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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milii View Post
    Rad has not only shown he has no imagination but he is now showing he has no compassion for others.
    If someone is ignored then that ignored person should have no way to track or communicate with the person ignoring them.
    Period.

    This isn't abut 'convenience' but about personal security, and not just about the adult that is being stalked but about children that play the game as well.
    As a person that is in hiding from a family member who tried to kill them then used the system to get away with it and is currently trying to use a number of cyber and phishing attacks against other family members trying to find out where I am currently; as a person who now has security cameras in nearly every room of my house in case this family member does find me and sends someone after me; trying to hide from someone who may be dangerous isn't some small thing, something that can be or should be trivialized.
    No, "Rad" is questioning the need for an additional convenience feature which would provide absolutely no "added personal security" over and above the existing anonymity feature, just give that a lighter touch. Given also that a determined stalker could trivially work around measures like that then it's debatable how much effort it's worth putting into it on that account. Seriously.

  2. #27
    ANY amount of effort and expense is 'worth' it when talking about personal security vs. a stalker.
    Period.

    But then it takes a small amount of empathy to understand this.
    Making Brides Princesses Again!

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milii View Post
    Nice to see you have never been cyber-stalked and show no imagination to put yourself into the shoes of someone who is being cyber-stalked.
    Yeah, I've been cyber stalked here in game. It sucks.
    Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, totally worn out & proclaiming "WOW, what a ride!"
    Continuing the never ending battle to keep Lobelia Sackville-Baggins in check

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymphonic View Post
    Yeah, I've been cyber stalked here in game. It sucks.
    And back then, would you have wanted to have more options on anynomity?
    'There now the numbers of Eldar increase,' Voronwë said, 'for ever more flee thither of either kin from the fear of Morgoth, weary of war.'

    In Laurelin - Lover of Tolkien's lore

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milii View Post
    ANY amount of effort and expense is 'worth' it when talking about personal security vs. a stalker.
    Period.

    But then it takes a small amount of empathy to understand this.
    As I already said, that suggestion doesn't provide any additional security so that's neither here nor there.

    But then it'd take a small amount of reading and basic comprehension to understand that.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    As I already said, that suggestion doesn't provide any additional security so that's neither here nor there.

    But then it'd take a small amount of reading and basic comprehension to understand that.
    If they can follow you around, they can note any characters you hang with, then come back with a new alt and try and wheedle info about their target; it is a well known technique used in cyber hacking as well.

  7. #32
    Unfortunately Rad is incapable of understanding because he doesn't want to, it is a waste of time trying to explain it to him. Much more important is getting SSG to listen and do something about it. I know what it is like as I have been through it and know that the ignore function is no help when a total ....... is stalking you and goes out of their way to annoy you. When going anonymous is the only way to stop them finding you, but then none of your friends can find you either. It does ruin the game when you have to hide rather than play freely with your friends. It isn't fair when the only way to return to how things were before they started stalking you is to either pay for a name change or grind to level up a new character. And all when it isn't your fault!

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    LOL @ "gaming ruined"... when I started playing MMOs we didn't gave friends lists or anything like that, we just talked to each other! Gaming isn't 'ruined' with that turned off. Don't exaggerate.
    I remember the old days as well, and talking to people. In my case however, talking devolved into being emotionally vomited over by first one, then another, fragile stranger who began logging in solely for cathartic release and support for mental health issues (in two different games).

    Sometimes rebuffing does more harm than good, or doesn't work, and retiring into anonymity is the gentler option.

    I didn't enjoy my time with "Anonymous" switched on: I'm on a RP server and my biographies are written to give my character dimension. When I switched it back off again I was immediately pounced upon by a player who had deleted the character first used to converse with me and rolled another, no doubt suspecting I was avoiding the first. (Which was true: I used an alt to check for weeks that the player was not logging in before taking Anon off my main.)

    An "ignore" directive would have to be applied to the stalker's account, and then the stalker's second account, and the third ... unless manually blocking a succession of noisome alts is a reasonable price to pay. For stalkers with nastier intentions I than I encountered, I'd personally pay it.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    Unfortunately Rad is incapable of understanding because he doesn't want to, it is a waste of time trying to explain it to him. Much more important is getting SSG to listen and do something about it. I know what it is like as I have been through it and know that the ignore function is no help when a total ....... is stalking you and goes out of their way to annoy you. When going anonymous is the only way to stop them finding you, but then none of your friends can find you either. It does ruin the game when you have to hide rather than play freely with your friends. It isn't fair when the only way to return to how things were before they started stalking you is to either pay for a name change or grind to level up a new character. And all when it isn't your fault!
    "Rad" understands just fine, but that doesn't mean I have to share your opinion about this being such a great idea. I see a problem... the limited anonymity the OP asked for wouldn't be enough to fend off a determined stalker (it'd be trivial to work around), you'd need broad-brush anonymity whereby nobody you haven't whitelisted somehow could see your location. *That* is what you should really be asking for, I reckon (making the anonymity function more user-friendly), not trying to run a blacklist via ignore because that's too specific.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by StoatMandible View Post
    I remember the old days as well, and talking to people. In my case however, talking devolved into being emotionally vomited over by first one, then another, fragile stranger who began logging in solely for cathartic release and support for mental health issues (in two different games).

