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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2017

    Was Círdan under Gil-Galads’ rule?

    In my humble opinion, clearly and absolutely not, but I would appreciate to hear from more versed posters and check if there is a general consensus on the subject, dealing mainly with the scope of the High-Kinship of the Noldor.

    During the First Age, and even though Círdan had a task of his own –entrusted by the Valar themselves-, there is no discussion that he acknowledged Thingol as his King –in fact it was for him that Círdan first delayed his departure-. After Thingol’s death, however, and because it is said that Gil-Galad ruled Lindon during the Second Age, some maintain that the Falathrim –and in fact all Eldar west of the Ered Mithrin- fell under his command.

    I for one, and for totally biased reasons, like to think that this was not the case, and that Círdan was fully autonomous. If anything, he would have acknowledged Elrond as the heir of Thingol, but the Half-Elven never claimed that title, instead contenting himself with being Gil-Galad’s herald –for reasons offensive to his Maia blood-.

    As I see it, Gil-Galad ruled the pro-Noldor community from Forlond –until the remnants of the Feanorians left to found Eregion-, Celeborn ruled over the anti-Noldor community in Harlond –until his wife decided to free herself from her nephew’s influence and move to Eregion too (;-P)-, and Círdan ruled over the Falathrim from Mithlond.

    That is not to say of course that Gil-Galad would not be highly respected universally, but until the formation of the Last Alliance, and then only as a war leader, Círdan and his people would not be formally subject to the High-King of the Noldor.

    I have not found any canon contradicting my position, but many assumptions on glossing material that I would like to contest. Any ideas?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    That Gil-Galad claimed the title of High King of the Noldor in Middle-Earth would have been pretty irrelevant with regard to Cirdan, since Cirdan wasn't a Noldo.

    However if he lived in lands ruled directly by Gil-Galad - such as Lindon, then he would of course have been under the rule of Gil-Galad in his persona of ruler of that country.

    I.e. Cirdan would not have been subject to Gil-Galad, High King of the Noldor, but he would have been subject to Gil-Galad, ruler of Lindon.

    That Elrond was the heir of Thingol is mostly of academic interest, since the kingdom that Thingol had been king over no longer existed after the end of the First Age.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Hi, Ertr! And many thanks for your reply!
    Whether the kingdom of Lindon included Mithlond or not is exactly the question. Geographically it did, but I'm not so sure politically.
    As for Thingol, Doriath did fall, but not all Doriathrim. The heir of Thingol would thus have no lands to rule over, but at least a bunch of subjects to care about. I agree though that this is purely an academic pastime... ;-)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    I like to think of Cirdan as semi autonomous within the confines of the Noldor realm of Lindon.

    I mostly justify this with reasons aforementioned, he was not Noldo, therefore not subject to the High King. But, was required to ferry them to the Undying Lands. I also put it down to that he was one of the three original recipients of the three elven rings. One was given to each 'ruler' of the 3 major Calaquendi settlements at the time, barr the Sindarin led silvan populated realm of the greenwood. Leaving out Eregion, as im not 100% without confirming if Galadriel had already left at this time to form her own realm and recieved a ring as the leader of a seperate realm or if she was granted it for being highest/oldest living Noldor in Eregion.

    Either way, this is a strong claim Cirdan as being semi, if not completely autonomous of Gil Galad for me. As the elven rings were used to enhance and protect the realms of the wearer.



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