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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post

    This is probably the most popular end game that LOTRO has ever had. Some claim they hate it as they play every day. Others did stop playing, after running everything a few hundred times since update 10. Is it really surprising that they get burned out? There are tons more taking it beyond the few hundred times mark. The OP is looking for some old players to return who were already in a pattern of only being on after updates. Those guys are gone. Newer players have replaced them. As seen by the years worth of identical threads, some peoples perception is off because of their dying kin.

    This is talking to more than just you Lestache. I wouldn't want to confuse you.

    Is this popular as in 'surprisingly popular Hytbold' popular, or in the conventionally accepted definition of the word? End game sucks right now and that is largely due to the ridiculous loot system that's been put in place. You know, that loot system based on complete randomness. The one that burns people out or just disincentivises them in the first place. The irony is it should be great with the number of options there are now to run max level instances.

    I have never seen such a lackluster response to a major LotRO update as I have seen with U11, both here in the forums, and in-game. Yeah, I know. Anecdotal BS right?

  2. #52
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    Some of the "old players" had run the old raid and instances like ToO, OD, BG, Moria's instances... for 7-8 months on level but didnt feel burn out (Entropy did Saruman T2C to the last day of RoI, not because the loots, but the joy of beating him). But now, they getting sick of Samborg and new raids only after few weeks.

    You might said "you cant run them that many times without burn out" but Turbine did well enough to the old content so things didnt burn out TOO QUICK like this.

    Probably there are new players now, who never actually do endgame stuffs, never get those top shiny gear which there was a time only for raiders. They're eager to group up to do stuffs, grinding, farming... for those shiny. People never raid maybe excited to finally getting invited to a raid, but then, after lots of fails (what do you expect from a pug, or even a kins group but with too many newbies never raid before?), they might think "why would i have to do this sh!t just for some bounties and relics? Samborg is x10 easier".

    But think about it, with this speed of burning out, they will soon, feel boring after got what they want.

    You might said "then there will be the even-newer-players to replace them". Well, probably, but since LOTRO is not really f2p (you have to pay alots for expansions and VIP/quest packs to actually access to instances and raids), i dont think there will be that many new blood.
    Last edited by Hiritier; May 24 2013 at 11:49 AM.

  3. #53
    To the last poster: name me a time that a group ran a ToO wing 50 times in a week. Your argument is just that people aren't smart enough to not burn themselves out. Obviously Turbine needs to bring locks back to counter this. I don't agree though. I like running stuff when I want. I'm also smart enough to mix it up and play for fun.

    I'm not going to argue this anymore though. There were not this many people in Snowbourn in the weeks leading up to Wildermore. Wildermore has a ton of activity on Brandywine, even though a festival is going. There are many more still just standing in Snowbourn too. I am seeing raids and instances form all the time. Where some of you seem to be confused is with what end game is. Of course the raid only groups peaked the month of the instance cluster...

    So Frisco, does that mean you aren't giving me your in game characters names?

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    This is probably the most popular end game that LOTRO has ever had.
    Heh, that's a funny joke. Thanks for the laugh. :P That's totally why raid kins/alliances are dropping left and right.. because the end game is so popular!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    To the last poster: name me a time that a group ran a ToO wing 50 times in a week.
    You are aware that ToO had weekly raid locks, right? You'd have to have 50 alts to run it that many times in a week (and OD and BG and DN and etc, etc.) That being said, my alliance managed to spend 3 hours a night 4-5 days a week there for months whilst attempting to beat content (and OD too, but I was not with them back then.) The same cannot be said of the new raids.
    Last edited by Lothirieth; May 24 2013 at 12:22 PM.

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothirieth View Post
    You are aware that ToO had weekly raid locks, right?
    Well, yeah. That was the entire point...

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    Well, yeah. That was the entire point...
    If you say so...

