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  1. #1

    Capped players used to be more polite

    Today, I was doing the MT N/S dailies. I'm fighting 4 mobs before I go to the captain and his mob. A 115 runs past me and starts wailing on the captain. I barely get 2 shots in before the captain's dead and I have to go find where he's re-spawned.

    This isn't the first time I've seen this and I'm sure it won't be the last. There's no consideration for other players in the game. Back in the day (and stay off my lawn!), people used to offer help, throw invites and do other things to help make the experience more enjoyable and less frustrating.

    If people want to know why player numbers keep dropping, it's not only because of poor Turbine/SSG decisions, it's the childish behavior of too many of the remaining players. Possibly you can blame it on the necessity of grinding so much, but it's still an issue.

  2. #2
    With the level boost that came out with Mordor, that lvl 115 might not be much of a vet, which doesn't excuse his behavior but does cast a bit of a different light on things.

    It all hasn't gotten that way, was just playing and saw in chat someone asking a grinder to move out of the area they were leveling in, next post was 'thanks for understanding' so politeness isn't dead.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by groucho42 View Post
    If people want to know why player numbers keep dropping, it's not only because of poor Turbine/SSG decisions, it's the childish behavior of too many of the remaining players. Possibly you can blame it on the necessity of grinding so much, but it's still an issue.
    The two are connected: A pay-to-win/gamble game attracts like community; those who don't mind anything but "winning" at whatever cost, and bloody gamblers.

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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by groucho42 View Post
    Today, I was doing the MT N/S dailies. I'm fighting 4 mobs before I go to the captain and his mob. A 115 runs past me and starts wailing on the captain. I barely get 2 shots in before the captain's dead and I have to go find where he's re-spawned.

    This isn't the first time I've seen this and I'm sure it won't be the last. There's no consideration for other players in the game. Back in the day (and stay off my lawn!), people used to offer help, throw invites and do other things to help make the experience more enjoyable and less frustrating.

    If people want to know why player numbers keep dropping, it's not only because of poor Turbine/SSG decisions, it's the childish behavior of too many of the remaining players. Possibly you can blame it on the necessity of grinding so much, but it's still an issue.

    There are a few individuals like that. But don't tar everyone with the same brush.

    Some players are not used to grouping anymore since soloing most content is doable. They have developed selfish attitudes.

    Best thing you can do is try to invite them and hope they join.

  5. #5
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    Rather than blaming them for poor behavior, maybe that player has to log in a few minutes and is trying to wrap up their dailies quick and doesn't have time to politely wait for you. Consideration works both ways. Even if they really are a jerk, it's just pixels. My 2 cents.

  6. #6
    If i was passing through a low level area and saw a player getting flogged up
    i would more often than not shing shing that mob up on the fly.
    my apologies if that broke anybodies immersion while saving them from death lol.
    “If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.”
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilan View Post
    Rather than blaming them for poor behavior, maybe that player has to log in a few minutes and is trying to wrap up their dailies quick and doesn't have time to politely wait for you. Consideration works both ways. Even if they really are a jerk, it's just pixels. My 2 cents.
    And it's worth that little. No, when you run by someone right in front of a boss, it doesn't matter how much time you have -- you're rude. I've also pointed out that, by far, this isn't the only time something similar has happened, it was just the straw that make the camel post (how's that for mangling metaphors?).

    I remember when Mirkwood first came out. It was very crowded. People were quickly throwing invites to other people in their area and lff was full of folks quickly fellowing to share kills. People would even hang around if a tough boss died just as somebody else walked up, to help that person kill it too. That was not a rare occurrence, now it is.

    As pointed out, I think that's because Turbine/SSG have done their best to run off the casual players, the people who came in to enjoy the game rather than look at it as competition.

  8. #8
    There's always a chance someone didn't notice you or thought you were already done with the boss and fighting your way back after respawn.

    MT dailies, from what I recall back when I run them regularly were usually like this - no grouping, no invites, free for all. We were all more or less on the same lvl though.

    I do look both ways in lower zones before going for the kill and usually ask if others want to fellow in high packed areas but that's it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by kudurru1 View Post
    There's always a chance someone didn't notice you or thought you were already done with the boss and fighting your way back after respawn.

    MT dailies, from what I recall back when I run them regularly were usually like this - no grouping, no invites, free for all. We were all more or less on the same lvl though.

    I do look both ways in lower zones before going for the kill and usually ask if others want to fellow in high packed areas but that's it.


    No, he's right, I have been having similar experiences since Mordor; high cap alts suddenly sweeping through the area I was questing in and killing everything in sight; several times I have had to give up and go do something else, as there was nothing left to target. 2 weeks ago in the Trollshaws there were three of them methodically sweeping up every wight in sight; luckily I had a kill quest and could move far enough away that some mobs respawned before they came back, so I got my kills in - but only just. If I hadnt been down to the last few kills, I would have really struggled.

    It is newbies coming in and buying high cap, then going back into the low cap areas for the extras, and not caring who they upset; as also mentioned, go back a year, and most High caps would let you take the first shot if they needed the kill as well, same as I do if I come across someone lower than me, I even notch a few when I come across similar level characters looking a bit low on morale or power.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    It is newbies coming in and buying high cap, then going back into the low cap areas for the extras, and not caring who they upset
    You may be on to sth here indeed, Valar packages did have a significant impact on this game.

