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Thread: U11 Patch Notes

  1. #1
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    U11 Patch Notes

    Patch notes are up here. Apparently, there was an LI reset, as well as the Mounted Combat rework. (We get a defeat event! Yay!)

    A couple of Captain-specific notes:

    • Set bonuses that reduce Defeat Event Cooldowns no longer stack. This will prevent unintentional stacking that could reduce cooldowns to 0s.
    • The Captain's Cloak of the Fornost Captain and Wyrmfire Mender's Ring have new proc effects on them. These proc effects are set up to trigger off the Captain's healing skills (and ONLY the Captain's).
    • Reducing damage done by Cry Wrath, Cry Havoc and Rally the Riders by 10-15%. Sorry to do it, but Captain damage output was far too high. Even with the reduction they are still capable of massive DPS while mounted.


    Nothing major. I wasn't too familiar with the Defeat Event Cooldown stacking, but I assume that we'll still be able to reach 6s RC. It's just that we won't be able to get a 0s RC any more. No big. And our Mounted Combat nerf was totally necessary.
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  2. #2
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    With the mounted combat change, we were doing so much damage that I did not notice any missing with the nerf in place.

    Now if only dismounted could be like that XD
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  3. #3
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    why do you say the MC dmg reduction is necessary? i see no need to cut it. yes, we did massive dmg on horse back... but so what? all the mounted content is trivial, at best.

    im not really complaining, as ill still kcik &&&, but dont see the "necessity" of the nerf. its not liek this actually effects teh "flavor of the month" thinking where people actually roll capns to take advantage. our dmg still sucks in all relevant ("real") content.

    i see this as more of an annoyance... so, now Bugud takes 10ms to solo instead of 9m.

    again, i see no need for this change... other than to waste my time. oh wait, DING! thats it. duh, these are all time sinks. its so obvious. sorry to waste *your* time letting me work this out on my own
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    Quote Originally Posted by SapienChavez View Post
    why do you say the MC dmg reduction is necessary? i see no need to cut it. yes, we did massive dmg on horse back... but so what? all the mounted content is trivial, at best.

    im not really complaining, as ill still kcik &&&, but dont see the "necessity" of the nerf. its not liek this actually effects teh "flavor of the month" thinking where people actually roll capns to take advantage. our dmg still sucks in all relevant ("real") content.

    i see this as more of an annoyance... so, now Bugud takes 10ms to solo instead of 9m.

    again, i see no need for this change... other than to waste my time. oh wait, DING! thats it. duh, these are all time sinks. its so obvious. sorry to waste *your* time letting me work this out on my own
    My guess is that they are tuning stuff with the classes before releasing any mounted combat content (I'm hoping there's stuff in the works).
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    agreed. that was kinda my smartass way of dancing around that issue. if we get group-tuned-mounted-content, im all for balance!
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    Quote Originally Posted by SapienChavez View Post
    why do you say the MC dmg reduction is necessary? i see no need to cut it. yes, we did massive dmg on horse back... but so what? all the mounted content is trivial, at best.

    im not really complaining, as ill still kcik &&&, but dont see the "necessity" of the nerf. its not liek this actually effects teh "flavor of the month" thinking where people actually roll capns to take advantage. our dmg still sucks in all relevant ("real") content.

    i see this as more of an annoyance... so, now Bugud takes 10ms to solo instead of 9m.

    again, i see no need for this change... other than to waste my time. oh wait, DING! thats it. duh, these are all time sinks. its so obvious. sorry to waste *your* time letting me work this out on my own
    Maybe because captains were dishing out really big numbers, maybe even more so than actual DPS classes? I think that warrants a reduction in MC dps. It's not a nerf, my cappy can still do more mc dps than my hunter can. And she can tank better mounted than my warden on a war steed but that's a different story.
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    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    Maybe because captains were dishing out really big numbers, maybe even more so than actual DPS classes? I think that warrants a reduction in MC dps. It's not a nerf, my cappy can still do more mc dps than my hunter can. And she can tank better mounted than my warden on a war steed but that's a different story.
    The design intent was to allow anyone to become a tank, and anyone to become a DPSer with mounted combat content.
    Last edited by Almagnus1; May 17 2013 at 12:18 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post
    The design intent was to allow anyone to become a tank, and anyone to become a DPSer with mounted combat content.
    Well when a captain can DPS better than a hunter or a burg can and a captain can tank while a warden cannot, something is wrong and therefore this was not a nerf. It was necessary. Hope they fix the tanking next, this is ridiculous. I'm sure the intent was not to make captains op.

    I'd like to see a quote from the dev diary where it explicitly states that this was the intent.
    Last edited by QueenArleth; May 17 2013 at 01:36 PM.
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    For the record, when I was on Bullroarer with a perfected version of my current bridle, I literally noticed nothing different between the BR captain/light steed combo and the U10 version on E. That told me that we were essentially losing excessive DPS. I think the nerf itself was warranted, and needed to be done to help give some more variety to mounted combat.

