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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unthariel View Post
    It seems like there was some improvement made in recent months in terms of performance. There is no improvement to sheer framerate and game is still as CPU limited as it was, but stuttering seems to be less frequent and all of those violent stutters are reduced.
    Reduced stuttering where, and on what server?/ I have been getting stuttering and rubber bands ON FOOT in several low level areas; this has never happened before (Evernight server), and has continued even after the emergency reboot of the server 2 weeks ago. Whereas before, it took a warsteed to go through an area faster than the server could populate it with mobs, now I can sometimes do it on foot (with a Hunter at +15% run speed).


    (Just to annoy Hurin); Gigahertz isnt everything. For the last year I have been slogging the guts out on an AMD FX6300; overclocking it from 3.6GHZ to 5.01GHZ, and then having to back off to 4.6GHZ because my watercooling couldnt keep up in the warmer weather during the summer (my room was hitting 38C due to the heat output from the cooler).

    Well, thanks to a really nice guy on HUKD, I got my hands on a replacement Phenom II 1090T (I managed to kill mine); on paper, the FX6300 blows the 1090T out of the water, but guess what, at 3.6GHz the 1090T blows the FX6300 away on LOTRO, and because the overclock is so small (base is 3.2GHZ), my cpu is running at barely 36C most of the time, and 41C while playing LOTRO, the FX would idle at 42C and reach over 50C during the game on the same cooler.

    Even with the cpu running 1.4GHZ below the max OC of the 6300, LOTRO is only using 65% of the core on average - with occasional peaks to 80%; at exactly the same game settings, the FX6300 was hitting 100% all the time..

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    Reduced stuttering where, and on what server?/ I have been getting stuttering and rubber bands ON FOOT in several low level areas; this has never happened before (Evernight server), and has continued even after the emergency reboot of the server 2 weeks ago. Whereas before, it took a warsteed to go through an area faster than the server could populate it with mobs, now I can sometimes do it on foot (with a Hunter at +15% run speed).
    I was talking about game performance, not server performance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    (Just to annoy Hurin); Gigahertz isnt everything. For the last year I have been slogging the guts out on an AMD FX6300; overclocking it from 3.6GHZ to 5.01GHZ, and then having to back off to 4.6GHZ because my watercooling couldnt keep up in the warmer weather during the summer (my room was hitting 38C due to the heat output from the cooler).

    Well, thanks to a really nice guy on HUKD, I got my hands on a replacement Phenom II 1090T (I managed to kill mine); on paper, the FX6300 blows the 1090T out of the water, but guess what, at 3.6GHz the 1090T blows the FX6300 away on LOTRO, and because the overclock is so small (base is 3.2GHZ), my cpu is running at barely 36C most of the time, and 41C while playing LOTRO, the FX would idle at 42C and reach over 50C during the game on the same cooler.

    Even with the cpu running 1.4GHZ below the max OC of the 6300, LOTRO is only using 65% of the core on average - with occasional peaks to 80%; at exactly the same game settings, the FX6300 was hitting 100% all the time..
    Frequency doesn't mean the same for different products. Each architecture has its own IPC and many other factors. For example any modern Intel CPU at 3 GHz still has more single threaded performance than FX6300 at 5 GHz. Frequency is a comparable factor only within the same architecture.

    Also FX6300 is not blowing 1090T out of the water, they are very comparable, especially in old games like LOTRO. They are similarly bad CPUs with half of the single threaded performance of modern CPUs.
    Last edited by Unthariel; Nov 12 2017 at 06:12 PM.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unthariel View Post
    I was talking about game performance, not server performance.



    Frequency doesn't mean the same for different products. Each architecture has its own IPC and many other factors. For example any modern Intel CPU at 3 GHz still has more single threaded performance than FX6300 at 5 GHz. Frequency is a comparable factor only within the same architecture.

