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  1. #1

    The Northern House: RP PvP Permadeath for Silverlode

    Two things I want to emphasize:

    1. This kinship is not in competition with any other kinship I know of, as it provides gameplay outside of your usual lotro session.
    2. Players on Silverlode do not have much of an advantage over players on other servers, as you have to join this kinship at level 10 or lower. While Silverlode players will have higher-levelled characters that can help their lower levels, they also have many fewer character slots to use than you will have if you haven't played there at all.

    The Northern House provides a unique roleplaying experience that anyone on any server should feel free to dip into for any length of time. You can have another server and another kinship as your primary focus while still enjoying what we have to offer when you are in the mood for it.

    ---

    Silverlode is now home to a roleplaying permadeath kinship: The Northern House.

    The Northern House is the pvp-permadeath branch of The Four Houses. (All four houses have a kinship house but the Eastern House is the only one that has been used up until now. The others are set up to accommodate future ideas such as this one.)

    Breaking It Down

    The idea behind this kinship is very different to any other that I have come across. I have seen kinships that have what is presently known as permadeath, but it is a permadeath designed for making gameplay more realistic. The permadeath I am going to describe to you is not about making the game more realistic, but rather about switching the focus from the progress of one character to participation in a grand history.

    The rules are as follows:

    1. You may only enter the Northern House at level 10 or lower. This is so that a person's power is roughly equivalent to what they have invested in their time with us.

    2. As soon as you leave the Northern House, you are dead according to our records.

    3. If you die, you are kicked from the Northern House, and are thus dead according to our records.

    Of course you may die and keep it a secret so long as there were no witnesses, but you would only be cheating yourself. This kinship exists to accommodate those who want this kind of game.

    4. You will be kicked if you deliberately attempt to ruin the roleplaying experience of other members. You will not be forced to roleplay if you do not want to but it is encouraged.

    5. If you are invited to spar by a fellow NH member, you must accept.

    6. THIS IS THE BIG ONE. If you lose a spar by low health, you are dead according to our records.

    You read that correctly. If you are invited to spar with someone, you must accept… and if you lose, you are dead.

    You will die and you will die often. You must understand: rather than progressing your character and the epic story of middle-earth, you will be contributing to a player-made history, inevitably forming feuds and friendships with other characters, and ultimately creating an impressive legacy that your great, great, great (etc.) ‘grandchild’ character will inherit.

    Of course, when you die, your belongings may be used by future characters.

    NOTE: You may run from spars but not log off. If you log off accidentally you should resume the spar as quickly as possible.

    7. You may NOT invite Pethala to a spar. Pethala is the leader of the Northern House but is not part of it: she is only there to manage it.

    Terminology

    Ghost: Those characters who are not in the Northern House. They are only apparitions to us.

    Spouse

    During your time in the Northern House, you and another NH character may choose to wed, and be formally recognized as such. The only rules for this are: 1. you must have either inherited or chosen a surname, which cannot be changed on our records once you have it, 2.you and your partner must be of opposite sex, 3. marriage cannot be undone. There is no divorce. Once you have chosen your partner, that is the person with whom you will create descendants, and that is the person who will be listed as your life partner on our records.

    Please don’t make a moral issue out of the above. In my opinion there is nothing moral about rejecting homosexuality or divorce as options but speaking generally this is not a game about morality (or at least I worry about anyone who thinks it is) and speaking specifically the above only serves to provide a neat process of creating genealogies. It is not anything to do with how you choose to roleplay the romantic side of your character.

    Once married, you and your spouse must choose to both use either the surname of either partner or a double-barreled version.

    Upon death your spouse becomes a widow, a widow who cannot marry or reproduce again, and who may or may not choose to roleplay as a sad widow (likely according to how you treated them).
    Children

    Children

    IF you married during your lifetime, you may have children. You must choose their name together with your spouse. You may have a maximum of one child every year (real-life month) after marriage.

    Your children must be characters that are not yet in the Northern House, and they must be characters that will be started within the next month. They do not need to be played by you. You may tell another player in the Northern House the name of your child so that they can create them and play as one of your descendants.

    Your children will be born at 16 years of age.

    Calendar (for roleplaying purposes and record keeping)

    Every month is a year by Northern reckoning. Days are roughly half a month. To be more precise, below you can see which month it is according to the day of the month by modern reckoning:

    January: 1,2,31*
    February: 3,4,5
    March: 6,7
    April: 8,9,10
    May: 11,12
    June: 13,14,15
    July: 16,17
    August: 18,19,20
    September: 21,22
    October: 23,24,25
    November: 26,27
    December: 28,29*,30*

    *Assuming they are days of that real-life month.

