We have detected that cookies are not enabled on your browser. Please enable cookies to ensure the proper experience.
Page 5 of 11 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 125 of 260
  1. #101
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    I do not always carry a WL in tow (and you could say the same thing for freeps with LMs).
    You can. So please do every time that stupid argument comes up. Ty.

    I think you're a little behind the ball on what sort of CC skills actually exist right now...

    I have a 10s duration melee ranged fear with a 10 second cooldown. Take DR and audacity away, and I can literally keep a single target standing there unable to do anything forever. Audacity and DR are the only things keeping that in check right now. Same thing for an appropriately traited burg/LM.
    Well, isn't that just stupid then? Create a skill with inflated numbers with the built in assumption that it will be mitigated by another system? Why add the layer of complexity? The more layers the harder it is for this all to work right. Remove DR, remove Audacity put some CD's on these skills and they're fine.

    I actually played through the era when that was possible for freeps; I was held in place for over 5 minutes by an LM while he waited for his groupmates to ride across the map to me so everyone could get credit. I do NOT want that sort of frustration reintroduced to the game.
    PVP is frustration. Eliminating one unideal set of circumstances simply introduces another. CC and AOE were the freep mechanisms for dealing with greater numbers. Any kind of creep buffs you want to talk about, if you're at all interested in the betterment of the game, as opposed to just in it for yourself, has to start with that numbers disparity. We all know, those of us who've been around long enough, what happens when creeps get buffed. Vets on both sides have less fun, log in less.

  2. #102
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    You can. So please do every time that stupid argument comes up. Ty.
    I'll put it this way; giving creep healers similar healing output in relation to the damage done by freeps that freep healers have in relation to the damage done by creeps... AND giving them similar stun protection would be terrible for the game. Stare-down stale-mate city would ensue. I don't think you're realizing what you're asking for here.

    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    Well, isn't that just stupid then? Create a skill with inflated numbers with the built in assumption that it will be mitigated by another system? Why add the layer of complexity? The more layers the harder it is for this all to work right. Remove DR, remove Audacity put some CD's on these skills and they're fine.
    They're really not. Again, I don't think you realize the importance of the DR system and what life without it would actually be like. I question whether you played back before daze effects had their initial duration cut in half by DR (back when LM daze was 30 seconds with a 15 second cooldown, allowing a single LM to keep two targets in full lockdown in perpetuity).

    This would be a giant leap back for the game. Even today, when we have audacity AND dr, one of the most common complaints about the game is how much CC there is and how powerful that CC is.

    I firmly believe that going about things the way you have listed them would be a disaster.



    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    PVP is frustration. Eliminating one unideal set of circumstances simply introduces another. CC and AOE were the freep mechanisms for dealing with greater numbers.
    CC and AOE are still the freep mechanisms for dealing with greater numbers.

    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    Any kind of creep buffs you want to talk about, if you're at all interested in the betterment of the game, as opposed to just in it for yourself, has to start with that numbers disparity. We all know, those of us who've been around long enough, what happens when creeps get buffed. Vets on both sides have less fun, log in less.
    Trying to balance around population simply does not work. It gives me ZERO comfort when I'm outnumbered 2:1 being camped at grams most weeknights post U10, that my faction is being kept weaker so that your faction doesn't get camped at GV with 2:1 odds.

    As others have pointed out, it is better to look into other tech to handle pop issues. There are many servers where creeps are outnumbered, and on the larger ones it is not uncommon for them to be outnumbered during prime-time. Your generalization does not hold.

    It would be much better to better the incentives for fighting outnumbered, and work on the balance such that the outnumbered side will at least get kills and have fun (vs the get 0 kills and wipe over and over due to the overpowered nature of healing right now).


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  3. #103
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    I don't think there's any value here Sticks in derailing the discussion by asking for or making assumptions about my qualifications to hold it. It's an old forum tactic that usually is employed by the side that feels as if they may be losing some ground. I'm not saying that's you, I'm just saying we can stay on the points themselves without needing to go there.

