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Thread: Spam healing?

  1. #1
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    Spam healing?

    Whenever I do instances like Fornost or Sambrog and I have a mini in the group, I often hear them say something like "Wow that was easy, I just had to spam the 1 key." And I since I have a level 50 mini who's leveling fast I cant help but ask.. is that even possible? And if it is..wouldn't we be expected to do a little more than that? like anthem buffs etc? I know mini's are in a good spot right now, you might even call them "ez-mode" but I was hoping when I got to level cap I would have a challenge healing groups and have to sort of "think outside the box" and come up with stratagies to keep the group alive..but now it sounds like I'll just be spamming 1 or 2 skills while watching tv and eating pizza.

    Thoughts? I'd also appreciate if someone who heals a lot on their mini could maybe list some of the harder things to heal for.

    thanks.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0920d0000002c9618/signature.png]Farimur[/charsig]

  2. #2
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    such a lie ...

    even in sambrog when theres only one mini you have to go for a bit more of hitting key 1..cause if they doing all hall pulls ppl get nasty bruised ...sometimes we even get healer aggro and end up healing ourself more than other ....but really sambrog and fornost are the worst examole you can point out for minis as healer role cause they are just for farming.... ask about mini doing bells t2 without wipes on first boss.. of outhealing inferno and healing stupidness of ppl who dont move from catapults ..also healing smaug and again foolish hunters that think they can tank the adds without them dying ..same goes to flight .....theres more than hitting and spaming 1 each raid and instance depending on how mini traits will have it preffer athems use ..i love them..also for me the ultimate healing challenge comes when you are healeing fellowships and raids at moors..there you have to burn your fingertips with all you have to make it .....to play well your mini means know more about what your doing than hitting a single key..that is if you want to be well know in your server as a competent mini..if not stay ws and spam heals
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  3. #3
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    Two things on Sambrog and Fornost first wing
    1. These are easier content. Buffing using anthems will make everything go faster and smoother- most players who have been at 85 for a while won't need big heals because they are overgeared for this content and usually play their class competently. I run DPS in Sambrog with kinnies, for example and switch stance only if there is a major mistake or at boss fights. Sometimes not even then. You can do some group heals in warspeech using codas. Otherwise i'll run harmony for GB in newer groups and only drop to null (my comfort zone for healing) if things get really messy in a new group who pulls madly.

    Support classes like Cappies and LM's can heal these. easily, too.

    So yes, you could just keep the anthems up and/or spam the odd single target heal with a good well geared and mixed group-especially one with RK or cappy or LM throwing out the odd heal too.. Dedicated healers aren't required for a lot of the end-game at the moment.

    2. This does not apply to all other content-especially on tier 2, or to new groups. BFE tier 2 for example when fire and catapults are hitting hard, can need your arsenal, quite often.

    3. Also if the group doesn't need healing, minstrel buffs still help the group, so I'd be spamming ballads and anthems when direct heals aren't required. Champs and wardens like the -attack duration + evade anthem of prowess and all classes like the anthem of war plus damage. Anthem of Composure gives plus resistances -good for squishies or long dots. More damage done, more resistance means things die quicker and there's less to heal.

    TLR ther's plenty to do as a minstrel to make the run smoother, even if your group doesn't need many spot heals. But spamming one heal as sole healer and using no anthems or ballads maybe an exaggeration unless it was a great team. Or someone else was healing too?

    And the minstrel sang to them……”and they passed in thought out to regions where pain and delight flow together and tears are the very wine of blessedness.”

  4. #4
    Heal Spam = Bad Minstreling

  5. #5
    Like the others have said, the 3 and 6 mans even t1 raids require minimal effort to beat. But try doing any of the t2 and t2cs and you'll sort goods from the bads real quick. My advice is to read up on some of the useful threads here and get the absolute most you can out of your class. I wouldn't say that you'll need to think outside the box to keep groups up, but you can certainly find plenty of ways to make your group perform better.
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

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  6. #6
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    Guys those instances were just an example, I see them say it in all kinds of instances. Don't focus on that part, my main question is..Is healing at cap as easy as it seems for pve?
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0920d0000002c9618/signature.png]Farimur[/charsig]

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by OruiFarimur View Post
    Guys those instances were just an example, I see them say it in all kinds of instances. Don't focus on that part, my main question is..Is healing at cap as easy as it seems for pve?
    Of course it depends on the instance, the group, the strategy, etc.

