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  1. #276
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    360
    THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU! This has been needed for far too long, thank you for finally doing it.

  2. #277
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    43
    I think, that you should go back to your old ways, rating decreases the infamy that people receive from killing you. Now you get consistent infamy and commendations

    I once saw a person who was Rank 9 and I checked kill log, its all the same person all over again

  3. #278
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Grams Rock - Complaining!
    Posts
    1,072
    Quote Originally Posted by CSM_River View Post
    Thanks for all the feedback and questions.

    The main things I'm getting here is that you want to know the best way to report, and what is the range of action that can be taken.

    Please open an in-game ticket to report it, and choose Cheating/Exploiting for your drop downs in the ticket window. If you *can* capture that names of the parties involved that's most helpful, but at least one is necessary.

    Actions taken will run from warnings to suspensions.

    -CSM_River
    Will, once proven a clubber there clubbed renown/infamy be removed?

  4. #279
    I used to farm but I don't care about rank as much as the comms I play creep side most of the time so I just farmed for comms but rank comes with that so its kinda hard to just farm comms rather than rank you people ever think some people just want comms instead of rank and btw freeps don't need the rank promotion that's just making them more op than what they are with their gold items and I have yet to see an increase in damage for the creeps ever since rohan came out and people started getting the hytbold gear and the gold rings it was tough but now wildemore came out with more gold jewelry I dont see a problem with creeps farming seeing as how freeps kill creeps before they have a chance to move a few steps with their stuns and massive damage

  5. #280
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    69
    Farmers that farmed for the past few Years are now sitting there and LOL`ing at all those that havent exploited everything that there was to exploit so far

    Same as with every other exploit that happend before(school seal farming anyone? Stat exploit anyone? Saruman t2 exploits?)...
    Those that abused the hell out of broken game mechanics/bugs/exploits etc etc. get to keep everything..

    But yeah... its a smart PR move atleast,lets see how well turbine enforces those things and handles it.
    (inb4 guy farming from 0 to 15 and getting a 3day ban w/o rankstripping etc.) I would not be surprised

    Good luck,and have fun.


    Edit :

    Sapience said past offenders will not get punished cause it was never against the rules.
    Yet,we had discussions about this (Squelchers and Cillion`s Threads where Sapience answered that farming is something they consider "against the rules/bad" and are looking into ways to deal with it) and a Dev saying it is an exploit! long time ago already. They said the reason that its not there yet is they dont know how to "spot" this kind of behaviour etc etc.

    My question would be why not atleast make it retroactive to that point where you guys actually openly admitted that it is an issue and not ok. Everyone knew it,those that say "wasnt against the rules so dont punish" are abusing your system once more.

    Cause an exploit is against the rules in the CoC. The Rule was always there,you just never choose to care or call it an exploit,for whatever reason that we will never know.
    Last edited by Okni; Aug 30 2013 at 07:09 AM.

  6. #281
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Okni View Post
    The Rule was always there,you just never choose to care or call it an exploit,for whatever reason that we will never know.
    https://www.lotro.com/en/forums/show...19#post6521319

    I guess the rule was not always there...

  7. #282
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    1

    Unhappy Cheat, cheat as long as u can ?

    Cheating as long as there is no rule for it !!
    I have never taken advantage of the mechanics.
    But slowy I think it was stupid of me.

  8. #283
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    69
    Quote Originally Posted by Balmorin_EU View Post
    https://www.lotro.com/en/forums/show...19#post6521319

    I guess the rule was not always there...

    You didnt read my post :/

    The Rule against exploits and abusing game mechanics to gain any form of advantage is right there in their CoC.

    17. You will not exploit, distribute or publicly communicate any Game error, miscue or bug which gives an unintended advantage within the Game world.

    Turbine for whatever reason just decided to ignore that,or exclude certain things wich even their developer called "exploit of game mechanics" ...
    Exploits and the likes are against their Rules,but they ignored most of those things for as long as possible... (wich is their right ofc)


    You can make up your own reasons for it,but its not a secret that various exploits and bug abuses have gone widely unpunished in the past years,even tho it is apparently against the Rules...
    (A 3day ban isnt really punishment if the said offender gets to keep ALL the rewards/advantages he gained by exploiting either..)
    Wich i expect the punishments for rankfarming to be.. warnings,3day bans at most... even for people who farm from 0-15 in a few runs.. And they get to keep everything they farmed ofc. Why would they punish this harder then other exploits that people abused in the past few years to gain advantages ^.^

    But we shall see how this turns out,im always happy to be surprised by Turbine,maybe for once in a good way... After all this time,for me so far its nothing but PR.

