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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrawn View Post
    There will be a loading screen either way, even when Gondor is connected to Rohan at Minas Tirith. The new Gondor areas will have to be on an entirely new map, just like Eriador and Rovanion are two different maps and require loading to pass between them. The bottom edge of the Rhovanion map is where the White Mountains are, you can especially see this if you use the Terrain Map plugin. So we will be loading into a new map any way we enter Gondor.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tirian-Hammerfist View Post
    Hang on, so you're saying that Rhovanion has already reached its limitations? How does the Terrain Map plugin establish this? I'm going to be really disappointed if this is the case.
    Actually, the border of TerrainMap is based on the existing map tiles and is in no way a restriction on adding territory to a map. Since there are western map coordinates as large as 118, it is reasonable to assume the southern coordinates could go at least as far even though the furthest south tile in TerrainMap is at about 77S. A more significant restriction is actually shown by MoorMap (MoorMap shows the coordinates of the mouse pointer on the Rhovanion overview map even though the built-in game map hides the coordinates on that map). The parchment map of Rhovanion has a southern edge around 86.85S which would indicate that anything existing further south would have to be on a different parchment map and might thus also get it's own Region (the term Region is used here in reference to the "r" value in the /loc coordinates where r1 is Eriador and r2 is Rhovanion).

    Another interesting point with Gondor is that it seems to be south of Dunland and Rhohan so it straddles both the Eriador and the Rhovanion coordinate systems. If the devs try to keep it all on the Rhovanion coordinate system it will have some really high west coordinate values. It will be interesting to see how they handle this.
    Last edited by Garan; Apr 29 2014 at 11:01 AM.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garan View Post
    Actually, the border of TerrainMap is based on the existing map tiles and is in no way a restriction on adding territory to a map. Since there are western map coordinates as large as 118, it is reasonable to assume the southern coordinates could go at least as far even though the furthest south tile in TerrainMap is at about 77S. A more significant restriction is actually shown by MoorMap (MoorMap shows the coordinates of the mouse pointer on the Rhovanion overview map even though the built-in game map hides the coordinates on that map). The parchment map of Rhovanion has a southern edge around 86.85S which would indicate that anything existing further south would have to be on a different parchment map and might thus also get it's own Region (the term Region is used here in reference to the "r" value in the /loc coordinates where r1 is Eriador and r2 is Rhovanion).

    Another interesting point with Gondor is that it seems to be south of Dunland and Rhohan so it straddles both the Eriador and the Rhovanion coordinate systems. If the devs try to keep it all on the Rhovanion coordinate system it will have some really high west coordinate values. It will be interesting to see how they handle this.
    Quick tangent - I really love maps and have always wanted to see more of them for the game. Is there somewhere that I can read up on / find the maps you're talking about? Many thanks!
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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warmutkan View Post
    Quick tangent - I really love maps and have always wanted to see more of them for the game. Is there somewhere that I can read up on / find the maps you're talking about? Many thanks!
    I’m curious to know what the creative’s are doing with regard to zone art. Southern Gondor and the west regions toward Anafalas and Belfalas (Westernesse siiiieeede yo) would seem to look akin to the southern regions of Spain and the Mediterranean regions of France. I will make somebody a happy Mod and use the new format to detail this, but there could be a logical reason to finally open up the docks at Celeondim for practical use as swift travel routes (by water) from the far north to the south. I would suggest using the Grey Havens but that could be a bit much to hope for.
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  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrawn View Post
    More great pics, of what we can hope to see.
    Hmmm, are those from White Dwarf? (Games Workshop) Corsairs of Umbar?
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by guguzza71 View Post
    Just yesterday I walked out of the side entrance of Beaconwatch down the east road to the river. The guards there let me cross the river but an invisible wall prevents me going further than the other side of the river. This seems like one of two ways we can head into Gondor.
    In some thread during the Beta It was "officially" commented that the Beacon is in Gondor. Meaning, at least that portion of Gondor adjacent to Beacon Watch exists today.
    Beaconwatch sits adjacent to the Mering Stream, the border with Gondor; the beacon being watched is at Halifirien (or Amon Anwar).
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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garan View Post
    Another interesting point with Gondor is that it seems to be south of Dunland and Rhohan so it straddles both the Eriador and the Rhovanion coordinate systems. If the devs try to keep it all on the Rhovanion coordinate system it will have some really high west coordinate values. It will be interesting to see how they handle this.
    Ignoring the fact that various areas are located "off the map" -- (Winterhome, and various instances, like the HD battles) it is perfectly reasonable to have a coordinate as large as 360 without stretching the standard geographic coordinate system.

    Note that 0.0N/S is located WITHIN the Forochel and Angmar maps, and Misty Mountains and Rivendell 0.0 E/W in the existing coordinate systems.

    The "edge" of Nan Curunir is 4.1 E, but the corresponding Edge of Entwood is 76.7W
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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  7. #57
    So guys, Turbine also annoucned Osgilith in the middle of 2015. Would that also mean we will see Ithillien too?

