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  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Elwenwing View Post
    This precisely, plus the official RP rules encompass a much broader area than just the naming rules!

    I do feel the outcome of the naming policy thread was generally supporters of both sides of the argument wanted basically the same thing!
    Yes, I agree, though the main issue was and is names. So called grey zone names. I don't think anyone was concerned about, or was against, any other rule.

    When it comes to channels, there is a problem with LFF, as people complained about fellowship posts in the World Chat, so it's moved to LFF. So LFF should stay out of character, or alternatively to create yet another channel, out of character, for the purpose of grouping (searching for a fellowship) for none RP players. I personally would just let LFF to stay as it is. I see both kinds of posts there, it doesn't bother me, and I think we should group and mix sometimes, do instances together, help each others, get to know fellow players

  2. #27
    I was pretty reluctant to pop into this thread, given the namecalling and mudflinging that previous threads on the subject have led to. Hopefully, SSG will manage to keep things in check this time. So here goes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Yes, I agree, though the main issue was and is names. So called grey zone names. I don't think anyone was concerned about, or was against, any other rule.
    I agree, and therein lies a huge problem.

    My take on the former threads was that most agreed that there was a need for some rules on a RP server, although there was much discussion on where the borders should go. But related to naming, a high amount of posters agreed that outright silly names (with lots of general examples provided) would have to go. Currently, they don't.

    In fact, the RP rules are not followed at all, whether they are related to naming, chat channels or harassment. THIS is why this thread has popped up. There's a difference between "relaxed naming" and "removing all the RP rules, unsticky them, then look the other way and act as if nothing has changed".

    Moving on:

    Cordovan, I am not sure whether this was your intention, but your answer a few posts above comes across as incredibly biased against the RP community. It could have been softened with something akin to "On the other hand, people playing on a RP server should respect those who have come here to roleplay/enjoy a more immersive game environment, and they should accept that some rules are in place to support this playstyle". But that argument has been fully missing from Turbine's/SSG's postings in recent years.

    There's a big picture missing from these discussions. Having a RP policy/ruleset was for me never about having a rules-lawyery weapons against others. The policy was a statement of intent from the game company that "on this server, we'll support roleplaying, and this is the way we will do it". This set the expectations that the community and the players could shape their gameplay around. If things got bad either way, Turbine/SSG could step in and regulate if necessary, but for the most part this wasn't necessary because you guys were clear on how things should work.

    It is this clarity that SSG has managed to muddle up, to the extent that the odds are now firmly stacked against roleplayers on a server originally dedicated to their needs. Roleplaying in the open now just leaves you open for griefing from the the very players you claim are just "trying to have fun in-game."

    And that's disappointing, to say the least.
    Last edited by Linawillow; Jul 14 2017 at 06:55 AM. Reason: Clarity/typos.
    Lina Willowwood, biscuit-eating bard on Laurelin
    Hobbit RP? Grand Order of the Lost Mathom
    Songs + videos on me biscuity burrow

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linawillow View Post
    There's a big picture missing from these discussions. Having a RP policy/ruleset was for me never about having a rules-lawyery weapons against others. The policy was a statement of intent from the game company that "on this server, we'll support roleplaying, and this is the way we will do it". This set the expectations that the community and the players could shape their gameplay around. If things got bad either way, Turbine/SSG could step in and regulate if necessary, but for the most part this wasn't necessary because you guys were clear on how things should work.
    I think this is a very important thing to keep in mind, and I expect the majority of players on Laurelin feels this way!

    It's precisely this certainty of being on a RP server thas become more unclear over the past couple of years, and it begs for a clear statement from SSG that sets a common set of expectations for the players of the RP servers again!

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Yes, I agree, though the main issue was and is names. So called grey zone names. I don't think anyone was concerned about, or was against, any other rule.

    When it comes to channels, there is a problem with LFF, as people complained about fellowship posts in the World Chat, so it's moved to LFF. So LFF should stay out of character, or alternatively to create yet another channel, out of character, for the purpose of grouping (searching for a fellowship) for none RP players. I personally would just let LFF to stay as it is. I see both kinds of posts there, it doesn't bother me, and I think we should group and mix sometimes, do instances together, help each others, get to know fellow players
    I personally don't mind if LFF is a channel that can both be IC and OOC!

    And I think you are very right in saying: "I think we should group and mix sometimes, do instances together, help each others, get to know fellow players!"

  5. #30
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    The coming of players from other worlds, -even on a daily basis at times-, is nothing new on Laurelin. It has been going on ever since Turbine took over the server from Codemasters back in June of 2011. More than six years ago. And yet, never before have we seen this negative stance against the server, except last year during the closing of the other worlds and the time of the transfers, and even then, from what I have seen, not in a large scale, but seemed so by a few/some and others that did not even play on Laurelin but still put up a negative stance. The demands and attitude that some, have had against the server, shows not an inability to read the rules as was said earlier, but an unwillingness to accept them, followed by bringing up arguments to abolish them.

    The policy has been in place and in effect for ten, or nine years. And yet we all got along well; the server has been in harmony in regards to respecting these official guidelines. And now somehow some players cannot do the same? that thousands of their fellow LotRO players over the years since the onset of the game back in 2008 have done?

    Also, as others have said, and as has been said before, it is not only role players that this matter concerns. There are role players, but there are also many that do not role play but came to/started on Laurelin for the enviroment that was set up by these rules and support which together contributed to a more immersive experience. So the number of people who are content with the policy further increases.