    Example Scenario

    You may be thinking that there are just too many ways to abuse this system.

    You’d be wrong. There aren’t enough, couldn’t be enough. ‘Abusing’ the system will be precisely what spices up our history.

    To make my point I will list an example.

    Example: Someone creates a character and joins the Northern House, then gives that character loads of crafting ingredients from a higher-levelled character to level up and then attacks new members of the Northern House. Here’s how that might look in our history:

    I 56 (the 56th year of the first age; we begin in the first age of our reckoning)

    Rumours spread throughout the Shire and Bree-land of a killer of youths, murdering even in coldest daylight while paralyzed residents looked on helplessly. Among the casualties were 5 of the youngest of the families of Bluestone and Oddfoot. In desperation, surviving relatives of these dead called upon the warriors of the Elventhorn family. Among them was Torluin Elventhorn, and taking up his greataxe he rode out to find some trace of this killer. But he did not return.

    Soonafter the killings doubled, and rumour spread that a wielder of a greataxe was now seen committing the deeds. It seemed that Torluin’s mind had become poisoned by the killer, seeing no evil in his crimes. Common were the reports of laughter as the killer or killers rode away from massacres.

    I 57

    The following is the account of Sofie and the Cheese.

    It was around this time that the elf Sofie Bluestone came of age, learned in the arts of runes. Not two months later, she was walking with her mother Candace through the quiet of Bindbole Wood when she spotted the glint of steel through the trees. She screamed out to her mother, but it was too late. An arrow had pierced her mother’s neck. As she lay dying, her mother whispered elegant elven words that Sofie had not learned yet. Then she reached into her dress and passed a package to Sofie. Bloodily, her mother choked now in plain words, mired as if by sleep.

    ‘Safe, Sofie, keep this, you must…’

    The footsteps neared. A fire blazed in her mother’s eyes.

    ‘Sofie, fly!’

    Sofie fled. But in such shock and anguish, her legs could only take her so far. She tripped over a gnarly root. Two men approached. Sofie knew neither. She knew only that she was hopelessly outmatched. Tears streamed down her face as she realized she had failed her mother.

    The rumors of laughter were true. They laughed heartily as their weapons shredded her dress and skin. Sofie breathed her last and closed her eyes, but still had to experience the men scouring her body for valuables. They found her mother’s package. Then came sleep.

    ---

    Of a sudden, her mother’s voice seemed to come from all around.

    ‘Sofie, do not fall this day.’

    She felt her body for scars but found none. Had it been a dream? Then she noticed a terrible smell. It was coming from all around. She opened her eyes and gasped. Two rotting bodies were strewn about her. Trying not to vomit she ran to where her mother had fallen, and was much relieved to find her mother’s body cold but unblemished.

    After there were no more tears to cry, Sofie searched her mother’s body. Finding an odd wrapper, the realization struck her.

    Her mother, in her dying deeds, had ended the horror.

    Candace carried always a chunk of Barrow-brie.

    ---

    You get the idea: all events can be interpreted to contribute to our overall history.

    In conclusion, if all that interests you, why don’t you roll a character on Silverlode and send a message to Pethala?

    For details of the history that we create, stay tuned.
    Last edited by Torathon; Aug 20 2013 at 05:45 AM.

  2. #2
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    So, help me get this straight, this is a RP PvP Kinship but it doesn't involve PvP as defined by 98% of the community?

    In reality, this is a sparring kinship - and the leader is exempt from the rules. Some of it sounds fun, but overall, not for me.

    Personally, I've never considered sparring a good test of skill. I get to prepare for the fight, wait for my CD's to be ready... I'll stick to the moors where I can be jumped... or jump someone, which is much more fun and realistic.

    Is there another example of it on another server I can read about? It seems, to me, you'll run out of members very quickly. Maybe call it a King of the Hill Clan...
    Irin r8 Hunter // Arngar r8 Burg // Akthuri r15 LM // Vishus r5 Captain // Curad r10 (active) Mini

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    So, help me get this straight, this is a RP PvP Kinship but it doesn't involve PvP as defined by 98% of the community?

    In reality, this is a sparring kinship - and the leader is exempt from the rules. Some of it sounds fun, but overall, not for me.

    Personally, I've never considered sparring a good test of skill. I get to prepare for the fight, wait for my CD's to be ready... I'll stick to the moors where I can be jumped... or jump someone, which is much more fun and realistic.