    You also completely ignore that many groups were spending many hours a week in there... you know, because there were actual hard, interesting fights to figure out rather than facerolling Sambrog over and over ( BfE and Flight challenge are hard.. interesting, fun, engaging? Not so much.) Your supposed "point" that people couldn't burn themselves out in things like ToO just because they couldn't complete it over and over again.. is well, silly.. but also points to the current lackluster quality of endgame if all there is to do is faceroll stuff over and over.
    Last edited by Lothirieth; May 24 2013 at 01:12 PM. Reason: grammar

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    To the last poster: name me a time that a group ran a ToO wing 50 times in a week. Your argument is just that people aren't smart enough to not burn themselves out. Obviously Turbine needs to bring locks back to counter this. I don't agree though. I like running stuff when I want. I'm also smart enough to mix it up and play for fun.
    Who's talking about running ToO 50 times/week? I said Entropy had raid all ToO wing T2C 2 nights/week from the day they released till the last day of RoI. We was eager waiting for the new raids, and now we sick of RoR just after a couple weeks the raids released. But if you have to know, yes i remember Leadin did farm Saruman T1 like 5-10 times/day for a couple weeks. Yes its a farm, but still have more interesting than Samborg.

    And yes, people will burn out soon with these faceroll instances, smart or noob. How many hunter you see still running Fornost after farmed it for 500 times and finally got the earrings? (or even quit before that) They get sick of it. Just like Sam now. After everyone had they 1st age, the poor wight lord will finally found his RIP.

    Most of who you see still playing are FARMER, since the game encourage them. Some are lore-lovers. Most of raiders stopped playing. And when i said "raider" i didnt mean who doing T1, or even T2C of lame stuff like Smaug. Im talking about the true raider who like to beat something hard and get a proper reward; who can't stand farming faceroll instances. Even the old 6 man like Moria on lever still give these people enough challenge to keep their heads up.

    And after all the farmers had shiny gear... 80% of them will quit because 50% of them dont care about raiding (why? For bounties? Please, we're talking about farmers. They dont care about challenge, they like to do easy stuffs over and over again) and 30% of the rest cannot find a good raid to join since most of decent raid leaders have left. Let's just give the game like 2 more months. You might try to form raid and instances to keep the game alive. Thats good tho. But you will see its harder and harder to find decent player, who good enough for T2C raid, or even, things like SG.

    But whatever, just enjoy the game when you can. Im done here.
    Last edited by Hiritier; May 24 2013 at 01:09 PM.

  8. #58
    "If you say so" LOL... Just wow...

    Can you both post screen shots of your Erebor challenge deeds?

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    "If you say so" LOL... Just wow...

    Can you both post screen shots of your Erebor challenge deeds?
    Find it yourself in the raid/instances box. We've done T2C BfE and Smaug. FLM just had too many bugs and base on luck more than strategy. And sadly after the lame U11 released, we cant have enough people for raid anymore.

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    "If you say so" LOL... Just wow...
    What on earth are you talking about?

    Can you both post screen shots of your Erebor challenge deeds?
    And what has this to do with anything? I've done Smaug challenge (like most people did the first week or so) and Battle challenge, but we've not attempted flight challenge yet... and did I not just write that 2/3 of the new raid challenges were hard, but not interesting, engaging, or fun? So what's your point?

    And weren't you done with this thread several posts ago?

  11. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothirieth View Post
    What on earth are you talking about?



    And what has this to do with anything? I've done Smaug challenge (like most people did the first week or so) and Battle challenge, but we've not attempted flight challenge yet... and did I not just write that 2/3 of the new raid challenges were hard, but not interesting, engaging, or fun? So what's your point?

    And weren't you done with this thread several posts ago?
    Do i really need to spell out this thing with loxks? Go read the first post you responded to. I clearly stated that there were locks before. You respond with something like "you know there were locks!?!??#@". I said, that was the entire point. You say "Whatever you say". I laugh because it is clear that you are a very special person. Are we both on the same page yet?

    I haven't argued the threads topic since I said I was done.

    You clearly stated that people spent time in the old raids because "they were actually hard".

  12. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Hiritier View Post
    LOL troll detected. First i thought you were a good guy trying to fight agains the tide. But now i've seen your true face. Alright, im out.
    Do you even see what you are posting? I am a troll as you claim a raid is way too easy, but can't beat it. You go on about "true raiders" and how only "farmers" are left. Yeah, good luck with all that guy.
    Last edited by Hadoril; May 25 2013 at 01:44 PM.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    Do i really need to spell out this thing with loxks? Go read the first post you responded to. I clearly stated that there were locks before. You respond with something like "you know there were locks!?!??#@". I said, that was the entire point. You say "Whatever you say". I laugh because it is clear that you are a very special person. Are we both on the same page yet?

    I haven't argued the threads topic since I said I was done.