    I also looked on Lotro Wiki regarding the next few updates. http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Gondor Interesting enough, it says the Blackroot Vale will be in Update 14 along with Dol Armroth. And update 15 will have Pelargir and the regions in between Pelargir and Dol Amroth. So I think that settles if there is going to be land inbetween the two Gondor cities. The question is though, how big exactly is Turbine going to make it in a landscape update instead of an expansion landmass.

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    Ignoring the fact that various areas are located "off the map" -- (Winterhome, and various instances, like the HD battles) it is perfectly reasonable to have a coordinate as large as 360 without stretching the standard geographic coordinate system.
    Actually, there are geographic coordinate systems that does not use degrees, and therefore can go a lot higher than 360.* The coordinate system of LOTRO seems a lot more like a mathematical coordinate system, given that it's used along a completely flat surface as opposed to a sphere(-ish) like the globe, so there's no reason to assume either 180 or 360 to be any more of a limit than any other number.


    *There's a mostly military coordinate system here in sweden using simply X & Y coordinates in meters, placing origo in the lower left point of a map covering the entire country. That way the entire country fits in positive numbers.

  9. #59
    So in which update do we get Minas Tirith?

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodgoing View Post
    Haha, yeah, I think the new regions and landmass are a lot more interesting than the new Beornings class.
    I could not have agreed more.
    Please read the post overhead and understand it fully before responding with overwhelming negativity to opinions you have no personal interest in, but still want to complain about. Don't troll the feeders. Great, you acknowledge the need to apologize, but I don't see an actual apology anywhere. Are you a politician by any chance? - xandervix_tog.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex53 View Post
    So in which update do we get Minas Tirith?
    Neither of the ones promised this year. Rowan said that Minas Tirith and Osgiliath would be coming in 2015.

  12. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex53 View Post
    So in which update do we get Minas Tirith?
    Judging by the link I provided. Osgilith will be update 16, so Minas Tirith and the land surrounding it I assume will be Update 17. I don't know if it will be an expansion or not.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by guguzza71 View Post
    Just yesterday I walked out of the side entrance of Beaconwatch down the east road to the river. The guards there let me cross the river but an invisible wall prevents me going further than the other side of the river. This seems like one of two ways we can head into Gondor.
    Every single time I see that name, and no joke, I see Baconwatch. I think I have a problem...

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by guguzza71 View Post
    Just yesterday I walked out of the side entrance of Beaconwatch down the east road to the river. The guards there let me cross the river but an invisible wall prevents me going further than the other side of the river. This seems like one of two ways we can head into Gondor.
    That's a good point. There's also, IIRC, a path out of The Brown Lands, east of the Great River. It's also been blocked by invisible walls so far. Or was it an Easterling camp? I don't recall, it's been a while since I went out that way.
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  15. #65
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    I wanna hear and see seagulls at Dol Amroth and Pelargir, I wanna sea ships loading and unloading their cargo, I wanna see a busy fishmarket and a tavern with ragged folk inside. I'm very excited about the thought of finally going to see some coast and ocean again, I really hope they do it justice

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by frickinmuck View Post
    Every single time I see that name, and no joke, I see Baconwatch. I think I have a problem...
    To be honest everytime I see the map name Derndingle under my minimap, I keep getting images of Mark whalberg in my head.

  17. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by Comstrike View Post
    I’m curious to know what the creative’s are doing with regard to zone art. Southern Gondor and the west regions toward Anafalas and Belfalas (Westernesse siiiieeede yo) would seem to look akin to the southern regions of Spain and the Mediterranean regions of France. I will make somebody a happy Mod and use the new format to detail this, but there could be a logical reason to finally open up the docks at Celeondim for practical use as swift travel routes (by water) from the far north to the south. I would suggest using the Grey Havens but that could be a bit much to hope for.
    I've always thought the gray havens would be a neat area for an update that is smaller than an expansion pack; I like the elves, and I enjoy exploring areas that are underdeveloped in the books.

    We know Sauron is using the corsairs to harass the coastline of Gondor; that suggests natural plotlines around "and therefore threats to the elves-with-ships who might be able to do something about a naval threat". Similarly, Sauron and some of his minions quite plausibly may want to stop elves from sailing off to the west out of general hatred of elves, and thus plotlines involving threats of destruction of the harbor, the skilled elven craftsmen who know how to build the ships, the trees or other materials they use to build the ships...

    It would be an interruption of the steady "march toward mordor" of the updates, though.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadlyGazebo View Post
    I've always thought the gray havens would be a neat area for an update that is smaller than an expansion pack; I like the elves, and I enjoy exploring areas that are underdeveloped in the books.

    We know Sauron is using the corsairs to harass the coastline of Gondor; that suggests natural plotlines around "and therefore threats to the elves-with-ships who might be able to do something about a naval threat". Similarly, Sauron and some of his minions quite plausibly may want to stop elves from sailing off to the west out of general hatred of elves, and thus plotlines involving threats of destruction of the harbor, the skilled elven craftsmen who know how to build the ships, the trees or other materials they use to build the ships...

