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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandalphor View Post

    I would personally love if audacity could be a personal skill (like stat tomes), not tied to gear, but I'll leave the rest of feedback for people who live there more or less and are more knowledgeable than I am.
    No thanks to P2W.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by siipperi View Post
    No thanks to P2W.
    Didn't say it should be p2w, just similar implementation. Personal skill instead of gear. Could be tied to rank.
    That would be my preference, but I'll leave it to people who are visiting Moors more often and know more about it.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandalphor View Post
    [Audacity] could be tied to rank.
    This is a very bad idea, please don't even consider it.

  4. #104
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    Pretty awesome Vastin got this whole thing set up!
    Glad to see creeps getting thoughts of love.
    "Not all those who wander are lost....some are so stubborn that they always think they're going in the right direction."

    "The 4th age is the store age" - Hetweith

  5. #105
    I'm sure I echo everyone's thoughts by saying thank you to Vastin and Cordovan for the transparency and the willingness to deal directly with the playerbase. This is not only unexpected, but highly appreciated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    Heh. Luckily the feedback is unanimous and sensible on certain points:

    - I'll certainly examining the base mitigations/stats on creeps. I didn't realize that these had not scaled at all with the rest of the changes we made for u21 (and possibly for prior updates). That makes no sense and will need to be updated to allow for a more sensible and flexible allocation of corruptions. I do intend to keep the new finesse corruptions (possibly with tweaks), but if the base stats are set at a more sensible place, they shouldn't be a problem.

    - Some of the initial feedback I'd gotten was that it was taking far too long for creeps to kill ettenmoors mobs - but it sounds like that isn't a DPS problem, so much as a disparity between creep/freep NPC vitality? That should be easy enough to address once I find out where it's coming from.

    - Combat appears to just be too quick and bursty at the moment (at least with several classes), so I'll be examining if it makes sense to rebalance crit magnitude vs crit mitigation to favor the latter more heavily in base stats and/or corruptions, which should have the effect of slowing down both sides to some degree. Improving base Creep mitigations and possibly nerfing certain high-burst creep skills would hopefully round that out, and maybe get duels back into the 30-60 second range, rather than the 5-15 second range, which is too quick for this style of combat.

    - Obviously a TON of issues with individual skills, concerning burst damage, CC issues, and improper debuff stacking. Too many for me to address in any concrete way in the time I will have available - but I'll see if I can soften up some of the most egregious cases creep side, and maintain a hit list of things to address in the future as time allows. Freep side I have to be more circumspect because it affects the entire rest of the game, but we do have plans to go into PvE skill balance as well, and I can try to make sure that those changes help address PvMP issues as well. :P

    - I have to think very hard about the role of Audacity armor. On the one hand, it is an entire additional subsystem that we have to update and balance with each major update to keep it relevant. On the other hand, if it isn't relevant, then the creeps need to be frequently updated to keep pace with regular gear upgrades on the Freeps - but it is much easier to rebalance Creeps than Freeps... We could potentially go for a much more technical solution to try to generally level the playing field (such as auto-scaling any and all freep gear as they enter the moors), but that would require a major engineering update and re-balance beyond just my playing with tables and skills.

    Choices choices...

    1. Great news! The Finesse Corruptions were something the community had been asking for for awhile now, but it just came at a very bad time. They didn't near compensate the loss of Finesse Creeps had already sustained, and Creeps just cannot afford to slot any Crit D or Finesse at all.

    2. This is indeed the case.

    3. Also great news!

    4. Some changes for PvE would be nice overall, but even if it were a PvP only change for Freeps, that'd be great. Limit the number of trait points usable, limit what armor you can use, put stat caps on, etc. If you can get a baseline for what Freeps are going to be using in the Moors, you establish a static baseline for balance, rather than CONSTANT updates needed for PvP.

