We have detected that cookies are not enabled on your browser. Please enable cookies to ensure the proper experience.
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 36
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    425

    Update 13 and hunters

    What can we expect in upcoming update?
    (Few words from our developer would be lovely)

    So far, I've only heard about stealth tracking (finally) coming back (I only hope it won't be deep in yellow/any line, so every pvp hunter could use it - pve hunters can live without that skill anyways).
    Merging all three tracking skills into one? (that would be very welcomed move by every single hunter, without any doubt)
    Anything about our survivability? (we have the lowest survivability of all classes; anything that would help that would be nice - stronger bubble, parry buff, whatever. We lost Cry Of The Predator, Swift Stroke and Agile Rejoinder, which weren't godmode skills, but helped at least a bit for our survivability)
    Finally properly fixed bugs with oils? (if you have oil in blue(huntsman), you could move and shoot (Barbed Arrow issue))

    Those are the things of major concern (to me, as mainly pvp hunter) and I believe they should be dealt properly.
    Not things like: what is spelled correctly in combat log, typos in traits or skills, whether you're holding your bow in left or right hand, damage type of skill you use once every month, and so forth.
    Trait trees have ruined the game

  2. #2
    It would be a tragedy if stealth tracking was only included in the yellow trait line (and to me the straw that broke the proverbial's camels back) . The ability to track stealth has always been in a hunter arsenal. It was stated that it was unintentionally removed so if that is true then we can assume that it will have its original functions. If you recall heightened senses was a yellow line trait pre HD and it still is. That included the same function as other tracks except it was enhanced. I believe it includes a + evade and trap cooldown? Still if you tracked in blue/red lines you had the ability to track stealth and that needs to return.

    I am not so excited about 3 in 1. First how often does anyone use Passage of Shadow? If I recall the last time I used it was back when I was in east of OG and trying to find a certain wight for the book. I guess I am thinking about the cool down. If they made it 90 secs then that would be a waste. I think the CD should remain as is. You can only target 1 mob at a time (foe or nature). Increasing it to 1 min or so would be defeating the purpose. It would save a click but the longer CD actually would nerf the skill.

    I agree there needs to be some tweaking in survivability.
    they are all dead.. they just don't know it yet....

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by anthonyx View Post
    I am not so excited about 3 in 1. First how often does anyone use Passage of Shadow? If I recall the last time I used it was back when I was in east of OG and trying to find a certain wight for the book. I guess I am thinking about the cool down. If they made it 90 secs then that would be a waste. I think the CD should remain as is. You can only target 1 mob at a time (foe or nature). Increasing it to 1 min or so would be defeating the purpose. It would save a click but the longer CD actually would nerf the skill.
    I think the OP was more arguing for the same CD, yet all tracks bundled into one. So you could hit one skill and track all possible enemies within range. Which would like, make hunter rather useful for hunting/scouting, rather than a store item trumping a class.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Bond007 View Post
    I think the OP was more arguing for the same CD, yet all tracks bundled into one. So you could hit one skill and track all possible enemies within range. Which would like, make hunter rather useful for hunting/scouting, rather than a store item trumping a class.
    That is what I was hoping but because there was no word on how it would be changed I am hoping the Dev sees it the same way.
    they are all dead.. they just don't know it yet....

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    31
    I expect generally to give us a serius evade-heal that our class desperately needs in Moorz.(personaly i do patience before i retire my favourite class)

    2nd i would like to see track could be able to use on horse like on war-steed.(The joke with the stealth tracking should be end ofc as sooner as it can)

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Mousaion View Post
    I expect generally to give us a serius evade-heal that our class desperately needs in Moorz
    Some sort of survivability in moors would be great.
    The creeps always go versus the most vulnerable group member. Thats almost always hunter, unless you have very low rank peeps along.
    So, not only are we the least survivable class, we also get targeted first.
    Either give us a better (induction free) self heal, or at least some "pay back" skill that is activated at low health and puts a massive aoe bleed on all close by attackers :-)

  7. #7
    I think we need some sort of self buff that allows us to avoid damage in the first place, not bounce back from minor damage (like a heal or bubble does).

    Something along the lines of a p/e buff (evade buff would make the most sense), or a flat -% inc damage buff, tied to a no induction setback on attacks.

    This would allow us to DO something while we are getting zerged by multiple people, rather than kiting and hitting pen shot once every 5s in blueline (ugh), or running around like a mad chicken vainly trying to gain distance in redline. Endurance stance is nice, but the evade chance buff lasts for far too long and you have to waste valuable time swapping stances to get it.