    Sometimes rebuffing does more harm than good, or doesn't work, and retiring into anonymity is the gentler option.

    I didn't enjoy my time with "Anonymous" switched on: I'm on a RP server and my biographies are written to give my character dimension. When I switched it back off again I was immediately pounced upon by a player who had deleted the character first used to converse with me and rolled another, no doubt suspecting I was avoiding the first. (Which was true: I used an alt to check for weeks that the player was not logging in before taking Anon off my main.)

    An "ignore" directive would have to be applied to the stalker's account, and then the stalker's second account, and the third ... unless manually blocking a succession of noisome alts is a reasonable price to pay. For stalkers with nastier intentions I than I encountered, I'd personally pay it.
    That's another peeve of mine what comes to ignore system. Despite someone is on your ignore list the ignore system some of their messages still get through with a glitch - either that, or the blocking doesn't apply to the user's entire account. It would make a perfect sense to work that way - same user and account wide friends list, so the ignore list should be account wide too.

    If I have tried to type "/ignore add -hisname-" again, I mainly have gotten an error that I didn't expect: chat server not available.

    My situation with him isn't so bad anymore, but it still makes me think that there should be more options for anonymity and more effective ignore. If not for urgent security, then for the players' comfort.
    'There now the numbers of Eldar increase,' Voronwë said, 'for ever more flee thither of either kin from the fear of Morgoth, weary of war.'

    In Laurelin - Lover of Tolkien's lore

  11. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Lindaelle View Post
    ... ignore list should be account wide too.

    My situation with him isn't so bad anymore, but it still makes me think that there should be more options for anonymity and more effective ignore. If not for urgent security, then for the players' comfort.
    I completely concur.
    Making Brides Princesses Again!

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lindaelle View Post
    And back then, would you have wanted to have more options on anynomity?
    Oh heck yeah. And I would have loved for ignore to be account wide. I'm so glad there is no marriage system in LOTRO, just the thought of the explosion from telling that stalker no to a marriage request when she made alts to track me down makes me full with dread...



    Uh, and my stalker used Mylotro during the three year forum beta to keep tabs on me. Myltoro had an anonymous feature, but it was not user friendly and it was not 100% reliable. So, I could not even make characters on another server to get away. It was horrible. And getting infractions from the previous CM at the time for making "false complaints" did not help either.

    Seriously, you have to experience being stalked in game to truly understand it.
    Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, totally worn out & proclaiming "WOW, what a ride!"
    Continuing the never ending battle to keep Lobelia Sackville-Baggins in check

  13. #38
    /Signed

    In the early years of this game, before the store and purchased name/server changes, i had to delete my main character, twice. Another player discovered I am female over voice chat and proceeded to harass me over that endlessly. I deleted my characters and he found me again. So I deleted those as well and switched servers. I no longer use voice chat because of people like that. If you place someone on your ignore list, there should be absolutely no way they can track you in game, even if you are in the same kinship. (One of the things this guy did was join each kin I did until a few RL friends and I made an exclusive kin) You should not exist in their world anymore. They shouldn't be able to chat you, emote you, track you in fellowship finder or kin log. Nothing.

    People make this out to be small, personal issues between two people and feel that its not a priority for GMs or developers. I hope those people never have to fear signing on to one of their favorite past times for worry that guy might be there, or that he might find you. Again. This is one of those things that many people won't ever touch, but it makes all the difference to those who need it. Yes, games are games, and they are meant to be fun, but they should also be safe.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by klausdog_1020 View Post
    If you place someone on your ignore list, there should be absolutely no way they can track you in game, even if you are in the same kinship.
    That's unachievable, as all they have to do at most is start another account. As I pointed out earlier: ignore-based blacklisting fails as soon as your stalker can log in as an entity that isn't on your ignore list or can readily enlist someone else's help to find you. As an alternative, being anonymous to everyone except people you've specifically whitelisted (friends, kinnies, whatever) would be far more effective.

  15. #40
    If Rad is not a proud user of PCMatic he should be.
    Come to think about it, everyone should use it.
    Making Brides Princesses Again!

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    That's unachievable, as all they have to do at most is start another account. As I pointed out earlier: ignore-based blacklisting fails as soon as your stalker can log in as an entity that isn't on your ignore list or can readily enlist someone else's help to find you. As an alternative, being anonymous to everyone except people you've specifically whitelisted (friends, kinnies, whatever) would be far more effective.
    Even then, a determined stalker could even start another account in order to join your kinship and track you down. Leave that account in place just to track you and 2-box with another new account to harass you.

