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  1. #1

    Players coming in from other servers - Laurelin RP

    * I'm going to post this elsewhere as well, but as it concerns Laurelin directly I will start here*.

    I think that the vast majority of the player base see the server re-organisations in a positive light. The moves that Turbine are taking reflect an awareness of some of the problems LOTRO faces and I would hope that increased population on the remaining servers, along with new instances and the approach to Minas Tirith/Mordor will breathe new life into the game.

    However, with regards to Laurelin server, it seems that a number of players that are transferring in are unaware of the RP rules that most of the server populaton have traditionally lived by. Whilst resisting the urge to reel off a few anecdotes, I think it's obvious that there has been some friction with the newcomers showing up with names and attitudes that, whilst perfectly legitimate for other servers, are not appropriate for Laurelin.

    We all want the server to be friendly, welcoming, and populated. So, would it not make sense for Turbine to place a prominent flag or notification on the Launcher/Transfer facility basically stating - 'Laurelin is an RP-EN server: you should familiarise yourself with what this means by clicking *here*' and then putting a checkbox or something at the end of the notice ? It would go some way towards reducing confusion and the inevitable disagreement that results. It may also allow Laurelin to attract a few more dedicated RPers than it might otherwise.

    Obviously the game caters for all types of players, and Laurelin's raiding community seems to be growing again (which can only be a good thing) - the server seems busier now than this time last year. But I think it should also strive to retain the RP approach that has always defined it.

    I would welcome feedback on this (both agreement and the inevitable disagreement

  2. #2
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    My kin will be moving from Withywindle to Laurelin later this year. I am not an RPer, and most of us in the kin aren't either. When I scouted the server a few weeks ago, I was happy with what I saw, and encouraged that several locals felt my toon names (below) wouldn't be a problem on an RP server. I was also happy to see that while many Laurelin players were RPers, the people I spoke with didn't really care what I did or how I spent my time ingame. If I RP, great, if not, also great.

    The server transfers are an inconvenience. While they're good for some players, and many are seeing that positive side, many players are also just as attached to their communities as you are to yours, and aren't thrilled at the idea of having to pack up their characters and ship them through a transfer service that has not been running perfectly.

    With that in mind, I'm not surprised that not everyone is coming in thrilled. And having seen how some communities have chosen to respond to the prospect of migrant players (read: poorly), I'm not surprised there have been tensions. At the end of the day, it's the responsibility of every player - not just those who are moving - to be welcoming, respectful, and contribute positively to the communities they are a part of. I wouldn't mind Turbine giving players that FYI on the transfer - more information certainly couldn't hurt - but that doesn't give the remaining 10 servers any claim to "their community" or "how we do things here" beyond what's explicitly enforced by Turbine in the COC and Roleplaying standards.

    None of this is to say that you/Laurelin players have done anything wrong. Simply, that some players seem to think their way of life is the only acceptable way, which is a shame.
    Neddor, Untrustworthy Guardian of Arkenstone
    Massan, Captain Nutter of Laurelin

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karistyne View Post
    * I'm going to post this elsewhere as well, but as it concerns Laurelin directly I will start here*.

    I think that the vast majority of the player base see the server re-organisations in a positive light. The moves that Turbine are taking reflect an awareness of some of the problems LOTRO faces and I would hope that increased population on the remaining servers, along with new instances and the approach to Minas Tirith/Mordor will breathe new life into the game.

    However, with regards to Laurelin server, it seems that a number of players that are transferring in are unaware of the RP rules that most of the server populaton have traditionally lived by. Whilst resisting the urge to reel off a few anecdotes, I think it's obvious that there has been some friction with the newcomers showing up with names and attitudes that, whilst perfectly legitimate for other servers, are not appropriate for Laurelin.

    We all want the server to be friendly, welcoming, and populated. So, would it not make sense for Turbine to place a prominent flag or notification on the Launcher/Transfer facility basically stating - 'Laurelin is an RP-EN server: you should familiarise yourself with what this means by clicking *here*' and then putting a checkbox or something at the end of the notice ? It would go some way towards reducing confusion and the inevitable disagreement that results. It may also allow Laurelin to attract a few more dedicated RPers than it might otherwise.

    Obviously the game caters for all types of players, and Laurelin's raiding community seems to be growing again (which can only be a good thing) - the server seems busier now than this time last year. But I think it should also strive to retain the RP approach that has always defined it.

    I would welcome feedback on this (both agreement and the inevitable disagreement
    Perhaps my comment is misplaced since I am not an RPer and you don't provide any examples (not that you should), but it was my understanding that RP was encouraged but not required. And with Evernight being the only other EN server, I don't think you can expect everyone to educate themselves. Furthermore, I don't see how Turbine or the RP community can enforce anything since RP is encouraged and one of the only EN servers. Again I am ignorant, but how are RP rules any different than the rules for any of the other servers? What do you mean by "names and attitudes that, whilst perfectly legitimate for other servers, are not appropriate for Laurelin"? I imagine that some people are struggling with names. And attitudes... well every server has their share of troublemakers and you, just like all the other servers, are likely to get a few more. I am not saying that your position is wrong. Simply, that I don’t understand the difference, and your position, although ideal, might not be practical.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aedelric2 View Post
    Perhaps my comment is misplaced since I am not an RPer and you don't provide any examples (not that you should), but it was my understanding that RP was encouraged but not required.
    Unfortunately the rules on Laurelin and Landroval are slightly different - on Landroval RP is encouraged so there is more leeway on the naming front. On Laurelin the naming rules are stricter.