    Even in raids, even if you have enough healers keeping you up, we're useless while focused. Every other class is not, either by use of AoE CC, or by use of non-inductioned damage skills, or by use of viable breakouts (NOT a slow removal that lasts for a whopping 0 seconds and places effects on players that can be wiped by the use of a 30s pot or slow removal skill....).

    What do you guys think?

    Or more importantly, what do the devs think?
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    78
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfNothing View Post
    Some sort of survivability in moors would be great.
    The creeps always go versus the most vulnerable group member. Thats almost always hunter, unless you have very low rank peeps along.
    So, not only are we the least survivable class, we also get targeted first.
    Either give us a better (induction free) self heal, or at least some "pay back" skill that is activated at low health and puts a massive aoe bleed on all close by attackers :-)
    I believe your forum name displays truth.

    Just add Troll,

    Either you person are the worst hunter on this planet and should go play a melee class or you are up against the very best creeps on your server.

    The hunter is in an EXCELLENT place at present in the moors, trait yellow and watch the renown and comms roll in, ANY decent hunter will tell you the exact same, I can take almost anyone in yellow 1v1, and if i do lose, and i do, its because that person really knows their class and is an excellent player, but i have to say, if my hunter dies against anything lower than a R10, i feel tears come to my eyes.

    Hunter is in an excellent place if you bother to sort out your tactics and key mapping. We do not need any buffs. Posts like this are the reason we can easily 1 or 2 shot most creeps if we get a nice crit in Red.

    Last night, 24K from one Swift Bow, 28K Upshot followed by a 18K Mercifull ( US and MS werent even DEVS)

    So please stop trolling, or better, roll a creep on Eldar and come 1v1 me, To make up for it being a new creep, I will take off all Aud
    Hunter - Faralyne (Eldar - Active)

    Warg - Justanibble (Eldar - Retired)

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Near the Equator
    Posts
    287
    Quote Originally Posted by Faralyne View Post
    Last night, 24K from one Swift Bow, 28K Upshot followed by a 18K Mercifull ( US and MS werent even DEVS)
    How did you get those hits o.o
    [COLOR="#669966"][center][size=1]Mildford - R9 Hunter • Support - R7 LM
    The Storm Crusaders • Gladden[/size][/center][/COLOR]

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Faralyne View Post
    Either you person are the worst hunter on this planet and should go play a melee class or you are up against the very best creeps on your server.

    The hunter is in an EXCELLENT place at present in the moors, trait yellow and watch the renown and comms roll in, ANY decent hunter will tell you the exact same, I can take almost anyone in yellow 1v1
    I've never lost to a hunter in a 1v1 (both pre-arranged and not pre-arranged) yet on Gladden or on Brandy, and I try to hold myself back from using certain skills on all of my creep dps classes. Are you saying every hunter I've run into is "the worst hunter on this planet"? I still find your statements dubious at best, and trolling at worst.


    Quote Originally Posted by Faralyne View Post
    Hunter is in an excellent place if you bother to sort out your tactics and key mapping. We do not need any buffs. Posts like this are the reason we can easily 1 or 2 shot most creeps if we get a nice crit in Red.

    Last night, 24K from one Swift Bow, 28K Upshot followed by a 18K Mercifull ( US and MS werent even DEVS)
    Please, show me a screenshot of you hitting these numbers on a full audacity, well traited corruption-wise, creep. 3 crit, 3 crit defence, 3 mastery, Dfp2 Hfp2 Hfd2.

    Ask anyone you know on creepside to provide you screenshots of their traits and audacity, then try to get these numbers again. After all, you can "easily 1 or 2 shot most creeps."

    I'm not going to waste my time on a server whose creeps clearly provide you with an easy time and a pampered view of what the hunter's situation is, but I wish you luck nonetheless at recreating these numbers which you have laid on the table.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    78
    Quote Originally Posted by Mildford View Post
    How did you get those hits o.o
    Very carefully selecting Jewellery, LI's and Traits, With a good rotation , ask Noirdesire how he feels after my hits.
    Hunter - Faralyne (Eldar - Active)

    Warg - Justanibble (Eldar - Retired)

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Faralyne View Post
    I believe your forum name displays truth.

    Just add Troll,

    Either you person are the worst hunter on this planet and should go play a melee class or you are up against the very best creeps on your server.
    lol, what a nice intro ...