    You clearly stated that people spent time in the old raids because "they were actually hard".
    If you'd managed to quote just one more word of what Lothirieth said (or, better yet, the entire sentence taken in context):

    [Emphasis added]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lothirieth View Post
    If you say so...

    You also completely ignore that many groups were spending many hours a week in there... you know, because there were actual hard, interesting fights to figure out rather than facerolling Sambrog over and over ( BfE and Flight challenge are hard.. interesting, fun, engaging? Not so much.) Your supposed "point" that people couldn't burn themselves out in things like ToO just because they couldn't complete it over and over again.. is well, silly.. but also points to the current lackluster quality of endgame if all there is to do is faceroll stuff over and over.
    The word "interesting" is rather important to Lothirieth's point.

    Anyway, perhaps you are seeing more people than you saw before. Frisco apparently isn't, but at the moment we're apparently talking about raiders.

    To that end, unless you're in that particular echelon of players - unless you're among those people who were clearing OD and ToO T2Cs on-level - you may not even be aware of the fact that we're disappearing from the game faster than ever before. We come from all different walks of life and different parts of the world, but we share one thing in common: we like challenging, high quality, interesting content with a loot system that makes sense. We're barely getting one of those things, and unfortunately it's not any of the three elements that encourages us to continue to play (high quality, interesting, and sensible loot distribution).

    If you want to argue that you're enjoying the game, that's fine. If you want to tell an entire group of people whose experiences and expectations you apparently don't share that, although their particular part of the game has fundamentally changed in the last year to the point that it is quite literally no fun, it's their fault that they're not enjoying it, at least do so without taking quotes out of context and address what is actually being said instead of what you wish was said.
    Last edited by Lestache; May 24 2013 at 01:54 PM.

  14. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Lestache View Post
    If you'd managed to quote just one more word of what Lothirieth said (or, better yet, the entire sentence taken in context):

    [Emphasis added]



    The word "interesting" is rather important to Lothirieth's point.

    Anyway, perhaps you are seeing more people than you saw before. Frisco apparently isn't, but at the moment we're apparently talking about raiders.

    To that end, unless you're in that particular echelon of players - unless you're among those people who were clearing OD and ToO T2Cs on-level - you may not even be aware of the fact that we're disappearing from the game faster than ever before. We come from all different walks of life and different parts of the world, but we share one thing in common: we like challenging, high quality, interesting content with a loot system that makes sense. We're barely getting one of those things, and unfortunately it's not any of the three elements that encourages us to continue to play (high quality, interesting, and sensible loot distribution).

    If you want to argue that you're enjoying the game, that's fine. If you want to tell an entire group of people whose experiences and expectations you apparently don't share that, although their particular part of the game has fundamentally changed in the last year to the point that it is quite literally no fun, it's their fault that they're not enjoying it, at least do so without taking quotes out of context and address what is actually being said instead of what you wish was said.
    I have no problem with the fact that you aren't having fun. I do have a problem with people calling an unbeaten raid really easy. It also gets annoying how many "real raiders" are acting. Come here and explain what you would like to see. Stop crying about it and claiming that the game is trash. I would love another ToO type raid. They did a ton of other stuff for this level cap though. They scaled a ton of stuff and imolemented some big new features.

    It isn't that the raids are easy. It is that they are short and don't have locks. The same thing would happen for all of you on ToO without locks. You would figure everything out much faster and then play it until you were bored a month later. Again, I watched many who constantly complain, play the new raids hundreds of times. You can't do that and then claim it is terrible. What you can claim is, the length and implementation weren't setup to keep your attention for an extended period. To which I could agree with if I was only playing the new raids. My kin plays a lot for fun though. We were running ToO last night. We run OD, which is a great raid still. Some of the OD challenges aren't easy either, while some are.

    So really my only problem with the "real raiders" is how most are presenting their complaints, and acting like they speak for a much larger crowd than they actually do. The ones who never stop playing are by far the worst. There was actually the excuse, "we can't find a single thing better to do with our free time, but LOTRO sucks", earlier in this thread. I see it a lot. It really foesn't make sense.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post
    I have no problem with the fact that you aren't having fun. I do have a problem with people calling an unbeaten raid really easy.

    [...]
    It took you all of two sentences to do exactly what I was hoping you wouldn't do. Who is calling Flight T2CM easy?

