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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    344

    We keep asking for change but why?

    Over the years turbine has made many changes to PvP. Personally I think most of them were decisions that didn't work out so well. As a community however we keep requesting change and as I look around I only feel as if things are much worse off now.

    Rather then ask for change and new things I'd like to ask turbine to stop changing things. Just stop! Do not introduce any new creep skills, classes, new zones, major zone changes, new items for freeps, etc..

    Take the resources that you would have put into that (however much that may be) and put into into fixing things. Fix the bugs, fix the lag (to the extent that you can), fix those major issues that people gripe about.

    This is just my thoughts and I know a lot of players will disagree with me but after years of playing it has become obvious to me that this is what turbine should be doing.

    Please fine tune the moors before moving on!
    Co-Founder of TEAM F. Turined R9 champ. Mashedtaters R9 Reaver
    Perma-Retired Pre SoM- R9 Hnt. R8 Reaver

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Narnia
    Posts
    202
    Okay.....fixing all those bugs and major problems in the moors IS change
    Creeps:Lugezer r11
    Freeps: Athelious r5

  3. #3
    Problem is, Turbine really didnt do the things we asked and broke promises as well. The changes they made are changes we really didn't want/approve of IE Outposts/Outposts buffs/relic buffs/removal of Hotspots/etc. They are changes I dont like at least. I see what you're getting at though. I say remove the outpost buffs at least.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    GW2.
    Posts
    178
    Quote Originally Posted by Slin6 View Post
    Take the resources that you would have put into that (however much that may be) and put into into fixing things. Fix the bugs, fix the lag (to the extent that you can), fix those major issues that people gripe about.
    Fix things. Okay, can you be more specific than lag & bugs? I have not experienced much of either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slin6 View Post
    This is just my thoughts and I know a lot of players will disagree with me but after years of playing it has become obvious to me that this is what turbine should be doing.
    Not sure what there is to disagree with, besides "things."
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0220400000025661a/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    Happy LotROing!

  5. #5
    Lag is horrific and effects swathes of players.

    Turbine have made it clear pvp is bottom of the priority list for all investment and fixes, other than lag, expect nothing.

    Lag though is a seperate issue, its not about game content, its about basic investment in the game to make it playable for the bulk of the playerbase.
    "Romper: You have the power to make EM less boring for yourself and everyone else. "
    "Look for your lore. But do not trust to lore, it has forsaken these lands." - Eolore prince of Lorehan

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    544
    Lag is not an issue you easily fix it to be honest.

    I am playing on a 500 euro maio sony and i dont experience lag problems since i ticked show buffs[Cant remember the word]only by me.

    No lag at all only a few lagspikes from time to time.

  7. #7
    Show only dispellable effects you mean probably.

    There are a number of things you can do to reduce lag for sure. But lag is widespread and destructive beyond what should be expected. Large numbers of players are effected by it.

    The amount of lag has increased across the board compared to how it was. This, as it is something that has got worse than it used to be is at turbines end or it would have always been there.
    "Romper: You have the power to make EM less boring for yourself and everyone else. "
    "Look for your lore. But do not trust to lore, it has forsaken these lands." - Eolore prince of Lorehan

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    544
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldwiley View Post
    Show only dispellable effects you mean probably.

    There are a number of things you can do to reduce lag for sure. But lag is widespread and destructive beyond what should be expected. Large numbers of players are effected by it.

    The amount of lag has increased across the board compared to how it was. This, as it is something that has got worse than it used to be is at turbines end or it would have always been there.
    I know the feeling about the lag the last days but i tend to ignore it as much as i can, though THE LAGSPIKES are starting to piss me off.

    I was recently on my hunter trying to get a nice ganking spot sadly i got a lagspike and after 3 seconds i realise i am on 5k morale with a warg hitting me i was a bit pissed since i only managed to take the wargs half morale.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Slin6 View Post
    Over the years turbine has made many changes to PvP. Personally I think most of them were decisions that didn't work out so well. As a community however we keep requesting change and as I look around I only feel as if things are much worse off now.

    Rather then ask for change and new things I'd like to ask turbine to stop changing things. Just stop! Do not introduce any new creep skills, classes, new zones, major zone changes, new items for freeps, etc..

    Take the resources that you would have put into that (however much that may be) and put into into fixing things. Fix the bugs, fix the lag (to the extent that you can), fix those major issues that people gripe about.

    This is just my thoughts and I know a lot of players will disagree with me but after years of playing it has become obvious to me that this is what turbine should be doing.