    I can take almost anyone in yellow 1v1
    I was talking about hunter in a group versus a group of creeps.
    1v1 is an entirely different thing.
    yellow hunter can hold very well against practically all sorts of creeps in 1v1
    But that seldom happens in moors


    Posts like this are the reason we can easily 1 or 2 shot most creeps if we get a nice crit in Red.
    Strange, how arguing for more survivability in groups "has been the reason" the devs gave us the high burst dps we have nowadays.
    You might check your logic.

    Red is nice if you sit camouflaged and wait for a poor creep coming by.
    Everyone can do that, but its not really a great achievement.


    So please stop trolling, or better, roll a creep on Eldar and come 1v1 me, To make up for it being a new creep, I will take off all Aud
    So you think a 1v1 duel versus a newly rolled r1 creep shows how OP a hunter is in moors?
    God gracious

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfNothing View Post
    Red is nice if you sit camouflaged and wait for a poor creep coming by.
    I'll add that in addition to what you have already said, this is also only true if:

    1) Creep is a greenie

    2) Creep does not trait crit defence

    3) Creep has little or no audacity

    4) Creep is not a warg who can simply HIPS and re-engage hunter on his own terms, or spider who can simply burrow and re-engage hunter on his own terms.

    4) Hunter has not been tracked/popped out of stealth during this entire time he's waiting for all of the following to be true in order to have a solid chance at the 1v1 kill.



    But this thread is being sidetracked, so we should stop now :/
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Bond007 View Post
    I'll add that in addition to what you have already said, this is also only true if:
    1) Creep is a greenie
    2) Creep does not trait crit defence
    3) Creep has little or no audacity
    4) Creep is not a warg who can simply HIPS and re-engage hunter on his own terms, or spider who can simply burrow and re-engage hunter on his own terms.
    5) Hunter has not been tracked/popped out of stealth during this entire time he's waiting for all of the following to be true in order to have a solid chance at the 1v1 kill.
    Right. Works well vs r1-r7, 1v1, from 40m range, when you surprise the poor fella while (s)he is doing her slug quest or whatever.
    I've done it a couple of times, but there is no sense of accomplishment.
    And if the creep knows how to play its class well, or if you don't crit (which I heard, happens from time to time) you are caught in red-line.
    Unless you have some very clever and special tactics up your sleeve (see for instance this post: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...created-in-RoR) red-line is not very good for 1v1, at least not versus experienced creeps.

    Red-line is not bad, if you have healer(s), but after focus pot and intent concentration are gone, you need to build focus, which is difficult if you are attacked by 3+ dps creeps.

    But this thread is being sidetracked, so we should stop now :/
    Right, so back on topic.

    My argument is not for the 1v1 fights.
    An average hunter can do decently well (imo best in yellow line) versus 1 average to good creep and versus 2 below average creeps.
    An excellent hunter will be better.
    I am not an excellent hunter, so I cannot predict how an excellent hunter would fair versus an excellent creep.
    There are better hunters than me on our server, and all have difficulties versus the really good creeps.
    Therefore, my guess is, that currently an excellent creep would have the advantage.
    Thats OK. Freeps need not always have the advantage, and being at a disadvantage helps to devise better tactics.


    My main argument is the following:

    1.) We have pretty high dps.
    This means we are priority targets in groups, because of our high threat (high dps)
    2.) We have low survivability.
    This means we are priority target in groups, because of the quick kill (low survivability)

    The combination of 1. (high dps) and 2. (low survivability) works against us in groups.

    If all freeps have the same rank, a well coordinated group of creeps will first target the squishy high dps classes.
    Its a completely logical decision. Its better to target the squishy dps before you target the squishy healer.
    The healer wont kill you, the squishy dps will, if not taken "care of" before hand.

    The squishy dps class is usually the hunter. Second are burgs, but they can hips.

    The problem is, if 3+ high dps creeps hit in a well coordinated move on the hunter, we go down so fast, that the healer cannot do much.
    We not only go down fast, we are a burden for the healer.
    Not only must the healer heal us more than the others, when we get pounced by 2-3 wargs and/or a reaver, we need large burst heals, which can be on cooldown, or just too late.
    The chances are, that we go down very fast in a well coordinated attack, and chances are also that any heals placed on us in the 5-10 seconds before we are dead are wasted.