    Is there another example of it on another server I can read about? It seems, to me, you'll run out of members very quickly. Maybe call it a King of the Hill Clan...
    1. I will not be exempt from the rules. Pethala is just an admin character for accepting and kicking people from the kinship. I will have other characters I play that will be entirely bound by the rules. Like everyone else who will join, this is not my main kinship and will only be played in by temporary, extra characters.

    2. I used to play Darkfall and PvMP is not PvP nor anything resembling it. However, 'RP PvP' IS the most accurate term for the Northern House. This is roleplay. For those who roleplay, it IS PvP, and a much more engaging PvP than what vanilla LotRO offers.

    3. For those who roleplay, you CAN get jumped and unlike PvMP you can get jumped anywhere and while you are doing anything.

    4. For those who roleplay, you do not get to prepare for a fight at all.

    5. It would be impossible for us to run out of members. This is where I am most convinced that you have completely failed to understand the idea, and that's ok because it was a long post. It is impossible for us to run out of members from player death because when someone dies they play as new characters (which may be their own descendants) that continue the story.

    The overall story, the history we are creating, is the point of this kinship.

  4. #4
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    Sounds intriguing, I wish you good luck.
    "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
    "Faithless is he that says farewell when the road darkens."
    J.R.R. Tolkien

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    1. I will not be exempt from the rules. Pethala is just an admin character for accepting and kicking people from the kinship. I will have other characters I play that will be entirely bound by the rules. Like everyone else who will join, this is not my main kinship and will only be played in by temporary, extra characters.
    Sound good, I misunderstood that piece.

    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    2. I used to play Darkfall and PvMP is not PvP nor anything resembling it. However, 'RP PvP' IS the most accurate term for the Northern House. This is roleplay. For those who roleplay, it IS PvP, and a much more engaging PvP than what vanilla LotRO offers.
    I'll leave this alone, you rubbed 10% of the playerbase's nose in the LotRO PvP, we are all entitled to our opinions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    3. For those who roleplay, you CAN get jumped and unlike PvMP you can get jumped anywhere and while you are doing anything.
    Not true, even if I am delivering mail in the shire and someone requests a spar I have time to sit on the window buff, etc. then there is still time before the spar begins... hardly "jumped".

    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    4. For those who roleplay, you do not get to prepare for a fight at all.
    See above

    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    5. It would be impossible for us to run out of members. This is where I am most convinced that you have completely failed to understand the idea, and that's ok because it was a long post. It is impossible for us to run out of members from player death because when someone dies they play as new characters (which may be their own descendants) that continue the story.
    Thanks for claifying.

    Quote Originally Posted by Torathon View Post
    The overall story, the history we are creating, is the point of this kinship.
    Sounds good.

    Maybe I missed it, but does this mean you'll have lvl 85's requesting spars with level 11's in the shire?
    Irin r8 Hunter // Arngar r8 Burg // Akthuri r15 LM // Vishus r5 Captain // Curad r10 (active) Mini

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    Maybe I missed it, but does this mean you'll have lvl 85's requesting spars with level 11's in the shire?
    Picture this. Some one spend weeks at least in this game purely to get a character
    to level 85 so that they can mercilessly kill lvl 10s. They get lucky and don't die once
    all the way to 85. Finally they get their killing machine and start picking off baby
    characters.

    Hopefully they enjoy the first few days of this because the reward for all their effort
    is being instantly despised by everyone else in the kin. People like me lvl up 85s and
    come after that person until we get them. The event goes down in our history as the
    rise of an evil that the free peoples rose up against and crushed.

    Eventually the kinship has a healthy supply of high levelled 'good' players
    that don't kill lvl 10s and do kill those who do.

    Sorry for the line breaks; my phone is being strange.

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    I am merely curious, but why on Silverlode?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Dekkameron View Post
    I am merely curious, but why on Silverlode?
    It happens to be the server that I was already on when I had the idea and it
    is the only server where my wife and I own most of a neighbourhood, which
    would be very useful for a roleplaying kinship. But not absolutely necessary, and
    if RP server players would be up for it only if I brought it over, I would.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    Not true, even if I am delivering mail in the shire and someone requests a spar I have time to sit on the window buff, etc. then there is still time before the spar begins... hardly "jumped".

    I get this. It's all about roleplay, if you really immerse yourself in it then you truly will be jumped. No ther characters exist, they are ghosts, the only other people on the server are your Northern House kinmates, be they good or evil.

