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Thread: Female Dwarves

  1. #1

    Female Dwarves

    I would really like to see female dwarves. I was discussing this with a friend of mine and we both agreed that (we're both female players) we would be more inclined to create dwarf characters if we had the option to make them females.

    I realise there hasn't been a lot mentioned about female dwarves within Tolkien's work, but since seeing the female dwarf extras in the movie, The Hobbit, it has really brought the lack of them to the fore, for me as a player at least.

    I appreciate the time you have taken to read my post, and look forward to reading the comments and thoughts on this

  2. #2
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    Look around - I'm sure a portion of the dwarves you see are female.

  3. #3
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    According to Tolkien, you can't tell the difference between dwarven males and female due to both genders having beards. To put it bluntly, if you want a female dwarf, give it a female name, and pick either one of the short or more neatly groomed beards, and put a dress on.

  4. #4

    As both prior posts have said...

    In The Lord of the Rings Tolkien writes that they breed slowly, for no more than a third of them are female, and not all marry; also, female Dwarves look and sound (and dress, if journeying—which is rare) so alike to Dwarf-males that other folk cannot distinguish them, and thus others wrongly believe Dwarves grow out of stone. Tolkien names only one female, Dís. In The War of the Jewels Tolkien says both males and females have beards.

    Middle Earth wiki Dwarf

  5. #5
    Normally things on the forums wouldn't stop me for a moment, back in beta when I had a separate account I would have been more "confrontational", I guess you could say, but I have faith that Turbine wouldn't go this far against the lore, fingers crossed!

    We need only female names for the bearded dwarfs, so if you and your friend are that pumped up about female dwarfs then create one, and I'm sure they will be welcomed with open arms from all the hardcore and bandwagon lotro fans. I know I will...

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by GwydionKyram View Post
    According to Tolkien, you can't tell the difference between dwarven males and female due to both genders having beards. To put it bluntly, if you want a female dwarf, give it a female name, and pick either one of the short or more neatly groomed beards, ...
    You don't even need to do that. There's a dwarf NPC in Noglond who occasionally remarks, "My wife's up at Thorin's Hall, having her beard braided." That implies a certain *length* of beard.
    Eruanne - Shards of Narsil-1 - Elendilmir -> Arkenstone

  7. #7
    I would like for Turbine to allow us to select Female
    when creating a Dwarf. It will not change ANYTHING
    from a male dwarf except that Dwarves will call you
    a she, all other races will still call you by male titles
    Last edited by EvAmy; Jun 18 2013 at 12:24 AM. Reason: typo :P

  8. #8
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    Sapience closed other threads like this one saying that it's not possible to select a female dwarf because they can't be distinguished.

    Still it is a pain for those playing female dwarves who want to use titles which are gender dependent.

    It's less a problem in English as it is in German, many more titles (than in English), have gender dependent forms.

  9. #9
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    Add boobs. Tada! Female Dwarf.

  10. #10
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Graycient View Post
    Add boobs. Tada! Female Dwarf.
    Your knowledge of dwarven anatomy is impressive. Clearly the only explanation is that you must be one yourself. You will now probably be executed by the High Council of the Dwarves for revealing their most private secrets.

    You will be sadly missed.
    TANSTAAFL

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazza_dee View Post
    I would really like to see female dwarves. I was discussing this with a friend of mine and we both agreed that (we're both female players) we would be more inclined to create dwarf characters if we had the option to make them females.

    I realise there hasn't been a lot mentioned about female dwarves within Tolkien's work, but since seeing the female dwarf extras in the movie, The Hobbit, it has really brought the lack of them to the fore, for me as a player at least.

    I appreciate the time you have taken to read my post, and look forward to reading the comments and thoughts on this
    You can make female dwarves. They just happen to look exactly like male dwarves, and that is true to Tolkien's description of the race.

    Quote Originally Posted by EvAmy View Post
    I would like for Turbine to allow us to select Female
    when creating a Dwarf. It will not change ANYTHING
    from a male dwarf except that Dwarves will call you
    a she, all other races will still call you by male titles
    Okay, put this way, I can understand and even endorse the request, so, /signed.