    The problem is the COMBINATION of high single target dps and low survivability.
    What works well versus non-intelligent mobs in PvE, does not work well at all against intelligent creeps.
    In PvE we can control our dps, we can wait for the tanks to build aggro, we can actively help in dropping aggro (beneath notice) and the tanks can force taunt if we are not good at controlling our dps.
    In PvMP all this is useless.

    As long as the COMBINATION of high dps and low survivability is not somehow mitigated in PvMP, hunters are not very well balanced versus the other classes and will always remain the first priority target for the creeps.
    It is OK that we are priority targets. It is the role of a hunter to be a glass cannon.
    But if the glass cannon goes down so fast, that even a good healer is at his limit, something is wrong.

    That we go down so fast in a coordinated attack has not much to do with the skill of the hunter.
    Our induction-less self-heals are limited (bubble + pots). An average hunter can activate them as fast as an excellent hunter.
    Furthermore, in a coordinated attack the creeps will attack from different sides, in which case an excellent hunter (with the best movement and positioning skills) will not have a substantial advantage over an average hunter.

    We need some skill that allows us to survive longer than just a few seconds versus a well coordinated attack of multiple creeps.
    I would not mind, if in the process of obtaining such a skill, we loose out a bit on dps. In fact, that would (indirectly) help our survivability, because we are not that large a threat anymore.
    Creeps are intelligent. If hunters are less of a threat and more survivable, the playing ground is levelled.
    Creeps will have to choose more on the skill of the individual players, who to target first, then just by looking at the class and rank.

    But boasting how high our (single target) dps is, is just the wrong approach.
    In fact, if the mentioned figures were correct (which I doubt) that would make the situation even worse.
    Our high single target dps is part of the problem.
    Its THE incentive for the creeps to go after us.
    Dispatch us in the beginning, no dps to worry in the future.
    In fact, even if our dps were a factor of 2-3 higher, it would be useless, if the dps is relocated to the rez circle within 5-10 seconds...
    Last edited by MasterOfNothing; Mar 15 2014 at 07:37 PM.

  15. #15
    This made me happy

    I literally agree with everything you say. We need survivability far more than any amount of dps right now.

    Yellow line was a good idea, but it's virtually useless against more than one person due to the fact that you can't pick which creeps your traps hit in a group. If they did something about that, I would be slightly more happy, but what they really need to do is add something that ALL trait lines can benefit from.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    AFK in Dol Amroth
    Posts
    810
    some of the comments made me laugh
    [center][color=cyan]Fellowship Hadacar: I now have a mental image of a little pea with a NE Patriot's logo painted on it.[/color][/center]
    [center][img]http://bit.ly/1Oq7Mgg[/img][/center]
    [center]From Dwarrowdelf to Arkenstone | [color=red]Asylum | No-QQ[/color][/center]

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    425
    Agile rejoinder. I think if we would get that back (or something similiar), all the comments about survivability would cease.
    I still can't figure out why was it removed...
    Trait trees have ruined the game

  18. #18
    Maybe if AR was brought back and it triggered off an evade response or something?

    Because it wasn't too great without being used in tandem with swift stroke. Our parry rating isn't extraordinarily high without SS anymore (mine's something like 19% with 2 swords), and parrying itself is very limited given the fact that it's only useful against reavers anymore.

    You'd still have to hit the AR skill itself to get the heal so it wouldn't be a bob & weave sort of heal, but if it triggered off evade I think it would be more in line with the HD changes.


    I really do think that some sort of no induction setback skill or trait + some way to avoid damage would still be more useful than a heal I have to say
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    AFK in Dol Amroth
    Posts
    810
    Overlooks hunters while others are buffedlike crazy.
    Cant give us decent surival on par with every other classes..

    A 10% P/E SS with scaled AR should be fair considering other classes dont even have cds anymore..just basically general skills.
    Lul @ Warriors heart with shorter CD than a morale pot, atleast we have a 30sec unintteruptible insta heal that gives more morale than the dmg taken trying to use it.
    [center][color=cyan]Fellowship Hadacar: I now have a mental image of a little pea with a NE Patriot's logo painted on it.[/color][/center]
    [center][img]http://bit.ly/1Oq7Mgg[/img][/center]
    [center]From Dwarrowdelf to Arkenstone | [color=red]Asylum | No-QQ[/color][/center]

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    425
    So, apparently, update 13 is not bringing anything to our survivability
    Dev is ignoring the thread
    And when even the creeps are asking to give hunters some survivability, you know it's a serious issue.