    5. It's a tough decision, but I'd argue Aud armor doesn't need terrible updating if you provide some sort of requirement for it and/or a massive penalty if you don't, then balance creeps around that Freep standard. That being said, there would need to be a faster way to get Aud armor for Freeps, because it'd leave Freeps high and dry with not enough commendations to purchase the required armor.
    ~Rank 11 Loremaster, Arkenstone~

    ~Rank 13 Warg, Arkenstone~

  6. #106
    I cannot speak for 1v1s or small group versus small groups. What I can tell you is that the Raid v Raid situation is most definitely not balanced now, and it certainly not in favour of the Freeps. There are two key reasons for this. Firstly healing balance has changed completely. Minis have had their outgoing healing nerfed, and healing generally freep side simply doesn't cut it. On the creep side healing appears to have increased dramatically, with 200k heals frequent. When facing craids with standard amounts of healers, particularly defilers, you just simply can't kill anything. So freeps are dying faster, and creeps are dying slow, if at all. This more than make up for the perceived increase of DPS freepside

    The second issue is Audacity. Creeps have it, Freeps don't. We've had to stop wearing Audacity armour because it wasn't updated for 3 years. We had desperately hoped the new set would fix this. It doesnt. Compared to even basic PVE purple armour, the moment you put on the new set you lose 15-25% DPS (even allowing for the Audacity dps boost) and you lose 25-30% morale. That simply not a good enough trade off for reduced CC, so no-one is wearing it, and won't until it at least has some primary stats/morale/vit or a set bonus.

    Craid v Fraid even numbers is Freep wipe every time, so look forward to an endless GV camp if these changes are implemented.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Yand View Post
    I cannot speak for 1v1s or small group versus small groups. What I can tell you is that the Raid v Raid situation is most definitely not balanced now, and it certainly not in favour of the Freeps. There are two key reasons for this. Firstly healing balance has changed completely. Minis have had their outgoing healing nerfed, and healing generally freep side simply doesn't cut it. On the creep side healing appears to have increased dramatically, with 200k heals frequent. When facing craids with standard amounts of healers, particularly defilers, you just simply can't kill anything. So freeps are dying faster, and creeps are dying slow, if at all. This more than make up for the perceived increase of DPS freepside

    The second issue is Audacity. Creeps have it, Freeps don't. We've had to stop wearing Audacity armour because it wasn't updated for 3 years. We had desperately hoped the new set would fix this. It doesnt. Compared to even basic PVE purple armour, the moment you put on the new set you lose 15-25% DPS (even allowing for the Audacity dps boost) and you lose 25-30% morale. That simply not a good enough trade off for reduced CC, so no-one is wearing it, and won't until it at least has some primary stats/morale/vit or a set bonus.

    Craid v Fraid even numbers is Freep wipe every time, so look forward to an endless GV camp if these changes are implemented.
    1. I believe there is a new healing rune for Freeps that helps healing?

    2. Defiler heals are certainly potent, I said already that when/if Creep mits are boosted, they probably need a nerf and/or disable stacking heals (as someone suggested earlier in the thread).

    3. We are hopefully going to have a way that encourages/forces Freeps to wear audacity, and balance creeps around that.

    4. Even numbers should be a wipe for Creeps easily every time. It sounds like you are either facing superior numbers, or your DPS is simply not doing their job. 2 Hunters and a Red Cappy are enough to melt any target, regardless of heal support.
    ~Rank 11 Loremaster, Arkenstone~

    ~Rank 13 Warg, Arkenstone~

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by fmac81 View Post
    I think Zaheer/Altair does have a fair point that any minor tweak could have large ramifications... I totally get that, and his response earlier made me reconsider my request for a straight nerf of Barrage (low-key zinger at me btw).

