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  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Akotah View Post
    I've got a number of creeps and freeps on the Brandywine server above rank 5, so I can speak with a bit of confidence when I say-
    no matter how you slice it, refusing to group even with new creeps has never made sense to me.

    It's stupid. There's no good excuse to just run around in 3-4 small groups rather than just having everyone group
    together. The same goes on freep side, too. It's ridiculously hard to find people who will let you join their group. And
    there's just no good excuse for it.

    "Nooo! They die too easy!" Just sounds like a lame excuse to be elitist. All it takes is good leadership, and low ranks
    do just fine in a group.

    Maybe they should just make creeps start at rank 5 to begin with. Cut out the annoying, lonesome stage. But the way
    things are, i'm sure creeps would just start demanding "at least rank 10" if that were to happen regardless.
    A lot of new creeps refuse to comply with simple directions that you need to take into account. I can't count how many times I've said for a new creep to "put their voice chat on", even directly through IMs and they just simply don't. I really don't know why. That's another way they can be a detriment other than being low ranked and weak.

    Like many others' semantics have echoed, the Moors are much different than what they used to be with the addition of audacity and rank now providing freeps a boost as well. You need all the cohesive strength in one raid as you can get. Until the lower ranked creeps are higher ranked and learn the game a bit more through trial and error, they are nothing but a burden and a hassle. This has nothing to do with elitism, but simple logistics of the Moors. I provide the same scenario that I said before: if you had the option of having a Rank 5 warleader over a Rank 1 Warleader in your raid when you are fighting a powerful freep raid, who would you choose? Say for example you had to kick the rank 1 to make room for the rank 5?

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    10 Haven Way Imlad-in-Glir
    Posts
    56
    This does seem to be something that varies from server to server. On Laurelin I found the Creep community very welcoming. I was given gold and loads of quest items by complete strangers, which really helped me with those difficult first levels. Creeps as low as R1 can join a raid if there's a spot. Obviously people are going to kick you if you don't try to contribute and just run around leeching.

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Aelaer View Post
    This does seem to be something that varies from server to server. On Laurelin I found the Creep community very welcoming. I was given gold and loads of quest items by complete strangers, which really helped me with those difficult first levels. Creeps as low as R1 can join a raid if there's a spot. Obviously people are going to kick you if you don't try to contribute and just run around leeching.
    Yeah, I'd often give newbies free quest stuff too, but I'm just saying if it's a situation where creeps need the firepower/heals of a higher ranked creep, they will most likely kick the weaker, lower ranked, and least experienced creep for them.

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Blighty
    Posts
    2,376
    As a corollary to this discussion it is interesting to note that warg packs are paradoxically the most discriminatory and the most egalitarian groups that regularly form in the Ettenmoors. On the one hand you must be a warg to join (with very rare exceptions). On the other hand my experience has shown that warg packs will include just about any warg that wants to join regardless of how low ranked they are or how little Audacity they have. The fact that the person wishing to join is a fellow warg seems to override any other consideration.

    That is not to say that that is always the case. For example, sometimes on my server (Laurelin) there will be packs formed that specifically ask for rank 10+ or rank 12+ wargs. These are usually small packs and more aimed at allowing more high ranked wargs to play in a pack without leading to give them a break or perhaps in response to a specific threat e.g. a particularly potent small group of freeps.

    The general rules stands though: if you are a warg and there is an open pack you will not be refused admission.
    [URL="http://theartofwarg.com/"]@theartofwarg[/URL]

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Riviere-du-Loup
    Posts
    116
    I am on BW server too and actually the elitism is more than the op have mentioned. If you want in a craid of those who play often in the moors its more R10 to get in. and the discrimination isnt just for rank its for class too. Wargs are too squishy and have no room in craid, only for a few exceptions. Craid usually preferes high ranks reaver, WL and BA, a few wargs, spiders and defilers to fill up the rest.

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    GV Steps
    Posts
    1,262
    Quote Originally Posted by Aranglas View Post
    Greetings

    I had just rolled my first Reaver on the Brandywine server due to it's abundance of players and thus groups for PvMP. However not all were as expected. Although there was an overabundance of players on both sides, in the Creep side some players decided to make a discrimination in the Creep playerbase. They tagged every player above Rank 5 worthy while all the rest of us who were below that rank were tagged as useless to them. The result was that while the Freep side was fighting us in a full 24-man raid, we were scattered on 3-4 small groups with the largest one being a 7-10 man raid which consisted of some elitists who chose to tag the rest of us as useless. While I understand that it is their right to chose with who to play I also believe that such behavior is really ruining the PvMP as new players are actually unable to enter raids and thus perform successfully in the field of battle as other only rarely take notice of their status. Last but not least it is really sad to even think about the "warm welcoming" that many new players may get in such an unfriendly environment.

    So, what is your opinion on this issue ? Do believe that there is something that can be done ?
    My opinion, it's how people are by nature.
    I don't think turbine should be responsible for moderating the social situations that players themselves set up. I don't think these players are obligated to cater to a fellowship of people they don't know.