    Take fornost water, for example. It IS insanely easy if you have a decent group, but some PUGs can be pretty terribad and you will find yourself healing your heart out to keep yourself alive while a tank-in-traning struggles to pick all the mobs that are very interested in you.

    In the case of a good group, I often find myself just playing anthems to speed things up and throwing the occasional heal. A good minstrel will always be doing something, even if much healing isn't needed, you can provide other types of benefits to the fellowship -which is why I'm permanently a 4 yellow, 3 blue minstrel-.

    As for raids, it's the same as above. I've done very easy raids where I don't need to do much healing, and I've done the same raid with a bad group where I've needed to do well over 3k heals per second to try and survive.

    So the short answer is: healing can be pretty easy, but it isn't always easy; the difficulty -or lack thereof- of healing is extremely situational. However, never focus on just keeping the group alive, be a good minstrel and be useful, even if dedicated healing isn't needed.
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by OruiFarimur View Post
    Whenever I do instances like Fornost or Sambrog and I have a mini in the group, I often hear them say something like "Wow that was easy, I just had to spam the 1 key." And I since I have a level 50 mini who's leveling fast I cant help but ask.. is that even possible? And if it is..wouldn't we be expected to do a little more than that? like anthem buffs etc? I know mini's are in a good spot right now, you might even call them "ez-mode" but I was hoping when I got to level cap I would have a challenge healing groups and have to sort of "think outside the box" and come up with strategies to keep the group alive..but now it sounds like I'll just be spamming 1 or 2 skills while watching tv and eating pizza.

    Thoughts? I'd also appreciate if someone who heals a lot on their mini could maybe list some of the harder things to heal for.

    thanks.
    Generally the instances that people run from globallff tend to be the easier ones, because they tend to be idiot proof and so you get a good rewards:time ratio. There are a number of instances at the cap which will prove challenging for beginners right through to the experts. There are very few people who would claim that BfE T2C is easy, its certainly not something I think the majority of people could do off the bat.

    There are undoubtedly many easier instances that won't stretch most competent players. If you want some slightly trickier content I've found the "In Their Absence" 6 mans challenge to be at the higher end, Fornost: shadow is also a little trickier than the others in that cluster, and you will certainly feel like a healer, especially if you go before your fully geared. In OD T2 Fear/Ivar/Gorthingy required will be difficult for in a less experienced/geared group. The Erebor cluster on T1 will require you to heal competently. For T2/T2C Fires of Smaug depends completely on people knowing what they need to do to not die. Flight/Battle will depend on the level of your group, they are certainly challenging for a group of casual players, with the challenges being in the realm of very good-excellent.
    “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elemiire View Post

    So the short answer is: healing can be pretty easy, but it isn't always easy; the difficulty -or lack thereof- of healing is extremely situational. However, never focus on just keeping the group alive, be a good minstrel and be useful, even if dedicated healing isn't needed.
    Thanks, my favourite answer. No offence to the others, but this one was the most informative while still being pleasant to read
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0920d0000002c9618/signature.png]Farimur[/charsig]

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by OruiFarimur View Post
    Thanks, my favourite answer. No offence to the others, but this one was the most informative while still being pleasant to read
    I agree completely with Elemiire's summation.

    I certainly intended no offence. I'm pretty sure no one else did either.

    You asked about specific instances and so we replied to your question about those instances, in the context of the rest of the end game. I was simply providing what I hoped was useful information. The replies all pretty much provided the same answer in a variety ways. That's the way of forums. They are repetitive and full of words. )


    Once again, apologies if i came off condescending or rude.

    And the minstrel sang to them……”and they passed in thought out to regions where pain and delight flow together and tears are the very wine of blessedness.”

  11. #11
    I agree totally with the sentiment, especially with water/sammy

    Recently I had a warden I run with taunting me with the fact "his hps was better than mine"

    Oh the flaws of combat analysis, trying to explain about anthems in a 4y situation were a no go, " I have a swap book for anthem of war" oh lol ok.

    Next run I took 5b and spammed the bejesus out of everything.

    Bad dps was the cause of the instance taking so much longer that time apparently

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazlo10 View Post
    I agree totally with the sentiment, especially with water/sammy

    Recently I had a warden I run with taunting me with the fact "his hps was better than mine"

    Oh the flaws of combat analysis, trying to explain about anthems in a 4y situation were a no go, " I have a swap book for anthem of war" oh lol ok.