    In response to 'they want to just have fun'. The same can be said about role players, and non-role players as well that came to/started on Laurelin for that more tailored enviroment and to be free of 'Loredestroyer', 'Porkchop', words used as character names. They too, cannot enjoy their time in-game if the RP channels, and especially the say channel, are trumped by OOC talk, when that kind of names start to pollute the world, and in general when they are made feel that these concerns are not acted upon. And all these players do not even get a choice. The other players, not content with the policy, they at least have a choice: Snowbourn.


    It has been talked before in length, but perhaps a reminder is needed. For their own wisdom and marketing purposes, the company needs to realise well the impact this ruleset has had and the role it has played over the long years. In brief, it has served as a/the reason for many to keep coming into the game. Not because of the sole existence of the rules, but due to the enviroment and player community that they have helped to shape, and, preserve as the years went by and the story of LotRO unfolded. It is the place where, when it comes to LotRO, so many players have laboured for the the work of their hearts: whether it be a kinship that its story has been playing out for years, an event that has gifted the entire community (and not only of Laurelin), with memorable immersive times, storylines that enrich the experience of being in-game, discussions that are about the world and the lore, rather than mmo talk, and much more yet. Things that add to the game experience not only of role players, but non-role players too.

    And so the in-game hours have been richer here and slower the wearing of experience of LotRO itself as a game. This all has happened because the tailored enviroment laid out by this policy and supported over the long courses of time, set the platform for them to happen - the foundations that, in a way, laid out the fate and fashion of the server.

    It has served as a gaming experience which earns the game itself more longlasting playtime, which in turn has other positive effects on the game, such as the presentation of a more populated game, (which in turn has a good first impression on new players), the encouragement of player/character-interaction, the purchasing of, what would seem to others trivial, many trivial items from the store, and more yet.

    Think again to yourself whether you want to take away the support for this, and so in time lose what the game so freely had going on for nearly a decade, the lifetime of the game itself, and has given LotRO these additional benefits.


    It is time to hold true to the word that was openly and officially made, and continue again the support that was upheld for all these long years, and for which so many players over the years chose this server for and even started all over again from level 1 leaving their former servers behind.

    Talk to the responsible GMs on Laurelin (and Belegaer), and remind them that the relaxation of the policy has been long over. Not much effort is needed to decide when they receive tickets about 'Kitchenfoilz', 'Rocketscience' , nor when the RP channels are taken over by OOC talk, nor if an event is disrupted by player-behaviour. It is clear enough.

    Put up the official forum thread again, update it and pin it so it can be easily accessible. And if you are busy these days (which is understandable), then the work has already been done for it, with the long needed updated version of it: removing broken links and the Estel world, replacing Turbine with Standing Stones Games, including the World channel as another OOC source, removing the now gone channels of LFF and Advice, and cutting out much, much, repetition. You can do this at least in the meantime. It is there ready for you to use and free up your time in this.

    https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...42#post7736542

    The time is now. The upcoming expansion will bring with (and has already done so) new players, returning players, and much coverage from various sources ahead. LotRO is gaining once again traction. This is the time to restore the trust that was broken, and let the tale of the server continue on as it has ever done. It is an advatange to the game, a draw for others to join and stay. Do not underestimate it. As in times past, give it the attention and support it deserves.















    Quote Originally Posted by HairytoesMcfluffyfoot View Post
    and i see the laurelin self appointed naming police are frothing at the ears again, quite frankly i would be for the shutting down of the role play support till its stops being used as a weapon of trolls, and implementing the following measures,

    1. Tickets only available to subscribers

    2. As the server is clearly marked EU isp ban all non EU players from EU designated servers. ( mainly looking @ NA players here as they have their own servers)

    3. All those who repeatably raise name based tickets that are not upheld should be banned for harassment ( same goes for the naming and shaming in worldchat) perma - ban for third offence

    4. Close all the servers and relaunch with the RP tag fully removed as there would not be the harassment and endless arguments

    5. subscription based access to RP channels if they want GM support they should have to pay for it.

    [...]

    Disappointing post, but it serves another, good purpose: a prime example to be openly seen of the aggressive stance towards Laurelin that some of the transferring folk have had, as well as others that did/do not even play on the server.

    Almost all points are unreasonable and senseless, but to address one of them:


    2. No. Players have chosen to leave their former worlds and start all over again on Laurelin out of their own will to be in the environment that is much more suited for their preference and interests. They have had to start from level 1 again, in many cases after being years away on other servers. If this was to be done, which I can say with outmost confidence that it will not be, we can expect another outrage of very large proportions, as players of other servers have been coming to Laurelin since 2011.




    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    [...]

    When it comes to channels, there is a problem with LFF, as people complained about fellowship posts in the World Chat, so it's moved to LFF. So LFF should stay out of character, or alternatively to create yet another channel, out of character, for the purpose of grouping (searching for a fellowship) for none RP players. I personally would just let LFF to stay as it is. I see both kinds of posts there, it doesn't bother me, and I think we should group and mix sometimes, do instances together, help each others, get to know fellow players
    If I remember well, the LFF channel was removed from the game, on all servers, a few updates ago. Sadly, the advice channel too was removed, which for various reasons written before in depth, is unhelpful for the game.

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Erennor View Post
    If I remember well, the LFF channel was removed from the game, on all servers, a few updates ago. Sadly, the advice channel too was removed, which for various reasons written before in depth, is unhelpful for the game.
    LFF is still here - it was turned into a global channel the same time the advice channel was removed.
    Lina Willowwood, biscuit-eating bard on Laurelin
    Hobbit RP? Grand Order of the Lost Mathom
    Songs + videos on me biscuity burrow

  7. #32
    @Errenor, Snowbourn doesn't exit any longer. Only other English speaking server still in existence, apart from Laurelin, is Evernight. LFF still exist and is very much used.

