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  1. #1

    Why remove level 100 worn symbols of the elder king from OD T1 now?

    As someone who does not have a lot of time to spend gaming, I was a little tweaked to read that 100 first age symbols will be removed from the T1 OD loot table in 14.2. I'm not arguing that they should have been there in the first place, but the fact of the matter is that they're there and have been there for weeks. People have been grinding wound and fear wings into dust, and some have been able to outfit their toons with shiny 100 FA weaps and class items by simply re-running the same content over and over again.

    What's the logic in taking the symbols out now? Why should I now not have the same chance at a FA if I choose to run OD the same number of times as someone who rushed to 100 and had played more than me the past few weeks? If the loot table was correct when U14 went live, please leave it alone. If including FA symbols in the table was a mistake, it should have been hotfixed weeks ago and changing it now doesn't put the toothpaste back in the tube. It feels unfair.

    Oh, and please stop with the random DA daily quests. Let me choose which quests to take so that I can complete the stupid deeds.

  2. #2
    Because it was never meant to Drop on T1 in the First Place. And by this Time, just ask a Online Friend (who goes there) to bring you one FA.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by CM-Amenophis View Post
    Because it was never meant to Drop on T1 in the First Place. And by this Time, just ask a Online Friend (who goes there) to bring you one FA.
    Sure... it was a bug Turbine just does every times the same thing.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gardhik View Post
    Sure... it was a bug Turbine just does every times the same thing.
    Yeah, tell me about it! They do this every time they release an update! Officially, it's a "bug" but it happens so consistently one has to be suspicious...
    Co-Leader of The Osgiliath Guard, Arkenstone (ex Elendilmir)
    Osdor, Osdur, Osdrina, etc...

  5. #5
    I guarantee that OD will be another dead raid right away since there will be no reason to do this anymore. OD is great for grouping, my kinship recently started adding this to weekly calendars, and it got us all together again after a long time of just doing solo stuff. This is a sore spot for me since our number of active players has disappeared quite drastically. Also I monitor the world chat sparingly and most of the grouping invites pertain to an OD run.

    Turbine are you hearing us. Don't remove the most popular raid area currently run since we get FA symbols on an occasional run. You screwed up the West Gondor update since we did not have enough quests for level 100. You screwed up the dailies since we get the wrong coins for rep faction and we could not get enough DA rep for all of the factions without an obscene amount of repeated runs. Essence gear does not drop hardly at all and it is difficult to barter for this from a vendor since you need so many gold and silver DA coins. So essence gear I cannot properly report on since I cannot get the gear. I have plenty of essence but cannot get gear! Don't get me started on universal solvents because I have been logging in for hours a day since update 14 went live and I have yet to receive one.

    So to me the only thing going right is the OD RUNS!!!!!!!!!!
    .
    Windfola - THE WATCH
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  6. #6
    On this occasion, I agree with the people who want to retain it. If it wasn't dropping 100 symbols to begin with, I would not want them to drop in a T1 raid on principle. However, the cat has been out of the bag so long that the only people who benefit from this drop being removed are the ones who have farmed it now to sell for inflated prices on the AH later.

    Better not to have made this mistake in the first place - but we seem to have said that a few times recently.

    100s: Aedfrith (HN), Aldnoth (CP), Hrolfdan (MN), Aldfryd (WD), Morriarty (CH), Aednoth (LM), Mishhar (BR), Hraldan (GR), Rumbold (BG): The little ones - Rumbelina (MN), Brai (RK)
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by darthhager View Post
    I guarantee that OD will be another dead raid right away since there will be no reason to do this anymore.
    They must change the loot tables, instead of removing completely FA from T1 several weeks too late.
    If there is another good T1 loot table (with very low chances to get some items from T2 loot table and FA symbols), casual players will run T1 and with another better and different T2 loot table, more experienced players will run T2 (with, for example, gold essence socketed armours as some people suggested and at least 1 or more guaranteed FA symbols per run)
    Last edited by Castorix; Sep 03 2014 at 08:32 AM.