    On the other hand, I decided to give my main a break from Mordor and took my Aria crafting mule to LL yesterday for slayer deeds instead. Did most of them picking out mobs scattered on landscape and circled camps first to see if anyone was there but I wasn't constantly looking over my shoulder so I may be guilty of spoiling someone's fun as well.

    Guess I'm used to giving players a benefit of the doubt.

  11. #11
    You need to spend a day on EVE online before complaining about mean players. However mean they are, players have an incredibly limited capability to affect other players in any significant way in lotro.

    Is this really worth a thread... sorry if it seems cruel but your complaint amounts to little more than winging to me.
    Illydros Squanto Ulricson Saridas Gap

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by 007Squanto View Post
    You need to spend a day on EVE online before complaining about mean players. However mean they are, players have an incredibly limited capability to affect other players in any significant way in lotro.

    Is this really worth a thread... sorry if it seems cruel but your complaint amounts to little more than winging to me.
    the reply "Well, some other game is worse" doesn't mean squat. We're not talking about another game, we're talking about a change in this one

  13. #13
    Thats why Turbine introduced "open tabbing". A single hit on the mob or a single heal on another player fighting a mob and the kill counts for everyone involved. Your complaint is ridiculous.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by DisplTru View Post
    Thats why Turbine introduced "open tabbing". A single hit on the mob or a single heal on another player fighting a mob and the kill counts for everyone involved. Your complaint is ridiculous.
    Well... there is some truth to it, but it is not restricted to just Lotro. People in most games nowadays are interested in only one thing: Get the MOST loot/rewards in the LEAST amount of time. And while there is nothing wrong with wanting to get the best rewards in the time you have allotted to playing Lotro, it does create an environment where selfishness trumps cooperation, and that is a shame.

    My introduction to MMO's was with Everquest in 1999. And although this was a different game, there was a lot more politeness going on. There was no open tapping, and not much of a quest system until years later..... so you leveled up by grouping up and running content, typically by pulling landscape mobs in a group. If a new group entered the zone, they yelled out a "camp check" to see which areas had groups actively pulling. A few groups would then yell out locations that were taken, and you and your group went off to the next best available location. You then pulled mobs, killed them, etc.... all the while by not pulling from the areas that other groups were in.

    Open tapping sort of changed this, partly for the better (you can "chime in" a boss mob with multiple people and get the quest reward), partly for the worse (people passing you by, getting the mob you had been waiting for while you were still fighting the orcs a few steps before the boss...). Open tapping means that you can still get by when people aren't polite, but it also means that people no longer HAVE to be polite. Before open tapping people would ask and help if you needed a NPC, now they just tank roll over them regardless of whether someone else is trying to get to that mob at the same time.

    With the current dailies in Mordor there are several quests where you have to open a door or entry of some sort, after which without a doubt a mob appears you have to kill. But people have figured out that if you back up quick enough, the mob doesn't aggro..... so they open the door, split, and leave the mob for whomever comes next to deal with. I try to be polite and at least clean up the mess I make. I cause an orc to spawn, i'm the one killing it so I don't leave it for the next person to deal with. It's this kind of behavior that seems selfish to me. I have heard the excuses like "well maybe the person only has so much time to finish the dailies, cut him some slack....." - perhaps so, but you could actually be polite and clean up your own created mess.

    I agree that open tapping has made things a lot better.... but the recent complaints about the chests in the haunted burrow does show that people are still being azzwipes and are not interested in being polite or friendly but only interested in getting the loot quickly, and before anyone else, and they can just screw themselves once you have your loot.

    I guess it all comes down to this: It doesn't hurt to be friendly in-game.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by DisplTru View Post
    Thats why Turbine introduced "open tabbing". A single hit on the mob or a single heal on another player fighting a mob and the kill counts for everyone involved. Your complaint is ridiculous.
    Thats fine - assuming you have time to get a hit in; the guys I have been running into were all attacking at once, so every mob was down in a fraction of a second, - long before even my quickshot was ready, any "open tabbed" kills I got were pure chance, and probably no more than 2 before they had cleared the area.

  16. #16
    The hard part is some use MT dailies to farm SOE's. So in reality it is just unfortunate you are in a region that is very useful to end game players. Yes, it stinks. You can't assume that any 115 will stop what they're doing and ask if you need the captain too. It's like people deeding virtues in level 10 areas. Yes, people at endgame oneshot lowbie mobs. It's the system.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trogdor_the_Burninator View Post
    The hard part is some use MT dailies to farm SOE's. So in reality it is just unfortunate you are in a region that is very useful to end game players. Yes, it stinks. You can't assume that any 115 will stop what they're doing and ask if you need the captain too. It's like people deeding virtues in level 10 areas. Yes, people at endgame oneshot lowbie mobs. It's the system.
    Although everything you have said is true; it has usually been the case that a capped player was someone who had come up the hard way, appreciated what it is like for someone on-level, and mostly gave the low cap player first shot; any number of times I have been followed through an area with a capped player patiently waiting for me to make the first shot before getting the kill, often without even asking.