    The post you disliked I think indeed had the purpose of showing how things can get unreasonable and senseless. I don't think poster meant all that was written in a literal sense. Just my two cents.

    I would like to remind you that I can also write an essay on the subject of my closed server. It was equally special to me just as Laurelin is special to you. Please understand, some of us were perfectly happy on our old servers, and never wanted to move, and all this was hard on us as well. But here we are now together! And I now want Laurelin to be my home and special to me. And I'm getting there!

    That being said, I never was against any former rules but naming rules, and was rooting for them to stay more relaxed. I personally came here with zero RP experience and few alts with questionable names, but in hope for the much better community than Evernight has to offer. And also ready to stand up for RP community and go by rules as long as they are reasonable. Additionally, it was not even possible to transfer to Evernight for a while. But I would prefer Laurelin even if it was possible.

    Now you might think I'm worried about those few alts with questionable names... I don't, because upon arrival, I did contact GM to check my names and give me tokens. I have about 20 characters. Two of them got renamed. One was borderline case, in the words of GM, but he left me keep it. My kinship was renamed as well, in a fashion I couldn't like less (no notice or talk whatsoever), but hey, most kinnies like our new name actually. I can tell that GM did put thought into it and I'm thankful for it Why I would like bit more relaxed naming rules for the so called grey zone names, I wrote at length in the old thread about it, can repeat on request.

    Another thing that it was bothering me personally, been told I need to have Biography. My biographies are either funny comments from friends and kinnies, or my favorite quotes from the game. When I check other peoples biographies, I want to cry. All royals, lords and ladies, descendants from ancient lines, heirs to thrones... One day I'm gonna roll my eyes into another dimension I had half a mind to write Townsperson from Brockenborings, merchant lass. Because heck someone has to sell goods, craft, cook, clean and slay goblins on our borders! Oh well, I think you got my point

    Now back to the request and Cordovan, he did said rules will stay relaxed until further notice, as I understood. Give us time and wait thing. Hence tickets being ignored, for the lack of better word. I think perhaps RP players are going wrong way about it now? I would instead go on with a post with actual problems you guys are experiencing on a daily basis or often enough. That way I think in most cases you would get support from everyone.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I am a bit busy at the moment, but we can work on it. The trick is that since the server merge, the community of Laurelin has become more diverse, and recent discussions on the forums here clearly show that there are as many people who want us to be super-strict on the rules as those who feel very strongly that we should stop being so harsh to people trying to have fun in-game. There's also a sentiment that the exceptional RP naming rules were used to harass others. I appreciate that some want a very strict barrier to entry on Laurelin based on a deep knowledge of lore-specific nomenclature, but we have to accept that not everyone wants to play that game, and some people who have been on Laurelin for some time now feel like they didn't have a choice when it came time to transfer servers, and ended up on Laurelin.

    Rather than it being a case of us being heavy-handed in applying rules, we'd rather respond to the desires of the community. But it's clear that there is a deep divide on Laurelin, and that needs to be settled before we have another sticky post that can be used as ammunition.
    Preface/disclaimer: I am not a Laurelin roleplayer. I do roleplay my characters in an ultra light fashion on other servers.

    This post from SSG is BS. How dare SSG abandon the only RP server. Laurelin should be preserved as a monument to the truth of this game and the genre of mmoRPg.
    This is SSG chance to step up and honestly support this type of gameplay. Shame on you SSG.
    I will volunteer an hour(ish) a day to processing GM requests for support of RP on Laurelin, as a community assistant.
    I recommend that SSG make a serious attempt to keep the gem of this game, that is Laurelin, intact.

    I suggest a hardline approach...
    Post a message in all public chat channels, on an hourly basis, that Laurelin is a STRICT RP server over the next month.
    At said date open and FREE transfers OFF LAURELIN will begin for the whole month.
    Anything after said period will be handled in the proper hardcore method of account adjustments and account bans.

    This is SSG chance to show the MMO world just how serious you really are about the Intellectual Property you have been granted stewardship of.

    /signed ...an upset fan
    Edit: I will log in this weekend to finish a crafting project I promised to some stranger in world chat.
    Enjoy my Mordor Expansion pre-order money. I will not condone this behavior. Shame on you!
    Last edited by R_C; Jul 15 2017 at 04:28 AM.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by R_C View Post
    Preface/disclaimer: I am not a Laurelin roleplayer. I do roleplay my characters in an ultra light fashion on other servers.

    This post from SSG is BS. How dare SSG abandon the only RP server. Laurelin should be preserved as a monument to the truth of this game and the genre of mmoRPg.
    This is SSG chance to step up and honestly support this type of gameplay. Shame on you SSG.
    I will volunteer an hour(ish) a day to processing GM requests for support of RP on Laurelin, as a community assistant.
    I recommend that SSG make a serious attempt to keep the gem of this game, that is Laurelin, intact.

    I suggest a hardline approach...
    Post a message in all public chat channels, on an hourly basis, that Laurelin is a STRICT RP server over the next month.
    At said date open and FREE transfers OFF LAURELIN will begin for the whole month.
    Anything after said period will be handled in the proper hardcore method of account adjustments and account bans.

    This is SSG chance to show the MMO world just how serious you really are about the Intellectual Property you have been granted stewardship of.

