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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    West Coast
    Posts
    202

    Threat Stance Vs. Block Stance

    Hey Guard people...
    Apologies if this has been posted somewhere else recently.
    I have been tanking raids a lot more recently and am occasionally having some problems with threat. It's never a huge deal, as I can usually get it back, and mostly it's on instances like BFE where I am fighting against 10 other people dumping all the DPS they can into a boss. I haven't seriously tanked instances since Moria. I took a break from the game before Mirk came out and have been back for a little while now but have just recently started tanking again. Back in Moria there was still the debate about threat vs block, and I always tanked in block stance. I am doing so now as well. I have a 2A axe that is maxed on the DPS with 3 stars. I have a 2A belt that unfortunately only has the 1% inherent threat boost, but I have the threat boost legacy maxed on the belt.

    All that to say, is it possible still to effectively tank in block stance with top tier DPSers in your group, or do I need to start going threat stance to effectively hold in all situations?
    Grimfel - 90 Guard/Bellarieth - 85 Rune Keeper/Beoros - 70 Captain/Beorgarn - 30 Warden

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    2,100
    Quote Originally Posted by JehovahSoldier View Post
    Hey Guard people...
    Apologies if this has been posted somewhere else recently.
    I have been tanking raids a lot more recently and am occasionally having some problems with threat. It's never a huge deal, as I can usually get it back, and mostly it's on instances like BFE where I am fighting against 10 other people dumping all the DPS they can into a boss. I haven't seriously tanked instances since Moria. I took a break from the game before Mirk came out and have been back for a little while now but have just recently started tanking again. Back in Moria there was still the debate about threat vs block, and I always tanked in block stance. I am doing so now as well. I have a 2A axe that is maxed on the DPS with 3 stars. I have a 2A belt that unfortunately only has the 1% inherent threat boost, but I have the threat boost legacy maxed on the belt.

    All that to say, is it possible still to effectively tank in block stance with top tier DPSers in your group, or do I need to start going threat stance to effectively hold in all situations?
    Going to be really tough to keep things going in block stance if you have top tier dps gunning against you. Just use threat stance. I also try to get my crit up to a decent level and use the Armor of the Erebor Defender 2 piece bonus for Shield-Blow and then the 4 piece Barad Guldur armor for its Threat Over Time bonus. Also don't worry too much about your axe and DPS. Your main taunts are litany of defiance, shield taunt, vexing blow, shield-blow (since it's a fast hit). I even toss in fray the edge since it's another ToT.

    Don't feel ashamed to use Challenge if you're feeling "on the edge" and are about to be surpassed by the DPS while waiting on a cooldown for litany or shield taunt.

    Don't forget to work in Whirling Retaliation to leech some threat from people, too!

    In the worst cases you might need to use Engage and Challenge the Darkness to copy the threat and put yourself out in front for a bit. Just make sure that if you're going to do that you have a litany or shield taunt ready to stack on top of it quickly.
    Chromite (Hunter) - Grumbletocks (Guardian) on Landroval, Appendage (Hunter) on Brandywine

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by ChromiteSwiftpaw View Post
    Going to be really tough to keep things going in block stance if you have top tier dps gunning against you. Just use threat stance. I also try to get my crit up to a decent level and use the Armor of the Erebor Defender 2 piece bonus for Shield-Blow and then the 4 piece Barad Guldur armor for its Threat Over Time bonus. Also don't worry too much about your axe and DPS. Your main taunts are litany of defiance, shield taunt, vexing blow, shield-blow (since it's a fast hit). I even toss in fray the edge since it's another ToT.

    Don't feel ashamed to use Challenge if you're feeling "on the edge" and are about to be surpassed by the DPS while waiting on a cooldown for litany or shield taunt.

    Don't forget to work in Whirling Retaliation to leech some threat from people, too!

    In the worst cases you might need to use Engage and Challenge the Darkness to copy the threat and put yourself out in front for a bit. Just make sure that if you're going to do that you have a litany or shield taunt ready to stack on top of it quickly.
    This thread could/will quickly become bogged down in guardian epeen. At present it is essentially impossible to tank against proper dps while in block stance. Between RoI launch and the ToO update guardian threat was way too high on shield skills, so threat stance was essentially useless, but obviously that has changed. A few instances allow tanking in block stance, but those instances require different strategies than the current "zerg everything" mentality(BfE t2/c requires pretty slow/controlled dps, so it gets quite easy to do without threat stance).

