 and possibly even T3 in landscape and Mathom hunter gear, but I hope not. I would like to see the new instances on par with Court of Seregost / Ruined City T2c for 3 mans and Silent Street / Dome of Stars T2c for 6 mans.
    Last edited by Knight.Arkenstone; Sep 09 2018 at 04:13 PM.
    Knight | Captain | Arkenstone | Rainbows & Unicorns

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by spelunker View Post
    Remember back in RoI when they expressed a goal of getting rid of all the various convoluted barter options and consolidating down to Marks, Medallions, and Seals? As I recall, the intention was for seals to be required for top-end gear and for them to be converted down to marks/meds any time new gear was released (to prevent instantly being able to buy it). This, plus deed locks on barter meant you needed to do the raid to get the raid gear, but you didn't have to do the raid exclusively to work your way to its gear.

    No reason the same principles couldn't apply to all the other types of barter currencies and rewards. So deed locks mean you have to do the content you want to get rewards from and seals are required for the highest tier rewards. Back in RoI, seals were only available from t2c content, but for the purposes here you could get them from any instance or specific landscape content set up to reward players with all those different barter currencies currently. Rate of currency accrual would be based on the time investment required to complete the content (So a 5 minute landscape quest gives 1/2 the rewards of a 10-min 3-man, gives 1/2 the rewards of a 20 min 6-man, gives 1/2 the rewards of a 40-min Raid).

    I haven't played in ~3 years and my barter wallet scroll still is a mile long, not to mention all the stuff eating up actual inventory space, without having touched anything past Old Anorien. As I'm wrapping my head around how to get new gear I see these convoluted barter systems are even more frustrating than ever.
    Long time no see. Check your PMs.
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  15. #15
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    Back when it mattered, they used to convert stored Seals to Medallions when they had a major upgrade with Instances.
    It is logical, in view of the times in which we live. But to be logical is not to be right, and nothing on God's earth could ever make it right!
    - Judge Dan Haywood

  16. #16
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    Already posted this as well in another topic, but I will do it here as well:

    It is time in general to update these boxes(Amethyst Box of Ancient/Forgotten/Whatever Spoils) from Featured Instances(to make it more rewarding only bestow the box on t2 and not on t1!) even at current level(115) they are outdated. By keeping them on t1 you can reset it endlessly with Mithril coins and the instance is ran on average 2,5x faster and easier then on t2. The (Amethyst Box of Ancient/Forgotten/Whatever Spoils) should contain the following after a conversion:
    • Make rewards only possible to run on t2c. This tier is as we all know for certain instances a bit harder and apart from that is doesn't allow farming immediately as some instances take a certain amount of time for completion!
    • Crafting Materials from Gorgoroth(Gorgoroth Crafting Bundle) should be converted to the new Ironfold Crafting Materials(Ironfold Crafting Bundle)
    • Crafting Materials that were being used or which used to drop in Throne of the Dread Terror as a reward should be entirely removed. Same applies to the ''Box of Rangers' Crafting Journals'', ''War Materials'' and ''Northern Ithilien Essences'' that are dropping from these boxes.
    • 2 Slivers of Black Steel Key should be converted to 200 Embers of Enchantment (only ran on lvl 120 t2c, or t1 if the instance does not allow higher then t1, like GB/Helegrod and several others). After all it takes quite some time to do one instance on t2 challenge after all. Besides the box has a chance on dropping Embers not a guarantee. A common percentage can be taken into this.
    • Additionally you can add a ''x'' number of Motes of Enchantment to a Featured Instance that has or is being run on a lower level then lvl 120. (Applied to Grey Box of Ancient Spoils)
    • New Found Coins should be updated and have a role into a new function. In my humble understanding I have no idea why you release a new FI armour set and make the maximum level 119. That is not really looking forward to future content. Lets say that an ''x'' number of New Found Coins can be converted to a ''low'' amount of Embers of Enchantment, that it at least allows you to barter pets/cosmetics and small pieces of gear. If you don't consider embers, consider something else like meds/marks.
    • ''Enchanted Gorgoroth Adamant'' could be converted before to 40 Ashes of Enchantment, this should be updated towards a ''Enchanted Ironfold Adamant'' which bestows ~40 Embers of Enchantment.
    • Anfalas Scrolls of Empowerment should remain inside these boxes as they were before, with a droprate between 1-3.
    • There should be an increase drop value towards the following items: Blemished Symbol of the Eldar King, Imbued Legacy Replacement Scrolls, Relic Removal Scrolls, Universal Solvents, Anfalas Star-Lit Crystal and Stat Tomes. For Stat Tomes get a random box in here where people can choose their own tome, rather then Tome of Might XI that can drop theoretically 3x in a row.
    • Consider also either to put certain typed essences in these boxes or allow New Found Coins to be able to barter essences somewhere for ''x'' coins of a barter vendor.