    /signed ...an upset fan
    Well said. Laurelin and indeed the other RP communities are assets to the game - bringing player-made content to an environment that would otherwise be sterile. I don't want to log onto the game only to find someone called IPWNZNUBS jumping around - if I want that I can log onto WoW or even SWTOR for that effect. But more than that, lotro is the only MMO I have played where the roleplaying is the most significant aspect of the MMORPG. The CM's post just goes to show that not only are SSG poor custodians of the game and the community (Codemasters were the best), they have no appreciable idea of the value they are destroying.
    It must be your PC...

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by R_C View Post
    Preface/disclaimer: I am not a Laurelin roleplayer. I do roleplay my characters in an ultra light fashion on other servers.

    This post from SSG is BS. How dare SSG abandon the only RP server. Laurelin should be preserved as a monument to the truth of this game and the genre of mmoRPg.
    This is SSG chance to step up and honestly support this type of gameplay. Shame on you SSG.
    I will volunteer an hour(ish) a day to processing GM requests for support of RP on Laurelin, as a community assistant.
    I recommend that SSG make a serious attempt to keep the gem of this game, that is Laurelin, intact.

    I suggest a hardline approach...
    Post a message in all public chat channels, on an hourly basis, that Laurelin is a STRICT RP server over the next month.
    At said date open and FREE transfers OFF LAURELIN will begin for the whole month.
    Anything after said period will be handled in the proper hardcore method of account adjustments and account bans.

    This is SSG chance to show the MMO world just how serious you really are about the Intellectual Property you have been granted stewardship of.

    /signed ...an upset fan
    Edit: I will log in this weekend to finish a crafting project I promised to some stranger in world chat.
    Enjoy my Mordor Expansion pre-order money. I will not condone this behavior. Shame on you!
    Honestly SSG did not officially abandon their support for the RP rules, yet their actions and statements do make it feel we are headed in that direction!

    That's why I started this thread in the first place, to hopefully get a bit of clarity on where we are now in that regard.

    I very much agree that they should better support the RP status of the official RP servers, but I would not really want to see a hardline approach myself.

    I would prefer it if SSG would follow this course of action:

    1) Update the RP rules to what they should be according to SSG, while keeping in mind the RP nature of the server. If they want to make changes to the rules that is their prerogative, and I personally hope they will be generally what we have now!

    2) Make a clear statement that players on RP servers are expected to follow the rules!

    3) Enforce them better than they are enforced now

    Please understand it's not my intention to drive anyone away from Laurelin!

    I honestly feel the rules have never been that strict or difficult to respect with a bit of good will from the player to do so!
    Last edited by Elwenwing; Jul 15 2017 at 09:28 AM.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    @Errenor, Snowbourn doesn't exit any longer. Only other English speaking server still in existence, apart from Laurelin, is Evernight. LFF still exist and is very much used.

    The post you disliked I think indeed had the purpose of showing how things can get unreasonable and senseless. I don't think poster meant all that was written in a literal sense. Just my two cents.

    I would like to remind you that I can also write an essay on the subject of my closed server. It was equally special to me just as Laurelin is special to you. Please understand, some of us were perfectly happy on our old servers, and never wanted to move, and all this was hard on us as well. But here we are now together! And I now want Laurelin to be my home and special to me. And I'm getting there!
    Not specifically directed at me, but I would like to offer my thoughs about this too!

    I think all the players I play with on Laurelin feel sympathetic to the situation of players that lost their long time home server! It was a sad day they announced the server closures, and it's understood very well that this must be a hard thing for any player! I am happy to hear you came to Laurelin and it's becoming your home now!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    That being said, I never was against any former rules but naming rules, and was rooting for them to stay more relaxed. I personally came here with zero RP experience and few alts with questionable names, but in hope for the much better community than Evernight has to offer. And also ready to stand up for RP community and go by rules as long as they are reasonable. Additionally, it was not even possible to transfer to Evernight for a while. But I would prefer Laurelin even if it was possible.

    Now you might think I'm worried about those few alts with questionable names... I don't, because upon arrival, I did contact GM to check my names and give me tokens. I have about 20 characters. Two of them got renamed. One was borderline case, in the words of GM, but he left me keep it. My kinship was renamed as well, in a fashion I couldn't like less (no notice or talk whatsoever), but hey, most kinnies like our new name actually. I can tell that GM did put thought into it and I'm thankful for it Why I would like bit more relaxed naming rules for the so called grey zone names, I wrote at length in the old thread about it, can repeat on request.
    It sounds to me you and your kinmates came to Laurelin with precisely the right mindset to make it a new home! As you show the mutual respect for others and the RP nature of the server that we all should keep in mind is important! Sadly the discussion about naming rules did not make me feel that was true for everyone! And quite often discussions about RP rules end up in not much more that a mudfight, with both sides not willing to move at all! I feel we should focus on common wishes rather than on the most extreme of opposites!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Another thing that it was bothering me personally, been told I need to have Biography. My biographies are either funny comments from friends and kinnies, or my favorite quotes from the game. When I check other peoples biographies, I want to cry. All royals, lords and ladies, descendants from ancient lines, heirs to thrones... One day I'm gonna roll my eyes into another dimension I had half a mind to write Townsperson from Brockenborings, merchant lass. Because heck someone has to sell goods, craft, cook, clean and slay goblins on our borders! Oh well, I think you got my point
    In my opinion you don't really need a biography, and you just write one if you so desire to! In a way it is a helpful tool to lay out the basis for an rp-character! If you want to be a townsperson from Brockenborings then you should be! As long as a biography is somewhat in line with the lore it's all good I think! And variety is the spice of life!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    Now back to the request and Cordovan, he did said rules will stay relaxed until further notice, as I understood. Give us time and wait thing. Hence tickets being ignored, for the lack of better word. I think perhaps RP players are going wrong way about it now? I would instead go on with a post with actual problems you guys are experiencing on a daily basis or often enough. That way I think in most cases you would get support from everyone.
    The most common issue that I see right now is an increasing amount of wildly OOC names, and I mean those even beyond the "grey area" of the naming policy. Also I witness a growing amount of OOC talk in the IC chat channels! Do I report people over that? No I don't, as I'm trying to be lenient. But it does pains me to see the direction we are headed in, and I felt I needed to post in response to Cordovan's reply to the question of why the official RP rules are unstickied!
    Last edited by Elwenwing; Jul 15 2017 at 10:48 AM.

  12. #37
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    Ok, clearly some folks are very passionate about the sticky, so I'll put it back. Just a reminder that our current server tag and policy continues to remain unchanged.
    Community Manager, Lord of the Rings Online
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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    Ok, clearly some folks are very passionate about the sticky, so I'll put it back. Just a reminder that our current server tag and policy continues to remain unchanged.
    Thank you Cordovan! It's greatly appreciated!

    I hope you will find some time one day to update the rules so they are in an SSG format and if needed slightly adjusted to make them a bit more clear on things like the naming policy!

    Quote Originally Posted by Linawillow View Post
    There's a big picture missing from these discussions. Having a RP policy/ruleset was for me never about having a rules-lawyery weapons against others. The policy was a statement of intent from the game company that "on this server, we'll support roleplaying, and this is the way we will do it". This set the expectations that the community and the players could shape their gameplay around. If things got bad either way, Turbine/SSG could step in and regulate if necessary, but for the most part this wasn't necessary because you guys were clear on how things should work.
    Just for emphasis I think the above statement describes the importance, as well as the purpose of the RP rules very well for many players on the RP servers!

    Also I think it would be great if SSG and the players can keep the discussion going to express their wishes as far as the RP policy is concerned!
    Last edited by Elwenwing; Jul 15 2017 at 12:05 PM.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elwenwing View Post
    However I do not feel this is necessarily a roleplayer vs non-roleplayer thing! I have non-roleplayer friends on Laurelin who have been there far longer than I have!

    They chose to make it their home because of the RP rules allowed them to have a more immersive game experience, while opting out on RP events! And they often join our RP kin for adventure nights, and everyone gets along perfectly fine!
    Quote Originally Posted by Erennor View Post
    Also, as others have said, and as has been said before, it is not only role players that this matter concerns. There are role players, but there are also many that do not role play but came to/started on Laurelin for the enviroment that was set up by these rules and support which together contributed to a more immersive experience. So the number of people who are content with the policy further increases.
    I'm not a roleplayer, I play on several servers and one of them is Laurelin. I picked that server because of the rules that created a more immersive experience for me. I remember wandering the Middle-earth of Laurelin and it would be almost like being in the books, just like if Middle-earth was a real place

    The roleplayers have always been very welcoming of me, and I've even visited some of their events and have been warmly welcomed there as well

    I hope Laurelin will always be what it has been for so many years, because where else can one go for a truly immersive Middle-earth visit?

    Two of my non-roleplayer friends have also started playing a bit on Laurelin as well as their old servers, just for the thrill of feeling like they have actually entered the books
    ;) “There are hundreds of paths up the mountain, all leading to the same place, so it doesn’t matter which path you take. The only person wasting time is the one who runs around the mountain, telling everyone that his or her path is wrong.” ~ Hindu Proverb

  15. #40
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    The Shire
    Posts
    118
    Quote Originally Posted by Silmelin View Post
    I'm not a roleplayer, I play on several servers and one of them is Laurelin. I picked that server because of the rules that created a more immersive experience for me. I remember wandering the Middle-earth of Laurelin and it would be almost like being in the books, just like if Middle-earth was a real place

    The roleplayers have always been very welcoming of me, and I've even visited some of their events and have been warmly welcomed there as well

    I hope Laurelin will always be what it has been for so many years, because where else can one go for a truly immersive Middle-earth visit?

    Two of my non-roleplayer friends have also started playing a bit on Laurelin as well as their old servers, just for the thrill of feeling like they have actually entered the books
    Aye, the RP rules benefit all players of RP servers and that's why I feel they are so important!

    I certainly hope to be able to visit Laurelin for many more years as well, and enjoy the added immersion of being on an RP server!

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    342
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    Ok, clearly some folks are very passionate about the sticky, so I'll put it back. Just a reminder that our current server tag and policy continues to remain unchanged.
    This is classic business as usual, nothing to see here, corporate tactics. Well, the writing is on the wall. The rules sticky is just what prompted the conversation. Just a reminder: The underlying problem of a lack of presence and fair enforcement of policy, still exists. The fact that SSG has already changed the policy is obvious, just did not tell your customers. It takes all of ten??? Minutes to update a thread???
    Free transfers Off Laurelin might be the best approach, allow the bored and childish to go somewhere else.
    Have a service announcement at the character creation process when first logging into the RP servers.
    These two items will provide 90%+/- of the workload towards enforcement. Quik ideas, off the top of my head.
    I have high hopes for SSG. Providing a solid RP environment is one of the things SSG should aspire to. Be leaders of the pack.

