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  1. #26
    judging by the fact that each trait tree is named after our stances and the champs are losing theirs, I am assuming stances will go away. I am really curious how this will effect ranged dps. Will we still have the jav skills or will there only be gambits we get by traiting into the assailment tree? Will we get a new jav builder/masteries and they change shield/fist to be ranged? I went back over the dev chat and there is no mention in any question about stances. I have a feeling we are losing the fun of changing between melee dps , tank, and range dps at will in combat. Though honestly it does makes us seriously overpowered to a degree, but its really also what makes us unique as a class.
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  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by gelleg View Post
    judging by the fact that each trait tree is named after our stances and the champs are losing theirs, I am assuming stances will go away. I am really curious how this will effect ranged dps. Will we still have the jav skills or will there only be gambits we get by traiting into the assailment tree? Will we get a new jav builder/masteries and they change shield/fist to be ranged? I went back over the dev chat and there is no mention in any question about stances. I have a feeling we are losing the fun of changing between melee dps , tank, and range dps at will in combat. Though honestly it does makes us seriously overpowered to a degree, but its really also what makes us unique as a class.
    I wouldn't be so sure. Champs are losing their stance because they'd really only use one stance per trait line. Wardens stances aren't as tied to trait lines as the champs were, and wardens switch stances much more frequently, so I could see them keeping stances.

    We know at least some classes will be keeping stances, as that was specified by a dev to not count for the ~20 skills they quoted everyone would have. Out of the 9 classes, 5 of them have stances and one has been confirmed to be losing those stances. Considering the fact that warden stances probably change their playstyle the most compared to the other three, I'd say that's decent odds that warden keeps theirs.
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinDragon View Post
    I wouldn't be so sure. Champs are losing their stance because they'd really only use one stance per trait line. Wardens stances aren't as tied to trait lines as the champs were, and wardens switch stances much more frequently, so I could see them keeping stances.

    We know at least some classes will be keeping stances, as that was specified by a dev to not count for the ~20 skills they quoted everyone would have. Out of the 9 classes, 5 of them have stances and one has been confirmed to be losing those stances. Considering the fact that warden stances probably change their playstyle the most compared to the other three, I'd say that's decent odds that warden keeps theirs.
    I switch stances on my champ all the time. I also do so on my guardian as well, even with the added induction. Back in my wadening days I also would swap regularly on my warden. Just one less option in combat making the class[es] simpler to play. Some will like it, others won't. I'm looking forward to the updates to all of the classes. The warden is tough to balance so it will be interesting.

  4. #29
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    If it were technically feasible (and we know Warden class development operates on an even tighter shoestring than the rest of the game, since changes or improvements usually can't be amortized over the other 8 classes), allowing Wardens to change between spear and javelin builders/gambits more fluidly would eliminate the need for separate melee/ranged stances (and make Assailment-style play much more attractive in PvE).

    Having done that, the tanking stance and damage stances could then be rolled into the trait lines pretty easily.

  5. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by LagunaD View Post
    Having done that, the tanking stance and damage stances could then be rolled into the trait lines pretty easily.
    If this happens and they still link things like HoTs and buffs to the stance/trait tree I am done. I switch back and forth, part of the fun of the class. Not as worried about the damage or ICMR/ICPR as the effects of the gambits.
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  6. #31
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    https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...E2%80%99s-deep

    As many of you know, threat will be seeing some significant changes in the future
    given the threat revamp, it was decided that they were certainly going to need more of an active, survivability-based playstyle to compensate for the future ease of threat management
    I thought easy mode threat and defensive rotations where warden territory. Also, guards getting a full bleed DPS build is interesting as well. Two handed weapon blocks should be cool for the OP/Fighter off tank line. I'd like to hear more about this threat revamp though.