    Also FX6300 is not blowing 1090T out of the water, they are very comparable, especially in old games like LOTRO. They are similarly bad CPUs with half of the single threaded performance of modern CPUs.
    Wrong way around, the OLDER 1090 is blowing the 6300 out of the water. I do agree that the Intel chips have a lot more horsepower going for them though, even my daughters elderly 3GHz Xeon quad core can match and exceed the single core performance of any FX chip except the 220watt monsters, and even then it gets very close; only a few percent behind when given a very minor 9% overclock.

    However the AMD chips seem to handle LOTRO better when it come to the single core issue; testing both the 1090, the 6300, a core 2 duo and the Xeon (I dont have any newer Intel boards); the AMD boards do a 60/40 spilt when given 2 cores to play with, but revert to single core if given more than 2. The Intel chips wont start on the 2nd core until the first is hammering on the ceiling, which causes heating issues.

    As I said, I cannot test this on newer Intel chips, as I dont have any.

    So playing LOTRO on the 1090 is a lot smoother - when the server is behaving itself.


    Off Topic, My newest Hunter has just entered Moria; the plan is to NOT use LI, but see how far I can take him using weapons made by my Weaponsmith and Woodworker; FPS has been fairly consistent at between 62 and 74 fps so far, no huge fluctuations during combat or while riding my goat around. The Evernight server seem to be behaving itself tonight, only one momentary glitch in several hours of play.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    Wrong way around, the OLDER 1090 is blowing the 6300 out of the water. I do agree that the Intel chips have a lot more horsepower going for them though, even my daughters elderly 3GHz Xeon quad core can match and exceed the single core performance of any FX chip except the 220watt monsters, and even then it gets very close; only a few percent behind when given a very minor 9% overclock.

    However the AMD chips seem to handle LOTRO better when it come to the single core issue; testing both the 1090, the 6300, a core 2 duo and the Xeon (I dont have any newer Intel boards); the AMD boards do a 60/40 spilt when given 2 cores to play with, but revert to single core if given more than 2. The Intel chips wont start on the 2nd core until the first is hammering on the ceiling, which causes heating issues.

    As I said, I cannot test this on newer Intel chips, as I dont have any.

    So playing LOTRO on the 1090 is a lot smoother - when the server is behaving itself.


    Off Topic, My newest Hunter has just entered Moria; the plan is to NOT use LI, but see how far I can take him using weapons made by my Weaponsmith and Woodworker; FPS has been fairly consistent at between 62 and 74 fps so far, no huge fluctuations during combat or while riding my goat around. The Evernight server seem to be behaving itself tonight, only one momentary glitch in several hours of play.
    Heating issues? How can you get heating issues on just one core with light load like that? Percentage usage is not very accurate, different things are utilizing CPU differently, 100% usage in game is not causing much heat and power draw, while some synthetic benchmark stresses the core to the limits and causes a lot of heat. But still you should never have heating issues when only one or two cores are used.

    There is probably something with 1090T that makes it behave differently vs FX6300 despite similar theoretical performance. Maybe SMT on FX was causing issues? It is known for causing issues, sometimes just physical cores without SMT are performing better. And 1090T has only physical cores.

    Moria doesn't have serious performance issues. You will have some in Tharakh Bazan when looking at the area from the camp and certainly during instances because there are places where mob count is pretty crazy, add to this all the player effects and skills and you will get serious FPS drops, but for questing and exploring there is little issue there. One place where it starts is Bree, and then you won't have any issues all the way to Galtrev. But it has been smooth for me today and I could run around without a single stutter on maxed out settings, it was much worse when I left the game couple months ago. Then the next stuttery place is Stangard and after that you enter Rohan and Gondor and say goodbye to good performance.

    LI are probably the most interesting thing to do, I have maxed out 60lv LIs on my second character. Maxing out and generally caring about equipment and keeping your character the strongest possible at all levels is a great thing to do, especially if you are not rushing to level cap. Just leveling and questing can get boring quite quickly (although I have to say that LOTRO kept me playing for very long periods of time), but if are also doing instances, raids, fellowship quests, crafting and maxing out equipment then game is more diversified.
    Last edited by Unthariel; Nov 13 2017 at 12:46 AM.