    Maybe some skill similiar to Eldar's grace, on 5 minute cd..

    Anyways, I dare our developer or anyone responsible, to max out a hunter, with top gear, maxed virtues, best jewlery and 2/2/2 sets for max crit defense, make him rank 9 or 10 and test fights against every creep class of rank 9+, with "everything allowed" rule, in all three stances. Few fights. Just to see the statistics. And when it's all done, to come to hunter forum and say that our class does indeed needs no more survivability than we have now.
    That would be only fair thing, I believe.
    Or ignore this thread again and witness less hunters playing the game.
    Trait trees have ruined the game

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    that bright star in the constelation of Vela
    Posts
    164
    Quote Originally Posted by Mucica View Post
    What can we expect in upcoming update?
    (Few words from our developer would be lovely)

    Merging all three tracking skills into one? (that would be very welcomed move by every single hunter, without any doubt)
    Anything about our survivability? (we have the lowest survivability of all classes; anything that would help that would be nice - stronger bubble, parry buff, whatever. We lost Cry Of The Predator, Swift Stroke and Agile Rejoinder, which weren't godmode skills, but helped at least a bit for our survivability).
    Totally agree

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Bond007 View Post
    I've never lost to a hunter in a 1v1 (both pre-arranged and not pre-arranged) yet on Gladden or on Brandy, and I try to hold myself back from using certain skills on all of my creep dps classes. Are you saying every hunter I've run into is "the worst hunter on this planet"?
    There are no decent hunter soloing nowadays on brandywine, bw best hunter in 1v1 retired long ago.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bond007 View Post
    Please, show me a screenshot of you hitting these numbers on a full audacity, well traited corruption-wise, creep. 3 crit, 3 crit defence, 3 mastery, Dfp2 Hfp2 Hfd2.
    Ask Tarp or Chachii the numbers they get on their hunters, and they'll confirm the 25-30k crit upshots with stealth pop.

    Perfect trait setup on a r10+ dps class btw.



    First Marshall Angiela

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by AngielaBrandywine View Post
    There are no decent hunter soloing nowadays on brandywine, bw best hunter in 1v1 retired long ago.
    Fair enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by AngielaBrandywine View Post
    Ask Tarp or Chachii the numbers they get on their hunters, and they'll confirm the 25-30k crit upshots with stealth pop.
    I believe 25-30k upshots. I can hit those numbers on my hunter against creeps from stealth, true enough.

    But that's more of an issue of the creep not traiting correctly rather than me (or others) doing something extraordinary. I've never gotten hit for more than 15k upshot dev on my warg with 7 audacity, and I'm sure it's simply because I still trait 3 CD while others choose to go for, what are imo less viable, squishier builds leaving out CD.

    So it's not the hunter being powerful, it's the creep traiting in such a way that makes the hunter seem powerful. I could take off almost all my crit defence gear and dance in front of a BA and get popped for a 13k VT dev, but that doesn't mean BA dps is powerful.

    Quote Originally Posted by AngielaBrandywine View Post
    Perfect trait setup on a r10+ dps class btw.
    Why thank you :P

    Healers don't have a reason to lose the crit defence though, either. If anything, they have more of a reason to trait it, seeing as they're the ones more likely to be focused in fights.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  24. #24
    hiho

    how are u playing the hunter solo a.m.? Is there aposbilit to win against good creeps open map in a 1v1? would be interested in your respowns.

    greetings
    Haldrar/Krassh
    [IMG]http://lux-hdro.de/generator.php/Haldrar/1/15/1/4/85/Bettler+Barden+und+Schurken/0/2/1/11/10/1/1/8/8/8/8/0/0.png[/IMG]

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by astonwe View Post
    how are u playing the hunter solo a.m.?
    Very carefully.

    Quote Originally Posted by astonwe View Post
    Is there aposbilit to win against good creeps open map in a 1v1?
    Yes, it's possible. Not probable, but possible.

    Good is pretty subjective, but I'd say a good creep will always win against a good hunter now. Whereas before it was somewhat fair chance for both sides (I usually felt like hunters were skewed low in 1v1 power, but meh... also, obvious exception of reavers), now every creep class can roflstomp a hunter unless they're trash (which, thankfully, a lot of the creeps are right now, since many returned for ezmode and don't know how to play).

    Always give it a shot though, you might surprise someone who's just expecting free kills.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

 

 
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload