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  1. #1

    Withywindle 3v3 League

    Hello, a good portion of players has expressed desire for such occasion to happen so I took the liberty of hosting it.
    The competition is simple. All teams will be put into a table, where during the league each creep team will play each freep team. Winners will be awarded points in the league and when each team has played the other, the team with the most points will be winner.

    This league is intended for 3v3 fights (if successful might expand into 6v6 in the future)


    Length of the event is not yet decided upon, so any suggsestions and ideas are welcome
    For the reward for the team who has accumulated most points by the time when season ends, I will put up 1x 800 Turbine points key. while weekly rewards could perhaps include such as Lootboxes,steel keys,symbols for creep side and tomes,lootboxes,steel keys, gold for freeps

    Rules for group make-up are following: A freep team is allowed to have maximum one minstrel or captain. 2 other slots are designated for DPS. Only one of each class is allowed in a team.
    Each person can only use one character to take part in the league with.
    A creep team can have only one of defiler or warleader and only one of each class is allowed in a team
    Cercaint skills will most likely be prohibited. So far my black-list includes "never surrender, "fellowship's heart", burrow, "warriors fortitude"

    Creep healer: Defiler
    Creep support: War-leader
    Creep cc: Spider
    Creep dps: Warg,Reaver,Black-arrow

    Freep healer: minstrel, captain
    Freep dps: warden, champion, burglar, hunter, guardian, rune-keeper, loremaster


    Fights will take place one-by-one in an open area without npcs. All teams gather in a Teamspeak 3 server during the event. Any outside interferance of the fight will result in a re-play. Any complaint of foul-play will be adressed to me and it will be reviewed. Therefore I suggsest each team to capture the fights on video so it can be sent in for a review.

    Now I would like to ask everybody to chip in with ideas/proposals for rule-changes/addons, the length of the event and anything else you would think would improve the league.

    The start to the league will be given when required amount of teams have signed up and the rules have been reviewed and approved by the attendees.

    To start signing up teams, you can post your team with class and character makeup here, or send me in game MAIL to "Iones" on freep side or "uloga" on creep side.
    Last edited by georg112; Jan 30 2014 at 03:18 AM.
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

  2. #2
    Nice idea, but easier is to roll random Heal Mini/Supp Cappy/DPS burg group and give them TP
    Gilrain: Keeslanaff - r12 RVR
    Withy: Keeslaff - r13 HNT, Cometodaddy - r9 BA, Warglaff -r7 STK

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by giboosc View Post
    Nice idea, but easier is to roll random Heal Mini/Supp Cappy/DPS burg group and give them TP
    As you can see, I specified that only one healer/support class is allowed per group. any suggsestions are welcome
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by georg112 View Post
    As you can see, I specified that only one healer/support class is allowed per group. any suggsestions are welcome
    Sorry. My bad.
    Gilrain: Keeslanaff - r12 RVR
    Withy: Keeslaff - r13 HNT, Cometodaddy - r9 BA, Warglaff -r7 STK

  5. #5
    You seriously think this is fair fight? 3vs3? There is no combination of 3 creeps to kill anything with skills like fellowships heart, or some big rk heals.. Since you set it up as onli wl or defi available, there is no way for a creep healer to be alive more then 30-45s. In that time you cannot do anything with dps because of oh #### skills, which exist on every freep class. This way freep 3man will take those 800TP. If you allow defi and wl to be in same group, i believe freeps wont be able to kill the creeps. So 3vs3 wont work.

    6vs6 wont work either because you have to let freeps take support, so yellow cappy and mini group wins all. 3man group with good LM, mini and yellow cappy should have not much trouble outhealing 6man creep, let alone adding +3 to dps on freep side.

    There is just no balance however you put it really. Closest to balance is something with 10-12 freeps and a bit more creeps. On our server that is, in most situation.

