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  1. #1

    Which parts of Tolkien's works DIDNT you like..

    So we have had an awful lot of threads regarding the (very many) good points of LOTR, but what DIDNT people like? There is always something that niggles away, no matter how good something is. So what does everyone "dislike" about the books (no film discussion here.)? It doesn't have to be that you dislike it at lot, just....doesn't quite appeal as much as the rest of the book.
    My own part that I don't really like is the Breaking of the Fellowship at Amon Hen. For me personally I would have liked a little more detail about what happened to them all, rather than somewhat vague accounts. I understand that the book focuses on the main points of it but I would still have liked more detail.

    Thoughts?
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  2. #2
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    Character depth.
    He made an amazing world and cultures, described exquisite lanscapes, but all the characters seem such one-dimensional, stiff, cardboard cut-out creatures (I was going to say wooden but then I thought of Ents) .
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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by BirdofHermes View Post
    (I was going to say wooden but then I thought of Ents) .
    I love it!!!
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by BirdofHermes View Post
    Character depth.
    He made an amazing world and cultures, described exquisite lanscapes, but all the characters seem such one-dimensional, stiff, cardboard cut-out creatures (I was going to say wooden but then I thought of Ents) .
    I think you've hit exactly on Tolkien's priorities.

    Most important were the languages which then gave rise to the cultures (including the environments/landscapes in which they thrived), next came the mythology and then the history. The characters were simply those necessitated by the languages and cultures and required to move the history along. The individuals, being merely incarnations of their cultures, are going to be one-dimensional of necessity. In the truest sense, it's the cultures that are the real characters in Tolkien.
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  5. #5
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    I haven't read the entire LOTR yet (about 80% through the TT), but so far I can't seem to think of anything that really sticks out that I don't like. I guess the only thing that I'm not too fond of is that when Gandalf comes back his color changes from Grey to White. I sort of feel like the color white on Gandalf too closely resembles that of Saruman. Although Saruman had already changed to the "many colored" by the time Gandalf became Gandalf the White, I still feel like Gandalf should get his own color. I think Green would be a perfect color for him, since it portrays more of a color that has had a rebirth, like new fresh grass in the springtime. Plus, having a color that starts with the letter 'G' goes nicely with Gandalf. Gandalf the Green... that has a nice ring to it!
    Last edited by BackAgainAndThere; Jul 17 2013 at 08:07 PM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by BackAgainAndThere View Post
    I sort of feel like the color white on Gandalf too closely resembles that of Saruman.
    That's kind of the point. Gandalf became what Saruman should have been had he not fallen.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Egorvlad View Post
    That's kind of the point. Gandalf became what Saruman should have been had he not fallen.
    Yeah I understand that part. I don't know, I just sort of get an icky feeling when I think that Gandalf's color used to be a color that Saruman had had once.

  8. #8
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    I don't care for the Tom Bombadil part. Nothing against it at all, my eyes just glaze over when I get to that part. Sometimes I skip to the part where he drops them off just before Bree.
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  9. #9
    For the Two Towers and Return of the King, I found it hard to read about Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli and their journey in the first half where just about all of the action is, and then go on to Frodo and Sam for the second half. That part just seemed to have dragged on, and on, and on.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymphonic View Post
    I don't care for the Tom Bombadil part. Nothing against it at all, my eyes just glaze over when I get to that part. Sometimes I skip to the part where he drops them off just before Bree.
    I'm glad you said it first, lol. I don't care for Tom Bombadil either. Some of it is that he's too much of an enigma. I don't like that he can't be conveniently categorized. I also don't like that he's unwilling to help with the War of the Ring, and he is actually unconcerned regarding it. Then there's the whole singing nonsense to himself all the time even in perilous situations, lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frieja View Post
    I'm glad you said it first, lol. I don't care for Tom Bombadil either. Some of it is that he's too much of an enigma. I don't like that he can't be conveniently categorized. I also don't like that he's unwilling to help with the War of the Ring, and he is actually unconcerned regarding it. Then there's the whole singing nonsense to himself all the time even in perilous situations, lol.
    I can see it now... Tom Bombadil walking down the street, some guys getting mugged. He starts singing some bad song that nobody likes, then, Shank shank it's all over and he takes the guy to Bree.

