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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nouri View Post
    I'm thinking it would actually be pretty easy to ID boxers using third-party software. Just submit a combat log with a time stamp showing how you keep getting hit with six of the same skills at the same time. I'll post one next time I run across our spider boxer.
    I wouldn't post it (because of the whole "calling out names" thing) but does that actually mean anything to the GMs? I thought they had to personally witness something in order to take action. Or see it in official logs. Are combat logs actually recorded for them to review at a later date?
    R5 100 GRD Marevayave - Leader of Riddermarked For Death
    R8 100 MNS Fayah/100 LM Siennah/100 HNT Dinenol/102 RK Dhurik
    100 CHN Alachas/85 CPT Dinfaerien/60 BUR Dhax/35 WDN Godoric
    R9 105 MNS Fayeh (alt Wilya) - Lonely Mountain Band @ Landroval

  2. #102
    This thread is hilarious...

    I remember a very specific discussion where boxers are proven to be at a disadvantage in every situation pound for pound... If some one was 3 boxing, 3 people would be at an advantage over them... Being on both ends I could agree with that... I personally have found that I enjoy engaging with boxers simply because proper strategy leaves them at my mercy... Aside from 3rd party detection (which might cost too much to create), which boxing can be done without, I don't see how it can be proven...

    unless that is to say that the rules were to be changed so that everyone is at risk... fact of the matter is you might as well be against grouping, and/or using shout macros and target forwarding... unfortunately the moors isnt a 1v1 environment although it would be very nice to see some kind of organized arena implemented...

    What i find odd is that when the community guidelines were rewritten one of the things added was about petition threads...

    11. Polls and Petitions.
    While we consider this spam, we felt we should explain why. First, several pages of /signed and /unsigned doesn’t really offer us much in the way of actionable feedback. Second, they usually turn into something unpleasant. Instead we recommend a well-considered suggestion posted in the appropriate area that would allow for meaningful contributions and opinions to be shared by all members of the community.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    What i find odd is that when the community guidelines were rewritten one of the things added was about petition threads...

    11. Polls and Petitions.
    While we consider this spam, we felt we should explain why. First, several pages of /signed and /unsigned doesn’t really offer us much in the way of actionable feedback. Second, they usually turn into something unpleasant. Instead we recommend a well-considered suggestion posted in the appropriate area that would allow for meaningful contributions and opinions to be shared by all members of the community.
    Yeah, I typically get hesitant to even look when I see the word "petition" on these forums. That said, in fairness, there is a lot of valid discussion. As the rule itself says, pages of "/signed and /unsigned" isn't helpful. And even if some people have been posting that, most have actually given meaningful contributions to the discussion. And anything can turn unpleasant, regardless of whether the initial suggestion was a "petition" or not. Lastly, I often see people using "/signed and /unsigned" in threads that weren't petitions to begin with.

    I think the Turbine mods probably approach situations like this on a case by case basis. Polls and petitions are used all the time in real life, so I think they might be inclined to show leniency and only take action if another rule (like harassment) takes place. I honestly don't see why they made that rule in the first place... *shrug*
    R5 100 GRD Marevayave - Leader of Riddermarked For Death
    R8 100 MNS Fayah/100 LM Siennah/100 HNT Dinenol/102 RK Dhurik
    100 CHN Alachas/85 CPT Dinfaerien/60 BUR Dhax/35 WDN Godoric
    R9 105 MNS Fayeh (alt Wilya) - Lonely Mountain Band @ Landroval

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSM_River View Post
    Greetings, all!

    Bottom line, multi-boxing is allowed. What we don’t like are bots; we don’t like players who set up third party programs to run a character through cycles of fighting in an effort to level, or gain loot. But multi-boxing is a player who will control all characters.

    Someone also mentioned Fight-clubbing. If people want to 1v1 we will allow it, as long as they aren’t just feeding rep to each other.

    -River
    you get rep from fight clubbing? what faction is this?
    Captain-General Corrakkas, Hero of Legend

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by corrakkas View Post
    you get rep from fight clubbing? what faction is this?
    Children of the underdeveloped mind.
    ----A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything----

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    Instead we recommend a well-considered suggestion posted in the appropriate area that would allow for meaningful contributions and opinions to be shared by all members of the community.
    While petition threads may not be useful, this idea of "well considered suggestion posted in the appropriate area that would allow for meaningful contributions and opinions" was hardly desired by the previous forum moderation regime. Numerous threads were started about boxing in the Moors, contained well thought out opinions and were closed, deleted, poster infracted and that was it so it's not as if there's great precedent for those types of threads.

    Maybe if all of those had been read and considered instead of closed or deleted with infractions and bans handed out, we'd be past the point of "Please sign this to show that you think boxing is idiotic in the Moors", eh?

    Anyways, it matters not. This thread is here, petition and all. The points are being expressed now whether or not there are people simply /signing to show their support for removing boxing in the Moors.
    [CENTER]Turbine - Tracing Yeti Folk[/CENTER]

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    This thread is hilarious...
    I agree. Now that a rank farming multi boxer has joined the thread to find it hilarious, I find it hilarious too. Gosh, Shard, they already took away your farming, whatever will you do if they took away multi boxing too? You might actually have to (gasp) play legitimately!
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sefunsixtoo View Post
    For better or worse the only vote that will really count is your wallet.
    The best statement of all in the whole thread, in my opinion!

    So, you think that if they disable ./follow and they burn all the boxers existed on every server, your PvMP problems are magically solved?

    Even more, your days in Ettenmoors will be shiner and brighter?

    If you would say that, then I would ./vote for that as well!

    But, we have more serious PvP probs to talk about, if I may say so!

    e.g. I can't really understand why 3-4 casual freeps can't get down a single r6-7 and higher Defiler! The same, I can't really understand why a small creep group gotta try hard to

    kill a single champion who is stacked phys mits ( after essence system - update 14 ) and so on.

    As for those players who have chosen to "cheat" in just a game, I'd say that it's their natural to behave like that, there is nothing you can really do, in order to stop them from

    making you mad and ruining your game! Once boxing is banned, they will find out another way to troll you, because that's how they react in general and have fun!

    Macroers and boxers can easily find more and more cheats for any game, especially for an "alive" game, like MMOs!

    The bet is for us to ruin their game, to hunt them down and not to play with them or help them ruin other players' playtime!

    Do not expect much from any LOTRO programmer as far as this concerned any kind of cheating, they can't really help you with that!

    Cheaters will always cheat!

    Let's act collectively as a community rather than try to look for "the egg of Colombus"!

    With respect
    HAPPY NEW YEAR
    2 0 1 7

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Grego28 View Post
    So, you think that if they disable ./follow and they burn all the boxers existed on every server, your PvMP problems are magically solved?
    No. Just the multiboxer one.
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  10. #110
    It depends on what you consider legitimate play. I never broke any rules and I obey them to the fullest that I am obligated to. So if you think what I have ever done is wrong, take it to the GM's and see what they have to say.

    Yes farming is now illegal, but for 6 years it wasn't. You can thank a lot of the efforts brought by the 2013 Council that the decision was made in your favor, but remember that it was never a majority's favor, as most players were as unconcerned about it as it didn't conflict with their ability and right to play. I unfortunately, wished that turbine approached it differently, but making a clause to ensure that GM's could do as they see fit was easier then ensuring a players safety. On another note it is also unfortunate that power leveling is still taken as a positive while rank farming was nothing different.

    I could go on for days with examples of how legitimate play can be considered multi boxing but unless a rule is made against it, I will not even begin. Most of these PvMP "rules" that players seem to be so concerned about enforcing only exist to act against creeps. Disabling /follow will not work in resolving multi-boxing as the people whom are in the videos shown are using a software to clone their keyboard commands across multiple windows/computers, and can be done all without /follow. All that it would accomplish is disable players from using it genuinely while there is still an option that allows attacking a target to enable you to follow it. So, many things would need to be done not just disabling /follow.