    Part of this conundrum is that players are NOT going to use the current Audacity armor in the moors - because, for one, its only item 326, and for 2: not nearly as potent stat wise as their normal gear. If Freeps had a streamlined armor process for the moors (whereby you received more commendations from quests, and could thus barter for rank 1, 2, 3 sets etc), then the balance would be improved. Sure the variety of morale range would be limited, but essence slots might still make up for it a bit. As it stands, however, 6500-7500 commendations a pop is going to cost an arm and a leg of every creep alt and freep alt just for 1 piece of armor, if you're on a quiet server such as myself.

    In a "perfect" moors, I would like to see all PvE gear disabled except for LIs, class items, and bows. Jewelry would be available to acquire at each rank, same for armor sets. Each rank set might have either more audacity, or maybe a set bonus or something, but the SAME stat amounts, at least for the first few ranks, that mimic your typical PvE teal gear. This would only be accessible as part of the Moors "outfit" on the character, thats only activated in the PvP area (as in, you could equip it in the Moors outfit, and then be able to sell off the item to get back the inventory space). I think an earlier response said something about increasing Rank bonuses, which I would support.


    One other thing would be to PLEASE increase the commendations cap. 15,000 commendations is paltry. Make it 30,000. Or 50,000. Just anything higher than 15,000.
    I know, had put up a solution to avoid the use of PvE armour, please read my thread or earlier reaction on subforum : monster play


    Alltair / Zaheer

  9. #109

    (edit) Balance for creep classes

    Edit: delete most of the old post, now it is bit shorter with clearer points

    I play all creepclasses (rank8~rank10), I am not a skilled player, if this was starcraft I may be in the bronze~silver league.
    what I want to say to Devs is that, please remember that the majority of (pvp) players are not hardcore esport pro
    The balance should be make it more fun (make the fight last bit longer) for the less skilled and lower ranks folks like me


    -> minor increase % on the heal pots for lower ranks (red ranks)
    -> minor reduce cool down of pots (remove effects/debuf)
    -> scale up mastery of racial traits or class traits ( those are not scaled I think )
    -> add small heal over time to heal pot, if defiler heals are reduced; reason: freeps have way too many dot, most can not be removed, without defiler (crit) HOT, 0% survival
    -> or add small immunity for stun/root/daze like 1 or 2 second for creep; reason: very tough to get WL level up or find one (after 1 year mine is still at rank 8 )
    -> extent range for creep trackers ( ?%) reason: freeps can move around very fast(horse+movementbuff), the trackers barely work.
    -> if no range increase, each creep class should be able to use trackers to track 2 freep classes. But 1 class only unstealth or reduced range or longer CD.
    -> increase running speed (?%) for creeps outside of combat, doesnt have to be very much 1%~5% increase would be nice. ( then again not too fast ) reason: no many WL around


    Thank you
    Last edited by Magicbean; Oct 26 2017 at 06:36 PM. Reason: trying to make my points more clear

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    This is easily fixed: the CG must be set to lvl 115, not lvl 116.
    That would also fix the issue with creep pots not clearing wounds/bleeds from the CG.
    Arkenstone: Guntred Burg, Flormir Guard, Marv LM, Willaman Mini
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  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    - Some of the initial feedback I'd gotten was that it was taking far too long for creeps to kill ettenmoors mobs - but it sounds like that isn't a DPS problem, so much as a disparity between creep/freep NPC vitality? That should be easy enough to address once I find out where it's coming from.
    If you go through with your plans to adjust creep DPS/Health to mirror freeps, then likewise creep NPCs should be adjusted to mirror that of freeps'. Or vise-versa: adjust freep NPCs to mirror creep NPCs if you would prefer NPCs for both sides to be hard to kill. I prefer relevant NPCs personally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    - ... rebalance crit magnitude vs crit mitigation to favor the latter more heavily in base stats and/or corruptions, which should have the effect of slowing down both sides to some degree. Improving base Creep mitigations...
    This seems like a good idea to me on paper. Considering freep LIs are constantly gaining more crit magnitude every time there's another imbuement buff, there should be something to address it for creeps. A raw -X% incoming critical damage passive buff might be good. Then you'd just have to slightly up it every time LIs get buffed to maintain the status quo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    - I have to think very hard about the role of Audacity armor. On the one hand, it is an entire additional subsystem that we have to update and balance with each major update to keep it relevant. On the other hand, if it isn't relevant, then the creeps need to be frequently updated to keep pace with regular gear upgrades on the Freeps - but it is much easier to rebalance Creeps than Freeps... We could potentially go for a much more technical solution to try to generally level the playing field (such as auto-scaling any and all freep gear as they enter the moors), but that would require a major engineering update and re-balance beyond just my playing with tables and skills.
    I have never liked the concept of audacity. When truly relevant, you make new freeps/creeps that much more fodder. On the other hand, I see its appeal as a developer - if we know its required then we know they'll use it and new PvE gear won't be as intrusive. I think the general consensus though is that audacity is a pain, even though the built-in damage reduction is a necessity now.