    The third best way to escape the determined stalker would be to leave your kinship and get all your characters renamed (like Nymphonic), second best would be a rename followed by server transfer. The most effective would be to leave the game entirely.

    Unfortunately, this is a situation where the persistent bad guy has an advantage.
    The Lag is so bad I saw Sara Oakheart outrun someone - kickman77

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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nosdracir View Post
    Even then, a determined stalker could even start another account in order to join your kinship and track you down. Leave that account in place just to track you and 2-box with another new account to harass you.

    The third best way to escape the determined stalker would be to leave your kinship and get all your characters renamed (like Nymphonic), second best would be a rename followed by server transfer. The most effective would be to leave the game entirely.

    Unfortunately, this is a situation where the persistent bad guy has an advantage.


    No, the best way would be to have the stalker perma banned and ip blocked (after the appropriate warnings).

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    No, the best way would be to have the stalker perma banned and ip blocked (after the appropriate warnings).
    IP blocking isn't a good idea, on account of dynamic IP addresses. Someone alluded to that earlier.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    IP blocking isn't a good idea, on account of dynamic IP addresses. Someone alluded to that earlier.
    I agree it isnt ideal, but as more and more people get given a static IP, the better the option becomes.

    In an ideal world, everyone would have to prove their identity before being allowed to sign up; but that would put a lot of people off.

    The account(s) wide perma ban should dissuade all but the most sociopathic stalkers; and if they create a new account and get found out, it should get perma banned as well, even if they havent had a chance to do anything wrong.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by DKenny View Post
    Excellent suggestion. Visual harassment is still harassment. I would suggest you also open a support ticket and explain what the person is doing. Continue to submit tickets each time it occurs, taking screen shots if possible. Hope this matter gets resolved for you.
    Oh, dear.

    I don't suppose we can call visual harassment on those players who bound around the landscape like grasshoppers, so that whichever way we're facing, they continually pop into sight, "Look at me! Look at me jump!"

    No, I thought not.

    Just as well. If we could, I would never get anything else done.
    Eruanne - Shards of Narsil-1 - Elendilmir -> Arkenstone

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lindaelle View Post
    There's one loophole in the /ignore function what comes to harassment: it still allows the people harassing us to see our location from the friends list and go there, to appear right in front of us. I know this by personal experience, and it happened repeatedly over several days even in the locations where I didn't expect him to have a specific business.

    Being anonymous helps because it hides our location, but then it hides the location from everyone except the kin members, and kin members cannot examine you.

    So why not make it so the /ignore function makes us anonymous only to those we ignore?

    I also agree with this. I've given and received a lot of game and gear help by inspecting kin members.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by djheydt View Post
    Oh, dear.

    I don't suppose we can call visual harassment on those players who bound around the landscape like grasshoppers, so that whichever way we're facing, they continually pop into sight, "Look at me! Look at me jump!"

    No, I thought not.

    Just as well. If we could, I would never get anything else done.

    Some of those really ARE children, and not teens/adults out to annoy you.

    That is exactly what my daughter liked to do when I first created an account for her.

    Of course, now she is nearly 5, she is obsessed with killing Trolls.

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    Of course, now she is nearly 5, she is obsessed with killing Trolls.
    There are a few of those on this forum.
    Just saying...
    /wink
    Making Brides Princesses Again!

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    That's unachievable, as all they have to do at most is start another account. As I pointed out earlier: ignore-based blacklisting fails as soon as your stalker can log in as an entity that isn't on your ignore list or can readily enlist someone else's help to find you. As an alternative, being anonymous to everyone except people you've specifically whitelisted (friends, kinnies, whatever) would be far more effective.
    It would be nice to have an option for blacklist/whitelist.
    It would also be nice to have an option to be completely invisible to all on your ignore list or all not on your friends list. Make the ignored ones also invisible to you, and there is no 'visual harassment' either.

    Two check boxes; four states.

    Edit: Also ensure your name is cleared/barred from the Friends list of anyone whom you ignore.
    Last edited by Tsch; Jan 20 2018 at 07:45 PM.
    What shows is what there is.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by djheydt View Post
    Oh, dear.

    I don't suppose we can call visual harassment on those players who bound around the landscape like grasshoppers, so that whichever way we're facing, they continually pop into sight, "Look at me! Look at me jump!"

    No, I thought not.

    Just as well. If we could, I would never get anything else done.
    I have to disagree with you on this one. Not everyone is all business. Heck, I jump in mud puddles in Bree, stand on top of buildings and /wave at people passing by and laugh in RL when they stop and try to see where I am. And I jump off of waterfalls. And sometimes I stand by the vault npcs and advertise vault services in /say chat.

    No, I cannot agree with this at all.

    Not only that, I have a captain whose herald is named "Imwithstupid"
    Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, totally worn out & proclaiming "WOW, what a ride!"
    Continuing the never ending battle to keep Lobelia Sackville-Baggins in check

 

 
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