    But then again I remember quite contradictory behavior done by other players whom like to point the finger at others. It would be best to keep it to yourself and allow Mods/GMs to do their job and take appropriate course than act out vigilantly and risk yourself pointlessly. Also if you wish to further converse about my activities I urge you to come visit me at Vilyaunderground and i will give it to you in detail.
    Last edited by Zanishi; Aug 20 2014 at 08:56 PM.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    It depends on what you consider legitimate play. I never broke any rules and I obey them to the fullest that I am obligated to. So if you think what I have ever done is wrong, take it to the GM's and see what they have to say.
    I never said illegal. Just not legit. I guess you could conflate legitimate with legal, but it'd be a misnomer. I talking about taking the easy road, where everyone else just wanted to play it straight.

    I could go on for days with examples of how legitimate play can be considered multi boxing but unless a rule is made against it, I will not even begin.
    Good! Oh wait,

    Most of these PvMP "rules" that players seem to be so concerned about enforcing only exist to act against creeps.
    Nonsense. You farmed your creep and freep toons both, iirc. You started farming your freep and then switched to creep because you saw that farming there increased more than just rank, it also added skills.


    Disabling /follow will not work in resolving multi-boxing as the people whom are in the videos shown are using a software to clone their keyboard commands across multiple windows/computers, and can be done all without /follow. All that it would accomplish is disable players from using it genuinely while there is still an option that allows attacking a target to enable you to follow it. So, many things would need to be done not just disabling /follow.
    Hmm, so if that software can make those characters move effectively without /follow, then why are they /followed?

    But then again I remember quite contradictory behavior done by other players whom like to point the finger at others. It would be best to keep it to yourself and allow Mods/GMs to do their job and take appropriate course than act out vigilantly and risk yourself pointlessly. Also if you wish to further converse about my activities I urge you to come visit me at Vilyaunderground and i will give it to you in detail.
    Odd. Did you not say that you do not wish to converse on the subject until such time as it's been made illegal? Or perhaps you just entered this thread to troll? You know, like for the same reasons you started farming and multi boxing?
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    It depends on what you consider legitimate play. I never broke any rules and I obey them to the fullest that I am obligated to. So if you think what I have ever done is wrong, take it to the GM's and see what they have to say.

    Yes farming is now illegal, but for 6 years it wasn't. You can thank a lot of the efforts brought by the 2013 Council that the decision was made in your favor, but remember that it was never a majority's favor, as most players were as unconcerned about it as it didn't conflict with their ability and right to play. I unfortunately, wished that turbine approached it differently, but making a clause to ensure that GM's could do as they see fit was easier then ensuring a players safety. On another note it is also unfortunate that power leveling is still taken as a positive while rank farming was nothing different.

    I could go on for days with examples of how legitimate play can be considered multi boxing but unless a rule is made against it, I will not even begin. Most of these PvMP "rules" that players seem to be so concerned about enforcing only exist to act against creeps. Disabling /follow will not work in resolving multi-boxing as the people whom are in the videos shown are using a software to clone their keyboard commands across multiple windows/computers, and can be done all without /follow. All that it would accomplish is disable players from using it genuinely while there is still an option that allows attacking a target to enable you to follow it. So, many things would need to be done not just disabling /follow.

    But then again I remember quite contradictory behavior done by other players whom like to point the finger at others. It would be best to keep it to yourself and allow Mods/GMs to do their job and take appropriate course than act out vigilantly and risk yourself pointlessly. Also if you wish to further converse about my activities I urge you to come visit me at Vilyaunderground and i will give it to you in detail.
    Disabling the ability to run multiple clients on one PC would be a huge step in the right direction!

