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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    My Home is the Moors, roaming around .....
    Posts
    421

    Fiar play within the Moors - or NOT

    Below is a ticket i have sent to GM's as well as other channels asking for an explaination regarding fair play within the Moors and how htey think it is somewhat a balanced state of affairs.


    **************
    Dear Sir,

    Please can you tell me how you think the Moors are some what a fair state right now?

    We had a small group of 6 creeps agaisnt a single warden and we spent 15 minutes without killing him at all!!!

    We then tried another freep and the same result - all the freep classes are basically GODS and this is killing the Moors wiith your incompetence and poor attitude in making the Moors a fair battlefield.

    I was a VIP since the very 1st day it went live and I have now cancelled my subs and will not renew at all. Will certainly not purchse HD as there is sweet FA for creeps.

    This is a complaint regarding fair play, poor developement and the poor customer service that you as a company is providing its customers fairly. Everything is in favour of the freeps and nothing in the creeps favour. You have ruined the best part of the game and that is a shame.

    Several very long serving Creeps have left, are leaving and will never return becuse of this imcompetence and very poor balance that will NEVER EVER be close to give fair fights.

    A very unhappy annoyed long serving ex-VIP
    ******************

    All tickets were simply closed and ignored which I find even more infuriating and shows how small minded Turbine are. Creeps and the Moors is not wanted!!
    Last edited by BiteMarks; Sep 17 2013 at 06:42 PM.

  2. #2
    The question is, what are you going to do now? Wardens are OP, I think you'll find most people agree with that even wardens. Honest freeps no they are overpowered in compare to creep classes. Honest players know this has been the case in LOTRO for years. So the question is what are you going to do? You can appeal to the forums, been there myself, when you care it can be gratifying or extremely frustrating. The sad reality is the best possible solution (once you give up on turbine) is to make the most of your time. Identify what it is that you enjoy about the moors and try to create those conditions as much as you possibly can. When you cant, log off and do something else let the warden left with no one to kill figure out why he has no one to pvp against. Now ideally, creeps would get a buff. Wargs would be a little thicker skinned or much higher dps (its a burst class) WL's would get DPS buffs if they trait that way, not the #### dps on shield bash I mean big hits (4k+). That's just two off hand that come to mind, but I have minimal faith in turbine when it comes to their PvP offering so, I defer to the underlined portion of my reply.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Grothum
    Posts
    387
    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgrum View Post
    Identify what it is that you enjoy about the moors and try to create those conditions as much as you possibly can.
    ^This....if possible at all. In my opinion you need to be slightly autistic/massively masochistic to muster that 'singleminded' determination that's required to play full time creep these days. Or at least to be able to have fun in The Moors outside the social aspect. That said, I'm actually having fun in The Moors running around solo. Granted, I'm playing a rvr and can blow up the majority of pies I meet, but that's not really the point. Point is I located a niché in The Moors where I fit in and are able to have some fun and occasionally interesting fights!

    Oh, and I unsub'd of course, some time ago now. That helps tremendously, I highly recommend that. Would love to sub again, but Turbine needs to get their **** together first....but I'm sure they will do just that in HerpsDerp.

    Anyways, moaning at the poor sods at support wont do much, hardly their fault to begin with, they just (try to) do their jobs like the rest of us mongrel slaves of modern society.
    Last edited by poxnoxious; Sep 17 2013 at 10:18 PM. Reason: Because I can!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    285
    Just saying, if 6 creeps couldn't kill 1 warden, at least one of you were mindlessly staying in range to allow them to get gambits off in whatever stance they were in. And if it took 15 minutes, if any of you understood this mechanic you had plenty of time to explain it to whomever was allowing the warden to heal which leads me to believe none of you understood this mechanic which means I have no sympathy for you.

    Yes, they're OP but not as OP as bad players allow them to be.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    France
    Posts
    749
    Quote Originally Posted by Stepbrother View Post
    Just saying, if 6 creeps couldn't kill 1 warden, at least one of you were mindlessly staying in range to allow them to get gambits off in whatever stance they were in. And if it took 15 minutes, if any of you understood this mechanic you had plenty of time to explain it to whomever was allowing the warden to heal which leads me to believe none of you understood this mechanic which means I have no sympathy for you.

    Yes, they're OP but not as OP as bad players allow them to be.
    Yep. I'm no big fan of wardens in the moors, but what irks me most creep side when dealing with one is other creeps who just have *no* idea what's going on and end up helping the warden.