    But a big fat NO to female dwarves with cute pigtails, makeup and pink bows in their beards.
    Last edited by Aestivan; Jun 18 2013 at 03:32 AM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazza_dee View Post
    ... but since seeing the female dwarf extras in the movie, The Hobbit, it has really brought the lack of them to the fore, for me as a player at least.
    Alas, LotRO is a game about Tolkien's Middle Earth, not Peter Jackson and his abominations...uh...movies.
    [B]Crafting - Explorer - Tailor/Forestor/Prospector - 9s Across the Board[/B]

  13. #13
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    Some lore buff correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't Tolkien state somewhere that female dwarves actively try to not be distinguishable from their male counterparts if they leave their homes ?
    So them displaying male titles and being addressed as males would be fitting.
    Would be a nice touch though if you had the option just so actual dwarf npcs could address you correctly.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thorwyn99 View Post
    Some lore buff correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't Tolkien state somewhere that female dwarves actively try to not be distinguishable from their male counterparts if they leave their homes ?
    So them displaying male titles and being addressed as males would be fitting.
    Would be a nice touch though if you had the option just so actual dwarf npcs could address you correctly.
    I don't think it fits Tolkiens that we can actually run around with text over our heads, displaying our name, PvP rank and title in the first place.

    Don't base everything on lore, please. This is a game after all. And players who play female dwarves don't want to see male titles.

    Not to be distinguishable ... that's a cosmetic question, not a gameplay question.

    If it's really so important that others can't see the female title, then at least the player should see the real title.
    And of course, if we insist on dwarves beind indistinguishable, we have to forbid players to dress their dwarves in pink dresses.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neumi View Post
    I don't think it fits Tolkiens that we can actually run around with text over our heads, displaying our name, PvP rank and title in the first place.

    Don't base everything on lore, please. This is a game after all. And players who play female dwarves don't want to see male titles.

    Not to be distinguishable ... that's a cosmetic question, not a gameplay question.

    If it's really so important that others can't see the female title, then at least the player should see the real title.
    And of course, if we insist on dwarves beind indistinguishable, we have to forbid players to dress their dwarves in pink dresses.
    True but i guess it depends if you see titles as in character or out of character. I personally like it that if you see a dwarf you automatically assume it's a male just as a human would.

    The best idea would imo be to have the female button on the character screen which changes really nothing about your dwarf but you and all other dwarf players could see your female gendered titles, everyone else sees the male titles.
    Dwarf npcs should address you right and everyone else shouldn't.
    Be a nice touch but probably too much effort for the gain.

    The problem i have with generally giving out female titles to dwarves, besides the fact that i like it as it is, is that next thing that will be asked for is more femine looking dwarves(as you say people already put dwarves in dresses). We actually had a few of those already.
    I'm hardly a lore fanatic but i always thought the dwarves are a nice touch, although turbine took the easy way out by simply not offering a female option.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neumi View Post
    Don't base everything on lore, please. This is a game after all.
    You lost that argument the second Turbine decided to stick with lore and keep them indistinguishable. If you don't like male-specific titles, don't display them - it's not like they don't give you a choice.

  17. #17
    Female dwarf you say? Here I am!

    Rosiebelle Rabbitbane - Snowy's most well known lady of the halls of stone.

    We are out there - just they make it hard for us to express our feminine dwarvern identity - no beard ribbons, axes with flowers engraved on them etc.

    And indeed the last thread I made on this was closed - despite the fact it was a good discussion with no argument or bad language or anything really objectionable.
    Fight on my dwavern sisters! May the orc blood always wash right out your frilly dresses.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    You lost that argument the second Turbine decided to stick with lore and keep them indistinguishable.
    How? How is my argument lost?
    Btw, they didn't keep them indistinguishable, they eliminated female dwarves completely. All we have are men dressed like women. Having indistinguishable males and females would mean to have males and females in the first place, but to be unable to distinguish them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    If you don't like male-specific titles, don't display them - it's not like they don't give you a choice.
    It's no about me, I have no female chars.
    And no, they don't. They don't give anyone who plays a female dwarf the choice to use a female title. All one can do is to pick neutral titles and there are not many. This makes the rewards for many deeds and quests useless for players who decided to play a female dwarf.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thorwyn99 View Post
    The best idea would imo be to have the female button on the character screen which changes really nothing about your dwarf but you and all other dwarf players could see your female gendered titles, everyone else sees the male titles.
    Dwarf npcs should address you right and everyone else shouldn't.
    Be a nice touch but probably too much effort for the gain.
    Yep, that's really all we ask for.

