Good to see these sort of answers coming from the team; even the fluff question. Some questions and thoughts about the ones that feel relevant.
If say a ring drops from the boss 5% of the time, someone will get it their first time, but nearly 1 in 10 people will still be waiting to see it drop having run the instance 50 times. If its rarer; the spread gets worse. For me that is the irritating thing, the extreme variation between 2 players doing exactly the same thing, and it is WAI. If the drop rates were higher, people would be less frustrated (20% drop rate and you'll be really unlucky not to see it after 15-20 runs, where the difference doesn't feel as bad). I can see the appeal of a token based system, kill the boss 25 times and I can barter for what I want.
Ironically considering all those stats, I have not trusted a computer based RNG for over 10 years. Whenever I hear the 'RNG is working fine,' I mention the WI flag.
That may come down to the character the content is balanced against. Which leads to the obvious question of any thoughts of more challenging solo content (with appropriate rewards), as now the options are unchallenging landscape content, or group content, with nothing in between.
The thing I mail most these days is money, so with that in mind, any thoughts towards shared/kin banks?
On Twitter and in this thread, Sapience confirmed LotrO will exist after 2014 for sure:
with the RNG i have seen some crazy things. i have a hunter friend on dwarro who has run IP close to if not over 1000 times trying to recieve a golden hunters dagger. In fact, he gave up running the instance figuring he would never get it. other hunters have gotten it after only a few runs. I personally feel that it is extremely stupid to have to run the same run a million times with only a CHANCE a getting the item your after. I enjoy most of the different 3m/6m/12m runs, but i really dont enjoy the same run more than 10-20 times in a row. it gets to the point where i am basically sleep running the run as my mind zones out and i become a grinding zombie. I agree with some of the earlier posts that having a system that alows you to barter for the item after so many times running it would be excellent. This would make the grinding easier as the end would be in sight. I dont know how difficult this would be to do, but something needs to be done, as having to run 1000 runs for one gold item ( and still not getting it) is insane.
What confuses me is why Sapience & co choose to communicate as they do - even when given a yes/no question, he chooses to give a longer answer where the reader need to deduce the actual yes/no answer - and even then it will only be an expectation. Then he tops it by saying there's not a single bit of vagueness about that answer.
Granted, I'm no expert in communication and Sapience most likely is, but whether or not an answer is vague or not completely depends on the recipient. If the recipient finds the answer vague/unclear, like this one:
The correct answer, which is not a yes/no answer, is that yes they plan to keep this game going for a long time and that they are not keeping the imminent demise a secret and they have not mysteriously forgotten that fact that a contract is up for renewal next year.
Surely some players will pounce on it, but I'm sure it's the very same players as those who are currently pouncing "They haven't said they've signed the renewal yet, game is dying", I don't see any difference.
I believe the desire is that there are multiple ways to earn rewards. Players want progression and they want a sense of how far they are down that road. RNG is fun, if you are lucky (remember the Lothlorian Gift Boxes???), but if you are not, you may jump from a Mallorn...
Deeds are digestible bc you know you have 450 more Snow beasts to kill to get the Tiier 2 version done for that virtue. If you could use Unified currency (spend 90k marks) or deeds (run GB instances 300 times) as different paths toward a reward, then that would be great.
Today, you may just get someone a 1st age if you do a Raid on T2C, but those 7 seals you got for your 20 min run on FoS could be had in about the same time in Fornost (maybe less)
Leave RNG for the 'ooo I got lucky" moments, and let players work toward it otherwise. Generally I think Hytbold is disliked and Forlaw even more, but it would be one step worse if there was just a chance you got 5 tokens for that daily quest...
We're looking for choice and options (as some said for Hytbold, why lock players to a daily lock, if they can only get on a few times a week...maybe don't give them option for 35 quests, but maybe 25 max in a week if you missed 3 days)
Last edited by JTollers; Jul 11 2013 at 02:55 AM. Reason: spelling
Lets explain that on some fictitious numbers with a compare to raids before the change.
Raid Tier 2 CM.
Items Before (with raid locks) After - chance for each player - without raid locks First Age 1 gurenteed 1/120 Jewelry 2 gurenteed 2/120 EXP Runes 24 2 per player Relicts 24 2 per player Special Drops 1% Chance 0.0083 % Chance
Result of that with the new system:
you could get in theory 12 first ages. or 0. but i've never heared from dropping more than 3 in a run. but 0 is the normal case.
the problem with this is: you could not plan your progress at all, and that is a problem. i could not say: ok we(my kin and i) will be able to do this challange mode in 14 weeks if we all have our first ages.
one result of the new random mode loot system is: the intrest overall in raids, especially in T2CM is at a verry low point. from 24 willing people for orthanc there are 8 left for erebor. the other 16 are still playing(more or less) but there is currently no way to get them back to raid. why should they a such a terrible rewarding system.
the current system might look good at the paper, but it is so terrible for grouping players, thats what i could say about the people i play with.
i would not speek of a run of luck if someone is getting 16 gold items (and need to throw away 6 of them) and other 0. while in nearly the same group. (over a period of a month)[...] runs of luck(good or bad) in the short term.[...]