  5. #30
    Thanks for great analysis! I'll try to tune up my pc soon

    p.s. I wonder what is SSG saying about performance issues and (hopefully) fixes?

  6. #31
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    Cores have their own temp sensors, if it overheats it will throttle, even if the overall package, and all the other cores are within tolerance. There are a number of hardware monitors that will give you the individual core temps, and if you try one, you will see that the core temps are much higher than the overal package temp

    There mare major differences in architecture between the PII and the FX*, as there are between the Core2 and i series cpus, this was part of my argument with Hurin, you cannot downclock a 2017 i7 to 3GHz and get the same performance you would get from a 2008 core2 running at 3GHz, especially when testing with software designed for 2017 hardware.

    * The FX has much smaller on-die L1 and L2 cache sizes and shares memory controllers between pairs of cores; the Intel i series have identically small cache sizes, except for the most recent i7 version, which quadruples them. Part of my theory about why the old, slow chips perform so well at LOTRO in comparison to new faster chips, is that the game engine devs wrote to what the hardware of the time had - bigger L1 and L2 caches; so although the newer chips are much faster, they can only store a 1/4 of the data in L1 L2 cache that the devs anticipated, as well as being optimised for modern multi-thread software.

    I am aware of the FPS drop hotspots, and I have been complaining that in and around Bree they have been getting bigger in recent weeks, to the point where I was hitting a single digit fps area OUTSIDE of the town as I rode in, and getting single digit fps in parts of Bree where there has never been an issue before BUT ONLY IN ONE DIRECTION! Turn around and go the other way, and fps jumped to 45.

    There has been combat lag and hiatus events all over the low level areas that never usually suffer from it, and rubber banding ON FOOT in the LoneLands. This seems to have been mostly sorted in the last few days, and my last couple of days outside of Moria were nearly hiatus free, only one really noticeable issue; and even that wasnt as bad as the 5-10 second chill-outs the server was having a few days before.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by v0k View Post
    Thanks for great analysis! I'll try to tune up my pc soon

    p.s. I wonder what is SSG saying about performance issues and (hopefully) fixes?
    Turbine had noting to say. SSG mentioned client performance improvements in one of the letters if I remember well, but honestly there is probably not much that they can do. Fixing some seriously broken things is usually harder than just starting anew. And there are most likely no resources for doing either.

  8. #33
    Thank you Unthariel for the thorough analysis. Stuttering in particular has been driving me nuts. I have an older system (but above the requirements - former mechanical CAD system) and have more RAM and GPU than relative CPU power, and a standard HD. I have been testing several things, mostly around display settings and am happy to find that I noted similar results (though I wasn't as methodical and didn't use the nice tools you did, which is why I'm glad to see your data).

    Ironically I found a reduction in stuttering duration and frequency with high graphics settings vs. putting everything as low as I could. A last bit of testing with the texture cache seems to confirm the idea that if you have sufficient RAM, increase this to reduce the frequency of hard drive activity. So, oddly I am doing better for now with very nice graphics settings (I did turn down some things that I think would require more disk reads) and texture cache set to maximum. It isn't great but I think it will be OK.

    Oh, and I did add a small 2GB SD card I had around as a "ReadyBoost" cache, which seems to have helped a little.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSeaweed View Post
    Thank you Unthariel for the thorough analysis. Stuttering in particular has been driving me nuts. I have an older system (but above the requirements - former mechanical CAD system) and have more RAM and GPU than relative CPU power, and a standard HD. I have been testing several things, mostly around display settings and am happy to find that I noted similar results (though I wasn't as methodical and didn't use the nice tools you did, which is why I'm glad to see your data).

