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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    Annoying problem with Archer Heralds.

    So, while I've been playing LotRO off and on for a few years now, I've never really committed to a class to high-end content. The back-and-forth questing always gets to me, and I wander off to play something else and sorta forget about it.

    ANYwho, I finally reached a level with my Captain ( favorite class thus far ) where I can use the Archer Herald. A DPS pet is sorely needed, as I like to run a heal / deeps hybrid, and typically gain in survivability what I lack in damage. However this Archer...he makes me look bad. I do, with a halberd and Might stacked, about 300-400 damage with big hits. He does over 1k, and he does it often and MUCH faster than my attacks. I never really felt my damage was lacking until this twerp, and while the first and obvious fix is to just switch back to the standard-bearers for now, is this typical for the Archer pet?

    It wouldn't be so bad if he wasn't constantly pulling my target off of me, only to die in 2 hits, but the situations just seem suited to annoy me to no-end. Does he get more viable, or am I stuck with the hobos purely because they can take 4-5 hits before dying?

    Oh, and another really, REALLY annoying bug...when he shoots an enemy from behind me, sometimes the enemy will run the opposite direction, via some pathing error, and end up aggroing everything around him into the fight. I had to give up on the Tomb of Elendil quest for his sword, because I couldn't solo the instance in Evendim. One mob was literally pulling the entire instance.



    In short: Hobobow is starting to piss me off.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0a20b00000010691b/01008/signature.png]Catiwen[/charsig]

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong View Post
    In short: Hobobow is starting to piss me off.
    The main problem with the archer herald is that he does common damage. I imagine that around the levels you get him first (56), he may do massive damage since mobs don't have much common damage mitigation. This will probably even out as you progress a little bit. Though this may be way off.

    Also, if you're in a blue spec, shoudln't you be able to hold aggro just with your heals?
    "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

  3. #3
    You get the Archer Herald at lvl 30 or so now with the update. My lvl 41 Cappy has been using him for awhile now and yes he adds extra DPS but its nothing to far over the top. The heralds are buggy as all get out at the moment too. Like when you are riding on your horse and you pull something you can ride 2 zones away but as soon as you dismount my herald will run back to the mob that I pulled on the way. He usually comes back but a lot of times I have to dismiss him or he will pull a bunch of mobs and get killed and they then come for me. My only gripe with the Cappy so far is that when you lead off with a mark on a target you dont pull out your weapon during the fight. So you're standing there swinging an invisible Halbred or sword lol. Oh I also just started playing my Cappy when HD launched.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0620500000016ab3c/01003/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by jacobt29 View Post
    My only gripe with the Cappy so far is that when you lead off with a mark on a target you dont pull out your weapon during the fight. So you're standing there swinging an invisible Halbred or sword lol.
    Yes, this is horrible. It also tends to happen the other way round when you throw a Rallying Cry at the end of battle, so you end up running around with your weapon drawn. Outside of being annoying as hell, it also makes it hard to tell whether you've pulled aggro on some random landscape mob while riding around.

    Probably needs to get bug-reported to oblivion, because I'd really love to get this fixed.
    "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bezmer View Post
    The main problem with the archer herald is that he does common damage. I imagine that around the levels you get him first (56), he may do massive damage since mobs don't have much common damage mitigation. This will probably even out as you progress a little bit. Though this may be way off.

    Also, if you're in a blue spec, shoudln't you be able to hold aggro just with your heals?
    Well most of my heals are from Gallant Display, Valiant Strike, and Rallying Cry...and none of them seem to build much aggro. Plus they are all melee ranged, and my archer keeps firing from waaaay back the moment I even switch to a mob. I guess I need to take his assist off, and bind the attack key to my lineup and do it manually. Also, at 44, my weapons only do common damage as well.

    And I don't mind swinging the invisible weapon. Happens all the time, obviously, as I mark my targets first, but what ends up happening is my invisible weapon glows blue with my healing strikes, and I end up looking badass.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0a20b00000010691b/01008/signature.png]Catiwen[/charsig]

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong View Post
    I never really felt my damage was lacking until this twerp, and while the first and obvious fix is to just switch back to the standard-bearers for now, is this typical for the Archer pet?

    It wouldn't be so bad if he wasn't constantly pulling my target off of me, only to die in 2 hits, but the situations just seem suited to annoy me to no-end. Does he get more viable, or am I stuck with the hobos purely because they can take 4-5 hits before dying?



    In short: Hobobow is starting to piss me off.
    Yes this is and was typical of the archer. You have to heal him, buff him with shield brother, consider armaments (but I prefer standards), and get him some crests if you want to use him as more than a mob-gathering device and deed-completion simplifier. Consider being a scholar if you plan to solo with archer a lot, or work on buying or having some one make you some scrolls of warding lore / battle lore, even at low levels. These are some of the ways you can keep him alive better.

    Also, you're the Captain... why is he allowed to pull for you unless you're completing deeds in a low zone? Toggle Assist mode is more appropriate. You can always kite a group yourself.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by gripply View Post
    Yes this is and was typical of the archer. You have to heal him, buff him with shield brother, consider armaments (but I prefer standards), and get him some crests if you want to use him as more than a mob-gathering device and deed-completion simplifier. Consider being a scholar if you plan to solo with archer a lot, or work on buying or having some one make you some scrolls of warding lore / battle lore, even at low levels. These are some of the ways you can keep him alive better.