    I moved to Laurelin also, not to RP but I wanted a mature and friendly community and thought I would find it there. I was concerned that quite a few of my names don't stick to the lore - they are not offensive, just don't follow the naming rules. I'm watching world chat and what I see there is quite discouraging at times with a lot of hostility. Primarily from residents of Laurelin (not all I hasten to add) and this incites reactions. Then the incomers wade in and react in kind. And people have to be so careful, emotions don't convey well through on-line chat and with different nationalities involved - things said can often be misconstrued.

    Understandably Laurelin's world has been rocked as they are seeing a large influx of players, but I think there are some who are out there reporting new player names just because they can. One guy was renamed after being on the server about 30 minutes - no warning, just a rename. His name wasn't offensive, but probably did not fit in Tolkien's world. A warning would have been nice for him. Residents started saying it wasn't their fault, they didn't make the rules, that GMs watch chat and change names if they feel they don't fit, etc. etc. So there was a lot of buck-passing in my opinion - blaming Turbine and not the residents. The problem is some of the residents were probably dreading the closures and new players joining Laurelin and expected the worst. They've had weeks for the dread to build so they took it upon themselves to police and show no tolerance because they want to keep things the way they were before.

    And scanning through the list of who is online there are many many names that, whilst not offensive or some variant of xX***Xx don't fit the lore at all. But, from the kins and level, I'd say they've been on Laurelin for some time and haven't been reported.

    I'm hoping things will settle but all this and after only 2 moves from closing servers is a little worrying.
    Last edited by Chouxbun; Sep 30 2015 at 02:11 AM.


  5. #5
    A general comment first; It never ceases to amaze me the amount of perceived problems that some are able to spin out of a few people duking it out in /world.

    So far, I haven't seen a lot of hostility in the world channel over the transfers. There have been a few incidents, most notably driven along by a couple of usual suspects who are there to stir up drama. But really, people: you all know that if there is a chance to have unfiltered access to a large part of the server community, some people will abuse it. This doesn't mean that they represent the server population as a whole, or that Laurelin has been a smoldering toxic cesspool of fighting the last days. For the most part, what I have seen in /world are friendly welcomes to those transferring in. People are happy to see new people coming to the server, because it adds to the life of Laurelin, because it is a chance to make new friends.

    As for names, what people coming to Laurelin need to know is that the server runs under an extra roleplaying policy, set by Turbine:
    http://de.support.turbine.com/link/p...es-and-Policy/

    So, based on the guidelines, no-one can force you to roleplay on Laurelin. However, when you log into the server, you basically have to follow the guidelines above, regarding character naming, harassment by/of roleplayers, and behaviour in some chat channels. It is not really that hard to do, especially if you create a new character here. For people transferring in with existing names, though, the issue is stickier. Still, given that Turbine has stated that the RP rules will be upheld even after the transfer, you can hardly blame the community for working to uphold it. Many of the players here have actively sought out the server, in part because the policy has helped provide a more immersive RP experience.

    As for how the renaming works, the article above really describes it. Players report, GM's act. Still, lots of the locals are also somewhat confused over this, so I'll just quote something I wrote in an article about LOTRO roleplaying a little while back:

    Contrary to the belief of some, Laurelin and Belegaer aren’t monitored 24/7 by a team of RP game masters who actively look for violations of the RP policy. In reality, the game masters act on reports made by the players.

    Do you have a character whose name is problematic according to the RP policy and the Code of Conduct? Do you disrupt people trying to run an RP event? Do you talk about the latest Champions League results in the /say channel? Then another player might send a ticket to the GM’s, asking them to investigate further. After this report has been made, it is up to Turbine’s employees to decide whether or not you have violated the RP policy. Sanctions may include a forced renaming of your character name, warnings or bans from the game.

    The important thing to remember is this: As a rule, players don’t report because they want to be mean to you. They do it to preservere the roleplaying on the server, to allow roleplayers the immersion they look for. Many roleplayers want to filter out as many out-of-character distractions as possible, to concentrate on the storytelling. Realistically, the RP servers are the only places they can hope to achieve this. This means that roleplayers will be somewhat diligent in keeping the policy alive.

    Some find this problematic, comparing the RP servers to 1984-inspired police states, or by belittling the RP policy (and those who follow it) as silly. If that is the way you roll, or if the uncertainty that someone somewhere down the line might report you is too much to bear, then by all means: You should think twice before making an RP-supported server your home. After all, there are alternatives available.