    Since its a league, how did you plan to form a league table? With both freeps and creeps in same table or 2 tables for both sides?

    a.k.a. wait for new update
    [b][center]LUTZ THE GOD of Whitywindle[/center][/b]

    [center]Z fanboi[/center]

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    183
    I have to agree with Lutz there, there are plenty of loop-holes in the various forms of how the freep groups would be gathered, for both 3v3 and 6v6. But not oposing anything, I think it would be a good idea to start trying it sometimes, in a way to find out what sort of combinations would be more fair to both sides. With time, this idea might stick, and become some interesting form of action. Meanwhile if it doesnt work, a 1v1 tournament would be cool to have imo, as long there would be a few "rules" for the sake of fair-play and some balanced and fun fights.
    Cheers.
    Narthor - r11 Warden | Glawoneth - r9 RK | Trengo - r8 Burglar | Torvareth - r8 Champion | Morgand - r6 Hunter | Garina - r5 Minstrel
    Radguz - r12 Reaver | Narthorao - r8 WL | Narrowz - r8 BA | Woodyy - r8 Stalker(EN)
    YouTube Channel | Original Challenger of Gothmog - Laurelin | TheBandits Raid Alliance

  7. #7
    All teams in one table was the idea but now that I think about it, the bracket system wouldn't work, it'd have to be in a way where each creep team plays each freep team and points distributed out for each win.

    Perhaps restrict the buffs that sides can use, would make a difference.
    Last edited by georg112; Jan 29 2014 at 09:27 AM.
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by georg112 View Post
    All teams in one table was the idea but now that I think about it, the bracket system wouldn't work, it'd have to be in a way where each creep team plays each freep team and points distributed out for each win.
    + you need same amount of groups on each side.

    If you have only 4 teams on each side thats 16 matches per round.

    Narthor, 1vs1 needs way too many rules.
    [b][center]LUTZ THE GOD of Whitywindle[/center][/b]

    [center]Z fanboi[/center]

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Iluvatardd View Post
    +

    If you have only 4 teams on each side thats 16 matches per round.
    Yes, both sides would need same amount of people.
    I'm thinking lets say 8 teams on each side. each week on 2 days are the fixtures. each match-day they play 2 fixtures, so in 1 month the tournament can conclude.

    I will start testing which classes and restrictions can or can not be made.
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

  10. #10
    for the table: round rubin, you gain 1 point if you win and nothing if you lose. after all fights the team with the highest points wins.
    for group size, a 4 freeps v 6 creeps fight would be way better, but freeps will have only 1 healer (mini most likely), else it will be easy win for freeps.
    imo, it can work but prize is not needed. the prize is the fun you get + the points you get (if you win)
    don't make it as an event tho, should be like 1 - 2 fights a day, so ppl can come and watch and we can make it something nice.
    about teamspeak, i disagree with putting all teams on same channel, because the fighting groups have to talk with themselves and if the other group hears what they are planning it will be quite bad...one guy from each side (not fighting) can communicate with each other and make good.
    i would join this, but i think making someone a "host" of this tournament won't be good...maybe you can be a judge Morva
    [center][IMG]http://i60.tinypic.com/ohqwlt.png[/IMG][/center]
    [center][color=red][size=3]all chars kinda retired, not playin anymore[/size][/color][/center]
    [center]out of date but too bored to change it[/center]

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Czech Republic
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    150
    As much as i like this idea (or stealth's before) i think its nearly impossible cause of current state of the game (as Lutz mentioned). Also, i think theres so few players left that are not used to ezmode. But count me in, its worth to give it a try atleast.
    [center][img]http://s24.postimg.org/hrej3adgl/got_copy.jpg[/img][/center]

  12. #12
    We tried some combinations of creeps today vs 3 freeps, It's honestly not that bad given that players have different skill levels. A lot more has to be tested, but probably 2 of same class wont be allowed and probably some skills like "never surrender" "Fellowship's heart" "guardians morale/fortitude or whatever" will be barred from use

    For creep side, quite a few different class combinations seem to work well in a 3v3 fight.
    For the freep side there is quite a few combinations id like to see, but I honestly dont think it will be 100% freep farm fest as most of you have indicated.

    For example the spiders who have been annihilated by turbine I believe will turn out to be huge game-changers in 3v3 setting. Same goes for wargs

    To rolsperx : about TS my idea is to go into a ts server where we make a lobby and different channels which the teams in fight will be using

    Also I was thinking that It would be more fair if each fixture will be regarded as best of 3, so to eliminate some hit luck and more based on the general skill of people.
    Last edited by georg112; Jan 29 2014 at 12:47 PM.
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  13. #13
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    w.t.f. Lutz....
    You sound like freep not KR watcher.