    Next run I took 5b and spammed the bejesus out of everything.

    Bad dps was the cause of the instance taking so much longer that time apparently
    I have a swap book for anthem of war as well. I also put anthem of composure tact. mitigation, anthem of composure resistance and hammerhand skills bubble magnitude; it's pretty handy.

    And I would definitely trait 5 yellow all the time - I LOVE dual tales - if I could have the +10% crit heals as a passive, but that blue trait is just too good to pass.
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Elemiire View Post
    I have a swap book for anthem of war as well. I also put anthem of composure tact. mitigation, anthem of composure resistance and hammerhand skills bubble magnitude; it's pretty handy.

    And I would definitely trait 5 yellow all the time - I LOVE dual tales - if I could have the +10% crit heals as a passive, but that blue trait is just too good to pass.
    Just thinking about this today, I've been doing a lot of t2 flight lately and it struck me that hammerhand and also cotc c/d would be pretty handy on a swap, saying that they can both be used proactively before the wave starts/ or immediately for cotc.

    I do have trouble with this instance, getting the healing under control especially on big summoner waves (lag doesn't help)

    I hate having triumphant spirit on c/d if it happens in the first few waves that I need to proc the skill.

    I'm not sure how much cotc c/d actually decreases the cooldown re:waves but if it was available for 50% of the time at least I can fire off an anthem and give the group a little more of a chance.

  14. #14
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    Are you sure the hammerhand bubble legacy on swap book is really an advantage? I only tried it once shortly after that legacy appeared, and found that the loss in healing over time from the lower tactical healing on my (3rd age no relics no crystals) swap book compared to my (fully outfitted 1st age) healing book was considerably larger than the increase in bubble magnitude, thus making this legacy on the swap book obsolete since the resulting bubble was a lot less effective than the original one.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bramor View Post
    Are you sure the hammerhand bubble legacy on swap book is really an advantage? I only tried it once shortly after that legacy appeared, and found that the loss in healing over time from the lower tactical healing on my (3rd age no relics no crystals) swap book compared to my (fully outfitted 1st age) healing book was considerably larger than the increase in bubble magnitude, thus making this legacy on the swap book obsolete since the resulting bubble was a lot less effective than the original one.
    I'll post a screenshot next time I log in.

    As far as I can tell, the % gain from the legacy outweighs the loss of outgoing healing and stats from a 'main' book.
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

  16. #16
    What you have to do and what you can do, is not the same thing. I can solo heal Sammy on cappy using 1 skill, on mini maybe 2-3 skills. I can even heal it on my LM. No one will die. It doesn't mean I'm doing a good job.

    When massive heals aren't needed, you have to make yourself useful in other areas as a Minstrel. Keeping anthems up for more dps, help with AoE on trash etc. I do find it frustrating with over-healing Minstrels myself, refusing to be flexible in easier instances. They give us a bad name in the long run, making others think we can only do 1 thing, heal.

    Flight, BfE and Smaug T2 still needs a lot of pure and maximised healing, if you want to push your limits. Healing BfE T1 with a bad pug can be even harder. But very few 6-man still requires you to full-time heal. They definitely don't need cappy and Minstrel healing if the group has a proper tank.

  17. #17
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    @Bramor:



    I tested it. The bubble IS larger with the switch book with no relics or crystals, but the heal over time added to it is smaller.

    Aaaaaand I forgot to test the other bubble... but you get the idea :P
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

  18. #18
    If your swap book was lvl 85 then I guess the hot would maybe be 10% more on a 3rd age?

    I do like the skill even though its situational, mainly for like I said proc on tank in t2 flight or on myself when a low morale Rez.

    One thing I wonder, you may be able to help: does anthem of composure effect increase with crystals ? It's something I've overlooked because I primarily run 4b and have free peoples and prowess up all the time.

    I was under the impression that mitigations at cap were easy to max out, so I doubted its effectiveness. Is this not so ?

    I know sometimes i run with champs especially, who to be fair do sublime dps but require much more focus than the tank, so much so that I have to have them targeted with bolster permanently.

    I wonder if this is a fault in their game or me not being flexible enough to take focus from the tank and making him my primary heal, not so much of an issue with warden it seems if you can keep them up thru initial burst.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazlo10 View Post
    If your swap book was lvl 85 then I guess the hot would maybe be 10% more on a 3rd age?