    If you’d like to take the chance anyway, to take part in the fun things that happen on the RP servers: Be welcome! It is generally not too hard to follow the RP policy. The simple version is this:

    * Put a little thought into your character name, so it would be somewhat fitting in Middle Earth, while not being a near copy of some of the major characters in the LOTRO story.
    * Don’t actively mess up things for those who roleplay, and remember that your roleplaying choices is no excuse for harassing others.
    * Don’t talk about stuff that doesn’t belong in Middle Earth, or things that characters in Middle Earth wouldn’t know about, in the restricted channels.
    Lina Willowwood, biscuit-eating bard on Laurelin
    Hobbit RP? Grand Order of the Lost Mathom
    Songs + videos on me biscuity burrow

  6. #6
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    Thank you for the information. At least now I understand a bit better. Not trying to blame anyone. There are times when I wished I had more Tolkien immersion, so I understand the sentiment and I think it is commendable.

    I gotta say though being so strict presents a problem, at least in my mind. Now that I know what I know I probably won't move to Laurelin (acting was never my thing) whereas before I was considering it. The situation seems to force a lot of the previous EN worlds onto only one server, Evernight, at which point they will be in the same boat as Brandywine as far as population goes. I guess we can only hope that the hardware upgrades are going to be good.

  7. #7
    So my kin is coming to Laurelin from Withywindle, but a couple of my long established characters have names that might not be accepted by Laurelin naming rules. They are not outlandish names or anything, just all my characters have names based on my own name which makes a couple unsuitable, ie my berserker style Champion is called Sidicidal (my name + playstyle) It was given that name over 5 years ago and the whole kin knows me by that name. If when I come to Laurelin, I switch off my character's floaty name, how will anyone know what I am called to report me? Is there no way to avoid an unwanted rename?

  8. #8
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    if your name gets reported and force changed, you can always contact a GM, and explain to him why you were named the way you were. The GM might revert your name to what it was before if he thinks it is not a violation of the rules
    My Lotro blog :)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    So my kin is coming to Laurelin from Withywindle, but a couple of my long established characters have names that might not be accepted by Laurelin naming rules. They are not outlandish names or anything, just all my characters have names based on my own name which makes a couple unsuitable, ie my berserker style Champion is called Sidicidal (my name + playstyle) It was given that name over 5 years ago and the whole kin knows me by that name. If when I come to Laurelin, I switch off my character's floaty name, how will anyone know what I am called to report me? Is there no way to avoid an unwanted rename?
    If someone targets you for some reason, they will be able to see your name. If you aren't marked as anonymous, people will be able to see you in the social panel. If you enter a fellowship group, again people will see your name. And of course if you talk in any of the chat channels, people will see your name. That is a real pain and a ton of effort to try to keep your name a secret.

    There is no way to prevent a rename assuming you keep your original. You are at the mercy of the Laurelin community and the GM that sees the report about you. Even if you could talk to the GM and he/she reconsiders giving you a rename, you could always end up being reported later down the road and have the same problem. Second time around you might get a different GM that might not be so nice (or the original GM that handled your case might get tired of getting so many reports about that they decide to change it anyway). This is exactly one reason why I don't think I will be moved to this server.

    The second is that how do you stay in character when you are advertising in trade, recruiting for your kin, trying to get a fellowship together, etc. ? I know that people can't force you to RP, and I realize that LOTRO is a fantasy game so what I am about to say might sound funny. I don't want to have to keep up some façade simply because other people want me to. We all have to keep up appearances to a certain amount in real life, and I am not interested in having to do the same when I play a game.
    Last edited by Aedelric2; Oct 01 2015 at 05:26 AM.

  10. #10
    Unfortunately there is virtually no choice, Evernight is is going to become the new Brandwine as all the English speaking EU players try to cram onto there to avoid being forced to rename their characters to meet Laurelin's RP naming rules and our kin decided they hoped that Laurelin would be the less crowded of the only 2 English servers left (EU), so I am stuck with;
    1) Having my characters being given a forced rename, some of whom have had those names and been known by them since I first started playing back before F2P.
    2) Deleting my characters and starting new ones from scratch.
    3) Leaving my kin and the friends I have been playing with for years and transfering my characters to Evernight by myself.
    4) Leaving my kin and transferring to a non English server and having nobody to speak to (I can't speak any other languages).
    5) Deleting my characters and starting from scratch on a US server.
    6) Quitting the game.

    None of those choices are very palatable, but what choice is there? Unlike the US servers, we don't have 5 viable English speaking servers that we can transfer to. Our choices are far more limited.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Aedelric2 View Post

    The second is that how do you stay in character when you are advertising in trade, recruiting for your kin, trying to get a fellowship together, etc. ?
    Well, you simply say something along the lines of:
    - Selling [Greater Essence of Morale]
    - The Wardens of the Grey Gate are recruiting, looking for able wardens, burglars, guardians... For more information, please contact Aedelric or our other officers.
    - Hi, getting a group together for The Dome of Stars, need a healer.