    How hard would it be to set hard caps on freep stats as they enter the moors? Health caps at roughly the max health you could hope for with audacity gear, same with mastery. Then make audacity relevant (incoming damage reduction tied to it again) but PLEASE easier to obtain. Like easy easy... what is there to gain from grind in a PvMP zone other than discourage new comers and casual players? At that point you can still use PvE gear if you want, but stats will be about the same as aud gear (possibly a lot of overflow stats wasted) and you'll be penalized by taking more damage.

    It would be a bandaid solution to be sure - say the level cap increased by 10 and schedules dictated that new audacity gear wouldn't be released for a few months. But you could at least know as a developer that even with freeps being 10 levels higher, there'd be no incentive to use the new gear in PvP... the stat cap would see to that. So you keep creeps at a level that is competitive with that in mind until the next round of audacity is released, and you update creeps with it.

    People would snicker, but I can't think of a miracle solution for a team clearly has limited resources. I think I'd prefer criticism over outdated gear being mandatory (I can fix that eventually, at least it's playable) instead of immense unbalance (to which I cannot tend to until schedules allow, and people stop logging in).

    *****

    As an aside, outpost wars are annoying.

    An idea might be to make their buff apply to keeps on a one-to-one scale. Ex: River OP provides a mastery buff to those who it and are inside Lugs; Hithlad OP buffs LC; AEOP buffs TR; Isen OP buffs Isendeep. All four apply inside TA.

    TR/Lugs/TA already have some sort of feature where if you are inside them, a buff appears on your buff bar and dismounts you. That comes to mind when figuring out how to make the OP buff only apply to the inside of its assigned keep. Then just make the buff apply under that condition instead of globally. You can even double up and make both ROP/HOP buff Lugs and AEOP/IOP buff TR if it would be too much trouble adding that functionality to Isen/LC. If you want the watered down version, just make OP buffs apply inside keeps. Even more watered down - apply only in the delving.

    Keep PvE buffs tied to PvE areas of the map. Let open field fighters do their thing.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yand View Post
    I cannot speak for 1v1s or small group versus small groups. What I can tell you is that the Raid v Raid situation is most definitely not balanced now, and it certainly not in favour of the Freeps. There are two key reasons for this. Firstly healing balance has changed completely. Minis have had their outgoing healing nerfed, and healing generally freep side simply doesn't cut it. On the creep side healing appears to have increased dramatically, with 200k heals frequent. When facing craids with standard amounts of healers, particularly defilers, you just simply can't kill anything. So freeps are dying faster, and creeps are dying slow, if at all. This more than make up for the perceived increase of DPS freepside

    The second issue is Audacity. Creeps have it, Freeps don't. We've had to stop wearing Audacity armour because it wasn't updated for 3 years. We had desperately hoped the new set would fix this. It doesnt. Compared to even basic PVE purple armour, the moment you put on the new set you lose 15-25% DPS (even allowing for the Audacity dps boost) and you lose 25-30% morale. That simply not a good enough trade off for reduced CC, so no-one is wearing it, and won't until it at least has some primary stats/morale/vit or a set bonus.