    It's not rocket science too, all you really need to know is that they get 30s of very high mitigations through a skill called 'Defiant Challenge' - swirling spears above their heads, it's hard to miss -, that you shouldn't stun them when they use it (prevents the cooldown from being set - bug, unless it's been fixed recently), and that if they are the healing variety, you shouldn't stay in melee range if you're targeted or they'll spam heal gambits.

    Don't heal them, recognize Defiant Challenge, remember it lasts 30s before their pants are down, and next thing you know, you don't need half a raid to kill a warden.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sunset Strip
    Posts
    807
    Quote Originally Posted by Equendil View Post
    Yep. I'm no big fan of wardens in the moors
    Mmm, yeah.. I know some people responsible for that.. Mmm

    lol ;P

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Equendil View Post
    Yep. I'm no big fan of wardens in the moors, but what irks me most creep side when dealing with one is other creeps who just have *no* idea what's going on and end up helping the warden.

    It's not rocket science too, all you really need to know is that they get 30s of very high mitigations through a skill called 'Defiant Challenge' - swirling spears above their heads, it's hard to miss -, that you shouldn't stun them when they use it (prevents the cooldown from being set - bug, unless it's been fixed recently), and that if they are the healing variety, you shouldn't stay in melee range if you're targeted or they'll spam heal gambits.

    Don't heal them, recognize Defiant Challenge, remember it lasts 30s before their pants are down, and next thing you know, you don't need half a raid to kill a warden.
    This is all well and good but what if the group was melee heavy?

    Not much a melee heavy group can do against a Warden. Even if they have some ranged DPS, a smart Warden can just seek out Creep NPC's to get their heals. The best thing to do sometimes is to just leave them be and walk away, but that is hardly good for PvP now is it?

    They are a broken class, it's been that way for quite a long time now. If Turbine was interested in "fixing them" they certainly would/could have by now.

    Something like; no stance dancing while in combat would have worked nicely.
    "the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except those that sang best" - Henry VanDyke

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Stepbrother View Post
    Yes, they're OP but not as OP as bad players allow them to be.
    If rep still existed, you and equendil would get it, Milty.

    Is the sky falling somewhere?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    France
    Posts
    749
    Quote Originally Posted by BiteMarks View Post
    All tickets were simply closed and ignored which I find even more infuriating and shows how small minded Turbine are.
    People at support aren't paid to listen to people whining. Valuable lesson here: they don't have to.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Meldos shed
    Posts
    260
    Quote Originally Posted by BiteMarks View Post
    We had a small group of 6 creeps agaisnt a single warden and we spent 15 minutes without killing him at all!!!
    what 6 creeps? 6 rank0 defilers and warleaders? then he would probly even win
    6 rank6 defilers and warleaders? you'd probly do it still but it will be long fight!
    a normal fellow of little bit of everything. Come on then you did something wrong. I mean then you just don't know how to kill a warden. It takes some minutes to zerg a warden but still it aint that hard.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    I'm too drunk to taste this chicken
    Posts
    1,485
    Quote Originally Posted by BiteMarks View Post
    All tickets were simply closed and ignored which I find even more infuriating and shows how small minded Turbine are. Creeps and the Moors is not wanted!!
    Ugh, that's just ridiculous. That GM should have perma banned that warden on the spot and given your group a glass of warm milk to help calm you all down. What an outrage.

  12. #12
    If 6 of you can't kill 1 Warden then it's your fault not Turbines. Learn to play your classes. All you need is 1 warg, 1 defiler and any 1 or 2 dps classes.

    Flayer root > Blight + Healing curse > dps and he'll burn DC and NS. Kite DC for 30 seconds and then repeat. It shouldn't take more than a min. If you have 6 Reavers just stack up bleeds, disarm, hit 6 impales at once followed by DS and he'll drop like a rock. If you have 6 wargs you can chain fear him for 30 seconds and destroy him. 6 BAs? He should have 0 armour, KD > 6 VT > 6 Revenge gg.

    tl;dr: Wardens are OP, but creeps are fkn stupid as well.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    258
    Quote Originally Posted by Shintagh View Post
    tl;dr: Wardens are OP, but creeps are fkn stupid as well.
    ^This. If only creeps would spend a bit more time trying to get better, instead of crying on the forums..