  8. #8
    Considering that these FAs are supposed to level with you later on, I think that change is good. But the FAs should be put in the skirm camp for a seals cost, so there is still reason to run T1 raids, if T2(C) is out of reach for some reason.
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
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    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

  9. #9
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    The game has lacked consistency with regards to reward for a few years now. That's a lot of the reason why I can't be bothered to spend a dime on the game anymore, despite having plenty of money and having been a non-lifetime monthly subscriber since Beta.

    They just throw rewards in, then take them away, then move them around, and before you know it, they're useless anyway. The only lesson they teach by fixing these "bugs" months after the fact is that if you see something that is too good to be true, exploit it for all it's worth because it will disappear.

    Integrity is what is missing from the game these days. It's an even bigger issue for me than the lack of group content.
    [color=red]Work like no one is watching, dance like you don't need the money...[/color]

  10. #10
    Honestly, everyone should be used to this by now - 75's with BFE, 85's with Durchest, 95's with Way of Smiths, now 100's with OD.

    Think of it like this, the majority of the playerbase will hit level cap of any new update within the first week. Once content is consumed, those players will test scaled content - raids/skirms/instances - to determine where the ideal place to find the desired reward. When they find it - bugged or not - that content will be farmed until either it is fixed or it is closed.

    In the case of first age symbols, it is my opinion, Turbine is including them in T1 content on purpose - to drum up store purchases for crystals of remembrance, legacy tier scrolls, relic removal scrolls, and other LI devices. Makes perfect sense, flood the servers with the most desirable item and make the drops for devices to upgrade them at a low rate. Giving the player two options - use the store to get the upgrading done fast/instantly, or to force the player to grind over time to get the finished product. Then once the initial wave to spend in the store recedes, fix the farming area and force the players to obtain the object the way it was originally intended.

    But......Like before, T3 skirms supposedly will drop the symbol (at an even lower rate than previous).

    In addition, HD battles will also drop them. This is actually an improvement for those that cannot do T2/T2C raids or T3 skirms. You can do any type of battle to accrue the platinum reward (solo, duo. 3, 6, 12 man). Also, the drop rate for HD battles is higher than T3 skirms.

    So yes the nerfing of OD will stink for those that didn't get their symbols using that route. At least there is a viable alternative to obtain them like before, and a bonus one with the addition of getting them in HD battles.

    I farmed OD for a week and never won one, then decided to upgrade my jewelry running HD battles. After about 12 nights running 3-4 battles a night, I obtained all my jewelry (even got a gold item), got 2 symbols, and acquired enough medallions for quite a few scrolls of empowerment. In all, my 12 days of doing battles was way more effective use of my time than farming OD for 5 days and coming away with nothing.

    My advice is not to focus on one route to obtain what you want and obsess/rant about it when it gets changed/fixed. Look for alternatives, as they may have benefits the other doesn't.

    OP- about DA training exercise - agree 100%, quest RNG stinks!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by BruceCampbell View Post
    As someone who does not have a lot of time to spend gaming, I was a little tweaked to read that 100 first age symbols will be removed from the T1 OD loot table in 14.2. I'm not arguing that they should have been there in the first place, but the fact of the matter is that they're there and have been there for weeks. People have been grinding wound and fear wings into dust, and some have been able to outfit their toons with shiny 100 FA weaps and class items by simply re-running the same content over and over again.

    What's the logic in taking the symbols out now? Why should I now not have the same chance at a FA if I choose to run OD the same number of times as someone who rushed to 100 and had played more than me the past few weeks? If the loot table was correct when U14 went live, please leave it alone. If including FA symbols in the table was a mistake, it should have been hotfixed weeks ago and changing it now doesn't put the toothpaste back in the tube. It feels unfair.

    Oh, and please stop with the random DA daily quests. Let me choose which quests to take so that I can complete the stupid deeds.
    Why? Because after the horses have escaped you have to put a special padlock on the barn door!

    Honestly, given that many raiders have apparently abandoned the game (including my former kin), why restrict FAs to T2/T2C content? Particularly given that you can get them through very easy Big Battles and through skraids. I have 3 FAs for the one character I play, so I have no real ax to grind here, but I don't see the point of removing them. Maybe decrease the drop rate a bit on T1, and make them guaranteed (perhaps in multiples) in T2C/T2, but really.