    Craid v Fraid even numbers is Freep wipe every time, so look forward to an endless GV camp if these changes are implemented.
    So... I logged on my freep and inspected the people in your raids. Most of them are still wearing level 100 gear.... from 3 years back....

    Kind of dismantles your whole point about creeps dominating freeps in group play.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yand View Post
    I cannot speak for 1v1s or small group versus small groups. What I can tell you is that the Raid v Raid situation is most definitely not balanced now, and it certainly not in favour of the Freeps. There are two key reasons for this. Firstly healing balance has changed completely. Minis have had their outgoing healing nerfed, and healing generally freep side simply doesn't cut it. On the creep side healing appears to have increased dramatically, with 200k heals frequent. When facing craids with standard amounts of healers, particularly defilers, you just simply can't kill anything. So freeps are dying faster, and creeps are dying slow, if at all. This more than make up for the perceived increase of DPS freepside

    The second issue is Audacity. Creeps have it, Freeps don't. We've had to stop wearing Audacity armour because it wasn't updated for 3 years. We had desperately hoped the new set would fix this. It doesnt. Compared to even basic PVE purple armour, the moment you put on the new set you lose 15-25% DPS (even allowing for the Audacity dps boost) and you lose 25-30% morale. That simply not a good enough trade off for reduced CC, so no-one is wearing it, and won't until it at least has some primary stats/morale/vit or a set bonus.

    Craid v Fraid even numbers is Freep wipe every time, so look forward to an endless GV camp if these changes are implemented.
    I would honestly say Raid vs Raid is balanced, it just comes down to the coordination from both sides and the players skill on the class they are playing.

    I mean no disrespect but I have seen your raids and the people that you run it with and just like how Ionlyzerg stated above this reply the people you have in your raids are very under geared. So Raid vs Raid isn't a balance problem, its just your problem as myself and others have had no problem Raiding on both Freep and Creep side for a long time.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Vastin View Post
    -Vastin
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandCru View Post
    Hopefully the changes will take into account the upcoming buffs (21.3+) freeps will have (and are having : 21.2). Otherwise, if the reference is 21.1 (or even 21.2), we'll see you here again in 6 months.
    Quote Originally Posted by GrandCru View Post
    While Defiler healing has been greatly increased, it (~20%Morale/s) certainly does not need to be toned down, considering that freeps' DPS will keep increasing, Blessing of Darkness (bubble) is outdated and Fell Restoration has a 1.5sec induction and a 30sec CD.
    To illustrate these 2 points, I'd like to bring your attention to these newly introduced... artifacts



    One per weapon, AND one per class item.
    These are the rare ones, not INCOMPARABLE.
    And yes, they bump up the BASE (tooltip) healing or damage by a double digit % (if not triple).

    Which makes them very popular in a certain category of objective/competent/knowledgeable/commended players asking to somehow decrease the current creep healing and damage.




    So, if it is the intent of SSG to keep such artifacts as they are, to introduce more of them in the future, in addition to the usual more-essence-slots, then there is and there will be a lot of bumps up to do creep side.




    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    This is a bug we're intending to fix.
    ?...
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  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by maiki1978 View Post
    So your way of seeing something objectively is playing warg for a 2 weeks on preMordor release and then afterwards when Mordor comes out on a fotm hnt with a pocket healer rk on follow? Please...noone, and especially you, will forbid me giving my opinion about creep matters and especially at such a crucial phase.
    So you're blaming Giliodor for coming out with a duo to have a fight, while you only fight when backed up with a massive zerg so you can obsessively corpsejump everyone you killed afterwards?
    Each to his own playstyle, but when it's come to balancing the game your arguments are worthless whereas Giliodors arguments are actually well thought out and backed up by evidence.