  9. #284
    Quote Originally Posted by CSM_River View Post
    “Rank Farming” is officially defined as the intentional surrender of your character to an enemy; resulting in a purposeful defeat and a gain of Infamy or renown to increase rank. Rank Farming is specific to Ettenmoors PvMP (Freep vs. Monster Player). The enemy can be controlled by any player - either the same player controlling the surrendering character, or someone else.
    By your definition, it's illegal to give up when fighting, even if you know you're about to die anyway.

    The definition should include a part about putting it into systematic practise.

  10. #285
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    2,277
    Quote Originally Posted by Balmorin_EU View Post
    https://www.lotro.com/en/forums/show...19#post6521319

    I guess the rule was not always there...

    Although the op was referring to farming in that thread, it appears that that quote was referring to multiboxing.



    ....and there can never be a separate rule for each and every single stupid thing players can think of to do. We'd never get through reading the CoC before our subs were up....

  11. #286
    Thank you for this change of policy.

    However, (and you must forgive me for seeing the glass as half empty), I must ask, how do I know this policy will truly be enforced?

    The reason I ask is simply because whenever I report someone for vulgarity in OOC, or for having a vulgar name, nothing ever happens to them. The ticket is merely closed. They are not forced to change their name if it is vulgar. They continue on with impunity, turning what should be a rated T for teen game into a rated M one.

    I realize that ever since F2P's launch that the GM's are stretched thin. Still, I have no reason to expect this policy will be enforced when so many other tickets that report violations of previously existing policies are closed.

    What will you, Turbine, do to better enforce your policies in the future?

  12. #287

    redo

    thank you for fixing this problem although I have to say that 1 vs 1 is to some people rank farming which I have ben accused of on different accounts I wonder if this will affect 1 vs 1s

  13. #288
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    1,835
    Quote Originally Posted by CSM_River View Post
    Thanks for all the feedback and questions.

    The main things I'm getting here is that you want to know the best way to report, and what is the range of action that can be taken.

    Please open an in-game ticket to report it, and choose Cheating/Exploiting for your drop downs in the ticket window. If you *can* capture that names of the parties involved that's most helpful, but at least one is necessary.

    Actions taken will run from warnings to suspensions.

    -CSM_River
    Will the points gained from farming be taken away?

  14. #289
    I catch guys doing it all the time. There are even vids on youtube on how and where to do it with out getting caught. But i know whos doing it and it sux. As a side note i get free comm if i find one ha ha ha

  15. #290
    Quote Originally Posted by Daec View Post
    Will the points gained from farming be taken away?

    There is an amnesty for activities prior to the Official Announcement. Activities after that that are subject to report. All actions from then on are between the CSRs and the reported players.
    Whoever says “I” creates the “you.” Such is the trap of every conscience. The “I” signifies both solitude and rejection of solitude. Words name things and then replace them. Whoever says tomorrow, denies it. Tomorrow exists only for him who does not seek it. And yesterday? Yesterday is Kolvillàg: a name to forget, a word already forgotten.

    The Oath: A Novel by Elie Wiesel

  16. #291
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Orange County, California
    Posts
    4,223
    Quote Originally Posted by CSM_River View Post
    Participation in Rank Farming is an abuse of our game mechanics, and against our rules. Customer Service can identify this behavior and will take the appropriate action on both accounts involved, based on our findings. This activity can also be reported to the in-game staff for review.
    Well what do you know...

    Nice to see you guys finally pulled your heads out of your arses. Too bad you're about 4-5 years too late. lulz

  17. #292
    Quote Originally Posted by Bhoris_they_spider View Post
    So if creeps are having a bad night of it and I decide to run in to their raid with no-chance of survival to 'raise morale' then I'm a rank farmer?
    Quote Originally Posted by Delmore View Post
    If you do it over and over and over....yes
    I'm really bad at PvMP, but I keep on running out of the stone circle and rejoining the fray because my attempts to distract the creeps ending in my repeated death might help some other more powerful freep capture a tower. Its how I feel useful in the Ettenmoors, aside of dropping off Horehallow food sacks and ale once a day.

    Does this new ruling mean I need to just pretend like a death in Ettenmoors is permadeath, and sit out the rest of a group fight to avoid being labelled an "assistant to a rank farmer"? Because it sounds like repeated deaths will be assumed to be rank farming, and not just "being really bad at PvMP but still getting back up and rejoining the fight because that's what you do when you are on the side of Good."

  18. #293
    This is great news

    I hope you guys will come up with a Policy against multiboxing too. That would be awesome!

  19. #294
    Quote Originally Posted by Simon23 View Post
    This is great news

    I hope you guys will come up with a Policy against multiboxing too. That would be awesome!
    Multiboxing is permitted and not a violation.
    Whoever says “I” creates the “you.” Such is the trap of every conscience. The “I” signifies both solitude and rejection of solitude. Words name things and then replace them. Whoever says tomorrow, denies it. Tomorrow exists only for him who does not seek it. And yesterday? Yesterday is Kolvillàg: a name to forget, a word already forgotten.