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    Well when a captain can DPS better than a hunter or a burg can and a captain can tank while a warden cannot, something is wrong and therefore this was not a nerf. It was necessary. Hope they fix the tanking next, this is ridiculous. I'm sure the intent was not to make captains op.
    IMO, tanking doesn't matter until there's content that needs to be tanked. That's why it's a DPS fest atm. It's also why we need mounted combat content.

    It's also why a light steed (at least in Rohan) became so strong, because lights teeds outrun everything on foot, and outrun many of the mounted warbands. It's how it's designed to work. It also shows a flaw with the mounted/dismounted mechanic - which likely needs to be reevaluated since it's essentially game over once something's dismounted.

    As far as balance, captains should be at the same DPS level ON A WARSTEED as everyone else. Likewise for tanking and healing ability.

    And if there's something wrong with warden tanking on a warsteed, you need to figure out exactly what isn't working, and advocate for that to be fixed - NOT beg for nerfs to everyone else to bring them down to your level of suck.

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    I'd like to see a quote from the dev diary where it explicitly states that this was the intent.
    Not going to do the research for you, but the relevant dev diaries are:
    http://archive.lotro.com/news/2467-r...ounted-combat-
    http://archive.lotro.com/news/2418-r...diary-warsteed
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SapienChavez View Post
    why do you say the MC dmg reduction is necessary? i see no need to cut it. yes, we did massive dmg on horse back... but so what? all the mounted content is trivial, at best.

    im not really complaining, as ill still kcik &&&, but dont see the "necessity" of the nerf. its not liek this actually effects teh "flavor of the month" thinking where people actually roll capns to take advantage. our dmg still sucks in all relevant ("real") content.

    i see this as more of an annoyance... so, now Bugud takes 10ms to solo instead of 9m.

    again, i see no need for this change... other than to waste my time. oh wait, DING! thats it. duh, these are all time sinks. its so obvious. sorry to waste *your* time letting me work this out on my own
    I agree with you Sapien. I don't think it was necessary. Our damage was good, but nothing game-breaking - and other classes are more powerful on a mount than the Captain is and was in my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremi View Post
    I agree with you Sapien. I don't think it was necessary. Our damage was good, but nothing game-breaking - and other classes are more powerful on a mount than the Captain is and was in my opinion.
    If you look at the top end, the captain pulled waaaay ahead before U11. Now we're closer to everyone else (and again, I don't want to be completely OP in comparison, I want to be equal the top tier DPSers on a warsteed).

    Even with the testing I did on BR, the nerf isn't as bad as most think. Yes, it sucks to be nerfed, but it's not going to do much of anything really.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post

    And if there's something wrong with warden tanking on a warsteed, you need to figure out exactly what isn't working, and advocate for that to be fixed - NOT beg for nerfs to everyone else to bring them down to your level of suck.
    Yes thank you kindly for that. Not once have I said anything demeaning to you or anyone else. I'm not begging for anything. I simply state that captains are crying because they were 'nerfed' it's not a nerf. Captains can still do more DPS than real DPS classes. I think captain DPS should be lowered even more. I have a captain and quite frankly we deal way more damage than a captain ought to. As for warden tanking, I'll have you know I have absolutely no problems with tanking aside from Mounted combat. But once mounted I can't ever get aggro on warbands. I know it's not necessary but I could tank if I wanted to on my captain, but wardens can't DPS nor can they tank, if anyone should be complaining about the state of mounted combat its real DPS classes who deal considerably less DPS than captains do (burgs come in mind, and hunters who prefer to dismount and DPS as opposed to MC because DPS is so bad). But here captains are complaining about their DPS when they should be glad they can DPS. As for the comment about matching top tiered DPS, captains deal more damage than most DPS classes what more do you want?


    As a captain, honestly our DPS is a bit too much and should be toned down further.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    I simply state that captains are crying because they were 'nerfed' it's not a nerf.
    I agree with you here. While the skills themselves got nerfed, we got so much extra stuff that it evened out in the end.

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    Captains can still do more DPS than real DPS classes. I think captain DPS should be lowered even more. I have a captain and quite frankly we deal way more damage than a captain ought to. As for warden tanking, I'll have you know I have absolutely no problems with tanking aside from Mounted combat. But once mounted I can't ever get aggro on warbands. I know it's not necessary but I could tank if I wanted to on my captain, but wardens can't DPS nor can they tank, if anyone should be complaining about the state of mounted combat its real DPS classes who deal considerably less DPS than captains do (burgs come in mind, and hunters who prefer to dismount and DPS as opposed to MC because DPS is so bad).
    Since the entire class is boiled down to the character sheet for mounted combat (ie: all of your class skills and traits do not matter - except for our buffs oddly enough), the concept that captains should do less damage in mounted combat than everyone else doesn't really hold water for me.