    Of course there would be one "problem": Even if males and females look the same, some people would be offended by a female bare chested dwarf (some people are just like that). So the game would need one enhancement: to distinguish between male and female in the first place when it comes to cosmetics. Currently any male char can wear dresses because there is no distinction.

  20. #20
    I think in the age we are in any female (or male) gamer should be able to play a strong and distinctly female character of any race.

    I'm not asking to go against the lore. I don't want to lose the beard and I don't want boobs. I would like female dwarves to be acknowledged by NPCs and titles as being female. I would also like a couple of more feminine beard and hair styles available. That is all.

    The world Tolkien was writing in has changed a lot - the world he wrote about could do with a few very minor adjustments to reflect that in the context that so many gamers are now female. We have a significant voice that we should be able to reflect in all our characters.

    After all if so many hobbits can leave The Shire, we can ride goats across Rohan and quest by the side of ents I don't think it is stretching the lore any more than it has been already to just let female dwarves be a little, tiny bit female.
    Fight on my dwavern sisters! May the orc blood always wash right out your frilly dresses.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neumi View Post
    How? How is my argument lost?
    Btw, they didn't keep them indistinguishable, they eliminated female dwarves completely. All we have are men dressed like women. Having indistinguishable males and females would mean to have males and females in the first place, but to be unable to distinguish them.
    Given that there should be no female Dwarf adventurers (none at all, not even one) I think they've given people all that's warranted. The existing option is better than nothing, so do stop carping.

    It's no about me, I have no female chars.
    And no, they don't. They don't give anyone who plays a female dwarf the choice to use a female title. All one can do is to pick neutral titles and there are not many. This makes the rewards for many deeds and quests useless for players who decided to play a female dwarf.
    People still get a choice of neutral titles if they're that bothered. Or here's a thought, don't bother with titles at all and just worry about the character, as she's what matters and titles make zero difference to how a character plays. It's not like they're worth a damn in RP, either.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosiebelle View Post
    I'm not asking to go against the lore.
    Oh yes you do, that's exactly what you're asking for here:

    I would like female dwarves to be acknowledged by NPCs and titles as being female. I would also like a couple of more feminine beard and hair styles available. That is all.

  23. #23
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    I agree with Rosiebelle. No harm done when you can express being a female dwarf in a subtle way, like with gender specific titles. for the rest it is perfectly fine to keep appearances the same. It's not like that will suddenly make them DnD dwarves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    People still get a choice of neutral titles if they're that bothered. Or here's a thought, don't bother with titles at all and just worry about the character, as she's what matters and titles make zero difference to how a character plays. It's not like they're worth a damn in RP, either.
    If you don't care about titles why would this request bother you so? You could just ignore the "Groin, Lady of Fangs" floating above that sturdy and hairy dwarf you are teaming up with.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    Given that there should be no female Dwarf adventurers (none at all, not even one) I think they've given people all that's warranted. The existing option is better than nothing, so do stop carping.
    Don't make things up ... there should be "hardly any", not "none at all". "Usually" female dwarves don't leave the homestead. That does not mean that they never do.
    We have a lot of lore "expanding" elements in the game, this would be just one among many.

    Quote Originally Posted by Radhruin_EU View Post
    People still get a choice of neutral titles if they're that bothered. Or here's a thought, don't bother with titles at all and just worry about the character, as she's what matters and titles make zero difference to how a character plays. It's not like they're worth a damn in RP, either.
    People like titles. Turbine knows that, that's why we have so many and can earn so many.
    So why in this specific case are titles unimportant all the sudden?

  25. #25
    To everyone who is in this thread who is in support of female dwarves the best thing you can do is go out and roll and level one.

    Don't let the very great limitations within the game stop you. There are still plenty of nice dresses (though not designed for our shape) and nice hair flowers, hats and circlets. You can still use a girlie name.

    The more of us there are then the less people will feel we are something so unusual that we aren't worth bothering about.

    Dwarvern girls of Middle Earth get out there and show the world your beards!

    Signed - Rosiebelle and Posienell Rabbitbane
    Fight on my dwavern sisters! May the orc blood always wash right out your frilly dresses.

 

 
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