    That has changed recently, the pay to win crowd with their near instant cap dont care about low cap players, and have no idea what it is like to play the game as it was meant to be played.

    It is very sad that Turbine/SSG need the money so badly that they have prostituted the program, and allowed in the infantile minds that would normally walk away from a game such as LOTRO, and stick to their simple-minded shoot--em-ups.

    I call them the IGB - Instant Gratification Brigade.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by groucho42 View Post
    the reply "Well, some other game is worse" doesn't mean squat. We're not talking about another game, we're talking about a change in this one
    The other game I referenced gives you an idea of how significantly you can affect other players. When you compare it to lotro, you might begin to realize that you are nearly completely invulnerable to the actions of other players in this game. "Some other game is worse" might be how you interpreted my comment but I said a lot more than that.
    Illydros Squanto Ulricson Saridas Gap

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by DisplTru View Post
    Thats why Turbine introduced "open tabbing". A single hit on the mob or a single heal on another player fighting a mob and the kill counts for everyone involved. Your complaint is ridiculous.
    First, if you want to act as if you have a clue, learn that it's open tapping. You "tap" a mob by hitting it.

    Second, that was a very poor attempt to compensate more mature players for having to deal with folks such as you. When a 115 can one or two-hit a mob you're almost at, there's no chance to tap the mob.

    Here, let me help: http://www.dictionary.com/browse/considerate?s=t. Check it out.

  20. #20
    A short answer is that people *are* ruder on average since free play was introduced.

    The average free player may be as polite as the average VIP but free play attracts younger people that wouldn't be playing if they had to ask their parents for money so the average maturity level goes down.

    Also all subscribers have money invested in the game by definition and therefore some reason to care. Many free players care too but then there are the others that play more to troll and annoy people than for any other reason.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by groucho42 View Post
    Today, I was doing the MT N/S dailies. I'm fighting 4 mobs before I go to the captain and his mob. A 115 runs past me and starts wailing on the captain. I barely get 2 shots in before the captain's dead and I have to go find where he's re-spawned.

    This isn't the first time I've seen this and I'm sure it won't be the last. There's no consideration for other players in the game. Back in the day (and stay off my lawn!), people used to offer help, throw invites and do other things to help make the experience more enjoyable and less frustrating.

    If people want to know why player numbers keep dropping, it's not only because of poor Turbine/SSG decisions, it's the childish behavior of too many of the remaining players. Possibly you can blame it on the necessity of grinding so much, but it's still an issue.
    Generally If I'm doing dailies or stuff for deeds in lower level areas, if i see someone else around i let them go first before i do anything.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by groucho42 View Post
    First, if you want to act as if you have a clue, learn that it's open tapping. You "tap" a mob by hitting it.

    Second, that was a very poor attempt to compensate more mature players for having to deal with folks such as you. When a 115 can one or two-hit a mob you're almost at, there's no chance to tap the mob.

    Here, let me help: http://www.dictionary.com/browse/considerate?s=t. Check it out.
    According to your own words,

    I barely get 2 shots in before the captain's dead and I have to go find where he's re-spawned.
    You got two shots in on the boss, thus you tapped it. Why did you have to go and find where he respawned?

    Yes, there are some rude players out there but not as many as you let on to there being. In all my time on Crickhollow and Gladden, I might run into a person who seems to intentionally try to get ahead of you to once or twice a week, if that. Most people seem indifferent or will invite you to a fellowship. Like my current lowbie going through Ered Luin, she's been thrown a cold fellowship invite by people in the area about four times. I always ignore it as I'm moving faster than they are and don't want to wait for them (I also don't like cold invites). So, I kill my six wolves, get my planks of wood, get my elven pack, etc and am out of the area while they're still slowly questing.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    Although everything you have said is true; it has usually been the case that a capped player was someone who had come up the hard way, appreciated what it is like for someone on-level, and mostly gave the low cap player first shot; any number of times I have been followed through an area with a capped player patiently waiting for me to make the first shot before getting the kill, often without even asking.

    That has changed recently, the pay to win crowd with their near instant cap dont care about low cap players, and have no idea what it is like to play the game as it was meant to be played.

    It is very sad that Turbine/SSG need the money so badly that they have prostituted the program, and allowed in the infantile minds that would normally walk away from a game such as LOTRO, and stick to their simple-minded shoot--em-ups.

    I call them the IGB - Instant Gratification Brigade.
    +1 for this post - Yarbro, you have it bang-on here. The IGB is quite prevalent in the end-game currently in LOTRO and yes, it is down to the Valar program that has been instituted.
    Elquasso - HNT ... Haduthir - WDN ... Laurealasso - GDN ... Hendunaron - LM ... Broonzy - BRG ... Malenthir - HNT... Rilmien - MNS... Ornalaureano - GDN ... Melehton - CHM

  24. #24
    3 letters.

    F2P

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by siipperi View Post
    3 letters.

    F2P
    Sorry man, the real BS behaviour started a good, long while after F2P.
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