    If you follow these guidelines I am pretty sure FI loot is way more rewarding and up-to-date then it is currently!

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Geremir View Post
    Already posted this as well in another topic, but I will do it here as well:

    It is time in general to update these boxes(Amethyst Box of Ancient/Forgotten/Whatever Spoils) from Featured Instances (to make it more rewarding only bestow the box on t2 and not on t1!) even at current level(115) they are outdated. By keeping them on t1 you can reset it endlessly with Mithril coins and the instance is ran on average 2,5x faster and easier then on t2.
    I agree the contents of the boxes needs to be updated, however wholesale removal of all the lower level reward items is not the way to do it. People can and do run FI's at levels other then 115. A level 105 toon would probably welcome north ithilien essences or war materials dropping from an FI. In the same manor, when the level cap increases a level 114 toon would probably appreciate the mordor essences dropping from FI's. The best thing to do (IMO) is to have different loot tables for different level FI's. This would ensure that people get rewards appropriate to their approximate area in the game. Run a level 104 FI, get rewards appropriate for far anorien/north ithilien/the wastes. Run a level 113 FI get, rewards appropriate to mordor, Run a lvl 120 FI, get rewards appropriate to the grey mountains.

    2nd, Removing boxes from the T1 FI's is a bad idea. FI's encourage people to run group content who otherwise might not do it buy giving them a relatively stress free place to do it. T1 difficulty gives people who enjoy grouping but for what ever reason can't to T2, a chance to still enjoy the instances. Removing the boxes from T1 needlessly and unfairly hurts that group of people.

    3rd, I dont know anybody who uses their mithril coins on FI resets so they can farm it (maybe its common but i doubt it). I think you are creating a problem where none exists. If you really dont like the idea of people farming it, then get rid of the ability to reset it with mithril.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knight.Arkenstone View Post
    In a stream, Cordovan stated that item levels for u23 gear, subject to change would be something like:
    Item level 367 +-5 ........ lootbox gear
    Item level 370 +-5 ........ T1 instance gear
    Item level 375 +-5 ........ T2 instance gear
    Item level 380 +-5 ........ T3 instance gear

    Such a sad way to design gear :/

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisoxmo View Post

    Such a sad way to design gear :/
    Indeed such a bad way to design gear.To a point where difference is almost irelevent.No different gear in different tears,no set bonuses,no unique gold items(even tho they easaly put it in festival instance),no unique essences.Basicly nothing but one of most dull itemisation in history of gaming.

  20. #20
    A little bit off topic, but with reference to T1, T2, T3 sharing same gear sets, but with higher item levels (more stats) as you increase in difficulty:

    I think the one thing good that comes from this is that it makes it easier for players who know their class, but perhaps don't have access to a strong enough group to hit up higher tier content to still be reasonably well geared for when the raid drops (provided all essences can be crafted). The more players available, willing and reasonably well geared to raid the better - it makes forming groups easier and from a development standpoint how much of the community looks to get involved no doubt plays a part in determining how successful the raid is + makes it easier to allocate more resources down the line to group content.

    The min-maxers (such as myself) will still be rewarded with increased stats and I would definitely like to see a unique gold item drop from T3 6 man instance to encourage all players to work towards this.
    Furthermore, the raid itself should hopefully have one or two unique items (in addition to armour sets with bonuses).
    Last edited by Knight.Arkenstone; Sep 12 2018 at 07:15 PM.
    Knight | Captain | Arkenstone | Rainbows & Unicorns

 

 

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