    That said, welcome to BW. I'm sure you'll meet people and make friends in no time. Cheers

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Bama
    Posts
    340
    On gladden we have no problems bringing in any creep, though sometimes have to be suspicious of spies. What generally happens is what Joshy has said above. Low/unranked reavers are regarded with a little more suspicion because of spying and you might get the boot for higher ranked creeps or creeps of other classes. Said reaver may get the boot for a lower ranked WL or defiler even. It sucks but being a leader the whole point of the group is to win and that can be tough with the way freeps are especially if they stack the right classes/actually know who to play their class. I hate booting people or leaving some newer creeps in a group w/o a healer or where they won't get much infamy but i got to worry about group welfare. It also can get annoying when you have a trigger happy WL bubbling a rank 3 BA/reaver/spider or such right at the start of the fight when that bubble needs to be saved for someone who is contributing more. I have no problem with newer creeps tagging along to get infamy to rank up and get more useful faster but just got to understand what comes with being lower ranked. I would much rather said newbies get good at following targets and listening to orders than being a higher ranked and not doing what has been told because then some newbies follow them also and the whole raid goes to poo. The mapping aspect is a pain seeing as the grams map is the only one that can be counted on someone having and some dont even have to good one. I have actually been in a group when someone said their grams map was on cool down for another 30 mins or so. There is elitist behavior out there no doubt. On gladden it is mostly on freepside, the only creepside stuff is getting folks to break up kin runs when we need to combine forces for a large freep group or need a specific class i.e. WLs. I try and remember to give out as many map quest items as possible when i remember. I also will flip spots just so folks can get that quest for their maps, though I'm not very reliable on remembering to share the quest. I was there not long ago as a red ranked WL, I got more invites than random folks because WLs are always needed. I learned from better WLs than myself on what to trait and what skills need to be used when(I think i was rank 6 when i figured out my rez was for 5 and not for just one lol) but there are creeps out there who will help with ideas on how to trait corruptions and stuff. Leaders will generally tell you any special skills you need to use and when(i.e. hinder, blight, flayer root, timed coordination of impale and vt, etc). Just keep trying and as stated many times before in post and by any creep who is worth his weight in slug meet and footman badges, always work on your maps if you dont have them. The three keeps first and LC and then really up to poor isen but if you really wanna impress get your good isen LOL. Good luck to you and hope you keep at it as creep side seems to be a stagnate thing since it isnt just log in and win kinda deal.

  8. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    indiana
    Posts
    149

    Red face

    The creep/freep player elitist behavior is possibly the reason there seem to be never enough freeps or creeps,because
    the new people coming in rarely bother coming back for more than a few min unless it's to kill some time. I have gotten
    a few ranks going on my freep and creep, but the stuck up ones that forgot that they started with a big fat "zero" for
    rank have already been picked out and discarded into the iggy bin for life. I on the other hand have informed kin members
    and friends list peeps already that when the time comes,regardless of my rank,that I will be there to group and
    help when and if they come to the moors.

    Liability or not,don't be a tool and forget that when you first set foot in the moors,you were the new creep with no rank.

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Grothum
    Posts
    387
    Quote Originally Posted by Arandeath View Post
    Liability or not,don't be a tool and forget that when you first set foot in the moors,you were the new creep with no rank.
    Well said.

    Not saying anyone should 'endanger' their night of fun by inviting 10 r0 creeps into their craid or anything, but at least take the time to explain to the new guys what's up and down. Give them some pointers, some quest items or w/e and send them off into the moors with a feeling they're welcome at least. I'm truly puzzled by why some people (usually the same sorry bunch that do f... all to encourage new players when they show up) moan about being outnumbered when they do next to nothing to better the situation when the chances arrives.

    Anyways, new creeps stand a better chance of getting a proper welcome at the smaller population servers than the big ones, that's just a fact.

    /rant off

  10. #35

    See more on Know Your Meme


    See more on Know Your Meme

  11. #36
    As a reaver who has had to rank in Brandy with no store-bought stuff, I understand your pain, trust me. But we all had to go through it, and getting farmed day after day builds character.

    I'll also say the following: In brandywine we have daily 24-man fraids that can average up to rank 8 or 9, and that have up to 7 or 8 healers. We can't fight that with r5's in our raid. It's a very ruthless server in that sense, both sides will farm each other to oblivion if they get the chance, and if we creeps manage to make a stand everyday it's because we also have high rank people and excellent leaders.

    All I can say is try to get some buddies so you don't get killed while PvEing, and good luck. Welcome to Brandy!

  12. #37
    Why would you guys complain on that IF it takes MAX 5 days to get to r5 ? Simply by questing/gold tagging with others ?

    As mentioned above - reason #1 - newbies don't listen and follow directions. And it is really annoying for the leader. Especially if you fight against really good group/raid. You wont be able to win them with newbies in.

    But when I lead group/raid I usually get couple of newbies in just to help them with ranks. But I do that only when I have solid base of you called "elitelists", so I can be sure it wont be total fail.

    For instance, yesterday I was leading craid with like 3-5 r1-r5 newbies. Yeah we won (fraid had too like up to 6-8 newbies with no audacity), but guess what - I have no idea how, because focus fire and behaviour were totally terrible.