    Ironically I found a reduction in stuttering duration and frequency with high graphics settings vs. putting everything as low as I could. A last bit of testing with the texture cache seems to confirm the idea that if you have sufficient RAM, increase this to reduce the frequency of hard drive activity. So, oddly I am doing better for now with very nice graphics settings (I did turn down some things that I think would require more disk reads) and texture cache set to maximum. It isn't great but I think it will be OK.

    Oh, and I did add a small 2GB SD card I had around as a "ReadyBoost" cache, which seems to have helped a little.
    It sound like you think some of your problems are caused by the mechanical HDD; if you have enough RAM, you can switch off the page file, and stop the OS from using the HD entirely; alternatively, you can set a static size for the page file and reduce file fragmentation and read times significantly.

    I have been running high RAM with no page file since before XP came out.

  10. #35
    Many thanks for this guide. It was a great read and helped me out with the graphics settings.

  11. #36
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    I've tried to get back to the game after many months of break but the stuttering is just unbearable. Everywhere you go you get this, especially on mounts. Every YouTube gameplay from LOTRO you watch, you can see these dreaded stutters every few seconds. I have not seen a single game that would run so bad, and I have really seen a lot on a lot of different configurations. How can you even let the game be in such state.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unthariel View Post
    I've tried to get back to the game after many months of break but the stuttering is just unbearable. Everywhere you go you get this, especially on mounts. Every YouTube gameplay from LOTRO you watch, you can see these dreaded stutters every few seconds. I have not seen a single game that would run so bad, and I have really seen a lot on a lot of different configurations. How can you even let the game be in such state.
    64 bit client coming that should help with this but I don't get the stuttering as bad as most others do apparently.
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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unthariel View Post
    I've tried to get back to the game after many months of break but the stuttering is just unbearable. Everywhere you go you get this, especially on mounts. Every YouTube gameplay from LOTRO you watch, you can see these dreaded stutters every few seconds. I have not seen a single game that would run so bad, and I have really seen a lot on a lot of different configurations. How can you even let the game be in such state.
    Instead of fixing the underlying issues, they just keep lowering the suspension, adding chrome plated spoilers and go faster stripes, in the hope we will be distracted.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varkking View Post
    64 bit client coming that should help with this but I don't get the stuttering as bad as most others do apparently.
    Stuttering is perceived differently by different people and is vastly dependent on what they are used to, I am running a high-end system for years now, tuned to have the best gaming performance, so I can see any frametime inconsistency right away. I wasn't so bothered when I was using much lower end systems where unstable performance was normal for almost all games played. Testing clearly shows that the game is heavily CPU limited and scales almost 1:1 with CPU and RAM frequency, which is very unusual and just shows bottlenecked this game is and it strives for every single MHz, and also sees drastic improvements from using fast storage like SSD. Also I've proved that stuttering happens mostly in the exact same places repetitively every time regardless of graphics settings. So there is no reason why would anyone magically have less stuttering, because it is impossible to not have crazy stuttering in this game. As of today, you can use world's most powerful CPU under liquid nitrogen in conjuction with the fastest RAM and drive possible and you would still get ridiculous performance in this game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yarbro View Post
    Instead of fixing the underlying issues, they just keep lowering the suspension, adding chrome plated spoilers and go faster stripes, in the hope we will be distracted.
    Problem is that it probably cannot be fixed. There are far more modern games that exhibit similar issues. Basically all MMO engines are build on single threaded #### like this, there are also very recent games like Grim Dawn that are also having the same issue, single core is tortured with 100% usage all the time and the rest of cores in not used, which results in massive CPU bottleneck, stuttering and drops to as low as 30 FPS in very dense scenes even on the most modern heavily overclocked systems.

    64-bit client may help a bit, it apparently did a lot for American and Euro Truck Simulator, in some places I now have over double the framerate compared to 2-3 years back, despite the game still being DX9. Though I don't exactly know what they did and if it is even associated with 64-bit client, I didn't follow the progress.