    The Oath: A Novel by Elie Wiesel

  20. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by SabrielofLorien View Post
    Multiboxing is permitted and not a violation.
    That is correct. Confirmed by Sapience. One person running 20 F2P accounts simultaneously to form his own personal raid of reavers is permitted and not a violation.

  21. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    NO IT'S NOT.


    Good grief. What you are saying is, "okay I want to accuse this guy of rank farming because I don't like him. So what I'm going to do is, charge him over and over and if he kills me I'll report him for farming."

    Or.. Someone is having a bad day and wigs out and thinks, "since I'm dying all the time anyway, I'm going to prove something to someone by repeatedly letting these ezmoders continue to kill me so hopefully they'll eventually feel guilty".

    Neither of these are farming but both are under your definition.

    Also under your definition is this little scenario:

    "If I charge these guys over and over, they're going to have to let me live because if they don't they'll be farmers. and so I'll be able to do whatever I want."

    Again, not farming.

    Edit: Another scenario a pvmp noob is going to need to figure out another way out of the rez circle because along the same path he's been taking are the stealth packs that kill him over and over for going that way. Continuing to go that way is stupid, not farming. Except under your definition.

    The point is, you have to be able to establish INTENT. Per the definition, if the parties intend to allow their death to provide the other rank, then that is farming. That's the only measure you can uphold, anything else and turbine's going to wind up banning as many people in game as they do in the forums because they're being poor judges.
    This post is what i thought as soon as i read the new policy/rule.

    As a casual freep who plays a hunter sometimes when i PvP i sometimes get tired of being fighting someone who has an "I win" skill/button. Because i get tired of fighting an uphill battle i just stop fighting and try to get out of a rez circle or try to get into a keep. I have died hundreds of time without putting up a fight because i know that i will get zerged, rooted, trolled or killed and really don't feel like giving someone the satisfaction of looking like i'm trying and failing; by this definition if i stop trying to to win a battle i know i win then i am helping them rank farm (trying to get into a keep or out of a rez a ton of times is not feeding). If someone was mad at my lack of effort i could get reported or if someone at turbine looks at the looks they could see i died 50 times in a certain area and think im helping someone rank farm when im just trying to get into a keep or get out of a rez.

  22. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Legonist View Post
    This post is what i thought as soon as i read the new policy/rule.

    As a casual freep who plays a hunter sometimes when i PvP i sometimes get tired of being fighting someone who has an "I win" skill/button. Because i get tired of fighting an uphill battle i just stop fighting and try to get out of a rez circle or try to get into a keep. I have died hundreds of time without putting up a fight because i know that i will get zerged, rooted, trolled or killed and really don't feel like giving someone the satisfaction of looking like i'm trying and failing; by this definition if i stop trying to to win a battle i know i win then i am helping them rank farm (trying to get into a keep or out of a rez a ton of times is not feeding). If someone was mad at my lack of effort i could get reported or if someone at turbine looks at the looks they could see i died 50 times in a certain area and think im helping someone rank farm when im just trying to get into a keep or get out of a rez.
    All you had to do was port out of the rez circle to Micheal Delving then swift travel back to GV. Just sayin is all.

    As for the rule, I'm glad they implemented it. However it's far to little far to late.

  23. #298
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    England. north-west
    Posts
    2,685
    Quote Originally Posted by staveisle View Post
    That is correct. Confirmed by Sapience. One person running 20 F2P accounts simultaneously to form his own personal raid of reavers is permitted and not a violation.
    multi boxing it's self is not a violation it's self. but it purely depends on how you do it. you can report users who multi-box using bots and such, if there found to not contact the GM's when they ask or look like there cheating without being player controlled, they can get punished.

    I think sapience should add a thread on this... it always comes up and is quickly explained. it's another area like fight clubbing that has gray area's that vastly hard to define. but multi-boxing does have large positive benefits to players and if used correctly does no harm to other players.

  24. #299
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarenius View Post
    This is good. Unfortunate that it's not retroactive though, many people who have clubbed to r12+ will get away with it completely.
    Of course not.

    "Get away with it" - there was no rule in place for them to have gotten away with, so you CANNOT take action against them.

    Secondly, the legal ramifications here would be impossible for Turbine to stand by retroactive action. If someone were banned over such an issue, then they would be fully entitled to take legal recourse and they would certainly win.

    You simply CANNOT retroactively change things. Agreements are only legitimate when both parties agree and from that date point only. This is abundantly clear.

    Sorry.

  25. #300
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    939
    Quote Originally Posted by crunchyfrog555 View Post
    Secondly, the legal ramifications here would be impossible for Turbine to stand by retroactive action. If someone were banned over such an issue, then they would be fully entitled to take legal recourse and they would certainly win.
    Not really, Turbine got the right to ban any player from their game for any reason or no reason at all.

 

 
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