    So my advice for newbies: get your headphones to work, listen and follow to what you've been said.
    And other one - try to make newbie grps. With amounts you can kill pretty many freeps out there Sure some will die but still.

  13. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    indiana
    Posts
    149
    heh,since HD it's gotten a little more action going on but
    the exclusion of some some players has gotten worse as
    a few now only let r8+ in groups.the part that frustrates
    some players possibly is seeing these antisocial/rude players
    rank up in a couple weeks to 8 or 9 while they spend 2
    months going from r6 to r7 and nobody seems willing to even
    give out any tips to help.all because a few idiots that
    take the game too serious and qq at the idea that they
    might come up a couple points short,getting 1500 rather
    than the 1550/1600 they think they deserve?oh boo hoo.

    you guys that do this do realize it's only a vidoe game,right?
    no daily limits on how many comms and such that can be
    earned per server a day,they will still be there when you
    come back on.

  14. #39
    Dont be surprised. Everything bellow r6 or even r7 on creep side is absolutely useless. 99% of the time that means :
    1. No audacity
    2. No experience
    3. No skills that are needed in raid (most of them comes after r6-7).

    So thats just used leeching spot in a raid that could maybe become usefull if someone higher ranked logs in.
    Only thing left for you is :
    1.) Make a group of your own, call all the others "useless low ranks" that are around you to a group. Maybe 20 of you will be nice bait for freeps or count as 4 high ranked creeps at some point. Sadly /sarcasm off
    2.)Buy the skills from store, leech the raids for some time, get few ranks (r6 is easily attained in 4-5 days, nowadays), grab the audacity, and you will notice the difference between you and some other new players

    On the contrary, that doesnt neceseraly means same thing on the freep side cause of the current state of imbalance.


    P.S. Ofc, gain few friends, be social, if you are funny enough ppl will ninja invite you as soon as you log in

    Cheers

    EDIT : VERY IMPORTANT!!! - if you are new player, be sure that even if u get in a raid, your voice chat is enabled in Options. Most of raid leaders will remind you on that, but you just might not be able to HEAR it (heh) or miss it when he types it on chat.

  15. #40
    I will have to slightly agree with the OP in this topic.

    When I am on freep side, if there isn't already an open group, all it takes is one simple "lfg" in OOC and I get an invite no questions asked.

    But when I rolled a fresh Reaver I found it to be a very frustrating time in the moors. Very rarely would there be an open group (except warg packs), and I could spam OOC all day long with "lfg" or "any open spots" and get nothing but silence. Hell even when I just called out some Freeps ninjaing a keep or Ganking greenies I was almost always met with indifference while on creepside...

    But fast forward to today and my now rank 6 Reaver gets random invites all the time whenever I log on.

    The moral of the story is, get through your first 5 ranks and maps as quickly as you can. You'll get no love until then.

  16. #41
    This sort of thing is a really dopey attitude. It does not help develop the creep player base. These clods will limit future gameplay opportunities this way. It happens with freeps and creeps. best response yet, go to Laurelin. The people who do like to think that they are elite will always excuse themselves to do so, however they can. It is not worth a second thought. You don't blame a bear for dumping in the woods, don't blame an ignoramous for ignorance.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by GSO86 View Post
    I will have to slightly agree with the OP in this topic.

    When I am on freep side, if there isn't already an open group, all it takes is one simple "lfg" in OOC and I get an invite no questions asked.

    But when I rolled a fresh Reaver I found it to be a very frustrating time in the moors. Very rarely would there be an open group (except warg packs), and I could spam OOC all day long with "lfg" or "any open spots" and get nothing but silence. Hell even when I just called out some Freeps ninjaing a keep or Ganking greenies I was almost always met with indifference while on creepside...

    But fast forward to today and my now rank 6 Reaver gets random invites all the time whenever I log on.

    The moral of the story is, get through your first 5 ranks and maps as quickly as you can. You'll get no love until then.
    Yes.

    Most creeps, who lead raids, have to realize, that most greenie players can't get audacity without raiding, but, they can easily get 4-5 ranks with PVE by itself, and the maps, which are a necessity in the Moors. So emphasizing GSO86s moral again: beg for common quest items (high ranks have tons, and will give them to you for free - you might even get lucky, and get a mercy Sigil of Battle), do the quests for maps - if you're persistent, you can get poor maps in a week, and from there it's just a short stroll to good maps. By then you should be around R4-R5, and the chances of you getting into a group grow rapidly.

  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Manvett View Post
    Yes.

    Most creeps, who lead raids, have to realize, that most greenie players can't get audacity without raiding, but, they can easily get 4-5 ranks with PVE by itself, and the maps, which are a necessity in the Moors. So emphasizing GSO86s moral again: beg for common quest items (high ranks have tons, and will give them to you for free - you might even get lucky, and get a mercy Sigil of Battle), do the quests for maps - if you're persistent, you can get poor maps in a week, and from there it's just a short stroll to good maps. By then you should be around R4-R5, and the chances of you getting into a group grow rapidly.
    Too much, use of, commas

 

 
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