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  1. #426

    So, a brief summary of this thread for Produktion Malphunktion and Turbine:

    1) A very broad, significant swath of your player base wants group content, namely in the form of Instances/Raids, with some love given to PvMP. Also, skirmishes and open landscape group content (think Limlight Gorge, the eastern half of Angmar, etc.) have been mentioned to a lesser extent. The MM in MMO is there for a reason: people play these games to have content to tackle with other players. We know the numbers cited by members of the Turbine staff, in regards to the percentage of players that engage in these activities, but any educated person in math/statistics/science knows that without transparency of data and defining your terms (what constitutes a group/instance player? as already noted by several posters, among other questions), the numbers mean nothing and can be interpreted in various ways. Also of note, is that those players that enjoy group content are often kinship leaders/officers, and it's their contribution to the game that keeps many other players coming back. Their absence is being sorely felt by many servers as we speak...which brings us to-

    2) There's a reason Helm's Deep didn't do well compared to past expansions. There's a reason Big Battles weren't well received and are not widely seen as a viable replacement endgame. There's a reason the population has dipped frighteningly low and kinships are dissolving left and right. If this thread is to serve any purpose, it must be seen by the decision makers of the game. All this feedback will have no purpose whatsoever if it isn't acted upon. Again, as I mentioned in a previous post, acting on this very actionable feedback (and actionable feedback is what Turbine is always asking for) may be inconvenient in the short term, but for the long term viability of the game it's very necessary. Pleasing your customers is just very basic, common business sense.


    3) Like many others, I commend the Turbine development team for trying new, innovative mechanics (skirmishes, LI's, mounted combat, and yes, even Big Battles) but these should never be implemented to the exclusion of tried and true content (see number 1). This can in effect be tangential to number 2: There's a reason SoA, MoM, and SoM are looked back on with such fondness by many players. We got new mechanics PLUS additions to the tried and true group content.

    In closing: I, like many others, have become very invested in this thread (perhaps too much?). Mal, thank you for starting this thread and giving the player base a venue to share their opinions. But, again, all this feedback is only worth something if it's acted upon. All of us--even the disillusioned, disappointed custumers--enjoy, or used to enjoy, this game, and would like nothing more than for it to return to its former level of high quality. Anyways, I'm just repeating what many others, as well as myself have already stated. I'll be eagerly awaiting the Turbine team's response.



  2. #427
    I forgot to mention, I love skirmishes. It is nice to have something which you can do on your own or with others, which is fairly compact, most are quite short and where you can adjust the challenge level to your taste.

    Skirmishes was a good system because you still played your character, with your core abilities and the same play style, it was just enhanced by your solider where you could pick one which enhanced your overall game play. It was a great system... however, I think there is a danger in going too instanced based. While they are great fun I don't think they are good community enhancing features. When people can enter queues and don't need to travel or join kins or communicate with others it breaks down the depth of the community.

    I think instances was a significant contributing factor in WoW suffering a significant decline in subscribers as well. The queue system eroded a number of guilds on the server I played on, some never recovered and people moved on to other games. If people are happy in a kin, the community holds the players together for a lot longer, when you look at new mechanics or features you have to look at if they enhance the community or erode it.
    Last edited by Zvim666; Jun 27 2014 at 11:52 AM.

  3. #428
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Please sticky this thread.

    It contains a ton of honest, polite feedback including many who post very little (though I am not in that category ). If it is closed without being stickied, then in a few days it will just get buried off the first page of this subforum and forgotten about.

    Thank you for your time.
    Gremblus, Seuer, Grelob, and various others of Arkenstone

  4. #429
    I don't like floating nodes. I know many think this is petty. But it really annoys me to see a potato floating 3 meters above the ground. I think part of the reason it annoys me is that it just seems like something that would be so easy to fix. How can a floating potato exist in the shire for 5 plus years? Does not one care at turbine.

    Equally annoying and much more frustrating are nodes that are absolutely unreachable because they are buried inside a rock or to far up or down a slope that my toon can neither climb up to the node nor reach from above without falling off before getting close enough.