Last edited by Milithion; Jul 11 2013 at 08:15 AM.
Es grüßt General HauptmannMilithion - Held der Ettenöden
Sippenleiter von MNdK
Technische Hilfe FAQ: http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?402521-Technische-Hilfe-FAQ
I didn't really consider that there were different tiers of items one might win, but that is easy to work into the token system: you just have multiple things you can 'buy' with your tokens; indeed, rather similar to Marks, Medallions and Seals.
Basically, instead of winning either common, better, better2, better3, better4 or best loot, you win somewhere between 1 and 100 (but at least one!) tokens. (In general, the minimum number can be larger than 1, but can never be zero - this ensures that eventually, everybody can obtain the rarest reward.) Which number of tokens you receive is determined by the RNG.
You then have the option of handing in your tokens for the same items you might otherwise have won directly: let's say they cost 10, 20, 40, 60 and 100 tokens.
There's still a possibility that you will obtain the best item in one run (if you're awarded 100 tokens), but if you decide from the start that that's what you're working towards, you will never need more than 100 runs (in this example) to obtain it. On the other hand, if you get tired of waiting, you can go for one of the lesser options.
Essentially, this system allows bad luck to be overcome by tenacity.
I don`t believe that turbine is neglecting it`s deal with middle earth and like the McDonalds reference you don`t just wait there for the contract to expire, turbine has many other things to worry about and they clearly said that there will be many years of support to come. So to worry about weather or not the contract is done is just silly. Have a little faith and game on!!!!!
1s off for gev my spelly ples
2 im a big time pvp plaer im a rank 12 all most rank 13 im the hiest ranky cappy on my sover
and stell i see lvl 40 julry in the moors that lvl 85 run in and you all took cer of the problum of lvl 40 to 48 not a lowed in stell the low lvl stell find a way in lol but ha wunt to go in to that lvl 85 place get hit 1 die dont cumplan in ooc abart die
rell resun im on her is wundry if and how you all or going to balens stufe out not gust for freeps but creeps as well thow thay dont need the creep that mush to shanst maby there spamy stun on a bit of a cool down lool stell have a foow bums on my head gety shild bach 30 time in less then 30sec lool thenk it wood be cool if freeps that cood stun might have a better stun or a how you say it upgrad there stun wer thay can us it weth out a defet like cappy of to have for there 3 sec stun cumperd to a wlstun that last 10 to 15 sec pot it and thay gust hafe to stun you a gan then you cant pot it o and see the cappy shild you mad for us out in the moors cool look smoll and has a tatkel mastry raty for a clos rang fighty class not so good cappy or clos rang fighter thenk that might need to be sweshed to mpaktel mastry and maby a bit biger to the look is osume thow
o and most of all or hunters runceeper and mistrels out there in pvp we reliy on them a lot out in the moors there a bit to soft i see them get slad ever day out there and wesh thay had a better defenst at lest abel to hander 4 5 creeps on them and not die in 45 sec or less wunder if you have ing idels on helpy them out sume
and ples get red of the op buffs senst thows came in theres ben op war but rely a fight over the op liked it befor thows op wer it wust bast on the skills and xps you gan on fight a creep or freep now both sid fight for the op but not relly fight for the op see put it thes way i solo thows op so say i took 1 i lev not even 30sec of me levey that op grup of creep can com in there and take it backe gust that fast its like that on both sid so in a way theres less pvp and more pve out there be cus of thows op
Silence vs. vague, non-answers. Discuss amongst yourselves, class, while I take a bio break.
I pop, pop, shrews in the head, ed, ed,
And I eat what's left when the shrews are dead.
Look at the question again:
It was Turbine themselves who chose to go beyond the simple answer and instead confirm well beyond what cossieuk was asking, yet without actually answering the question.
BTW I just wanted to say thank you to all the Devs taking the time and answering our questions, this is one of my favorite Threads to read.
Beo - Level 95 Shing-Shing
I've noticed that some areas on the map are dimmed signifying that they are not on. Do yall have future plans for putting them online in the next couple of years?
Are there any plans to update the shared banking so we can put gold, silver, copper in to share between all characters on account?
I'd love it if they added scaleable war-bands to the lower level areas,
like Angmarim in evendim that leave an angmarim city and match toward Ost Galadh.
or Brigands who sneak in packs around the shire looking for hobbitses to thug.
each giving scaleable Marks or boxes as rewards.
I know in other MMOs, if a high level helps someone in those encounters, their toon is scaled down to say, lvl 10 or something in order to contribute a little more evenly against the public encounter.
I don't know if lotro's gear system would do this effectively, but it would make the game a lot more interesting, and enable high levels to help new players without making it easy mode for them.
LvL 100s: Beorning, Burglar, Captain, Champ, Guardian, Hunter, Lore-Master, Minstrel, Rune-Keeper
LvL 85: Warden, Minstrel
All my forum posts are my opinions and may not even be that. Also On Twitter: @leixicon
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