    Also, you're the Captain... why is he allowed to pull for you unless you're completing deeds in a low zone? Toggle Assist mode is more appropriate. You can always kite a group yourself.
    He doesn't pull for me, he pulls OFF me. That was my initial concern, that I wasn't doing enough damage compared to him ( seriously, lvl 40 with 1k bursts? ), but then again maybe going into red adds enough damage to off-set this and I'm simply not playing to my chosen strengths. I tried healing him at first, but he quite simply dies far too fast. With only 800 health to my 2800, he's more of a hinderence against groups or strong mobs that I can't carve into fast enough.

    But it is obvious I was playing off-kilter given my situation, I was mainly interested if Archers did this normally or if I was just playing too defensively. I've gone back to my Herald. The damage is a bit less, well actually a LOT less, but I've got more control over the ebb and flow. I suppose I'll pull him out in Skirmishes or when hunting, and play a bit smarter with my flag-wavers.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0a20b00000010691b/01008/signature.png]Catiwen[/charsig]

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Interesting. I suspect this issue will disappear as you level, since your stats and dps will increase much faster than your heralds. Back in the day, getting the archer at 56 was a huge deal; sounds like getting them at 30 now has the archer a bit too strong if they're reliably pulling mobs off of you like that. I only very rarely (and momentarily at most) had that issue in the 60s years ago, for what little that's worth in this post-HD world.

    Tinkering with my captain (level 76, reasonably well geared by level 75 endgame standards since that's when I last did much with him) since HD, I'm finding that my own dps is through the roof and the herald just isn't relevant for dps. I could use the archer like I used to, but if I'm two- or three-shotting things, it really doesn't matter. So I just have a herald of war tagging along after me for the damage buff and (if I ever need it) for the heal he can give me...

    Also, you're not going to solo Tomb of Elendil until probably ~70ish. The silly turtle at the end is an incredible pain to deal with unless you have a burglar and a full (or nearly full - need at least a 4y FM IIRC?) group for the FM to remove the incoming damage buff it has.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_Howell View Post
    Interesting. I suspect this issue will disappear as you level, since your stats and dps will increase much faster than your heralds. Back in the day, getting the archer at 56 was a huge deal; sounds like getting them at 30 now has the archer a bit too strong if they're reliably pulling mobs off of you like that. I only very rarely (and momentarily at most) had that issue in the 60s years ago, for what little that's worth in this post-HD world.

    Tinkering with my captain (level 76, reasonably well geared by level 75 endgame standards since that's when I last did much with him) since HD, I'm finding that my own dps is through the roof and the herald just isn't relevant for dps. I could use the archer like I used to, but if I'm two- or three-shotting things, it really doesn't matter. So I just have a herald of war tagging along after me for the damage buff and (if I ever need it) for the heal he can give me...

    Also, you're not going to solo Tomb of Elendil until probably ~70ish. The silly turtle at the end is an incredible pain to deal with unless you have a burglar and a full (or nearly full - need at least a 4y FM IIRC?) group for the FM to remove the incoming damage buff it has.
    I'm trying to level faster, but it's such a hassle going back-and-forth all over the Trollshaws right now. :P But it's good to know things improve for the Captain. I never expected them to be deeps machines, I rolled one when they first came out because I saw them as portable buff and heal machines like Pallies were back in old vanilla WoW, but here's hopin. Right now I just want to get to mounted combat, but Gods what a slog.

    I'll probably end up skipping Elendil quest then, if that's the case. I'm trying to get all the story as I go, but population on my server is pretty low at my play-times, and I just never had the patience or interest in a Kinship. : / Appreciate that heads up though, would've been madder'n hell if I had gotten all the way through only to face down that turtle and die. hehe
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0a20b00000010691b/01008/signature.png]Catiwen[/charsig]

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong View Post
    I'm trying to level faster, but it's such a hassle going back-and-forth all over the Trollshaws right now. :P But it's good to know things improve for the Captain. I never expected them to be deeps machines, I rolled one when they first came out because I saw them as portable buff and heal machines like Pallies were back in old vanilla WoW, but here's hopin. Right now I just want to get to mounted combat, but Gods what a slog.

    I'll probably end up skipping Elendil quest then, if that's the case. I'm trying to get all the story as I go, but population on my server is pretty low at my play-times, and I just never had the patience or interest in a Kinship. : / Appreciate that heads up though, would've been madder'n hell if I had gotten all the way through only to face down that turtle and die. hehe
    the archer scales poorly, but so do the other heralds. at 95 the melee heralds are not breaking 100 dmg with their auto attacks. the archer is doing 2-4x that, but still laughable.


    the back and forth nature of the epic questline is EXTREMELY annoying and an inefficient way to design it. it's really bad in moria, and moria is rife with mobs that debuff your attack speed which for a captain can be hell to use battle-readied.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Teyaha View Post
    Teyaha

    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong
    <I'm trying to level faster, but it's such a hassle going back-and-forth all over the Trollshaws right now. :P But it's good to know things improve for the Captain. I never expected them to be deeps machines, I rolled one when they first came out because I saw them as portable buff and heal machines like Pallies were back in old vanilla WoW, but here's hopin. Right now I just want to get to mounted combat, but Gods what a slog.