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterion View Post
    https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...E2%80%99s-deep





    I thought easy mode threat and defensive rotations where warden territory. Also, guards getting a full bleed DPS build is interesting as well. Two handed weapon blocks should be cool for the OP/Fighter off tank line. I'd like to hear more about this threat revamp though.
    Since we're light on details, this is mostly speculation, but...

    i see more potential tradeoffs in guard tanking between threat and defense than warden's currently have. If every use of shield-swipe/bash/smash/litany/shield-taunt builds a stack of 'fortification' that stacks up to 5 times, or 10, or whatever number, and can be cashed in for extra threat at the loss of the defensive buffs, it will be a nonetheless straightforward system. I think this concept is actually a great one for guards, but its nonetheless a straightforward one. Warden territory (as of now) is a far more complex stacking of generally unrelated buffs and threat skills, each line has a pairing that work together, but the fist shield line has no relation to the sh spear line, which has no relation to shield mastery, and no relation to shield fist, plus the currently wide variety of sources for threat generation (yes we all know EoB can do almost everything, but it doesn't have to).

    A well geared guard already caps mits, block, and parry, with an ok evade rating and 50+% crit D. I don't think i see what fortification can add to this beyond some evade (which doesn't fit with the name, or the dev description of the class) unless guard's ward is being axed or nerfed. Partial b/p/e mits, maybe? Either way, a currently full blue-line guard is thoroughly passively stacked defensively, adding to this defensive capacity seems like a great way to relegate cappies and champs aspiring to tanking roles to the sidelines again, and warden's continuing to have insane self-heals to keep pace (and thus face-roll everything besides high end raid bosses due to the awkward scaling nature of self-heals).

    The Dev diary on all these threat changes we are somehow supposed to already know about needs to come out yesterday. Yet another thing is being revamped with almost no communication. If they add threat meters, I'm going to rage.
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  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by spelunker View Post
    If they add threat meters, I'm going to rage.
    Yes it is all speculation. For all we know they are going to shake up all of the mitigation, inc healing, b/p/e caps and crit defense again. Exciting times.

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by artax33 View Post
    If this happens and they still link things like HoTs and buffs to the stance/trait tree I am done. I switch back and forth, part of the fun of the class. Not as worried about the damage or ICMR/ICPR as the effects of the gambits.
    Interesting - it might bring me back. I hated when each stance had it's own set of gambit effects. I guess time will tell.
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  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeger_Wulf View Post
    Interesting - it might bring me back. I hated when each stance had it's own set of gambit effects. I guess time will tell.
    I'd love it if we only had one stance, but they greatly increased the number of gambits we have so that all roles could be fulfilled without stance dancing. I just don't see that happening with the reduction in skill totals coming with HD though. Reduced utility and options is a bad thing for this class, and I'd rather have to stance dance for it than flat out lose it.
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  11. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Legonist View Post
    Ill drop the bomb for those who don't know the news yet. GAMBITS ARE NO MORE! I also heard the tanking system is broken too but i don't know how over exadurated that is.

    Also the warden forums in the beta section are in chaos from what i have heard (although im not in beta).
    I find it disconcerting that I'm seriously considering the possibility that this isn't a trolling post.
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  12. #37
    If it isn't, may Steve protect us.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hundolf View Post
    First off, hobbit wardens are the worst.
    Yeah... We don't like you either .

    Jk.

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  14. #39
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    For those who have played the class like myself since it first came into being we all love the advanced nature of the class. From a Dev point of view the complicated nature of the classes gambit system has always made it complicated to balance against the others. I wonder how many more manhours have been poured into the Warden class when compared to the others during their existence.

    It would be logical seeing as all the classes are getting total revamps to make the Warden class more easier to develop and balance. This is not to say i like what they are doing or perhaps plan to, i am not in the beta so i wont know till November what they have done. But by the post above saying they have removed the gambit system....well i can understand why they might.

    I really hope they don't break the class or worse remove the gambit system.

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  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legonist View Post
    Ill drop the bomb for those who don't know the news yet. GAMBITS ARE NO MORE! I also heard the tanking system is broken too but i don't know how over exaggerated that is.

    Also the warden forums in the beta section are in chaos from what i have heard (although im not in beta).
    This had better not be the case..

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Legonist View Post
    Ill drop the bomb for those who don't know the news yet. GAMBITS ARE NO MORE! I also heard the tanking system is broken too but i don't know how over exadurated that is.

    Also the warden forums in the beta section are in chaos from what i have heard (although im not in beta).
    repeating for emphasis and because i can't believe it: GAMBITS ARE NO MORE ?!?!?!? D: D: D: D:

    but but but....my warden....favorite class?....was it because he was too OP? D:


    please say this isn't so turbine. please. i love my warden D:
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  17. #42
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    I will cry if they get rid of gambits. I've set everything up so that my fingers can dance across the keyboard and swiftly build up a gambit. Also they are one of the many things which makes a Warden unique in LOTRO, along with being a medium-armor tank and javelin throwing (in my opinion).
    A warden of Lothlorien meets up a with a rune keeper from Lindon and a friendship is sparked. An elf hunter from Mirkwood finds a minstrel mourning the loss of Edhellen. A captain of Rohan rides to Bree and comes across a burned farm, the only survivor a young woman who'd defended herself with a rusted sword and axe. Thus many adventures begin.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gibraisia View Post
    repeating for emphasis and because i can't believe it: GAMBITS ARE NO MORE ?!?!?!? D: D: D: D:

    but but but....my warden....favorite class?....was it because he was too OP? D:


    please say this isn't so turbine. please. i love my warden D:
    Sigh.. I find even more disconcerting is the lack of response to the Champ and Guardian dev diaries. Stuff like that used to get a huge six page spread of rants and worries. Now, not even a wimper.

    Oh, if you want confirmation of that rumor, look no further than the deletion of the posts on the topic you are concerned about by a mod.

  19. #44
    Does anyone remember the usual time difference between the NDA being lifted, and the XPac going live?
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  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by spelunker View Post
    Does anyone remember the usual time difference between the NDA being lifted, and the XPac going live?
    Not really.. But I do remember a Dev Diary for Wardens on a Friday, with the NDA being lifted the same day, and the XPac coming out on Tuesday, five days later.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlgon View Post
    Not really.. But I do remember a Dev Diary for Wardens on a Friday, with the NDA being lifted the same day, and the XPac coming out on Tuesday, five days later.
    My rough memory of RoI and quick google searchin

    Looks like early June we started hearing news of RoI b/c this thread started https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...-to-the-Warden

    Mid July Closed Beta (I was in).

    August 26, 2011 NDA Lifted

    September 27, 2011 RoI Released

    -------

    I believe you are correct about RoR, I was pretty checked out and didn't really do much testing in the beta.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterion View Post
    My rough memory of RoI and quick google searchin

    Looks like early June we started hearing news of RoI b/c this thread started https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...-to-the-Warden

    Mid July Closed Beta (I was in).

    August 26, 2011 NDA Lifted

    September 27, 2011 RoI Released

    -------

    I believe you are correct about RoR, I was pretty checked out and didn't really do much testing in the beta.
    Sigh. now you made me miss the "good old days" when Turbine cared to let us know specifics about class changes four months ahead of time and devs actually participated/ asked questions in the forums of the classes they were working on before releasing stuff.

    Sorry DE, but you still only have 22 posts.. TOTAL to all your classes.

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Darlgon View Post
    Sigh. now you made me miss the "good old days" when Turbine cared to let us know specifics about class changes four months ahead of time and devs actually participated/ asked questions in the forums of the classes they were working on before releasing stuff.

    Sorry DE, but you still only have 22 posts.. TOTAL to all your classes.
    I wouldn't be shocked if she wasn't our dev anymore. many of the other classes had unanounced dev changes
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by spelunker View Post
    Does anyone remember the usual time difference between the NDA being lifted, and the XPac going live?

    With LM dev diary out today, we have Minis, RKs and wardens to get out. Well.. guess Nov 18 is a month and a half away.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlgon View Post
    With LM dev diary out today, we have Minis, RKs and wardens to get out. Well.. guess Nov 18 is a month and a half away.
    We still aren't going to know much after the dev diary comes out. Maybe when the NDA lifts we can get some true accounts of how each class has changed. I guess I'm just used to Orion's large in-depth dev diaries as opposed to these teaser diaries. After reading the champ, guard, and LM ones I still really don't know what is going on. They gave me some idea of their "direction" but no details.

 

 
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