    It would be an interruption of the steady "march toward mordor" of the updates, though.
    I think having Edhellond included in the Paths of the Dead to Dol Amroth update would be a wise move for the devs, because it gives them a chance to play around with a culture that has been on the back-burner since Mirkwood (aside from a quick visit in Thinglad); its also directly on the path between these two landmarks, so it would make sense to include it.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirian-Hammerfist View Post
    I think having Edhellond included in the Paths of the Dead to Dol Amroth update would be a wise move for the devs, because it gives them a chance to play around with a culture that has been on the back-burner since Mirkwood (aside from a quick visit in Thinglad); its also directly on the path between these two landmarks, so it would make sense to include it.



    How are they going to avoid having it there? I mean, it's by the sea almost directly north of Dol Amroth, and the devs probably won't even have any choice (unless they want to disappoint most of the players). /cheer.
    Please read the post overhead and understand it fully before responding with overwhelming negativity to opinions you have no personal interest in, but still want to complain about. Don't troll the feeders. Great, you acknowledge the need to apologize, but I don't see an actual apology anywhere. Are you a politician by any chance? - xandervix_tog.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirian-Hammerfist View Post
    I think having Edhellond included in the Paths of the Dead to Dol Amroth update would be a wise move for the devs, because it gives them a chance to play around with a culture that has been on the back-burner since Mirkwood (aside from a quick visit in Thinglad); its also directly on the path between these two landmarks, so it would make sense to include it.
    Play around with what? Edhellond had been abandoned for more than a thousand years, and we've seen plenty of Elvish ruins before.

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    Play around with what? Edhellond had been abandoned for more than a thousand years, and we've seen plenty of Elvish ruins before.
    I'm sure we could end up encountering a mariner of Cirdan - or we could explore the ruins with a curious Gondorian scholar - and while we have seen Elvish ruins before, they were all before Turbine wheeled out the great graphics that they used for both parts of Rohan, so I'd be hoping it to be pretty impressive.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirian-Hammerfist View Post
    I'm sure we could end up encountering a mariner of Cirdan - or we could explore the ruins with a curious Gondorian scholar - and while we have seen Elvish ruins before, they were all before Turbine wheeled out the great graphics that they used for both parts of Rohan, so I'd be hoping it to be pretty impressive.
    There hadn't been an Elvish ship there in more than a thousand years. Elves and Men are supposed to be sundered, remember, with Gondor being out of touch with the Elves, so Cirdan wouldn't be sending any ships there. So by rights it should really only be a sight-seeing tour - not that there'd be anything wrong with that - unless, of course, something else was going on (like some crafty Haradrim having sailed a ship there for some nefarious purpose).

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    There hadn't been an Elvish ship there in more than a thousand years. Elves and Men are supposed to be sundered, remember, with Gondor being out of touch with the Elves, so Cirdan wouldn't be sending any ships there. So by rights it should really only be a sight-seeing tour - not that there'd be anything wrong with that - unless, of course, something else was going on (like some crafty Haradrim having sailed a ship there for some nefarious purpose).
    Well, Turbine needs to bend the lore to make things interesting, and also the fact that Gondorians most likely didn't go strolling in the ruins, which means that they could always do something. Also, Black Numenorians would maybe want to plunder relics of the Elves. Also, Elves would have gone there recently.
    Please read the post overhead and understand it fully before responding with overwhelming negativity to opinions you have no personal interest in, but still want to complain about. Don't troll the feeders. Great, you acknowledge the need to apologize, but I don't see an actual apology anywhere. Are you a politician by any chance? - xandervix_tog.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomthing View Post
    Well, Turbine needs to bend the lore to make things interesting, and also the fact that Gondorians most likely didn't go strolling in the ruins, which means that they could always do something. Also, Black Numenorians would maybe want to plunder relics of the Elves. Also, Elves would have gone there recently.
    As you can see from what I suggested, Turbine could do something interesting with the place (like sinister skulking Soutron spies, up to no good!) without having to make up nonsense about Elves being there.

    Also - after more than a thousand years, if there'd been anything left behind worth stealing to start with then the local Men would have stolen it long ago.

    Also - what Black Numenoreans? There were hardly any of them left!

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    As you can see from what I suggested, Turbine could do something interesting with the place (like sinister skulking Soutron spies, up to no good!) without having to make up nonsense about Elves being there.

    Also - after more than a thousand years, if there'd been anything left behind worth stealing to start with then the local Men would have stolen it long ago.

    Also - what Black Numenoreans? There were hardly any of them left!
    Why not, they could fear curses or similar things which could be told about some places. And there could be very well hidden places or mostly buried places. So there are always possibilities that some relics are left - not to forget that you can find relics of the second and first age nearly everywhere - even in populated regions like Rohan, in sacked and plundered regions like Moria or in old fortresses like Isengard/Orthanc.

    The rulers of Umbar and probably/perhaps some/many rulers of the Haradrim were Black Numenoreans... so there aren't that less, it's more like the upper part of socienty in these regions, like the Numenoreans are only a relatively small percentage of Gondorians or like the patricians in ancient Rome.

 

 
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