    Casinoari - Rank 15 RK
    Malakorou - Rank 10 Defiler
    Casinari - Original Challenger of Saruman Minstrel

  13. #113
    That is true. However it would not resolve it completely, and would only create more issues as players saw action against it but it would still prevail. But again you are right it would be the best action to take if it were to be approached.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Nouri View Post
    Disabling the ability to run multiple clients on one PC would be a huge step in the right direction!
    No it wouldn't, because that would impact pve multi boxers who don't do anything to anyone. Going down that road will just stall the true issue.
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowlock View Post
    No it wouldn't, because that would impact pve multi boxers who don't do anything to anyone. Going down that road will just stall the true issue.
    who said you should be able to pve multi box? i say get rid of them both.
    A tree is a tree, a Rock is a rock and a Troll is Elmo

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by LEGENDofALL View Post
    who said you should be able to pve multi box? i say get rid of them both.
    If you want to mix both of these issues together, you're not going to accomplish either; there will be too much opposition to outlawing multi boxing in pve. Keep your focus narrow, pvp only, and you have a chance.
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowlock View Post
    If you want to mix both of these issues together, you're not going to accomplish either; there will be too much opposition to outlawing multi boxing in pve. Keep your focus narrow, pvp only, and you have a chance.
    why???????? boxing in either gives you an advantage of any solo player and in pve you can do 3 mans and get all the loot and sell it quicker then a single person can etc...now i will say pvp is a bigger issue but if theres only one way to stop boxing in this came and it would disable it in pve too, well im all for it.

    Period end of story.
    A tree is a tree, a Rock is a rock and a Troll is Elmo

  18. #118
    Like I said earlier it would be a good step but would not solve it completely as it could still be done. Like before when multiple instances were disabled people used to have multiple installs and/or multiple PC's its all irrelevant to make a change in good efforts if it doesn't work.

    And if rules were to be made what would define a multi boxer between a couple people playing together in the same house? How could a multi boxer just say "oh my kid brother is on /follow as I help him learn to play" and get away with it while people legitimately do that exact thing? What if someone used proxies to change their IP's?

    There is of course always the method available that turbine used for farming. Make a vague rule that applies to everyone and let GM's sort it out on a case by case basis. But then there is a risk of trolling/griefing and therefore innocent players can be subject to it.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    This thread is hilarious...

    I remember a very specific discussion where boxers are proven to be at a disadvantage in every situation pound for pound... If some one was 3 boxing, 3 people would be at an advantage over them... Being on both ends I could agree with that... I personally have found that I enjoy engaging with boxers simply because proper strategy leaves them at my mercy... Aside from 3rd party detection (which might cost too much to create), which boxing can be done without, I don't see how it can be proven...

    unless that is to say that the rules were to be changed so that everyone is at risk... fact of the matter is you might as well be against grouping, and/or using shout macros and target forwarding... unfortunately the moors isnt a 1v1 environment although it would be very nice to see some kind of organized arena implemented...

    What i find odd is that when the community guidelines were rewritten one of the things added was about petition threads...

    11. Polls and Petitions.
    While we consider this spam, we felt we should explain why. First, several pages of /signed and /unsigned doesn’t really offer us much in the way of actionable feedback. Second, they usually turn into something unpleasant. Instead we recommend a well-considered suggestion posted in the appropriate area that would allow for meaningful contributions and opinions to be shared by all members of the community.
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowlock View Post
    I agree. Now that a rank farming multi boxer has joined the thread to find it hilarious, I find it hilarious too. Gosh, Shard, they already took away your farming, whatever will you do if they took away multi boxing too? You might actually have to (gasp) play legitimately!

    Shard are you being called out by name? By a council member,to Troll and Grief?

  20. #120
    I am just as surprised as you are. I guess the new guy is taking a new guy vacation.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  21. #121
    Oh no. A multiboxer has been called a multiboxer.