    In-character announcements isn't that hard. You don't have to use Ye Olde English. You don't have to study Acting 101 to do it. We're not looking for Academy Award-worthy performances. Shortcuts like linking to items are OK. Just keep modern-day stuff out of the regulated channels, keep it simple and to the point, and you're for the most part golden. The channels where you want to take extra care is /say, /emote and /yell, since this is where most of the roleplaying happens.

    It is something of a moot point anyway, since most trade/LFF/Kin recruitments these days happen in the world channel. And that is not covered by the IC RP policy *smiles*
    Last edited by Linawillow; Sep 30 2015 at 10:48 AM.
    Lina Willowwood, biscuit-eating bard on Laurelin
    Hobbit RP? Grand Order of the Lost Mathom
    Songs + videos on me biscuity burrow

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    Unfortunately there is virtually no choice, Evernight is is going to become the new Brandwine as all the English speaking EU players try to cram onto there to avoid being forced to rename their characters to meet Laurelin's RP naming rules and our kin decided they hoped that Laurelin would be the less crowded of the only 2 English servers left (EU), so I am stuck with;
    1) Having my characters being given a forced rename, some of whom have had those names and been known by them since I first started playing back before F2P.
    2) Deleting my characters and starting new ones from scratch.
    3) Leaving my kin and the friends I have been playing with for years and transfering my characters to Evernight by myself.
    4) Leaving my kin and transferring to a non English server and having nobody to speak to (I can't speak any other languages).
    5) Deleting my characters and starting from scratch on a US server.
    6) Quitting the game.

    None of those choices are very palatable, but what choice is there? Unlike the US servers, we don't have 5 viable English speaking servers that we can transfer to. Our choices are far more limited.
    This sounds a lot like me. Not trying to say that RPing or Laurelin are bad, just not something I am interested in dealing with. I have to agree this aspect of the consolidation is not something I relish, and I think Turbine is making a mistake with only two EN servers.

  13. #13
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    Well, roleplayers have two choices of English language servers as well. One that has policies which support a roleplay environment, and one that doesn't. We who chose Laurelin chose it because it does have those policies. It also has a community unlike any other in the game. You are welcome to join us. We are sorry that you may need to be re-named, but if your name is that important, you might want to consider Evernight instead. The new server hardware should handle bigger populations just fine. But if you are coming to Laurelin, it should be for - not in spite of - our unique community.

  14. #14
    I feel that my original post has been somewhat misconstrued but allow me to clarify:

    When I say that there is friction with players with non-Laurelin names or attitudes, I don't mean that I believe that every character that is created on Laurelin should have a 100% Tolkienesque name (but wouldn't it be something to see ? ). No, the server generally operates along the lines of 'so long as your name is not *obviously* troll-y no-one has a problem'. Similarly, in my experience, the majority of players on the server are, at best, intermittent RPers or do no RP whatsoever.

    The specific difficulties that I was referring to (I have no wish to name particular individuals - even if they are simply characters) is where someone comes to the server, assumes that the rules there are the same as other less lore encouraged/enforced servers and decides to name his character xxxLEGOLASzergFTWxxx or whatever. As I stated previously, I understand this is completely acceptable on some other servers and this is as it should be, but on Laurelin the naming policy does aid in creating a specific atmosphere/immersion. The normal pattern from there is frequently that the person speaks on 'World' and is contacted by others - both by IM and over the 'World' channel - pointing out that there is a problem with their name. This usually rapidly descends into a nasty exchange over the 'World' channel to no-one's benefit.

    As I had said, the amount of raiding being done on Laurelin has definitely increased, and this is great. In our kin we have both regular RP nights and weekly raid evenings. LOTRO serves both needs admirably (we also have a band and deeding evenings but that's besides the point). I wouldn't wish to force raiders to use perfectly lore correct names if they don't wish to- and the vast majority of raiders on Laurelin use perfectly acceptable character names that are not strictly Tolkienesque - the truth is very few people care.

    As stated by a previous poster, Laurelin 'World' chat is OOC (to do otherwise would be impossible). Interpersonal interactions are at the discretion of the characters involved. Personally, I don't think the rules are that strenuous or imposing - a player needs to read three or four paragraphs to 'get it' and, as was previously stated, it does help create a unique server atmosphere.