    If you're pugging, and you yourself are skilled, chances are you'll encounter little trouble, no matter the stance. Most dps players are bad, and there really isn't anything in the game atm that can punish a raid too severely for a little threat leak. But if you run with/across those who actually know their classes and how to gear/trait/play them effectively, you'll run into massive problems. Without threat stance you're sacrificing a 28% bonus on every bit of threat you put out.

    Generally, if you don't threat stance one of two things is true: 1) your dps'ers are bad and should feel bad, 2) your dps'ers are good and conscientious and throttling their output, in which case you're holding them back and should feel bad

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    West Coast
    Posts
    202
    That's what I needed to hear, thanks gents (or ladies possibly ;])!
    Grimfel - 90 Guard/Bellarieth - 85 Rune Keeper/Beoros - 70 Captain/Beorgarn - 30 Warden

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    2,100
    Quote Originally Posted by thefamilyosc View Post
    Between RoI launch and the ToO update guardian threat was way too high on shield skills, so threat stance was essentially useless, but obviously that has changed.
    Hmm now you've made me curious. I never saw that as the case with guardian threat as I could still pull off guards on my main (Hunter). Although I _did_ see one bugged case where someone posted Third Age Belt pics where the guardian was in a skirmish and could basically blow on a mob and it would stick to him.

    That would have been fun heh.
    Chromite (Hunter) - Grumbletocks (Guardian) on Landroval, Appendage (Hunter) on Brandywine

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ChromiteSwiftpaw View Post
    Hmm now you've made me curious. I never saw that as the case with guardian threat as I could still pull off guards on my main (Hunter). Although I _did_ see one bugged case where someone posted Third Age Belt pics where the guardian was in a skirmish and could basically blow on a mob and it would stick to him.

    That would have been fun heh.
    Yeah, the couple months between RoI launch and the Orthanc instance cluster were probably the height of guardian threat(at least since I'd started playing). Graal had famously decided we "were in a good place" and just bumped up threat behind the scenes to compensate for the stat cap removal. It wasn't as high as, say, Warden threat currently is relative to everything else, but it was significantly higher than it has been since. Of course, the way the majority of guardians play a 1000% modifier wouldn't be enough.

  7. #7
    Solo... it is Block stance all the way. Never occurred to me to tank in Block. Even in Threat, reckless players can pull aggro off of you.

  8. #8
    general rule of thumb: Always threat stance. Block stance is like the black sheep of the family, never been properly upgraded to counter the immensly increased dps. Then again, instances have becoming so much easier you won't even notice that 5% in block and you don't need it.

    there's atm I know of 2 exceptions and of one of these it's a consideration, but thats erebor t2c and erebor t2. Our kin solo tanks both trolls and then block stance is just a must in t2c. Due to the balancing for dps on both trolls etc they cant go full out so you'll stay on top and you want that max capped block then. In erebor t2 it's optional imo, if you feel comfortable with then go block, otherwise threat will do just as fine. Anything else I cannot remember ever dropping to block stance other then maybe a temporary drop to increase defences if the tough gets going. But from my experience especially since the punishments called inductions on swapping stances I kinda never swapped anymore and only go threat. Unless erebor t2c.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Carson City, Nevada
    Posts
    467
    Quote Originally Posted by Aineas. View Post
    general rule of thumb: Always threat stance. Block stance is like the black sheep of the family, never been properly upgraded to counter the immensly increased dps. Then again, instances have becoming so much easier you won't even notice that 5% in block and you don't need it.

    there's atm I know of 2 exceptions and of one of these it's a consideration, but thats erebor t2c and erebor t2. Our kin solo tanks both trolls and then block stance is just a must in t2c. Due to the balancing for dps on both trolls etc they cant go full out so you'll stay on top and you want that max capped block then. In erebor t2 it's optional imo, if you feel comfortable with then go block, otherwise threat will do just as fine. Anything else I cannot remember ever dropping to block stance other then maybe a temporary drop to increase defences if the tough gets going. But from my experience especially since the punishments called inductions on swapping stances I kinda never swapped anymore and only go threat. Unless erebor t2c.

    Pretty much agree with all of this.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/032020000000a6424/01003/signature.png]Carthir[/charsig]

 

 

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