    This is particularly a big problem with imbuing coming, if it comes roughly as advertised/understood. Hard to imagine investing too deeply in any non-FA LI when you are going to keep it forever?!?

  12. #12
    I would be on board with lowering the drop rate on T1, except I'm sick and tired of running the same instances over and over and over for years just to get an upgraded version of the gear I had just finished maxing out. For a lot of us, PvE is just another thing we have to do before we can PvP. If they were to add in at least one new instance per year, it would make sense to tamper with the loot table to make it challenging, but when we're doing the same runs that we've done since 65-75cap on a loop and they think forcing us to run it on T2(oh my, what a challenge. Surely it's more dynamic and less boring now!) is a bandaid fix, I wonder how many books it will take before everyone just stops doing end game all together because of the lack of love it gets.
    Last edited by Pkid; Sep 03 2014 at 01:13 PM.

  13. #13
    Why take them only from OD T1 away? I think BfE T1 also drops FA symbols?
    I find it great. As a member of a small kinship, I will get the chance to try T2C again.

  14. #14
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    I'm sick of OD raids myself... and sick of making call outs for other 12mans and get 1-2 tells cause people would rather spam the "easy way" to get 1st age symbol. And avoided normal grouping and random chances...

    -_-

    Really, 1st age symbols should drop from t2 or above...and some staff should double x 99999999999999999999999 check there not gonna be super mega easy to get....
    Ok.. maybe not super easy, cause I have yet to get one or a 2nd age. I'm Mute, so running OD via text chat is a pain.. And most OD runs on my server are Kin or Friends and set events.

    I had much preferred 12man skirms myself, and make easy ones not drop it, or make it rare.
    Make it drop from 12man rift rescue, icy creavse, Storms, or others skirms that are unlocked via books or bought. Give people a reason to finish content to get to the symbols.
    Capcom Stalker...
    English is not my 1st Language... So shhhh!

  15. #15
    I understand OP's frustration. But I like the change. Maybe I'll have some fun in some raid now. Since U14, I joined one OD poison/disease wing farm, I stayed with them for 2 runs, and I never joined any other raid since. It's just boring. I'll rather be without FAs than spend another hour doing such raids.

    And there was rarely anything else going on, glff was just "OD d/p farm lf tanks/healers/cappies/hunters" all the time.

  16. #16
    This is a terrible change to make now. On my lowish population server this is all anybody will run and even OD runs are getting fewer and fewer. The population there is too low, especially the portion interested in raiding, to get anyone to do anything on T2. Symbol drops should have been only T2 to start if that was the intended way to get them and maybe then people would have at least tried T2, but it was left this way for weeks and the damage is done. All this will accomplish is completely kill off what little grouping is happening on my server.

    Considering that we have been told over and over that there is not enough interest to make new raids/instances, I would think FAs would be made easier to get so those of us that have lost all of our raiding friends already can at least easily get FAs for our many alts when the time comes for them to "level with us" as I see no point in that unless one has a FA weapon/item to begin with. Everybody I know hates BBs and if that is now officially my only option, I'll pass entirely.

  17. #17
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    I agree, why do it now? As I see it the only ppl this decision will affect are those that haven't gotten to level 100 yet. And I could see them now especially during the 100% xp weekend. C'mon level 100, I hope I get there before they take away the first age drops in OD T1. Please let them postpone the update!

    C'mon Turbine, you made a mistake (or did you?). Just let it be!
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  18. #18
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    Same procedure as every update since RoR. One reason why I stopped playing this game.
    Used to play: 85 Champ / Captain / Runekeeper / Guardian, Guild Master of everything but cooking.
    Playing now: Hellcat / King Tiger / GW Panther / IS / KV-5 / M4 Sherman and more

  19. #19
    I don't know what is sadder, the fact that Turbine is no longer doing new raids, or the fact that most of the player-base will do content depending solely on the reward, when the real reward should be the fun of doing the content.

    I am not saying the game rewards should not be a factor, but I honestly think there is something wrong with people when no one will touch a fun raid for a year, then suddenly everyone is grouping to do that raid because it drops a symbol, and then as soon as it doesn't drop the symbol everyone forgets the raid.

    Where did grouping with people to do something challenging for the fun of it and hopefully having a laugh and sharing some jokes go?