    For LOTRO the issue is more complicated, because framerate is not that much of an issue, it is bad and all over the place (literally you can just go ahead running around for lets say 30 minutes and your minimum FPS will be like 5 while maximum will be over 300), if there are some places where FPS drops then it is not something overly unusual, this happens in most games. But this stuttering... You can just see that everywhere and it is the same for everyone, even every youtube video from LOTRO shows massive frequent stuttering, especially when mounted. There is no way around it. Simply put LOTRO is amongst the worst performing games on the market, and it is inherent. I wouldn't expect it get fixed after so many years, they would do that long ago if they could, it is nobody's interest to have a terribly stuttery game.
    Last edited by Unthariel; Feb 16 2019 at 03:29 PM.

  15. #40
    I am running on pretty much the fastest hardware possible for GPU & single threaded CPU. The performance issues are annoying, but I resolved a good chunk of my performance woes with a 20-40fps gain.

    -----------------------------

    GPU: Nvidia 1080ti overclocked like a beast (this is basically on par with the fastest GPU in the world, which I believe is the +5% 2080ti which is horribly rated being such a small improvement)

    CPU: Intel i7 4790K @ 4ghz (this isn't that far below the best possible CPU in the world for singlethread performance)

    Harddrive: SSD of course.

    Monitor: 2560x1440 @ 144hz (this is why I am so frustrated when I don't get 90+ fps. After 90 I can tell the difference but it isn't as big a difference as getting to 90 which is huge to me. Anything below 90 just doesn't cut it for me, but 70 is acceptable. 40-50 is my bare minimum, but I hate it because going from 70-90 to 40-50 gives visible stutter.) I never use V-Sync (gross!) and just cap framerate @ 144hz or not at all.

    Latency: 51% on AT&T fiber 1000gbps.

    ------------------------

    A year ago, I remember getting extremely high framerates. I was running SLI 1080ti, but I don't know if LOTRO takes advantage of SLI. That's the only hardware difference, as I run just one 1080ti now. SLI/Crossfire is also so notorious for stuttering and all kinds of issues, so IMO everyone should always avoid that horrible tech and just go with the best GPU you can afford. However with MMORPG's, as we see here, as well as with most of Bethesda's poorly programmed games, the games I love are often CPU intensive and single threaded. It's horrible, but upgrading to the i7 4790K was the best thing I've ever done for MMO's, especially Hero Engine monstrosities like SWTOR or poorly programmed games like Skyrim (which I have to cap at 90fps anyway bc they violate game programming 101 and tie physics to framerates like some 12 year old incompetent programmer from 1980).

    Anyway, I messed with my settings and got some pretty big improvements. I noticed absolutely no visual difference between these settings being on LOW & ULTRA HIGH.



    Strategy: Turn everything to LOWEST (low/disabled for every possible setting except resolution). I then proceeded to turn every setting to max, to see if it gave any FPS hit. Out of all the hundred settings, only two gave any real FPS hit for me: Shadows (of any kind - blob or stencil) & Surface Reflection.

    In Lalia's Market facing all the clothing from the entrance, I get only 55fps on max settings. I noticed if I turned off shadows (Stencil Shadows and Blob shadows) entirely, I get 115fps. That is a boost of 60 extra frames turning off shadows. (Blob shadows still hits really really hard. And so does Low Stencil.) However no shadows is ugly bad, so I messed around and found only one setting mattered: Stencil Shadows. Turning this to Medium/High gives me 70fps. Anything more than High kills the framerate a lot for no gain. I notice no actual visual difference between Low & Ultra High stencil shadows. But I keep them on Medium anyway. (High outside in Bree lowered my fps a bit, so Medium is good).

    In Bree, I am getting horrible 40 framerate with max settings. Now I am getting 77+ framerate after I finally figured out what was killing my framerate. I noticed it wasn't just shadows killing my framerate outside in Bree (anything higher than Medium Stencil Shadows) It was also SURFACE REFLECTION. I turned this from Ultra High to Low, and bam - from 40fps to 77fps.