  16. #116
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    Vastin says...'On the other hand, if it isn't relevant, then the creeps need to be frequently updated to keep pace with regular gear upgrades on the Freeps - but it is much easier to rebalance Creeps than Freeps.'

    This is VITAL, it's been ignored for sooooo long.

    Glad its finally being acknowledged.

    DrRabbitfoot touched on an important point too, about 6 extra corruption slots, this would allow us to get up our finesse without compromising our dps or mits, think carefully about that.

    Perhaps there's hope stilll.......maybe.

    Overall a GREAT thread, apart from a few flaming posts, glad a proper dfiscussion is being had.
    Last edited by ScribeEzra; Oct 14 2017 at 04:16 AM.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tangaar View Post
    It hurts when i read that BA is in a very good spot...they are not
    ...exactly my thoughts, the CD's are awfully bad, besides the issue common to all creeps that non-crits do ridiculously low dmage.
    Skirm stance also need to be adressed, it's completly useless and the dps in it is sufficient maybe to kill Norbog.
    Evernight- R12 BA Krughai
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  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrandCru View Post
    To illustrate these 2 points, I'd like to bring your attention to these newly introduced... artifacts

    One per weapon, AND one per class item.
    These are the rare ones, not INCOMPARABLE.
    And yes, they bump up the BASE (tooltip) healing or damage by a double digit % (if not triple).

    Which makes them very popular in a certain category of objective/competent/knowledgeable/commended players asking to somehow decrease the current creep healing and damage.




    So, if it is the intent of SSG to keep such artifacts as they are, to introduce more of them in the future, in addition to the usual more-essence-slots, then there is and there will be a lot of bumps up to do creep side.
    This is actually a very good point. Each of those runes increases healing done by about 30% each, and damage by rougly the same, I imagine. I'm not sure how it is possible to balance creeps when some freeps will have access to these relics, and some won't. They make a day and night difference. The only thing I can think of would be disabling them in PvMP.
    That said, if creep defences get scaled properly, I do still believe defiler heals will be too strong, unless compared to hunter/burglar DPS, which is a very poor standard to compare to.

  19. #119
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    Please Note: I have not played PVMP in Ettenmoors since 2015, so please take this as a comment to PVMP in general and not a FAST balance pass.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    All I will say is that, if you find a way to make PvMP exclusive gear, that is enforced in the Ettenmoors, you will have an easy time balancing both sides from that point onwards. Sure, it will take you some time to figure it all out, but think on it. It might well be worth it, considering what you would get in return. You would just have two sides that essentially have stat templates that you can tune exactly the way you want.
    Hand this gear out for free so that freeps are all on equal footing, and do yourself a favour that way.
    This! (would make me considering returning to Ettenmoors)

    Would be a much bigger task to archieve, but once done (correctly) a BUNCH of time is saved in the future, both when PVE level is raised, ILI is scaled and other fancy items in PVE are released (relics.. etc.)

    As Gili stated.. Make the Freeps start with same "background" as Creeps aka from Zero with some Base stats, which can be bettered from playing PVMP
    I know this essentially would mean the PVMP would be more different from the PVE game gear wise, but it'll reflect a Good PVMP player as one WHO actually have played PVMP and in some way has earned the skills needed to rank up.

    As a side effect we may

    see some of the PVE farming dissapear. (In the Kin i'm in, the busiest ppl grinding are those who play in Ettenmoors)
    Opening up for allowing cosmetics in Ettenmoors

    Edit as side note: Got a RK friend who got the new +Tactic damage rune relic. Tooltip on one skill raised from 21328 to 26426. This is a raise around 23,9 %, but depending on legacies on LI it'll differ. 4 tooltips compared vary between 21,3 to 28,7%
    Last edited by Endoloose; Oct 14 2017 at 05:53 AM.

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Yand View Post
    I cannot speak for 1v1s or small group versus small groups. What I can tell you is that the Raid v Raid situation is most definitely not balanced now, and it certainly not in favour of the Freeps.

    Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to present to you, live right now on the stage....YAND!!! (roaring cheers - CC Rider music)
    Team Milt.

  21. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Lioncourt86 View Post
    As an aside, outpost wars are annoying.

    An idea might be to make their buff apply to keeps on a one-to-one scale. Ex: River OP provides a mastery buff to those who it and are inside Lugs; Hithlad OP buffs LC; AEOP buffs TR; Isen OP buffs Isendeep. All four apply inside TA.


    Agreed but why not just make them as hard to take on freepside as they are on creepside right now? Creeps hardly bother with them right now because it takes a small group to do it. Make it that way for freepside and you wont have burgs constantly solo flipping them to get their easy fix. And BTW, OP CGs should have MORE morale than their tyrant counterpart to match the overall creep vs. freep morale balance (and they always should have - OPs and keeps for that matter were always easier to take on freepside because of this).
    Team Milt.

  22. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    I'm not sure how it is possible to balance creeps when some freeps will have access to these relics, and some won't.

    But hasn't this always been the case? I remember still wearing crafted gear when I saw a freep player roll into the 'moors with a full Rift set and the difference was paradigm. Balance will never be perfect because there's no mythical "standard freep" to balance against. If we want action though, they had best balance creeps against a freep on the lower end of gear (maybe not the worst stuff but so-so gear whatever that may be).

    I say again, as a first pass, just give us the added 6 corruption slots and see how it plays out. I think it would work wonders. It would allow me to slot full tact mit and full phys mit and still DPS OK while not have to pick my poison between getting blown up by either hunters or burgs. As an added bonus, I imagine it would a very, very easy coding job.
    Team Milt.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    That said, if creep defences get scaled properly, I do still believe defiler heals will be too strong, unless compared to hunter/burglar DPS, which is a very poor standard to compare to.
    so you are saying that defliers shouldnt be able to heal through the strongest dps classes in the moors? Really yall are calling for defiler nerfs before anything has been done. As someone who ACTUALLY plays a defiler, there is no nerf needed now or if we get scaled properly.
    "You can't have your Kate and Eat her too!"

    Katelia Rk 11 Lm, Peppermintt Rk 12 Warg, Katetastrophe Rk 12 WL, Kateaclysm Rk 14 defiler

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kate00 View Post
    so you are saying that defliers shouldnt be able to heal through the strongest dps classes in the moors? Really yall are calling for defiler nerfs before anything has been done. As someone who ACTUALLY plays a defiler, there is no nerf needed now or if we get scaled properly.
    Problem is not when there's 1 defiler. Problem is when there's 8-12 of them and killing anything will become impossible when and if they rightfully tune down burst on freep side. I'm all about keeping defi heals same as they are now, but there needs to be some changes needed for defis. I would personally vote for returning longer inductions they used to have. Now class is faceroll in terms of healing due to non existing inductions.



    Also Vastin:

    Could it be possible to disable target forwarding in ettenmoors? That's one of game breaking things where defilers and DPS of both sides can just target RAT (raid target assist who calls targets) and there is no tactic into the game. Defilers can heal anyone who gets targeted immediately (instant 3 rows of HoTs on target) and DPS is not required to pay attention to targeting and following RAT
    Last edited by siipperi; Oct 14 2017 at 08:45 AM.

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Kate00 View Post
    so you are saying that defliers shouldnt be able to heal through the strongest dps classes in the moors? Really yall are calling for defiler nerfs before anything has been done. As someone who ACTUALLY plays a defiler, there is no nerf needed now or if we get scaled properly.
    He's saying that if Creeps get better defenses, and if something is done to lower Hunter/Burg DPS, it's probable that Defiler Heals would need to be dropped a bit, or some way to limit stacking HoTs on targets.
    ~Rank 11 Loremaster, Arkenstone~

    ~Rank 13 Warg, Arkenstone~

 

 
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