    Im sure team with my CC+ big rank dps and skilled WL can do some things.
    And if you only care about the actual win not the fair fights we can get by it... lol
    [URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/phx4everCZ/media/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1360.photobucket.com/albums/r660/phx4everCZ/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

  14. #14
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    I think it can be balanced in case, when creeps are bit higher ranks. I saw, what can TC with my heals do against +/- same ranks, but if you put higher freeps it wont be hard for them to grab the 800.
    [URL=http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/danlakerspower/media/Stuff/3651f64d-bbbf-44f7-a06a-56ea4c1f1102_zpsbd32883a.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y502/danlakerspower/Stuff/3651f64d-bbbf-44f7-a06a-56ea4c1f1102_zpsbd32883a.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
    KhaosRogues peasant

  15. #15

    Comments on balance

    We did some testing yesterday and the balance will not be as bad as some ppl think. With minstrel healing the 2 dps in the other team needs to kill me b4 the dps in our team killed the wl, it was pretty hard for me to sty up for long vs a green rank impaling rvr and a warg that stunns and dps a lot. But i guess that the warleader had a similar experience.

    If we for example take an othere combination spider defiler rvr vs yellow cappy and 2 dps. Then the spider drops his net and defiler start kiting and will survive much longer. Now the first target will be one of the dps and the cappy can moostly just mitigate the damage, not heal so much, so soner or later the dps will die, the spider helps the defiler stay alive with cc, debuff and net, and maybe use some cc on the cappy at good timings.

    So will the fights be completely balanced?

    No, but they will be more balance then the random encounters we run into all the time else.

    Some fights will be autowin for one of the teams. And at some figts will not. In some fights a minstrel with 14k morale will be 2 hitted by the rvr 7s into the fight. And in other fights the freeps wont even be scratched.

    When we tested we discouvered that doing fellowship heart probably should be removed, since i can just use it and kite the dps and be guaranteed to stay alive for 30 s, and after 30 s the wl will likely be dead and we are 3 vs 2. Still as death have similar mechanics.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrassEater View Post
    Some fights will be autowin for one of the teams.

    When we tested we discovered that doing fellowship heart probably should be removed, since i can just use it and kite the dps and be guaranteed to stay alive for 30 s, and after 30 s the wl will likely be dead and we are 3 vs 2. Still as death have similar mechanics.
    This is where the small fights generate controversy. I mean, there are a few combinations of freeps/creeps that like grass says, it would be an autowin for their side.

    Might be the example of a cpt-burg-ward group, where all have means to extend the duration of the fight avoiding their death by over 30 secs, with Touch and Go/KO, Never Surrender/self-heals, and Last Stand/avoidance buffs. In such a fight, the opposing side simply cant target the same one for long because of the combat breaking skills of that combination for example.

    Thats why in the same way we follow a certain set of "rules" for 1v1s, agreeing with Grass there, in the 3v3 there must be a few predefined stuff be4 each fight, not only on some of the skills of the opponent, but also on the type of group formed.
    Narthor - r11 Warden | Glawoneth - r9 RK | Trengo - r8 Burglar | Torvareth - r8 Champion | Morgand - r6 Hunter | Garina - r5 Minstrel
    Radguz - r12 Reaver | Narthorao - r8 WL | Narrowz - r8 BA | Woodyy - r8 Stalker(EN)
    YouTube Channel | Original Challenger of Gothmog - Laurelin | TheBandits Raid Alliance

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Narthor View Post
    This is where the small fights generate controversy. I mean, there are a few combinations of freeps/creeps that like grass says, it would be an autowin for their side.

    Might be the example of a cpt-burg-ward group, where all have means to extend the duration of the fight avoiding their death by over 30 secs, with Touch and Go/KO, Never Surrender/self-heals, and Last Stand/avoidance buffs. In such a fight, the opposing side simply cant target the same one for long because of the combat breaking skills of that combination for example.

    Thats why in the same way we follow a certain set of "rules" for 1v1s, agreeing with Grass there, in the 3v3 there must be a few predefined stuff be4 each fight, not only on some of the skills of the opponent, but also on the type of group formed.
    I dont think there's an auto-win combination for creeps.
    Freeps mostly rely on their class x creeps rely on their skill.
    [URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/phx4everCZ/media/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1360.photobucket.com/albums/r660/phx4everCZ/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romuh View Post
    I dont think there's an auto-win combination for creeps.
    I've been trying to think on one as well, but it seams it really rolls that way atm...

    Quote Originally Posted by Romuh View Post
    Freeps mostly rely on their class x creeps rely on their skill.
    On this times, and as a both side player, I couldnt agree more on this one Ode.
    Narthor - r11 Warden | Glawoneth - r9 RK | Trengo - r8 Burglar | Torvareth - r8 Champion | Morgand - r6 Hunter | Garina - r5 Minstrel
    Radguz - r12 Reaver | Narthorao - r8 WL | Narrowz - r8 BA | Woodyy - r8 Stalker(EN)
    YouTube Channel | Original Challenger of Gothmog - Laurelin | TheBandits Raid Alliance

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Narthor View Post
    I've been trying to think on one as well, but it seams it really rolls that way atm...