    My apologies for not previously acknowledging the other RP/RE servers, the conversation seemed to be about Laurelin specifically.
    Disclaimer: I do not Role-Play. I do enjoy the environment created by it.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Elwenwing View Post
    I think all the players I play with on Laurelin feel sympathetic to the situation of players that lost their long time home server! It was a sad day they announced the server closures, and it's understood very well that this must be a hard thing for any player! I am happy to hear you came to Laurelin and it's becoming your home now!
    It was a small group of people that created a very big problem, and some of the rules were used as a tool to harass people. I can see clearly how and why relaxing rules was the fastest way to solve that problem. I am not saying that RP players didn't have any problems, just explaining newcomers' side of the story from my observations and experience. I know it was not easy for you guys as well. It is also clear that we do need a set of rules, and my hope is that we can meet half way on some of those rules, because the idea of having an ultimatum and being forced to move again pains me in such a way that words can hardly describe

    I like to think we are decent and helpful people. Our was the smallest server, we know each others well. We enjoy every aspects of the game, we like to group and to help. After work, family, kids and other real life obligations, LOTRO is our place to have fun, relax, be with friends. We keep in touch outside of the game also, and some of us meet in real life as well. Our trolls and troublemakers left quite some time ago to bigger servers. And safe to say we don't want to see them again! But on another side, we just want to relax and enjoy the game, hopefully without disturbing anyone else. If we ever do, it's never on purpose. If we have to become any more careful than we are already, we can't talk of having enjoyment and relaxing time any longer. I think if most of us are willing and flexible enough, we could agree on most things, stay together, support each others. That is my hope at least.


    Quote Originally Posted by Elwenwing View Post
    The most common issue that I see right now is an increasing amount of wildly OOC names, and I mean those even beyond the "grey area" of the naming policy. Also I witness a growing amount of OOC talk in the IC chat channels! Do I report people over that? No I don't, as I'm trying to be lenient. But it does pains me to see the direction we are headed in, and I felt I needed to post in response to Cordovan's reply to the question of why the official RP rules are unstickied!
    Yes, I saw quite a few as well but most of them were low level characters which lead me to believe that perhaps we are dealing with alts used as a storage and/or newly created alts for the purpose of festival and LP grind? Not uncommon for me to see such personas during festivals. I also saw quite a few questionable white names like Happiness, Midnight, MissJustice, etc. These are not real names, just close enough examples. I concluded (didn't ask but seemed plausible) they must have been created with a purpose of doing a play.

    Indeed there are all sorts of things during festivals... We also see much more emotes, and of course people taking a chance to do deeds that are requiring use of emotes and festival consumables.

    Yes, channels are messy and that needs to be sorted out.

  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by R_C View Post
    This is classic business as usual, nothing to see here, corporate tactics. Well, the writing is on the wall. The rules sticky is just what prompted the conversation. Just a reminder: The underlying problem of a lack of presence and fair enforcement of policy, still exists. The fact that SSG has already changed the policy is obvious, just did not tell your customers. It takes all of ten??? Minutes to update a thread???
    Free transfers Off Laurelin might be the best approach, allow the bored and childish to go somewhere else.
    Have a service announcement at the character creation process when first logging into the RP servers.
    These two items will provide 90%+/- of the workload towards enforcement. Quik ideas, off the top of my head.
    I have high hopes for SSG. Providing a solid RP environment is one of the things SSG should aspire to. Be leaders of the pack.

    My apologies for not previously acknowledging the other RP/RE servers, the conversation seemed to be about Laurelin specifically.
    Disclaimer: I do not Role-Play. I do enjoy the environment created by it.
    So since Laurelin is a RP only server its should get theeee best treatment because somehow it preserves a game? No most people to RP makes some un lore specific lineage if anything just make it more correct as general under Angbor (excuse me if i spell it incorrectly) but most of the RP i have seen in my life have cheezy as hell bios and how could a random name that doesnt connect to a character lineage be connected towards them unless you can say or one of the far off distant cousins of Aragorn since in Numenor there were many who were had blood tie to Elros Tar-Minyatur but even then the story would be BS .. I do not think RP specific server should have and silver platter unless we can make a casual only server and a raider only server and a PvP only server which such given ways like hey to be apart of a raid server u must have a very cool name that doesnt have anything to do with Lord of the Rings naming system in Sindarin or Noldor ,Teleri.Vinyari ,Dark-elves names or Anglo names like the Rohirrim ... my point being 1 server with specific guidelines should not have its server specific updates like cant type in a name must be randomize and blah blah all the BS,no i think if u want to do it you should and they should be no gated access to any server by any means except the Er-Fr-Us-De -which we should also start having PVP/Raider/casual next to servers i guess since RP servers in your way of speaking should be held upon a mantle and gms should spend extra time making ur server roleplay the "best" over all the other right? so stop pointing fingers because people are not giving you the attention... i mean no harsh feeling but i think we need more updates into the game like why is Aragorn short then our toons when in the books he is meant to be taller than nearly or all the man of the third age since he is 6"6 which we should be 6"4 which should be fixed and the texture in breeland should be same as gondor and rohan so the aw inspiring graphics should be seen in both the starter and the endgame regions i would rather have that then have 4 servers gated to 50,60,65,75 caps which some people would really want since they some who play this game who are veryx100 nostalgic about those times. Farewell im off

  19. #44
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Beautiful Éire (Ireland)
    Posts
    391
    First of all a huge thank you for putting the original rule thread back as a sticky. I certainly appreciate the difficulties the game and ultimately those running it, have come to face due to the mergers. Reducing what was left of the European English none rp population to basically just one European English none rp server.. wow.. it must have given headaches... and obviously Laurelin had to take some overflow.