    I don't remember having much of ANY hitching/stuttering at all back a year ago when I played. Now it is really bad, especially on horse. The only change was the removal of my second 1080ti and switching internet providers from cable (150mbps) to fiber (1000gbps). I doubt this is the issue. Probably a patch, or a setting on my computer, or just the game sucks.

    Anyway, thought that might help. It gave me 30-40fps boost pretty much everywhere. Performance for MMORPG's is horrible, and LOTRO's is actually pretty good despite how insane it is to only get 70fps average in Bree/Laila's on the world's fastest GPU/CPU combo.

    My Nvidia settings are also max quality, except I do not use any DSR or AA settings in Nvidia Control Panel. No need with 4x AA in LOTRO.

    The only thing I haven't tried is something faster than a SSD. I'd love to see if anyone with Octane or M2 or RAM finds the stuttering to stop. It makes sense in some games, because of how incompetently the game programmers did things. (I am a gamedev myself and a game programmer; nothing close to an expert but I know a bit about the ways a lot of games are programmed when it comes to streaming in assets, large open world logic, and mmo netcode. Game programmers for MMORPG's are extremely disappointing and even big monoliths like Bethesda are notorious for massive violations of gamedev 101. Things even newbies know better than to do!).

    --------------------------------------------


    ==SETTINGS==

    SURFACE REFLECTION:
    Low
    STENCIL SHADOWS: Medium
    Everything Else: Absolute maximum possible.
    4x AA is required IMO and gives 0fps hit. Every other setting gives 0fps hit.

    TESTED IN: Bree only. This is where I was lagging the worst.
    STUTTERING: Unfixable.

    The first image is with the Low/Medium settings I just described. Below that at the very bottom is the same area with ULTRA HIGH settings. I see absolutely 0 difference in quality but look at the drop in framerate from 71 to 56 (framerate in the top left corner).

    edit: I take it back. Puddles on the ground look a lot better changing Surface Reflection to High. However the framerate hit is just way too high. Maybe I should turn this OFF (puddles disappear). For now I will keep it on low, so there are puddles and they dont look amazing but they at least exist. More testing is definitely required. You can see the difference between LOW/HIGH here. No reason at all to go above High though - frame drop with no real quality improvement.



    Last edited by Vivanta; Yesterday at 04:16 PM.

  16. #41
    Shadows are very confusing.

    If I keep on DX10 Dynamic Shadows in Bree, I get beautiful shadows and great performance.

    if I turn off DX10 Dynamic Shadows, it's like a 5fps performance hit as long as all other shadows are off (Stencil Shadows, Landscape Shadows, Blob Shadows all disabled).

    If I turn off DX10 Dynamic Shadows but turn ON other shadows (Stencil Shadows, Landscape Shadows, Blob Shadows) then I get an ENORMOUS fps hit. Turn DX10 Dynamic Shadows on with those on, and I get my performance back as the DX10 dynamics seem to take over.

    Notice the settings in the screenshots.


    I am guessing that since DX10 Dynamic Shadows are "OUTDOOR ONLY" this explains why my indoor framerate is so horrible. I assume based on the performance hit that the shadows are CPU intensive indoors (not DX10) but the DX10 dynamics are more up to date tech & use the GPU entirely. My performance hit with DX10 vs No shadows of any kind seems to be 5-16fps. Not bad at all for shadows everywhere. The lack of DX10 dynamics indoors though kills me and destroys my framerate looking at the costumes in Laila's market. Turn around and face the door and I fly up to 250+fps because it's not rendering any shadows but my character's. The sad thing is that in Laila's market there are barely any shadows really. Turning them off isnt a big deal like it is outside.


    For now, I will be keeping these settings:

    Last edited by Vivanta; Yesterday at 04:30 PM.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vivanta View Post
    I am running on pretty much the fastest hardware possible for GPU & single threaded CPU. The performance issues are annoying, but I resolved a good chunk of my performance woes with a 20-40fps gain.