    On this times, and as a both side player, I couldnt agree more on this one Ode.
    Good combination will prolly be WL+spider+ reaver.
    If all are high ranked this combo would provide some nice CC, heals and if good reaver- also dps.

    But for this to be balanced we should maybe discuss freep setups.
    Like OP classes in one group as has been said.
    Burg atm is just plain EZ op and if in group with cappy (broken) or warden (broken unmitigated bleeds will kill WL) this trio would be unkillable.
    So you should maybe limit it to one OP class max for group ?
    [URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/phx4everCZ/media/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1360.photobucket.com/albums/r660/phx4everCZ/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

  20. #20
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    I say this 3 vs 3 is nice challenge but bigger then that Freeps will take it at this time of expansion.
    Awesome idea and hope to watch some of these fights. Not VIP anymore and my creep skills kinda bad.
    As a small add-on I would love to see these guys in 1 group of 3 on creep side pls. Kratai, Odereth and Ash (not seen him tbh for long time now).
    I will wage in-game money on this team against any freep combinations.
    Little advice for you guys is pls don't count RK for healer this time around because they are nowhere near the potency
    they had in ROI and ROR days
    E-strolling must be made in South Africa.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ukanlos View Post
    I say this 3 vs 3 is nice challenge but bigger then that Freeps will take it at this time of expansion.
    Awesome idea and hope to watch some of these fights. Not VIP anymore and my creep skills kinda bad.
    As a small add-on I would love to see these guys in 1 group of 3 on creep side pls. Kratai, Odereth and Ash (not seen him tbh for long time now).
    I will wage in-game money on this team against any freep combinations.
    Little advice for you guys is pls don't count RK for healer this time around because they are nowhere near the potency
    they had in ROI and ROR days
    If Ash and Kratai (or Aghi I think that Aghi=Kratai- prove me different if you think so )
    would log for this kinda event ( I need to get full aud first lol) it should ofc be a strong team

    As I to this day think, that Ash is the best reaver and Kratai (or Aghi ) best WL on server.
    Haven't seen Grudusch the r12 reaver much to judge, as Im kind of a weekend soldier atm.
    [URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/phx4everCZ/media/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1360.photobucket.com/albums/r660/phx4everCZ/staenyacute%20soubor_zps6e4l16tx.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

  22. #22
    3v3 is a very good idea, count me in.

    Will be good to see the fights between high ranked groups. I will join in the in game betting too
    What about Low ranked freeps/creeps, I am pretty sure it will very hard if not impossible to win against a higher ranked (beter skilled most of he cases) group.

    Also can we enter twice? (with different chars)

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by georg112 View Post
    Rules for group make-up are following: A freep team is allowed to have maximum one minstrel or captain. 2 other slots are designated for DPS. Only one of each class is allowed in a team.
    Each person can only use one character to take part in the league with.
    A creep team can have only one of defiler or warleader and only one of each class is allowed in a team
    Cercaint skills will most likely be prohibited. So far my black-list includes "never surrender, "fellowship's heart", burrow, "warriors fortitude"

    Creep healer: Defiler
    Creep support: War-leader
    Creep cc: Spider
    Creep dps: Warg,Reaver,Black-arrow

    Freep healer: minstrel, captain
    Freep dps: warden, champion, burglar, hunter, guardian, rune-keeper, loremaster

    Now I would like to ask everybody to chip in with ideas/proposals for rule-changes/addons, the length of the event and anything else you would think would improve the league.
    To start signing up teams, you can post your team with class and character makeup here, or send me in game MAIL to "Iones" on freep side or "uloga" on creep side.
    ideas for rulings I've had so far

    And about people playing on different classes, I thought this would maybe not be fair play so I'm thinking of restricting people to 1 character.

    But all who want to take part in this, start talkign with others, form groups, sign up.
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

  24. #24
    Mybe its better to say that u can enter with max 2 characters but on the same side( creep or freep) that way if a kin have for example 5 active members and one of the members have 2 characters they can enter with 2 teams.

  25. #25
    Yes, also an idea, but would definetly have to be on the same side
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/344cakx.jpg[/IMG]

 

 
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