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    I really can't stand Aragorn becoming king. It's just not the same as Aragorn the Ranger. There could have been some modifications to Eowyn, though overall she's cool. I don't know, the end of it all is just a bit too sad. I wish that Arwen had had more parts so we could better grasp her character. But overall not that many complaints. Oh and btw thanks for starting this thread.
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  13. #13
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    Tom Bombadil in his entirety. He made no sense, his section of the books halted the main plot and was mind-numbingly dull. Also, he's just really annoying.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bethup View Post
    I really can't stand Aragorn becoming king. It's just not the same as Aragorn the Ranger. There could have been some modifications to Eowyn, though overall she's cool. I don't know, the end of it all is just a bit too sad. I wish that Arwen had had more parts so we could better grasp her character.
    I can see that a lot of people would've liked Arwen to be more in it, but (I'm just referencing the movie once here) in the Two Towers, Arwen was originally going to be included into the battle of Hornburg, and they were gonna show what happened to Saruman/Wormtongue. (Did I spell Wormtongue right?) I wish they had that explanation of what happened and that Arwen was there a bit more.

  15. #15
    I am going to jump on the Tom Bombadil dogpile. I can't stand that whole section.

    The point about character depth is well made, also. Still, it's Tom that makes me ill.

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    I have to admit that contrary to what seems to be the general opnion here, I rather liked Tom Bombadil. I agree that Tolkien neglected character depth in favour of cultural depth and would have preferred a bit more depth for the individual characters which would have added to the immersion in my view. My least favourite part of Tolkien's work is the Silmarilion, which has even less character depth and seems flat and two-dimensional, but then it is a history rather than a saga like the LotR.

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    I don't like what I see as inconsistancies.

    For instance, if Elf food and drink were really THAT wonderful, the elf lands would have been completely overrun with Hobbits, even if they tried to shoot them scrambling over the borders. They have that knack of not being seen, ya know.
    Last edited by EmyrSelyf; Jul 25 2013 at 05:51 PM.

  18. #18
    "Is it true, Mr. Frodo, that Elves have drugs the like of which no mortal has ever known? It certainly sounds like it."
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    "Yes, Sam. These are, indeed, High Elves. Sadly, they share not their precious drugs with outsiders. Still, they can be good company, and they sure throw a great barbecue."

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    Quote Originally Posted by podgie_bear View Post
    My least favourite part of Tolkien's work is the Silmarilion, which has even less character depth and seems flat and two-dimensional, but then it is a history rather than a saga like the LotR.
    The Silmarilion wasn't made to be interesting, it was made to give background. It wasn't meant to be part of the saga like LotR. LotR was meant to be its own and the Silmarilion was supposed to be like a history book. Not a saga.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aideani View Post
    The Silmarilion wasn't made to be interesting, it was made to give background. It wasn't meant to be part of the saga like LotR. LotR was meant to be its own and the Silmarilion was supposed to be like a history book. Not a saga.
    The Silmarillion was a missed opportunity.
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  21. #21
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    I do not see many of Tolkien's characters as flat, but that is probably because I've talked about them with other fans so many times, and heard of their interpretations, that they have become a lot, lot less flat to me because of that. Reading between the lines, so to speak.

    My least favorite aspects... I would have liked to see more of Aragorn and Arwen, and more of Faramir and Eowyn development in LOTR. But, for certain my least favorite aspect is Bard's introduction in the Hobbit in the same chapter and just a couple pages before he shoots Smaug. When I was younger, I felt ripped off when I read it. I definitely, definitely think he should have been introduced earlier and had a lot more of a part before shooting the Big Bad. I find it the weakest part of the Hobbit-- Bard's increased role is something that I am really looking forward to in the film adaptation since it was a disappointment for me in the novel. I should be cheering for him, not going 'what? You stole that kill!' XD

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aideani View Post
    The Silmarilion wasn't made to be interesting, it was made to give background. It wasn't meant to be part of the saga like LotR. LotR was meant to be its own and the Silmarilion was supposed to be like a history book. Not a saga.
    That's what I said.

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    His extreme passion for elves. I mean comon, do they even have any faults in his works?
    The way he pushes some characters aside to promote another. Happens with Aragorn a lot. I'm not sure I really like the Aragorn in the books, same goes for Gandalf the White.
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    Quote Originally Posted by podgie_bear View Post
    That's what I said.
    Where?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by podgie_bear View Post
    the Silmarilion, which has even less character depth and seems flat and two-dimensional, but then it is a history rather than a saga like the LotR.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aideani View Post
    The Silmarilion wasn't made to be interesting, it was made to give background. It wasn't meant to be part of the saga like LotR. LotR was meant to be its own and the Silmarilion was supposed to be like a history book. Not a saga.
    Quote Originally Posted by podgie_bear View Post
    That's what I said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aideani View Post
    Where?
    He said it in his very first post.
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