    I don't understand. I thought all rank farmers and multiboxers were proud of the way they played?
    [CENTER]Turbine - Tracing Yeti Folk[/CENTER]

  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by goober2 View Post
    here is their real problem, the freeps didn't mind my spider box when they were killing me over and over at grams. but now that the brandywhine freep leaders have all bailed on them to 1v1 the boxer is suddenly a problem, furthermore half the people who have replied to this thread are only butt hurt they died in the moors or because their freep leader has left them. the freeps have no problem killing my spiders with a solid group of 3. I pay for my accounts ill play them how I choose to play them regardless of what you conciter sportsmanlike. this isn't about boxing in the moors this is a pissing contest among people who have left/booted from kins/tribes bullying of other players because you don't agree with their game play and a forum QQ because you died in a pvp zone..turbine along with EVERY other mmorpg has said it isn't agains the tos to box. and to say its ok to box pve but not pvp is stupid. It isn't ok to pick and choose what you think is ok and what you think isn't when they both use the same programs and commands. anyone interested in learning to box pst to me and ill do my best to assist you.
    It's not just freeps that dislike have a problem with you boxing.I'd be hypocritical for me to support ANY creep boxer with as focal as i was against the multitude of freep boxers (even if i was able to kill 2-3/6 solo).It actually disgusts me to see how many pathetic creeps not only support you but would get 0 points if it wasn't for leaching off you.The fact that you not only need 6 spiders but have to ask for help to do things that any competent spider can do solo just shows just how poor you are without your bots.If it was just for trolling freeps i could understand but to multibox spiders now when spiders are so op that the majority of freeps can be beat with just 2-3 skills just seems to me to give the rest of us spiders a bad name and makes some of us not want to play a spider at all anymore cause of everyone thinking we are fotm ezmoders even if we have been playing a spider for so long we remember having tainted bite lol

    Quote Originally Posted by Nouri View Post
    Disabling the ability to run multiple clients on one PC would be a huge step in the right direction!
    Not really even back before the allowed the ability to launch mutple clients at once there was an easy way to still use 2 clients on the same computer

  23. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    I am just as surprised as you are. I guess the new guy is taking a new guy vacation.
    Feeling your situation is a little precarious now eh? Having to switch to forum pvp? Hmm, still though, I find it ironic that you find it offensive me calling you a multi boxer when you are in a thread defending multi boxing.
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

  24. #124
    that has nothing to do with it....

    there are a large number of violations in this thread and as i dont want to be getting into any trouble i have chosen to keep myself at a distance.... hence why i keep dodging a number of things being discussed HOWEVER anyone is more then welcome to come to vilyaunderground and ill give then my full unsolicited and uncensored opinion about anything they want...

    FUNNY ENOUGH THOUGH even this post I am currently making is a violation because I am defending myself... As much as a few people here wanted this to be about me and my biased view, it isn't... I was giving information followed with some of my opinion its not my fault that people have chosen to keep their heads in the sand...
    Last edited by Zanishi; Aug 23 2014 at 02:18 AM.
    "There are things that go bump in the night. We're the ones who bump back." -BPRD

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanishi View Post
    that has nothing to do with it....

    there are a large number of violations in this thread and as i dont want to be getting into any trouble i have chosen to keep myself at a distance.... hence why i keep dodging a number of things being discussed HOWEVER anyone is more then welcome to come to vilyaunderground and ill give then my full unsolicited and uncensored opinion about anything they want...

    FUNNY ENOUGH THOUGH even this post I am currently making is a violation because I am defending myself... As much as a few people here wanted this to be about me and my biased view, it isn't... I was giving information followed with some of my opinion its not my fault that people have chosen to keep their heads in the sand...

    Interesting viewpoint. From here it appears to me that you entered this thread in a trolling manner "I find this thread hilarious" objected when your own actions are called out as false when you offered those same actions up as some form of proof of your knowledge of the situation, and have since been feigning outrage as you continue to troll and derail since you can't seem to muster a reasonable argument. I can see how badly you want to make this personal since you want to take the discussion to some fringe site, but if you actually wanted to be on topic you wouldn't need to.
    Phrasing! Doesn't anybody do phrasing anymore?

 

 
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