    Which brings me to the suggestion that I made. With so many new players coming in (which is fantastic - all the kins see this as an opportunity to recruit new blood), the established rules are often overlooked and confusion is the result. Would it not be useful for the devs to place, in the launcher/transfer facility a flag or note as suggested - simply pointing out to the player that Laurelin is RP-EN and this is what it means ? ( maybe a link to the Laurelin-specific naming guidelines ?) - it would save time for everyone and prospective newcomers would be informed. It would also make it easier for the established population to sort out those who are genuinely mistaken in their names/attitudes from those who are simply trolling.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Aestivan View Post
    Well, roleplayers have two choices of English language servers as well. One that has policies which support a roleplay environment, and one that doesn't. We who chose Laurelin chose it because it does have those policies. It also has a community unlike any other in the game. You are welcome to join us. We are sorry that you may need to be re-named, but if your name is that important, you might want to consider Evernight instead. The new server hardware should handle bigger populations just fine. But if you are coming to Laurelin, it should be for - not in spite of - our unique community.
    Sorry, but you have to face the fact that an awful lot (possibly the majority) of players transferring to Laurelin are doing so despite the RP not because of it. If that is unpleasant news then talk Turbine into keeping more English speaking EU servers, otherwise you have to face the fact that we are involuntary transfers and not attracted by the RP server. If we were attracted to it we would have joined it instead of our present servers. The Laurelin community is going to change, there is no way around that because the players and kins transferring to your server are going to bring their own community ideas and practices with them. Unfortunately as can be seen in real life, when a community is flooded by different cultures, that community is forced to change or deal with the friction created. Just look at any country to see this in action, ie Christians and Muslims, American Indians and White settlers, etc, forced immigration always forces these issues to surface.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    Sorry, but you have to face the fact that an awful lot (possibly the majority) of players transferring to Laurelin are doing so despite the RP not because of it. If that is unpleasant news then talk Turbine into keeping more English speaking EU servers, otherwise you have to face the fact that we are involuntary transfers and not attracted by the RP server.
    I was being nice.

    No, you need to face facts. The policies exist. They are in force. Infractions will be reported. Malicious infractions will be reported as harrassment. Please familiarize yourself with RP policies for Laurelin. They do apply to transferring players. If you cannot accept that, go somewhere else.

    Turbine has pretty much told us that there will never be new worlds with an RP policy. For English-language roleplayers, this and Landroval are all that there is. If you come here, you cannot ignore those aspects of the rules that you find inconvenient. You cannot expect special accommodation. The RP policy is part and parcel of life on Laurelin. It will not change just for you.

    You do not get to pick this world for its roomier accommodations and more congenial playerbase and then disregard the things that have made it what it is. We welcome those who are able to understand and respect what is different in our community whether they roleplay or not. But those who exempt themselves from the rules that have been in place since launch can expect consequences to follow.
    Last edited by Aestivan; Sep 30 2015 at 04:56 PM.

  17. #17
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    It is not expected that you should be well-learned about the server, but understanding regarding its different nature which is rooted deep in the long past even when the game first begun. Yes, rp is not required and Turbine or the community cannot force you to role play, yet this server has an additional set of official rules and policies for the preservation of a greater immersive environment. How these are different from other servers one may ask? They are not the same as the Code of Conduct (which apply to all Worlds) but in addition to those policies.

    In brief those are:
    • Names should be within the spirit of the setting. This does not mean that they must have the right meaning or ending, but that they should be fitting names for the world of J.R.R. Tolkien. Opposite examples of this would be: Suuperman, Fishslapper, Rofltcopter, Pvpman, and so on. Of course these are not offensive, but as you doubtless can see, and perhaps know well enough in your heart, such words are not suitable/realistic to name the peoples of Middle-earth (our characters).
    • Do not harass role play and rp events and people because they are role playing.
    • The say channel (mainly) is reserved for IC (In Character/role play) speech.


    These additional policies that the server has are reasonable and easy enough to follow, and they are here for the good of the server; encouraging in this way a more immersive environment and preserving it (at least more than on any other server). Very many people have come over the years (and still do) for this, and to avoid the out of Middle-earth names that are seen in plenty and often on other worlds. These extra guidelines, have surely played a significant role in the different shape and growth of this server, and in its outset. It would not be just to have these diminished because of the transfers. When one moves to another country, does he expect the laws to change or lessen because of how things are on his former homeland? It is clear that some at least, are simply not pleased to be under such a new (for them) extra set of rules (and yet unwilling to go to Evernight in a somewhat reasonable fear of that server becoming too crowded) and thus the arguing/discussing of this matter and especially the naming.

    In any case the executive producer of LotRO has already openly said that the rp policy will remain the same. It will not change, nor lessened. And that is good (for the reasons mentioned above, and others yet) and not unfortunate as has been said. There are indeed very many on this server that have a care for role play, immersion, and the lore. And here we come on some other words that have been oft seen lately -to make perhaps those who do not rp and want to transfer here, feel more at ease-, that the majority on Laurelin are not role players. It does not seem so, especially considering that this server has started with an rp tag next to it on the Worlds list and has remained there for all these long years. Apart from this, there are more than a few other tokens, both in and out of the game that show this - that the numbers of role players on Laurelin are in truth very great.

    I can perceive somewhat how people whose servers are closing feel, and that they are unwilling to lose their names, but do not think unkindly of the Laurelin community if they try for the more immersive and mature environment to be preserved. It is not a case of players here being authoritative or ill-willed, and reporting name-violations just because they can. It is care for the nature of this server, and that should not be rebuked.