    Please fine tune the moors before moving on!
    Agreed 100%. Throwing good development after bad needs to stop.

    • Fix the lag - Even if it means layering.
    • Remove content gating by removing audacity.
    • Slow down combat but neutralizing crits and devs.
    • Get rid of maps to kill the zerg culture creepside.
    • Buff NPCS so Keeps are actually a defense instead of a deathtrap.
    • Allow purchase of base skills only from the store, traits and improved through rank ONLY
    • Disperse fights by putting pve quest objectives back in play.
    • Remove open tapping from PVMP.
    • Remove all point-gain buffs.
    • Go back to a barter system for pots and gear, remove commendations.
    • Allow us to fire OUT of EC and OC
    • Reduce survivability of Defilers; buff their healing.
    • Bring back hot spots.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Waterford, Ireland
    Posts
    3,401
    If Turbine had changed things the way the community asked, we'd be better off. Their disregard for our suggestions is partly responsible for the state of the Moors and, indeed, the game.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Squelcher View Post
    If Turbine had changed things the way the community asked, we'd be better off. Their disregard for our suggestions is partly responsible for the state of the Moors and, indeed, the game.
    I laugh, but not at you. I laugh because you could read your statement so sarcastically and it'd be quite funny. You're new, I don't blame you but seriously, these moors we have now are made up of like 85% player recommendations from these forums. I can just see a dev reading your post and pulling their hair out or laughing at the irony.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Ettenmoors
    Posts
    2,324
    This is what I keep telling people, but they just shake their heads and walk away. Some people prefer to have rocks in their shoes.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    502
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    • Get rid of maps to kill the zerg culture creepside.
    no. the zerg culture is both sides. Of course you know that being you are mainly a creep player, if I remember right. March is way slower that horses and with the buff freeps can add they are way harder to catch. Not to mention there's been several times I've hit a freep for 1k damage just to have it not be dismounted and get away. So if you are seriously suggesting to get rid of maps, then I'd say get rid of mounts. Creeps enter the moors with 0 maps. Freeps enter the moors mounted.

    other than that some of your ideas aren't terrible.


    EDIT: i'm forgetful
    Last edited by Kate00; Jun 07 2013 at 06:53 PM.
    "You can't have your Kate and Eat her too!"

    Katelia Rk 11 Lm, Peppermintt Rk 12 Warg, Katetastrophe Rk 12 WL, Kateaclysm Rk 12 defiler

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Waterford, Ireland
    Posts
    3,401
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    You're new
    No, I'm not.

  15. #15
    I don't know how many people remember the SOA days and complaints of back then, but one of the most frightful things is that Turbine actually DID at times listen to the community on the forums.

    For example, people used to complain about a player's rating being made visible to all via the star icons over the character's portrait. To keep their stars, many players would hide in the back of the raid. Since players complained about this behavior, Turbine ended up removing the stars. As soon as they were removed, guess what players did? "Whaa! I really miss the stars! I wish they'd add the stars back!" And no, that wasn't just star-huggers who complained about the change. It was those targeting the star-huggers who also complained, many of whom used to complain about the stars being there in the first place.

    The exact same thing happened with hotspots. Players complained about too much PvE in the moors, and demanded that hotspots be removed or be made meaningful. Sadly, Turbine listened only to the first suggestion. Once the hotspots were removed, guess what players did? "Whaa! I really miss those hotspots!" The very same players who complained about them being there, now complained that they were gone.

    Be careful what you ask for. All of you. Turbine might just listen. For big things? No. But for little things that tend to add up to the overall experience? Yes, they'll listen.

    But yes, Turbine also adds things absolutely nobody ever asked for. It's quite annoying, and often game-breaking. I would give my right paw to have late SOA mechanics added back into the game. But I guess too many guardians complained that the best shield in the game was PvP-only requiring rank 7. PvPers are supposed to settle for second best, and never the PvEers. The Valar forbid freeps should have obtainable and usable armor in PvP that is also useful for some PvE. Or, on the other hand, to just be able to bring their PvE gear to the moors and try out their build on some creeps.

    See what happens? Players complain, they get what they wanted, and then they find out they really didn't want it at all, or at least not quite the way Turbine envisioned it.

    OP, I do understand your request. I just wish Turbine would hold still, and just focus on balancing the classes each update. But that would require testing and real effort. They'd rather wait to fix the class imbalance for months and months, and tweak something needlessly instead so they can say they gave us something.
    [IMG]http://i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af239/headlongflight/silversig_r9_snow_final_zps2657a3d4.png[/IMG]
    [B][COLOR=#ffff00]Silverbullets [/COLOR]- Rank 9 Warg, Landroval[/B]
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  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    344
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    Agreed 100%. Throwing good development after bad needs to stop.