    Think of it this way, if a captain, guard, warden, champ, burg, and hunter all have the exact same crit and physical mastery scores, shouldn't they all output the exact same DPS?

    Also, if a captain, RK, LM, and mini all have the exact same crit and tactical mastery scores, shouldn't they output the exact same DPS? Shouldn't they also output the exact same healing?

    Granted, all of this is in the scope of mounted combat, especially since every single player is presented with the same three choices of light, medium, or heavy warsteed.

    There needs to be consistency and equality across all tanking, healing, and DPSing roles.

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    But here captains are complaining about their DPS when they should be glad they can DPS.
    So, there are people that whine after every nerf.

    Even when nerfs are warranted like this one, and the IHW nerf (it really was too broken back then).

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    As for the comment about matching top tiered DPS, captains deal more damage than most DPS classes what more do you want?
    A balanced system with fun group content that's instanced.

    Quote Originally Posted by QueenArleth View Post
    As a captain, honestly our DPS is a bit too much and should be toned down further.
    No, it shouldn't.

    The burg and hunter DPS needs to be improved by fixing what's wrong with those classes in mounted combat and/or their favored steed size class.

    The same also needs to hold true for tanking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post
    If you look at the top end, the captain pulled waaaay ahead before U11. Now we're closer to everyone else (and again, I don't want to be completely OP in comparison, I want to be equal the top tier DPSers on a warsteed).

    Even with the testing I did on BR, the nerf isn't as bad as most think. Yes, it sucks to be nerfed, but it's not going to do much of anything really.
    We just disagree that Captain was completely OP by comparison to other classes before this nerf. Yeah, we could do a lot of damage - but so could about everyone else - and I was on balance stronger on my warden mount even before these nerfs. Now it's not even close after this update, and some of my other mounts pull far ahead of my Captain one in terms of what they are capable of - though I should point out that's primarily due to buffs they got and not specifically the Captain nerfs.

    We agree the nerf isn't that bad. I did point that out. But it was still unnessasary in my judgement, and the so-called OPness of the Captain mount was highly exagerated in my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremi View Post
    We agree the nerf isn't that bad. I did point that out. But it was still unnessasary in my judgement, and the so-called OPness of the Captain mount was highly exagerated in my opinion.
    As a single player, you should almost **NEVER** be able to one shot on level guys on the landscape. I did that with such frequency on the light steed that, yes, that needed to change.

    Also, others have done DPS parses, and the captains were quite a bit ahead of the other classes. It's not like this is done 'cause of QQ - there's data for this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post
    As a single player, you should almost **NEVER** be able to one shot on level guys on the landscape. I did that with such frequency on the light steed that, yes, that needed to change.

    Also, others have done DPS parses, and the captains were quite a bit ahead of the other classes. It's not like this is done 'cause of QQ - there's data for this.
    Right, because something taking two shots instead of just one is such a big deal right?

    I'm sorry Almagnus but I don't think we going to agree on this one, especially if your argument is because we could sometimes one-shot pathetic landscape monsters means we were over-powered on a warsteed.

    I can live with the nerf, but it wasn't necessassary, least not in my opinon - and the fact we could one shot easy landscape mobs doesn't change it. There are way more glaring imbalances on this game than w/e little advantage Captains may have had on a warsteed if you ask me.
    Last edited by Jeremi; May 20 2013 at 08:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremi View Post
    I'm sorry Almagnus but I don't think we going to agree on this one, especially if your argument is because we could sometimes one-shot pathetic landscape monsters means we were over-powered on a warsteed.
    I recall hearing of parses where we were ahead, not marginally ahead, but significantly ahead of everyone else with mounted combat DPS. There was definitely imbalance there, and it was something that needed to be reigned in, especially if Turbine is trying to tune the system for group content (which I suspect they are).

    Either way, the nerf looks bigger in the patch notes than what I'm seeing in gameplay, especially with the new skills factored in. At least, that's been my experience on a light steed before and after U11 went live.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremi View Post
    There are way more glaring imbalances on this game than w/e little advantage Captains may have had on a warsteed if you ask me.
    Oh, like what?

    What, in your sage opinion, would you rather have Turbine fix?
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    Our regular run-of-the-mill attacks were comparable to other DPS classes, it was our Crits that were God-mode. Sapience even referenced this in his example of why we caught the bat, something like 25k Crit damage or something. When MC was first introduced I was pumped about not being the bottom of the barrel DPS wise, it felt nice to have our 15 minutes at the top.

    And whoever was saying we needed nerfed even further, I think Wardens are OP when not on a WS so they should knock you guys down some in regular combat - I mean you all can solo most group content, not cool! ;p (tantrum over)

 

 

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