    And it is wise for all to know/remember that (as Turbine has written) even a block from the server (and going further, an account ban too) can be given in repeated violations of Laurelin's official guidelines. But I want to say to all those who like what Laurelin offers and yet are perhaps in doubt or a little daunted by all this - do not be. For as it can be well understood, this would happen only to those who have no mind to respect these things. So one would have to go out of his way indeed to receive this from Turbine. And this too has contributed well to the player base of the server as in this way Orc and troll-like behaviour and actions have been restrained. An example that comes now to mind, for my part I do not ever recall an rp event on this server being disrupted. But on other servers, and especially on Landroval, this has been the case many times. This example shows how much of a good and significant role the additional official support with these policies has played over the years in shaping up a much more respected community.

    Lastly, since the remaining servers were announced I have seen more than once this (or variances of it) being said: ''Face the fact that your community is going to change.'' Likely enough people do not mean for this to sound like it does, but it would be good to be more careful with the wording here as it seems and sounds almost as a threat. The different nature and environment of this server will not change just like that, or at least not significantly and this I feel that I can say with certainty. For the only way this would happen it would be if the rules were taken away, and if the Laurelin players were gone, and thus also the long in-game traditions such as the recurring lore-inspired events and kinships that have ever added much to the rich immersive atmosphere of this server.

    There are many players (and even entire kins) from other servers (and especially Gilrain) who are glad to come and be in this more Middle-earth immersive environment. And these folk may likely grow in time in some ways more like to us, enhanced in arts and gentleness. But we do not see all this positive behaviour because they are happy with what Laurelin offers. And if you too would like to learn more about the different nature of Laurelin and the lore-rich environment it offers, there is even an essay written about this server. https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...s-Online-Essay

    To those who may feel somewhat bitter about their names being changed, that is understandable, but be not unjust in your grief. If you would have the friendship and good will of the players about, Laurelin is ready to give it. We are a new people and a new world to you, but we have the desire and good will to welcome you.
    Last edited by Erennor; Sep 30 2015 at 08:09 PM.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Aestivan View Post
    I was being nice.

    No, you need to face facts. The policies exist. They are in force. Infractions will be reported. Malicious infractions will be reported as harrassment. Please familiarize yourself with RP policies for Laurelin. They do apply to transferring players. If you cannot accept that, go somewhere else.

    Turbine has pretty much told us that there will never be new worlds with an RP policy. For English-language roleplayers, this and Landroval are all that there is. If you come here, you cannot ignore those aspects of the rules that you find inconvenient. You cannot expect special accommodation. The RP policy is part and parcel of life on Laurelin. It will not change just for you.

    You do not get to pick this world for its roomier accommodations and more congenial playerbase and then disregard the things that have made it what it is. We welcome those who are able to understand and respect what is different in our community whether they roleplay or not. But those who exempt themselves from the rules that have been in place since launch can expect consequences to follow.

    I am sorry, but it is this kind of attitude that has made the move to Laurelin so traumatic. The lack of compassion shown by some, and it is only some, has been jaw dropping. World chat on the first night was positively toxic, and although some of it was down to the newcomers a lot was also down to the locals.

    My kin moved to this server because of the mature and welcoming player base. We hoped to find a world akin to the community that Gilrain was. Monday night was a blow to that. I hope the true nature of Laurelin shines through soon, because if you think the arrival of the second smallest server has been bad, just wait for the other more popular ones to come.

    It is sad that to stay with my friends and kin, who I have played with for many years and care about deeply, I now have to live on a server of fear, waiting for some random person to decide that my name - none of them offensive - isn't good enough. Have a naming policy by all means, but limit it to offensive or egregious names and give them an option to move to another server before forcibly changing the nature of a character they may have had and developed for several years.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    305
    I'm from Gilrain and I have always been very active in world chat. I'm active in Laurelin's world chat now, hopefully there have been no issues with me over that, I feel I am doing my best to contribute to the good feeling on the server and doing my best to help people on either side. It wasn't a straight forward transition, Laurelin is definitely a unique place, different in some ways to the uber-casual friendly atmosphere of Gilrain where there are no policies which this week have caused people on either side to get stressed and upset. Silly things have been said in world chat, but I am going on the idea that it's not easy for anyone, I will forgive and forget nearly everything that doesn't go well, aside the definite trolls but they are just their usual selves. It upsets me to see any side really hurt and worked-up and we are in this place because for English speaking players who want a strong mature community server, Laurelin right now is the only choice (out of two). Turbine hasn't got the manpower to do much here, it's down to us as a community to work this out. And we will, because bit by bit I can see people are starting to understand. It won't be easy, I see that now, but none of us have the choice. If you love LOTRO, love a friendly community, we are going to have to dig deep and become better at accepting each side.

    To the Laurelin people, this transfer will be one of the easier ones, I can tell you that now as a person coming from Gilrain. Gilrain has one of the best groups of people, who stood together and worked together, through fun times and hard times (our tribute to a friend who sadly passed away was one of the most moving times I have seen online, anywhere). Like any family, we have a few bad sheep (not account bound fortunately), but you'll not find a finer group of players who love friendly community and fun chats. They may be a little shy of the rp side, but you will find them to be a good addition to your server, in the end.