    I wrote much in the original thread addressing the rp rules and do not wish to force repetition on others, but as a player belonging to a group cited by some other posters here, I really wish to add weight to their and our plight once more. I had taken a break and when I returned it was clear mergers were soon to be upon us, thus I decided to abandon all my Windfola toons, years of spending on warsteeds, cosmetics and more, for a new start on a European server, and I chose Laurelin.

    It is impossible to adequately describe my awe of this wondrous new Middle Earth I entered. Years I had played Lotro, but this felt almost like a new game to me. I was not a roleplayer, and I still do not consider myself a roleplayer truly, as I struggle with the chatbox format, being used to writing novels (my post length can be a give away on that >.>), but it was ever so beautiful to find this marvelous environment Laurelin presented me with. I felt like a child opening Christmas presents, honestly, every time I would enter Bree or other regions where I'd encounter active roleplay (and it seemed to be almost everywhere). There was the Bree watch patrolling.. walking, not running, and I am not sure I can say I had ever seen anyone walk before in Lotro! Other Bree citizens too.. or in the outback, I'd come across players engaged in roleplay, and I would listen in and it lifted my heart. Call me stupid, but I am actually welling up here while typing this, for it was truly a powerful and inspiring experience.

    Not long after the mergers happened, and it was scary how fast all which I had observed on first arrival in Laurelin, vanished. It is a painful loss, and if even I, who had only been able to taste it for a short while, feel this pain.. then how much harder must it be on those who actively helped to create that environment, from the roleplayers themselves to those who did not roleplay, but through their respect made it possible that Middle Earth could be brought to life in such amazing ways.

    I think because others who arrived after me (none roleplayers like myself, from other servers) did not experience this environment anymore in its full glory, they never really could understand what others were speaking when they asked for the rules to be reinforced. For them it appeared just a dictatorship out to make them miserable. Maybe, had I not witness what I did, I would have felt the same, and it certainly took me some time too to fully understand and appreciate the value of those rules.

    It is tough now, because in all truth I think Laurelin will in many ways have to start over. The confidence and trust of the roleplaying community has been hurt, I suppose they hide away now or some may have left for good.. but I do believe that if we get the rules back, see them reinforced in kind and caring ways, meaning people will need to be given some time to learn.. there is a chance at least some of that wonder which was Laurelin, can recover, and should it recover, I am also certain many who now fear the rules, will find it actually enhances our Lotro experience. Most players I meet on my travels seem to be very nice, generally mature in mind players. They have blended in truly well and have become part of the server, their home, same as mine, and I am convinced one of the reasons we do feel at home is because of still something special hanging in the Laurelin air.

    I don't believe in silly naming rules where every name has to follow correct grammar or any such thing, just common sense, as I believe it must have prevailed in Laurelin for many years, and I would suggest to deal with harassment in no uncertain terms, meaning naming and shaming in chat channels has to be a punishable offence. A GM should monitor world chat for a few days, just to make presence felt and to make clear, flaming over the subject from either side is not allowed, but I also realize this all might not be possible anymore. SSG has inherited an array of issues, Laurelin one of them, and I do not blame the company for wishing this would just go away, and certainly cash flow is far more important at this stage then to restore Laurelin, but still.. for the love of Middle Earth and this special server, I can continue to hope.

    Thank you either way for keeping Lotro alive <3

  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    Ok, clearly some folks are very passionate about the sticky, so I'll put it back. Just a reminder that our current server tag and policy continues to remain unchanged.
    Until GMs start enforcing that policy again, this is meaningless.

  21. #46
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    81
    I miss the pre-merger Laurelin. Granted, there were a very small number who abused the naming rules to troll other players, but they were defeated with a simple appeal to the GM. Likewise, only a small number of Consolidation refugees are rude in action and in name choice. Most of all Laurelin players (old and new) are quite nice. Please resume enforcing the RP server ruleset so we may regain that Middle-earth feeling we once had.
    What shows is what there is.

  22. #47
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    The Shire
    Posts
    118
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirhaen View Post
    It was a small group of people that created a very big problem, and some of the rules were used as a tool to harass people. I can see clearly how and why relaxing rules was the fastest way to solve that problem. I am not saying that RP players didn't have any problems, just explaining newcomers' side of the story from my observations and experience. I know it was not easy for you guys as well. It is also clear that we do need a set of rules, and my hope is that we can meet half way on some of those rules, because the idea of having an ultimatum and being forced to move again pains me in such a way that words can hardly describe

    I like to think we are decent and helpful people. Our was the smallest server, we know each others well. We enjoy every aspects of the game, we like to group and to help. After work, family, kids and other real life obligations, LOTRO is our place to have fun, relax, be with friends. We keep in touch outside of the game also, and some of us meet in real life as well. Our trolls and troublemakers left quite some time ago to bigger servers. And safe to say we don't want to see them again! But on another side, we just want to relax and enjoy the game, hopefully without disturbing anyone else. If we ever do, it's never on purpose. If we have to become any more careful than we are already, we can't talk of having enjoyment and relaxing time any longer. I think if most of us are willing and flexible enough, we could agree on most things, stay together, support each others. That is my hope at least.
    I agree it was a small group of people of both new and old players that caused the issues! And I also agree relaxing the rules at the time of the server closures was a good thing to do, to give everyone some time to settle! But I think that by now the rules should be enforced again, to make it clear people do need to generally respect them!