    If you prepared for the fight you would be writing your own piece of kin history as either a coward who ran or a cheater who was outed and might have been dealt with, or maybe you took the whole kin over.

    I think it's a cool idea, not sure I would ever participate but I applaud the creativity.


    Attended by Coldaen

  10. #10
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    It still feels like a glorified fight club to me.

    I do think it's a good start, but the game mechanics prevent this from working as intended.

    Like I said, someone picks a fight with you, you have a solid 10s to buff yourself, apply HoTs, etc. then another 5 or 6 after you've accepted the spar.

    If it is RP, where in Tolkien's Lore did the Free Peoples Fight each other? Sounds more like Game of Thrones, to me...

    I'll stop replying and watch for progress on the server, if it goes well I will try my hand... heck, the server's highest ranked LM in PvP might do ok... maybe, just maybe.
    Irin r8 Hunter // Arngar r8 Burg // Akthuri r15 LM // Vishus r5 Captain // Curad r10 (active) Mini

  11. #11
    I quite like the idea of this....

    But do we HAVE to join below lvl 10? I personally am done leveling toons of silverlode and don't have any that would fit the bill....

    Perhaps increase the maximum level to join? maybe to 25, 30, 40 or 50? xD asking for a lot, I know...

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    heck, the server's highest ranked LM in PvP might do ok... maybe, just maybe.
    Nice Sorry I was dismissive of PvMP, it's just that a pvp that can only take place in one part of the world isn't my cup of tea. Darkfall (1) for me was a place to just live, crafting and gathering while looking out for pvpers and avoiding them until I was skilled enough to fight them (you have probably heard of the Darkfall grind). It was meant to be roleplay, but the community was dead and the hardcore players who were around were just there for a good fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    It still feels like a glorified fight club to me.
    It will really depend on what kind of players we get. I for one won't be looking for fights with my first character at all. I'll just be contently living my hobbit life, being part of this community and hoping that no ill comes to any of my friends. And of course, ill will come. So, to give you an idea of what I would do:

    If someone tries to fight me, I will flee the scene. Others may well call me a coward but I will call it good sense. I will inform upstanding members of society that a ruffian has attacked for no reason whatsoever, and hopefully battle-hardened folks will join me in tracking said ruffian down.

    I would hope that, in general, killing for no reason, even killing someone at the same level as you, would be interpreted as 'evil'. It would certainly be evil within the lore. However, if you witnessed such a fate strike a friend or relative, and you sought out the killer... that could hardly be interpreted as a break from lore. And those who do 'break' from lore can be interpreted as ruffian, bandit, thug, etc.

    By the way, my insanely optimistic vision for this idea is that maybe one day the devs take note of this roleplaying endeavor and reward it with something like a server-specific gameplay accommodation of our roleplaying so that we don't have to use the rough system of sparring. For there to be even the slimmest chance of that happening, we would have to convince the devs that the vast majority of us were being respectful of lore and they would have to not see constant skirmishes all over the Shire, Ered Luin, and Bree-land. Whether or not that happens depends on the kind of community we create.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joebob7 View Post
    I quite like the idea of this....

    But do we HAVE to join below lvl 10? I personally am done leveling toons of silverlode and don't have any that would fit the bill....

    Perhaps increase the maximum level to join? maybe to 25, 30, 40 or 50? xD asking for a lot, I know...
    Hmmm. I will consider that. But are you sure you want that long-term? Remember that this will only help the character you presently have at 25, and if that character dies and you want to continue the story, you will have to play through those levels anyway. Unless you always happen to have a level 25 ready.

    Also, whatever we make the maximum will also be the effective minimum, because many players won't want to join until they have reached the highest level at which others can join.

  13. #13
    I just saw that it is a 'Welcome Back Weekend'! Meaning that we get +100% experience. That makes this weekend the best time to join this kinship for those of you wanting to get strong characters quickly.

  14. #14
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    You should try to contact Healsyou and Bambam in game. They love to roleplay and I will sure they will be very happy with this new experience.

    Healsyou like to roleplay as a hobbit thief that play the cowbell every time he steal something (even if his toon is a man).

    And Bambam like to roleplay as a bubble.. I know it doesnt make sense at all, but oh well.

    Anyway best luck with this proyect, have fun!
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irin19 View Post
    It still feels like a glorified fight club to me.

    I do think it's a good start, but the game mechanics prevent this from working as intended.