    I do like the skill even though its situational, mainly for like I said proc on tank in t2 flight or on myself when a low morale Rez.

    One thing I wonder, you may be able to help: does anthem of composure effect increase with crystals ? It's something I've overlooked because I primarily run 4b and have free peoples and prowess up all the time.

    I was under the impression that mitigations at cap were easy to max out, so I doubted its effectiveness. Is this not so ?

    I know sometimes i run with champs especially, who to be fair do sublime dps but require much more focus than the tank, so much so that I have to have them targeted with bolster permanently.

    I wonder if this is a fault in their game or me not being flexible enough to take focus from the tank and making him my primary heal, not so much of an issue with warden it seems if you can keep them up thru initial burst.
    Yes, the HoT would probably be more beneficial with a 3rd age book level 85, but that skill is used very scarcely, really... I just put the legacy there because it's nice to have for some fights.

    And no, as far as I know, anthem of composure mitigation or resistance is not affected by crystals. Then again, this is situational. I don't always swap the book to play composure; I only do it when I have too many squishy people to heal or when a resistance boost is needed. And yeah, mitigations are fairly easy to max out, but I usually run with DPS classes such as hunters or champs that focus on being pure glass cannons

    So anthem of composure -with the swap- is still nice for fights like Smaug. Before the pairs run up to the valves, give them a nice mitigation / resistance boost to help with the fire damage.

    Btw, I'm missing the Cry of the Chorus cooldown legacy... but I seriously haven't been able to find it in any book lately.
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

  20. #20
    i know what you mean about composure, mostly my anthems are more aggressive running 4b, especially in like bfe for instance. I don't have that on my swap book. (My fellow mini who plays a lot in the ettens swears by it)

    Coct cd lets you proc once in every 3 waves in flight, if i get a big lag spike on spawn i'll proc this then use fh maybe, although a lot of the fight in t2 is still left to chance imo.

    Realistically i don't want composure on a swap because i am lazy. The bubble is proactive (i know i keep bleating on about flight) and anthem of war i use when the healing is under control.

    I guess there are some times where i want to buy myself a little bit of time and the bubble does help a little. Battle hymn is 99% of the time one of my yellows, so i tend to have prowess up mostly with free peoples. I just wasn't sure if there was any merit in using composure over prowess without the legacy.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elemiire View Post
    @Bramor:

    I tested it. The bubble IS larger with the switch book with no relics or crystals, but the heal over time added to it is smaller.

    Aaaaaand I forgot to test the other bubble... but you get the idea :P
    Thanks a lot for that screen! The difference is less than I seem to remember, but since I'm mostly using the bubble for its HoT these days (it's kind of turned into my emergency HoT for hunters and other squishies if Chord of Salvation is on cooldown and I need a quick heal on the move) I guess I'm still better off using it with my main healing book without the legacy.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazlo10 View Post
    i know what you mean about composure, mostly my anthems are more aggressive running 4b, especially in like bfe for instance. I don't have that on my swap book. (My fellow mini who plays a lot in the ettens swears by it)

    Coct cd lets you proc once in every 3 waves in flight, if i get a big lag spike on spawn i'll proc this then use fh maybe, although a lot of the fight in t2 is still left to chance imo.

    Realistically i don't want composure on a swap because i am lazy. The bubble is proactive (i know i keep bleating on about flight) and anthem of war i use when the healing is under control.

    I guess there are some times where i want to buy myself a little bit of time and the bubble does help a little. Battle hymn is 99% of the time one of my yellows, so i tend to have prowess up mostly with free peoples. I just wasn't sure if there was any merit in using composure over prowess without the legacy.
    Well, I guess it would depend on the fight and your 'style' when healing.

    Since I'm a 4yellow minstrel, I usually have 4 anthems up so I don't really have a tight choice. But yes, I would use prowess over composure as a 'to go' anthem in most fights.

    Honestly, when I get the legacy for CoC cooldown (if I even find it ) I will probably replace one of the composure legacies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bramor View Post
    Thanks a lot for that screen! The difference is less than I seem to remember, but since I'm mostly using the bubble for its HoT these days (it's kind of turned into my emergency HoT for hunters and other squishies if Chord of Salvation is on cooldown and I need a quick heal on the move) I guess I'm still better off using it with my main healing book without the legacy.
    Good point. I guess it's a matter of deciding which is more valuable in a specific situation: the bubble or the HoT.
    And then, forever remains that change from G to E minor.

 

 

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