    I do understand your worries about people asking for a stricter enforcement of the rules, but please do not worry about that too much! That request for better enforcement is not made to drive people away from the RP servers, just to return to a situation where you see less OOC behaviour and wildy inappropriate names!

    Sadly some grim views have been painted about the strict enforcement of RP rules in some of the discussions here on the forums, but in my experience anyone who has the intention to generally follow the RP rules, can and should play on a RP server carefree and get along fine!

    In my four years on Laurelin I always found it a very diverse server with players of all styles, and for the most part that never caused many issues at all!
    Last edited by Elwenwing; Jul 16 2017 at 11:58 AM.

  23. #48
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia PA USA
    Posts
    414
    Quote Originally Posted by Elwenwing View Post
    And I also agree relaxing the rules at the time of the server closures was a good thing to do, to give everyone some time to settle! But I think that by now the rules should be enforced again, to make it clear people do need to generally respect them!
    Relaxing the rules during the merge was a terrible idea, and it created this problem. Kicking this can down the road to get the troubled server merge done was bound to backfire.

    Given this policy is a legacy from Codemasters, I've always wondered how much internal support the RP designation really has in then-Turbine and now-SSG. Did Turbine ever honestly intend to resume enforcement later? They must have realized what a logistical nightmare resuming enforcement would be and how much bad will it would generate among those forced to rename after enduring the transfer process. More likely they hoped the problem would solve itself as the original residents of Laurelin got used to the new status quo. For me, I "moved" to Laurelin from Landroval (which meant recreating my characters since transfer isn't possible) specifically for the naming rules, so I resent this "slow boil the frog" approach.

    Are they going to do anything now? This is a problem that gets harder over time, as more characters are created and more new players come to Laurelin. So I doubt the rules will get enforced again on Laurelin. If SSG really wants to solve the problem in a way that generates the least ill will among them and both sides of this argument, here's what they could do: Build a new server under full RP rules, recategorize Laurelin as RE, and give players who care free transfers to the new server from Laurelin.

    I argued at the time that relaxing the rules temporarily for transfers was problematic. I suggested including a disclaimer in the transfer utility if they really intended to resume enforcement later--which they didn't do. And here we are after many months still having the same argument because of it. Relaxing the rules "temporarily" was a huge mistake.

  24. #49
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    342
    I had all these snippet quotes set aside about the rules and why people play at RP servers, I thought it would be a nice montage piece of art. I have actually spent many, many hours composing this.
    However, if anyone has read this thread... my repeating of the amazing comments of the passionate players here in the forums is not needed.

    I will visit two ideas which standout from every single post for those who TLDR
    1. There needs to be an enforced policy.
    2. People like RP servers for immersion purposes.

  25. #50
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    342

    My first hour of Volunteer Work

    I took an hour to adjust the RP server rules to be inline with a policy I believe SSG is currently comfortable with. (I believe this is the Official SSG Policy [though they have not commented])

    Standing Stone Games Official Roleplaying Rules and Policy

    Standing Stone Games has official role-playing servers for our players within The Lord of the Rings Online™. These servers provide our players additional ways to interact within The Lord of the Rings Online™, and give players the opportunity to be deeply immersed within the lore of The Lord of the Rings. Servers are designated as Roleplay by the “RP” tag before their name. Please visit Standing Stone Games Code of Conduct page, found at (URL), which applies to all of The Lord of the Rings Online™ servers.

    The following worlds are Roleplay
    [EN-RP] Laurelin
    [DE-RP] Belegaer
    [FR-RP] Estel

    In addition, the Landroval server is Roleplay-Encouraged.
    The server name is:
    [EN-RE] Landroval


    In order to facilitate an immersive roleplaying experience, Standing Stone Games recommends the use of names within the spirit of The Lord of the Rings. Character names should be inspired by and reflect the lore of The Lord of the Rings. Please note that names that are homonyms or similar to characters from the lore of The Lord of the Rings may not be used, as stated in Standing Stone Games naming policy (URL). This policy is in effect for all servers.

    We suggest using the “Random Name” function when creating a character if you are unable to find an appropriate name.

    Standing Stone Games Harassment Policy
    Standing Stone Games Code of Conduct, (URL) applies to all of The Lord of the Rings Online™servers.
    To encourage a friendly and cooperative environment within Standing Stone Games Roleplay servers, players should be tolerant of the roleplaying choices of others. Since roleplaying may mean different levels of involvement and immersion to different players, you may not disparage, harass, abuse, or threaten players for their choice of roleplaying. You may not use roleplaying as a reason for disparaging, harassing, abusing, or threatening other players for any reason.

    If a player is harassing, disparaging, abusing, or threatening other players because they are roleplaying, please report them by going to the Main Menu, then Help, then New Ticket. Standing Stone Games will then investigate the situation and take appropriate action.
    Repeat violations of this policy may result in:
    o Warnings.
    o Account suspension.
    o Repeated or extremely offensive violations may result in a permanent account suspension.

    Standing Stone Games highly suggests that you use the “ignore” feature if you disagree with how a player is communicating. You may ignore a player by typing “/ignore playername” without the quotes, or by right-clicking their name and choosing to ignore them. This will prevent you from seeing any chat from that character.

    Players of The Lord of the Rings Online™ have access to private chat channels and tabs. Standing Stone Games recommends learning more about private chat channels here (URL) and making use of them to provide an optimal environment for roleplay.

 

 
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