    -----------------------------

    GPU: Nvidia 1080ti overclocked like a beast (this is basically on par with the fastest GPU in the world, which I believe is the +5% 2080ti which is horribly rated being such a small improvement)

    CPU: Intel i7 4790K @ 4ghz (this isn't that far below the best possible CPU in the world for singlethread performance)

    Harddrive: SSD of course.

    Monitor: 2560x1440 @ 144hz (this is why I am so frustrated when I don't get 90+ fps. After 90 I can tell the difference but it isn't as big a difference as getting to 90 which is huge to me. Anything below 90 just doesn't cut it for me, but 70 is acceptable. 40-50 is my bare minimum, but I hate it because going from 70-90 to 40-50 gives visible stutter.) I never use V-Sync (gross!) and just cap framerate @ 144hz or not at all.

    Latency: 51% on AT&T fiber 1000gbps.

    ------------------------

    A year ago, I remember getting extremely high framerates. I was running SLI 1080ti, but I don't know if LOTRO takes advantage of SLI. That's the only hardware difference, as I run just one 1080ti now. SLI/Crossfire is also so notorious for stuttering and all kinds of issues, so IMO everyone should always avoid that horrible tech and just go with the best GPU you can afford. However with MMORPG's, as we see here, as well as with most of Bethesda's poorly programmed games, the games I love are often CPU intensive and single threaded. It's horrible, but upgrading to the i7 4790K was the best thing I've ever done for MMO's, especially Hero Engine monstrosities like SWTOR or poorly programmed games like Skyrim (which I have to cap at 90fps anyway bc they violate game programming 101 and tie physics to framerates like some 12 year old incompetent programmer from 1980).

    Anyway, I messed with my settings and got some pretty big improvements. I noticed absolutely no visual difference between these settings being on LOW & ULTRA HIGH.



    Strategy: Turn everything to LOWEST (low/disabled for every possible setting except resolution). I then proceeded to turn every setting to max, to see if it gave any FPS hit. Out of all the hundred settings, only two gave any real FPS hit for me: Shadows (of any kind - blob or stencil) & Surface Reflection.

    In Lalia's Market facing all the clothing from the entrance, I get only 55fps on max settings. I noticed if I turned off shadows (Stencil Shadows and Blob shadows) entirely, I get 115fps. That is a boost of 60 extra frames turning off shadows. (Blob shadows still hits really really hard. And so does Low Stencil.) However no shadows is ugly bad, so I messed around and found only one setting mattered: Stencil Shadows. Turning this to Medium/High gives me 70fps. Anything more than High kills the framerate a lot for no gain. I notice no actual visual difference between Low & Ultra High stencil shadows. But I keep them on Medium anyway. (High outside in Bree lowered my fps a bit, so Medium is good).

    In Bree, I am getting horrible 40 framerate with max settings. Now I am getting 77+ framerate after I finally figured out what was killing my framerate. I noticed it wasn't just shadows killing my framerate outside in Bree (anything higher than Medium Stencil Shadows) It was also SURFACE REFLECTION. I turned this from Ultra High to Low, and bam - from 40fps to 77fps.

    I don't remember having much of ANY hitching/stuttering at all back a year ago when I played. Now it is really bad, especially on horse. The only change was the removal of my second 1080ti and switching internet providers from cable (150mbps) to fiber (1000gbps). I doubt this is the issue. Probably a patch, or a setting on my computer, or just the game sucks.

    Anyway, thought that might help. It gave me 30-40fps boost pretty much everywhere. Performance for MMORPG's is horrible, and LOTRO's is actually pretty good despite how insane it is to only get 70fps average in Bree/Laila's on the world's fastest GPU/CPU combo.

    My Nvidia settings are also max quality, except I do not use any DSR or AA settings in Nvidia Control Panel. No need with 4x AA in LOTRO.