    It is possible that these fall into the lessor category you were asking as to not give feed back on. So I'll chime in on my thoughts on instances. BB's. I thought the battles were a great way to tell the epic story, and really enjoyed the existing in the same place at different times. I however am not a fan of repeating big battles. I have ended up doing so on my mains because I wanted the extra two skill points. I don't like the way that for the duration of the BB I have to always be busy always moving, always clicking. If you stop to sip your coffee you could fail the whole thing. Yet at the same time never really challenged. Just constant low level stress of constantly needing to click objects. Just not my cup of tea.

    I probably enjoy six mans the most or at least play them the most. The six man foundry and spider instance with ROI I always enjoyed. I enjoy the 12 man's I just don't get the chance to play them as much. Needing 12 people as well as more good players. It seems in the 6 mans one or two good players can carry the day even with the rest a little mediocre. So not just needing 12 people but 12 quality people to do t2c is a bar. Though I did run 12 mans not on t2 a few times. Most people don't want to do that. For some reason people feel it beneath them. Shrug.

    Even if I don't get to run them (12 mans) as much as I'd like to, I feel it is important to have current ones. The old ones 'scaled' just never play the same. I think it is important because it gives me a reason to 'gear up'. While I did not get the opportunity to go on 12 man t2c runs as much as I would like, it was always important to gear my toons up so that when I did get a chance to go I could hold my end up.

    Now with the current situation I just see no reason to gear up. Pre to gating 2 skill points behind doing BB's I never ran them. People would say - but you can get nice Gold drops, and I would shrug and say, 'So what'. I see no reason to get 'all dressed up' when there is no place to go.

    What is the point of 'gearing up' if there is not at least the possibility of needing to be all you can be. I know a lot of people like getting dressed up and geared up just to show off and lord it over others that they have 6 gold items or what not. But that has never been a motivating factor for me.

    So I hope we get get some new six man runs so I can enjoy running them again and again and maybe even a new 12 so I can feel there is a reason to 'gear up'.

  5. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by Dordain View Post
    I personally know of dozens of people that have quit this once-great game, and all say they quit over two things:
    1. A lack of traditional "end game" content(3, 6, and 12 player instances).
    2. The RNG causing players to give up out of frustration and anger.

    It's as though the people making all of the important decisions for this game don't actually play it themselves, or even really understand what the MMO genre entails. I am confused as to what Turbine thinks their business model is.

    Turbine stopped making the type of content that is the primary draw of a Massively Multiplayer game, and then dare to wonder why so many of their customer have abandoned them.

    If they're catering to the RP-only crowd, then why did they nix the housing update? It seems pretty obvious that they could have made a lot of money off of that if RPers actually are their core demographic. How could Swans(Lol wut?) be more lucrative than monetized housing?

    Anecdote Time: This week, Landroval saw a full PUG of 12 people get together in only 10 minutes in GLFF for a full clear of Dar Nargubud(That's the raid at the very bottom of Moria) at 2am CST(-6 GMT). Most were 95s. Does that sound like there's no interest in raiding to you?

    What should really concern Turbine is the fact that the word is out in the MMOverse at large: LotRO no longer provides group content, and that huge numbers of players have quit the game. They can maintain whatever "truth" they want here on their own forums, but sites like MMORPG.com regard this as a dead game by a has-been company. How could they possibly hope to draw in new players with such a toxic reputation?

    Please bring back the same high quality end game content that you previously made.
    Please show this thread to whomever is actually in charge at Turbine, and if necessary, your direct liaison at Time/Warner. The mandate of this thread should be undeniably clear: Your customers are begging you for a reason to once again give you their money.
    I love your post. I had the same thoughts exactly. Who is Turbine catering to? Not the raiders, because they say no new raids/dungeons. Not the groupers, because they have consistently moved away from group content. Not the PvPers, as Moors continues to be an issue. So, who is left? The RPers? Ok, well not them either, because they won't update the housing and haven't made any significant changes to the Cosmetic system.

    To what audience, then, is Turbine catering? The "anti-social", "I don't want to talk, roleplay, group, or pvp with anyone" player? Is that really the majority of the playerbase existing and potential?

  6. #431
    Sapience is offline Former Community Manager & Harbinger of Soon
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Thanks for all the great input over the past week. As is traditional with this style of post (think back to the old Tell the Community Team posts), we usually let them run about a week before closing them. I'm sure you've given Mal and the team a lot to think about, but we do ask you remember that, as Mal said, there are no promises that anything here will make it into the game, only that Mal was going to listen to help him better understand what the forum community is interested in.


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