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Lothlorien
    Posts
    1,686
    Quote Originally Posted by BiteMarks View Post
    Below is a ticket i have sent to GM's as well as other channels asking for an explaination regarding fair play within the Moors and how htey think it is somewhat a balanced state of affairs.


    **************
    Dear Sir,

    Please can you tell me how you think the Moors are some what a fair state right now?

    We had a small group of 6 creeps agaisnt a single warden and we spent 15 minutes without killing him at all!!!

    We then tried another freep and the same result - all the freep classes are basically GODS and this is killing the Moors wiith your incompetence and poor attitude in making the Moors a fair battlefield.

    I was a VIP since the very 1st day it went live and I have now cancelled my subs and will not renew at all. Will certainly not purchse HD as there is sweet FA for creeps.

    This is a complaint regarding fair play, poor developement and the poor customer service that you as a company is providing its customers fairly. Everything is in favour of the freeps and nothing in the creeps favour. You have ruined the best part of the game and that is a shame.

    Several very long serving Creeps have left, are leaving and will never return becuse of this imcompetence and very poor balance that will NEVER EVER be close to give fair fights.

    A very unhappy annoyed long serving ex-VIP
    ******************

    All tickets were simply closed and ignored which I find even more infuriating and shows how small minded Turbine are. Creeps and the Moors is not wanted!!
    I agree with you Bitemarks, that Moors is very ridiculous right now, but what did you really expect the GM's to do to the Warden? Ban him for playing the class that Turbine offered?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shintagh View Post
    but creeps are fkn stupid as well.
    One could say the same about many freeps.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Ireland
    Posts
    186
    [QUOTE=Shintagh;6926629]If 6 of you can't kill 1 Warden then it's your fault not Turbines. Learn to play your classes. All you need is 1 warg, 1 defiler and any 1 or 2 dps classes. QUOTE]


    erm...lol, this here is a prime example of whats wrong. Even this guy says is "All you need is 1 warg, 1 defiler and any 1 or 2 dps classes". <<<I know whats stupid and its not Creeps!

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Waterford, Ireland
    Posts
    3,401
    The wardens who believe that creep skill is at fault, not wardens being overpowered... Amusing. Never could you find a more solid example of fundamental attribution error.
    Anyone who believes warden is even close to balanced is either completely blind, or has highly limited knowledge of the meaning of the term 'balance', or both.

    I can easily outplay and outmaneouvre the vast majority of freeps, however that doesn't mean I can beat them. Pure numbers are against me. You can't beat maths no matter how good you are, unless your opponent is very bad (which many wardens are), but even bad wardens are powerful.

    Playing a weaker character on a weaker faction makes it more likely, logically, that you will be of a higher skill level than a person who plays an easymode, spoonfed, god-mode button masher class on a faction of similar description.

    ''That which isn't constantly challenged grows weak''. Tell me, wardens, is it a constant challenge to defeat your opponents?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Squelcher View Post
    The wardens who believe that creep skill is at fault, not wardens being overpowered... Amusing. Never could you find a more solid example of fundamental attribution error.
    Anyone who believes warden is even close to balanced is either completely blind, or has highly limited knowledge of the meaning of the term 'balance', or both.

    I can easily outplay and outmaneouvre the vast majority of freeps, however that doesn't mean I can beat them. Pure numbers are against me. You can't beat maths no matter how good you are, unless your opponent is very bad (which many wardens are), but even bad wardens are powerful.

    Playing a weaker character on a weaker faction makes it more likely, logically, that you will be of a higher skill level than a person who plays an easymode, spoonfed, god-mode button masher class on a faction of similar description.

    ''That which isn't constantly challenged grows weak''. Tell me, wardens, is it a constant challenge to defeat your opponents?
    Who are you even talking to? I'm pretty much the only active warden in this thread and every post I've made has the clear admission that wardens are obviously OP. I play the most op class in the game and my current one has a 1.5 kill to death ratio. Ill skip the claims of being god's gift to wardening but I don't think you'll find many people on E who think I'm a bad player. Care to share your war-tab and explain to me how that shows you chalenging yourself more than me? The best II can tell you're looking for an excuse to call yourself good without having to back it up with facts.

    @pox: I've witnessed a reaver win a 5v1 against terrible freeps, does that make that class broken? That there are possibilities for skilled play to overcome sheer numbers is good design, not bad. I just wish it was more readily availible to more classes.

    Also, the example shintagh provides is a fantastic way for a 3 or 4 man to not kill a shield warden.

 

 

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