  16. #66
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    Cirgellon... stop trolling.

  17. #67
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    Apart from the fact that you seem to be setting up a new straw-men every post... the players that are still complaining aren't a concern: at least they still care. Most people I see leaving the game just lose interest, play less and less and at some point just don't show up anymore. Those are far more deadly than people that are still bothered enough to post about it on the forum.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirgellon View Post

    So Frisco, does that mean you aren't giving me your in game characters names?
    They're by no means secret, but why would I give them out to someone who's done nothing but insist I'm a troll and liar? Spend time searching through my post history if you must have them.

    If you're wanting to look and see if I play...yes, I still play. Last night was raid night, and we had 7 people show up. We pugged a couple T2 then got bored. I've been doing Wildermore dailies (hit kindred today) and was killing all warbands daily until I realized that in 11 days I only had 12 warband tokens, so I figure I'm not going to bother running them for 2 more weeks straight just for a pocket piece I'd never wear. I logged in 1 character for 45 minutes today, realized there was nothing fun to do, then took a 4-hour nap instead.

    For comparison, we ran ToO up until the last week of Isengard. I ran DN up until the week Mirkwood was released. We ran the Rift until Moria was released. And that was long after most people had all the rewards. As it is now, after months of T2, we've had 7 1st Ages drop in raids. But that's okay, they're so cheap and easy most people have bought them. So it's not surprising attendance to raid is flagging with still 5-6 months to go in this expansion.
    [color=red]Work like no one is watching, dance like you don't need the money...[/color]

  19. #69
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    I'm on one of the bigger servers, and I tend to use GLFF to gauge how many people are on the server.

    Usually, after an update there are 300-400 people in GLFF. After Update 11 went live, there were less than 200 during peak hours (however, that number has increased a bit with the Spring Festival).

    IMHO, I think LOTRO is treading water. They lost quite a few Devs, they're using gimmicks to meet their login quotas (the slot machine), the last epic storyline felt like it was put together by a group of eight year olds (which, I might add, you can complete ALL of the quests and the storyline within a few hours), the slot machine has no mystery to it because you know what you're getting before you even get it, the same exploits that were in the last update are in this update and the lore was thrown out the window a long time ago.

    Right now, it just seems they are trying everything to make a buck and have completely lost direction, or it seems they really don't care what happens to the game anymore.

    Sad to see LOTRO die like this, but I saw it coming a long time ago.

  20. #70
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  21. #71
    Seems some of the troll posts from a certain poster got deleted.. along with any post that referred to said troll posts, one of those being mine. Don't have the will to type up stuff again, which is why you won't see me addressing certain posts again.

  22. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Edhereth View Post
    this is the most interesting thing in the whole thread... and sad

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edhereth View Post
    Funny this chart is missing server and time, I call this BS.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al. View Post
    Funny this chart is missing server and time, I call this BS.
    Time? It has months on it.

    This all the servers that were formerly US servers - it is logins per minute data for all of them combined. The data comes directly from the Turbine's servers and is then put into a graph.

  25. #75
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    Complain or defend what you want of Brandywine - it at least has some people left while smaller servers are left in a lurch. I'm gonna have to agree with the complainers tho - GR brought back way more people then WM, I remember suggesting every premium friend to buy it. Right now I haven't even bought Wildermore myself (I've been there of course!). Comparing what I got from GR vs WM - GR had landscape group content (and it was actually fun... well, for a time at least) and a fun and engaging instance. What does WM have? Well, quests, and not so many of them either. I'm not gonna pay 795TP for a small questpack that doesn't even have VIRTUES.

    And considering raids and how cool/lame easy/difficult they are:
    Not having locks is the quickest way to get people really bored really fast. I liked them (then again, if you have no raid cluster, you don't really need locks, huh).
    Someone mentioned pugging t2 Erebor raids (now that I think of it, I've even been in one!). Pugging a t2 raid and winning on the first try with some people firsttimers in that raid? How could this even happen? So there's one or two difficult t2c-s, good for Turbine. That doesn't mean they would be engaging or rewarding or connected to the rest of the game in any way (bringing in the Erebor setting was a mistake imo).

    Say what you want, this game is headed in the wrong direction as far as people who have played it for the last years and expect some quality are concerned.
    Quit.

    Find me on Steam and ESO, same name.

 

 
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