    The only thing I haven't tried is something faster than a SSD. I'd love to see if anyone with Octane or M2 or RAM finds the stuttering to stop. It makes sense in some games, because of how incompetently the game programmers did things. (I am a gamedev myself and a game programmer; nothing close to an expert but I know a bit about the ways a lot of games are programmed when it comes to streaming in assets, large open world logic, and mmo netcode. Game programmers for MMORPG's are extremely disappointing and even big monoliths like Bethesda are notorious for massive violations of gamedev 101. Things even newbies know better than to do!).

    --------------------------------------------


    ==SETTINGS==

    SURFACE REFLECTION:
    Low
    STENCIL SHADOWS: Medium
    Everything Else: Absolute maximum possible.
    4x AA is required IMO and gives 0fps hit. Every other setting gives 0fps hit.

    TESTED IN: Bree only. This is where I was lagging the worst.
    STUTTERING: Unfixable.

    The first image is with the Low/Medium settings I just described. Below that at the very bottom is the same area with ULTRA HIGH settings. I see absolutely 0 difference in quality but look at the drop in framerate from 71 to 56 (framerate in the top left corner).

    edit: I take it back. Puddles on the ground look a lot better changing Surface Reflection to High. However the framerate hit is just way too high. Maybe I should turn this OFF (puddles disappear). For now I will keep it on low, so there are puddles and they dont look amazing but they at least exist. More testing is definitely required. You can see the difference between LOW/HIGH here. No reason at all to go above High though - frame drop with no real quality improvement.
    2080 Ti is on average 40% faster than 1080 Ti, from as low as 25% faster in some games up to as high as 60% faster in some, there are no circumstances at which any 1080 Ti can get within 5% of even stock 2080 Ti, even in games where the difference is only 25%. However that doesn't matter here because realistically you will never get GPU bound in LOTRO, not even close.

    If you have VRR, V-sync is active only on max refreshrate, and is automatically turned off when you drop below. And is still required to avoid tearing even with G-sync or FreeSync, so the common tactics is to turn V-sync On and then lock 2-3 FPS below max refreshrate, this way avoiding V-sync input lag and avoid tearing at the same time, win-win. You can also significantly reduce V-sync input lag by locking 0.010Hz below exact max refreshrate. So it is not "gross", it is required. https://www.blurbusters.com/howto-low-lag-vsync-on/

    There is a link to Graphics Settings Breakdown at the beginning of this thread, you can check the difference between different shadows settings there. There are massive differences depending on the environment. Quality of Stencil Shadows determines how far they can be rendered, and they work mostly for characters. For high quality dynamic shadows for foliage and architecture you need DX10 Dynamic Shadows, otherwise you will have low quality static shadows for foliage for example.

    You can also use x8 AA, it shouldn't affect your performance, it is entirely GPU bound settings and you are entirely CPU bound.

    Surface Reflections is the most unoptimized setting in game. Small pond in Bree has the same performance hit as huge water surfaces in Harwick. There is also very hard to find a good looking setting, because Off looks ok in the day from up close, but bad from the distance and water looks like a black hole during the night. On Low, it reflects only the sky, which looks odd and worse than Off from up close, and similarly bad from the distance. It will also look bad in places where there is no sky to reflect. Then High and Ultra reflect normal objects, High reflects only some part of objects and with lower object detail, while Ultra reflects everything, but both have massive performance hit.

    There are few settings that you can adjust to get huge boost to average framerate, mainly Surface Reflections and Object Draw Distance, but not only they are essential for quality, but also the stuttering is not fixable, so there is no effective difference in performance, you can even have 1000 FPS average and it won't matter if you get massive stutter every 10 seconds. Getting better CPU and RAM to increase single threaded performance also only raises average performance without any affect on stuttering.

    The only thing that has any real affect on stuttering is SSD, which reduces stuttering frequency up to 3 times compared to HDD, but it is still bad. Page File Usage says 0% and there is no difference in performance even from turning Page File off all together, so it doesn't seem that the game is running out of video memory due to 32-bit architecture because it would have to use Page File is such case right?
    Last edited by Unthariel; Yesterday at 04:56 PM.

 

 
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