    To the Gilrain people, I have been on Laurelin for a while, before server moves were talked about. They are a good bunch like us. They have some different priorities, but like we pick a kin to suit us, you still play along with the non-kin, help them, chat with them. It's been a tough ride and it will get better. Promise.

    My only worry, after Gilrain, some incoming servers will maybe bounce a little harder, so Laurelin and Gilrain, we really need to get it together before we see those coming in, because there will be some closures and moves that will really put our new home to the test. Gilrain is easy, other places not so much.

    Two servers for English-speakers in the old world. It's a raw deal but we live with what we have. Together, because the other option is just stupid and wasteful.
    "I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. You cannot pass."
    Officer in the Elders kinship - http://www.theelders.org.uk/
    We have left the wandering spark (Gilrain) to find the Song of Gold (Laurelin)...

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    105
    I was not trying to incite an argument. I am just not happy with the situation. I am in no way trying to direct my frustration towards RPers or Laurelin but more towards Turbine. I still think that they should keep one other non-RP server open, but that is just my opinion which doesn’t amount to much at the end of the day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aestivan View Post
    No, you need to face facts. The policies exist. ... They do apply to transferring players. If you cannot accept that, go somewhere else.
    It will not change just for you. ... But those who exempt themselves from the rules that have been in place since launch can expect consequences to follow.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    Sorry, but you have to face the fact that an awful lot (possibly the majority) of players transferring to Laurelin are doing so despite the RP not because of it....The Laurelin community is going to change...
    Quote Originally Posted by Aestivan View Post
    ...But if you are coming to Laurelin, it should be for - not in spite of - our unique community.
    As Linawillow stated Turbine is the one who set the rules and enforces them, and so far they intent to keep doing so. The rules are there for a reason, and I can respect that. They can and should be enforced as long as Turbine is backing it up. I am well aware that there are people who don’t have any respect whatsoever, and shame on them. Change is inevitable, but incoming players shouldn’t try to change or maliciously undermine the existing atmosphere of a new world. It is just speculation on our part whether the rules are going to change, and as it stands now, Turbine has said they won’t. It also seems arrogant to me to expect special treatment. Purposely ignoring/breaking the rules paints other transferees in a bad light.

    On the other hand, the Laurelin community needs to understand that there are obviously a significant number of transferees that don’t know the rules. Being reported within 30 minutes of arriving and the like is not very welcoming. It would be much better if the Laurelin community tried to explain, link, etc. (as was stated some already do) so that the new arrivals could learn before any further action is taken. Turbine could certainly help the education part of the process along.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hammadryad View Post
    Unfortunately there is virtually no choice, Evernight is is going to become the new Brandwine ... so I am stuck with;
    1) Having my characters being given a forced rename, some of whom have had those names and been known by them since I first started playing back before F2P.
    2) Deleting my characters and starting new ones from scratch.
    3) Leaving my kin and the friends I have been playing with for years and transfering my characters to Evernight by myself.
    4) Leaving my kin and transferring to a non English server and having nobody to speak to (I can't speak any other languages).
    5) Deleting my characters and starting from scratch on a US server.
    6) Quitting the game.

    None of those choices are very palatable, but what choice is there? Unlike the US servers, we don't have 5 viable English speaking servers that we can transfer to. Our choices are far more limited.
    Please try to understand that in some ways Hammadryad is also right. The transferees don’t have a lot of options, so we have to choose whether we want to deal with competing for quests & resources, and possibly lag; or rules that seem strange, restricting, harsh, and maybe even confusing to someone who has never dealt with RPing before. Turbine is essentially forcing us to decide between forfeiting some freedom (however minor of an inconvenience you might feel that it is) and constant competition. For some the choice is a no brainer, but for others of us it is a struggle. Another facet of this is that there is an aspect of the RP rules that can be a little subjective. The other problem is that there are too many unknowns at this point. Perhaps some reservations would resolve themselves if transferees immersed themselves in the Lauerlin atmosphere for a week or so before deciding on a destination.

    While I think the consolidation is a good thing, this particular aspect is, in my opinion, less than ideal. Regardless, it is what it is. The only way to make the best of the situation is for both sides to tolerate and respect the other.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Upon these hither shores
    Posts
    277
    Quote Originally Posted by Mappo_Gilrain View Post
    It is sad that to stay with my friends and kin, who I have played with for many years and care about deeply, I now have to live on a server of fear, waiting for some random person to decide that my name - none of them offensive - isn't good enough.
    this is hilarious, you guys really like to exaggerate things, all this name fear is just paranoia. Live on a server of fear... well, three solutions: get a lore friendly name change, keep playing with your current name (because likely with many of the transfer names you'll get away with it) or Evernight.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    680
    Quote Originally Posted by Karistyne View Post
    I feel that my original post has been somewhat misconstrued but allow me to clarify:

    When I say that there is friction with players with non-Laurelin names or attitudes, I don't mean that I believe that every character that is created on Laurelin should have a 100% Tolkienesque name (but wouldn't it be something to see ? ). No, the server generally operates along the lines of 'so long as your name is not *obviously* troll-y no-one has a problem'. Similarly, in my experience, the majority of players on the server are, at best, intermittent RPers or do no RP whatsoever.