    I'll probably end up skipping Elendil quest then, if that's the case. I'm trying to get all the story as I go, but population on my server is pretty low at my play-times, and I just never had the patience or interest in a Kinship. : / Appreciate that heads up though, would've been madder'n hell if I had gotten all the way through only to face down that turtle and die. hehe>

    the archer scales poorly, but so do the other heralds. at 95 the melee heralds are not breaking 100 dmg with their auto attacks. the archer is doing 2-4x that, but still laughable.

    the back and forth nature of the epic questline is EXTREMELY annoying and an inefficient way to design it. it's really bad in moria, and moria is rife with mobs that debuff your attack speed which for a captain can be hell to use battle-readied.
    I play in yellow spec line when I solo so I hadn't considered that maybe he was pulling mobs off you (my threat shout forces 6 nearby foes to attack only me). Sorry about that. Scaling instnaces give better XP for leveling than skirms or landscape. If you own the North Downs, maybe get a group together and get the Fornost instances done so that not only will the Shadow instance be available for later on, but also, it makes leveling a lot less painful when you can do it on Elites rather than Normals. Unlike other games, this one increases and multiplies the rewards instead of dividing them if you group.

    (The only thing I still miss about Everquest is that I can't fly here. I sometimes log in there just so I can fly, amazing how much I miss it.)

    Interrupt, attack speed and dots I can't remove will still get my new Cappy killed even in Annuminas. Though that place is a horror of oddly placed different level creatures. The wandering purples make me wanna scream sometimes. Not fun. Anyway, at the 45-50 level, Annuminas is a great place to get lots of XP from quests.. Olcalwe (I can't spell it sorry) is a questgiver that just follows you around and gives you quick little "find 6 flags and burn them" quests that are closeby and at my level, 44ish, they reward around 5500 xp each. Just watch out for the wandering purples as I said... they're signature 49-ish level. Ouchie.

    Annuminas taught me that although we've been buffed, we're not immortal, hehe. When people ask, "how are you getting killed", the answer is a simple Annuminas for me.

    Another good reason to be a tinker... tokens to remove dread are way easier to get if you make them yourself. I see them on the auction at 1 for a gold piece and think... really? But then, I have a max tinker and all my alts carry a stack of tokens, so my viewpoint is probably different on that.

    Annuminas is part of Evendim quest pack, just to save you the trouble of finding out the hard way whether or not you need to buy it.

    My favorite instance cheat sheet: http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/World_Instance
    Last edited by gripply; Jan 08 2014 at 06:43 PM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong View Post
    He doesn't pull for me, he pulls OFF me. That was my initial concern, that I wasn't doing enough damage compared to him ( seriously, lvl 40 with 1k bursts? ), but then again maybe going into red adds enough damage to off-set this and I'm simply not playing to my chosen strengths. I tried healing him at first, but he quite simply dies far too fast. With only 800 health to my 2800, he's more of a hinderence against groups or strong mobs that I can't carve into fast enough.

    But it is obvious I was playing off-kilter given my situation, I was mainly interested if Archers did this normally or if I was just playing too defensively. I've gone back to my Herald. The damage is a bit less, well actually a LOT less, but I've got more control over the ebb and flow. I suppose I'll pull him out in Skirmishes or when hunting, and play a bit smarter with my flag-wavers.
    only happens as blue or red line at low levels.

    after moria he won't hold anything from you.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by chazzstrong View Post
    So, while I've been playing LotRO off and on for a few years now, I've never really committed to a class to high-end content. The back-and-forth questing always gets to me, and I wander off to play something else and sorta forget about it.

    ANYwho, I finally reached a level with my Captain ( favorite class thus far ) where I can use the Archer Herald. A DPS pet is sorely needed, as I like to run a heal / deeps hybrid, and typically gain in survivability what I lack in damage. However this Archer...he makes me look bad. I do, with a halberd and Might stacked, about 300-400 damage with big hits. He does over 1k, and he does it often and MUCH faster than my attacks. I never really felt my damage was lacking until this twerp, and while the first and obvious fix is to just switch back to the standard-bearers for now, is this typical for the Archer pet?

    It wouldn't be so bad if he wasn't constantly pulling my target off of me, only to die in 2 hits, but the situations just seem suited to annoy me to no-end. Does he get more viable, or am I stuck with the hobos purely because they can take 4-5 hits before dying?

    Oh, and another really, REALLY annoying bug...when he shoots an enemy from behind me, sometimes the enemy will run the opposite direction, via some pathing error, and end up aggroing everything around him into the fight. I had to give up on the Tomb of Elendil quest for his sword, because I couldn't solo the instance in Evendim. One mob was literally pulling the entire instance.



    In short: Hobobow is starting to piss me off.
    blue line has innate -threat. of course he will pull from you at low levels.

 

 

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