    I think Turbine should temporarily drop first age symbols for groups of 12 people using the slap emote on Tom Bombadil 500 times. I wonder how many raids will form to farm 'TB' endlessly.
    [IMG]http://i59.tinypic.com/qqnx2o.jpg[/IMG]

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex53 View Post
    I don't know what is sadder, the fact that Turbine is no longer doing new raids, or the fact that most of the player-base will do content depending solely on the reward, when the real reward should be the fun of doing the content.
    [...]
    Where did grouping with people to do something challenging for the fun of it and hopefully having a laugh and sharing some jokes go?
    I couldn't agree more (coming from an ultra slow non-level capped player).

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex53 View Post
    I don't know what is sadder, the fact that Turbine is no longer doing new raids, or the fact that most of the player-base will do content depending solely on the reward, when the real reward should be the fun of doing the content.
    It has ever been this though. Do you think people thought Grand Stairs was the "most fun"? Halls of Crafting? Both were fine runs, don't get me wrong, but they were done endlessly because they were the fastest way to the cheese, not because they were inherently better than Forges or FG (hard to beat head cook for fun value). OD T1 complete clear is fast and at least somewhat entertaining. It is rather more accessible than T2, particularly since many raiders seem to have departed (at least among my circle). I like the fact that people are motivated to not do their DA grind solo but rather to group up for SOMETHING. And this is IMHO better than some of the previous incarnations of the FA grind, which was gauntlet/Durchest, or Trolls.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by DelgonTheWise View Post
    It has ever been this though. Do you think people thought Grand Stairs was the "most fun"? Halls of Crafting? Both were fine runs, don't get me wrong, but they were done endlessly because they were the fastest way to the cheese, not because they were inherently better than Forges or FG (hard to beat head cook for fun value). OD T1 complete clear is fast and at least somewhat entertaining. It is rather more accessible than T2, particularly since many raiders seem to have departed (at least among my circle). I like the fact that people are motivated to not do their DA grind solo but rather to group up for SOMETHING. And this is IMHO better than some of the previous incarnations of the FA grind, which was gauntlet/Durchest, or Trolls.
    I distinctly remember people doing all the Moria 6-man runs when Moria was released. Then again, you had to because originally (before Moria medallions) the token for each piece of armour dropped in a different instance. But then people moaned about not being able to get their armour doing the instances they preferred.

    But yeah, I am not saying people have not been reward driven in the past, just that they are.
    [IMG]http://i59.tinypic.com/qqnx2o.jpg[/IMG]

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by CRUSHUC View Post
    Think of it like this, the majority of the playerbase will hit level cap of any new update within the first week.
    I don't think majority means what you think it means I think you meant minority, disproportionately vocal maybe, but definitely in the minority.
    [SIZE=3][COLOR="#006400"]Wal's Army on Eldar - Walred (Champ), Walbert (Cappy), Walmur (RK), Walori (Guard), Walrandir (LM)[/COLOR][/SIZE]

  24. #24
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    This thread reminds me a talk I had with some other plays on the global channel of our server. I was disappointed to see that U14 still had the OD T1 exploit (it was present during the 95 era), a player told me that his kinship was running raids for pleasure but that a good loot would make player more incentive to run T2 content.

    I can't agree more with her, and what saddens me is that they are plenty of threads/bug reports that describes the current problems of that loot table, but no action was taken or even announced until recently.

    And I still find stupid that since U14 made T2 more competitive, most players will not run because of tha lack of incentive ; they will go to the easy way.
    My suggestion to loot table I think incentive to run harder content and with larger groups (iLevels are for exemple only).

    3 players 6 players 12 players
    T1 iLevel 192 purple iLevel 194 purple iLevel 196 purple
    T2 iLevel 194 teal (50% chance) iLevel 196 teal (50% chance) iLevel 198 teal (50% chance)
    T2C iLevel 194 teal 100% + 10% gold iLevel 196 teal 100% + 10% gold iLevel 198 teal 100% + 10% gold

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by xandervix_tog View Post
    Yeah, tell me about it! They do this every time they release an update! Officially, it's a "bug" but it happens so consistently one has to be suspicious...
    Yes, everytime.....it's no bug or error..

 

 
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