    The specific difficulties that I was referring to (I have no wish to name particular individuals - even if they are simply characters) is where someone comes to the server, assumes that the rules there are the same as other less lore encouraged/enforced servers and decides to name his character xxxLEGOLASzergFTWxxx or whatever. As I stated previously, I understand this is completely acceptable on some other servers and this is as it should be, but on Laurelin the naming policy does aid in creating a specific atmosphere/immersion. The normal pattern from there is frequently that the person speaks on 'World' and is contacted by others - both by IM and over the 'World' channel - pointing out that there is a problem with their name. This usually rapidly descends into a nasty exchange over the 'World' channel to no-one's benefit.

    As I had said, the amount of raiding being done on Laurelin has definitely increased, and this is great. In our kin we have both regular RP nights and weekly raid evenings. LOTRO serves both needs admirably (we also have a band and deeding evenings but that's besides the point). I wouldn't wish to force raiders to use perfectly lore correct names if they don't wish to- and the vast majority of raiders on Laurelin use perfectly acceptable character names that are not strictly Tolkienesque - the truth is very few people care.

    As stated by a previous poster, Laurelin 'World' chat is OOC (to do otherwise would be impossible). Interpersonal interactions are at the discretion of the characters involved. Personally, I don't think the rules are that strenuous or imposing - a player needs to read three or four paragraphs to 'get it' and, as was previously stated, it does help create a unique server atmosphere.

    Which brings me to the suggestion that I made. With so many new players coming in (which is fantastic - all the kins see this as an opportunity to recruit new blood), the established rules are often overlooked and confusion is the result. Would it not be useful for the devs to place, in the launcher/transfer facility a flag or note as suggested - simply pointing out to the player that Laurelin is RP-EN and this is what it means ? ( maybe a link to the Laurelin-specific naming guidelines ?) - it would save time for everyone and prospective newcomers would be informed. It would also make it easier for the established population to sort out those who are genuinely mistaken in their names/attitudes from those who are simply trolling.
    Thanks for clarifying. This is the kind of response I've seen from most Laurelin natives in my lurking: happy to have us do our thing, so long as they can do their thing. So long as we all follow the rules, we're good. That's the positive, policy-based response that I think makes the most sense. It's not what everyone has been doing (see this thread, and others), but it's what I've seen most often.

    Again, more information for players about what an "RP server" is would be helpful. Many of us forum posters are familiar with the document (or at least know it exists), but that may not be the case with the wider player base. Couldn't hurt to drop them a mail when they transfer in, or whatever other FYI is easy and workable. That kind of information doesn't place blame or assume incomers are disruptive, and I think we both know those sorts of assumptions create more problems than they solve.
    Neddor, Untrustworthy Guardian of Arkenstone
    Massan, Captain Nutter of Laurelin

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    105
    This is just a drop in the bucket, but I added a short blurb about roleplaying to the guide I wrote (https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...09#post7447109). Perhaps, it will help make transferring people more aware.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by elvenes View Post
    this is hilarious, you guys really like to exaggerate things, all this name fear is just paranoia. Live on a server of fear... well, three solutions: get a lore friendly name change, keep playing with your current name (because likely with many of the transfer names you'll get away with it) or Evernight.
    Are you deliberately trolling or just living in cloud cuckoo land? You just have to see previous posts and threads by LAURELIN players saying how they don't want migrant players, that names WILL be reported and anyone coming to Laurelin HAS to fit THEIR community. What a welcoming atmosphere huh? I had a character on Laurelin even before the server closures were announced let alone how many and which servers. And even back then I was warned by the Laurelin community to watch out for the RP mafia because "it contains some right jerks who seem to think they are responsible for making the server population obey more rules than Turbine ever made, they will report you if you so much as blink wrong!" Luckily I wasn't personally that bothered back then as was just looking for a new server and when I was reported by someone and forcibly renamed I just deleted the toon and moved to Gilrain. The lore breaking name that "ruined the atmosphere of the whole server" was "Sidhartha", which means my current Sidhartha obviously will not be welcomed on Laurelin either.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Upon these hither shores
    Posts
    277
    are you deliberatly being hostile or you just live in your own victim world? read the responses up yours. You'll see that people are clearly stating that transfers are welcomed. The report nazis are not rpers as they could care less and only want to rp as they always have. The report ready ppl are a small minority and they themselves can be considered elite snobs for trash talking of others. And I have seen only one case of outburst in the chat because names since transfer started. if you are so concerned and think Laurelin is a toxic server to be, you can transfer away. You'll be surprised however to see how many borderline names are around and not getting a report. You don't have to have a norse, quenya, sindarin old english name to be on Laurelin. But if someone in chat sees the Roflcopter of Wonderboy then yes, likely it will get a rename. Chill out, and don't be so paranoid about a name. It is not healthy for you, nor it is nice for laurelin natives to be called RP mafia guys or jerks. If none of this works..... Evernight.

 

 
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