    Like I said, someone picks a fight with you, you have a solid 10s to buff yourself, apply HoTs, etc. then another 5 or 6 after you've accepted the spar.

    If it is RP, where in Tolkien's Lore did the Free Peoples Fight each other? Sounds more like Game of Thrones, to me...

    I'll stop replying and watch for progress on the server, if it goes well I will try my hand... heck, the server's highest ranked LM in PvP might do ok... maybe, just maybe.
    If I understand this thing correctly, you're not qualified akthuri. You have to start the kin on a toon level 10 or LOWER. In which case, none of my toons on this server would qualify either.
    Last edited by Versity; Aug 24 2013 at 01:22 PM.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Versity View Post
    If I understand this thing correctly, you're not qualified akthuri. You have to start the kin on a toon level 10 or LOWER. In which case, none of my toons on this server would qualify either.
    Yeah I saw that after the fact. I won't be leveling up another toon, 4 geared 85's are all I can maintain now anyways. I wish this idea had surfaced, oh, say, 5 years ago...
    Irin r8 Hunter // Arngar r8 Burg // Akthuri r15 LM // Vishus r5 Captain // Curad r10 (active) Mini

  17. #17
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    U people need to stop smoking wierd things! Its scary
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  18. #18
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    I like it. If I make a RK Ill never lose in a spar. nor die to npcs doing my pve stuff. This is a win already! where do I sign up. Or I can make a warden and never die.......at all. even solo a dragon t2 raid....healing myself. I think this is a great idea. Ill make a RK and a Warden and life Forever! WOHAHAHAHAHAH <3 Actually it is a cute idea. not that I like the intro enough to join

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldacarion View Post
    You should try to contact Healsyou and Bambam in game. They love to roleplay and I will sure they will be very happy with this new experience.

    Healsyou like to roleplay as a hobbit thief that play the cowbell every time he steal something (even if his toon is a man).

    And Bambam like to roleplay as a bubble.. I know it doesnt make sense at all, but oh well.

    Anyway best luck with this proyect, have fun!
    They are transferring to a ALL RP server. So that they can look at the stars and dance with Marigold. I am kinda jelly. But Ill miss them!

  20. #20
    Sounds kinda fun think I may give it a try.
    YeahBuddy

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by mivkle View Post
    Sounds kinda fun think I may give it a try.
    That would be great, though so far I have only had one person contact me in game. Add you and there is possibly three of us doing this idea. You might want to wait until there are most people who have expressed an interest, though I'm happy with starting with three.

    I'll update this forum if more people contact me.

  22. #22
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    Sorry, I stopped reading at rule 7. I don't see this having any chance, presently. First troll who attains lvl 25 will just challenge all new members, who must accept. He'll never have anyone catch up to him.

    That said, this might become viable IF Turbine allows sparring within the Big-Battles instances coming with Helms Deep and IF the challengee, not challenger, gets to choose the location of the fight.
    If that happens, I'm up for it. The lvl 85 who's done all that work just might be defeated by an upscaled lvl 10. I'd roll a few lvl 10 characters and take a shot at it. Not sure how much I'd care about the RP side, but I'd try not to ruin it for others. I'd just be there to knock the king down the hill.

    Perhaps you'd like to pitch this to Turbine and see if they'll include support for spars in those instances.
    Last edited by Moochi; Aug 30 2013 at 02:46 AM. Reason: Revised my 2nd IF. Again.
    Silverlode lvl100 raiding characters: Glaistig Skop | lvl100 solo and small group characters: Bede, Elentir, & Wibba

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  23. #23
    Believe it or not, this has started. With only two of us. But still.

    Current participants: Hurvurl, Taeden.

    Taeden and Hurvurl have made a pact not to kill each other, though as a blissfully ignorant hobbit who spends his days fishing, Taeden is about as capable of killing anyone as he is of climbing the Party Tree. Which is to say: not at all.

    Update to roleplay mechanics: If you 'yield' during a spar, the victor can choose to spare your life or to kill you. If you really don't want to die when facing a stronger character, your best chance would be to run. Hell, that's what Taeden will do.

    Those who join the Northern House can feel free to post here with stories about their adventures. We'll collate it all into one large story when there is more of it.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Moochi View Post
    Perhaps you'd like to pitch this to Turbine and see if they'll include support for spars in those instances.
    That's a great idea.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Moochi View Post
    Sorry, I stopped reading at rule 7.
    Do you mean that you just got bored of reading or that you see a problem with rule 7? I have since explained why rule 7 does not have the effect of meaning I am exempt.

 

 
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