    • Fix the lag - Even if it means layering.
    • Remove content gating by removing audacity.
    • Slow down combat but neutralizing crits and devs.
    • Get rid of maps to kill the zerg culture creepside.
    • Buff NPCS so Keeps are actually a defense instead of a deathtrap.
    • Allow purchase of base skills only from the store, traits and improved through rank ONLY
    • Disperse fights by putting pve quest objectives back in play.
    • Remove open tapping from PVMP.
    • Remove all point-gain buffs.
    • Go back to a barter system for pots and gear, remove commendations.
    • Allow us to fire OUT of EC and OC
    • Reduce survivability of Defilers; buff their healing.
    • Bring back hot spots.
    I agree strongly with most of that. Ever since combat was sped up with MoM release I have posted numerous threads about how the Dev mechanic does not belon in PvP. It should have been removed and the crit multiplies should have been limited. I strongly agree with the removal of point gain buffs (with the exception of the DG/ost buffs). I think it weakens the PvP community.

    Another thing I've been asking for is Hot spots. 3/4 of the fights I remember from SoA were from hot spots or started in them. They gave a great spot to tangle without heavy NPC cover. Obviously there was issues (say spider flipping for one) but overall they were great. If I remember turbine blamed them for lag at one point to help justify the removal.

    Sadly though I do not believe most of that list can be accomplished. There has been to much change and the community is very different from what it use to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silverbullets View Post
    I don't know how many people remember the SOA days and complaints of back then, but one of the most frightful things is that Turbine actually DID at times listen to the community on the forums.

    For example, people used to complain about a player's rating being made visible to all via the star icons over the character's portrait. To keep their stars, many players would hide in the back of the raid. Since players complained about this behavior, Turbine ended up removing the stars. As soon as they were removed, guess what players did? "Whaa! I really miss the stars! I wish they'd add the stars back!" And no, that wasn't just star-huggers who complained about the change. It was those targeting the star-huggers who also complained, many of whom used to complain about the stars being there in the first place.

    The exact same thing happened with hotspots. Players complained about too much PvE in the moors, and demanded that hotspots be removed or be made meaningful. Sadly, Turbine listened only to the first suggestion. Once the hotspots were removed, guess what players did? "Whaa! I really miss those hotspots!" The very same players who complained about them being there, now complained that they were gone.
    Yea that is unfortunate. Players requested something be done about hotspots and turbine landed on removing them and replacing them with OP's. I remember not going in any OP's until we figured out we could farm chieftan seals.

    I agree with your assessment of what happens when they do listen. They only listen half way and the past shows they don't put the resources into PvP so we get a half &&& update. Remember how excited everyone was for Moria and thought we might get a new map...then got excited for the big map updates...then it came out...

    good ol turbine.
    Co-Founder of TEAM F. Turined R9 champ. Mashedtaters R9 Reaver
    Perma-Retired Pre SoM- R9 Hnt. R8 Reaver

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Kate00 View Post
    no. the zerg culture is both sides. Of course you know that being you are mainly a creep player, if I remember right. March is way slower that horses and with the buff freeps can add they are way harder to catch. Not to mention there's been several times I've hit a freep for 1k damage just to have it not be dismounted and get away. So if you are seriously suggesting to get rid of maps, then I'd say get rid of mounts. Creeps enter the moors with 0 maps. Freeps enter the moors mounted.

    other than that some of your ideas aren't terrible.


    EDIT: i'm forgetful
    Yes, I've been a creep since ROI, unsubbing and going over to the dark side to help out. My creeps are now higher ranked than my freeps who I don't play anymore. Both sides zerg, everyone knows this. However, in my experience, creeps will call for help as a matter of course. Whether they need it or not, they just assume they will. Its just so easy to get numbers and they constantly lean on that crutch. I see way more craids than fraids as well. Sure, March is slower. Make it faster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slin6
    Sadly though I do not believe most of that list can be accomplished. There has been to much change and the community is very different from what it use to be.
    Agreed again. This community only wants what is in their own self interest, very few have any desire to see an objectively better game. Crying to Turbine to make it so I can kill my most hated enemy (who is always the one I cannot kill currently) is much more important than keeping players around and making the battles themselves more fun. Instant gratification and disposable gameplay are the rules of thumb nowadays.

 

 

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