    As the reservations you have to the rest, I'll say this. After DR was implemented, after we got Audacity, CC nerfed to nearly nothing, AOE made unattractive, store bought skills and maps, creep buffs that remain to weavers and reavers and BA's, objectives in the moors rearranged, multipliers added to point gain...

    After all the changes that have been made in the past 5 years, can you objectively say that as a whole, LOTRO PVMP has improved since Book 12?

  4. #104
    Sapience is offline Former Community Manager & Harbinger of Soon
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    9,519
    If we're going to turn the discussion to the qualifications of individuals to comment, then we're going to end this very quickly. Please keep it on topic.

  5. #105
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Inside my head
    Posts
    53
    Instead of doing a flat out nerf or buff to either faction, the different classes need to be addressed individually and skill by skill. Buffing or nerfing an entire faction is what causes certain classes to become OP and FotM, which badly alters numbers and balance of the general PvP.

    The worst thing that can be done, which has been suggested in some parts in this thread, is to buff something and at the same time nerf another, that just risks tilting the balance too much and again cause some classes to be OP and screw the numbers. People will play the different classes as long as they are fun and able to do something, if all classes can do so, *ideally* there would be no FotM classes.

    PvP is something that needs to be continuosly checked on; changes that seem needed have to be incorporated and monitored so as to identify if they work or not and tweak again if necessary. Obviously for something like this, you need people and resources. If Turbine is not willing to give that to PvP, I very much doubt that anything will happen or any sort of balance will be achieved.The problem is not so much that the balance swings from one side to the other, in my opinion, the problem is that the gaps in between revisions are too large and because of this, the pendulum sings too wide.

    It's like things at the moment, we have had outposts and keep/delving buffs fore quite some time, and players have realised that these things (coupled with the easy faction-flipping) easily alter the numbers, the strong just becomes stronger. Yet nothing has been done about it because no one is "really" looking at it. They were a good idea, but it didn't work so they needed to address that, but that hasn't happened.
    Last edited by Edelith; May 15 2013 at 03:04 PM.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/22224000000059eab/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    I don't think there's any value here Sticks in derailing the discussion by asking for or making assumptions about my qualifications to hold it. It's an old forum tactic that usually is employed by the side that feels as if they may be losing some ground. I'm not saying that's you, I'm just saying we can stay on the points themselves without needing to go there.

    As the reservations you have to the rest, I'll say this. After DR was implemented, after we got Audacity, CC nerfed to nearly nothing, AOE made unattractive, store bought skills and maps, creep buffs that remain to weavers and reavers and BA's, objectives in the moors rearranged, multipliers added to point gain...

    After all the changes that have been made in the past 5 years, can you objectively say that as a whole, LOTRO PVMP has improved since Book 12?
    Yes.

    Without reservation.

    In fact, I would put the later periods of pvp in moria (post-fire DoT curability fix) and Mirkwood (post Knockdown/CJ fixes) up against any other single period of time in terms of the overall quality of play in the moors. And I would say that post-audacity RoI was very close to being right up there with those other periods but for the issues with brands and overall healing potency. I would likely STILL take late RoI over Book 12 SOA, though I have to admit I would take book 14 SOA over any other period of time.

    Many of your suggestions amount to removing things which were added with good reason. I've experienced this game's pvp full on in absence of diminishing returns, it is not something I would ever want to see returned. I do not wish to disqualify you from posting about it, but rather qualify myself for posting a counter argument: being locked down for minutes at a time without recourse is not fun or good gameplay.

    Edit:

    As an aside; I do have to chuckle a bit that you chose book 12 SOA, as this book actually introduced the initial DR system to the moors.
    Last edited by Sezneg; May 15 2013 at 03:16 PM.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  7. #107
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    Yes.

    Without reservation.
    Then where did everyone go?

  8. #108
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    In-game
    Posts
    3,706
    I'd like to say that the RK class should get an overhaul. I try to avoid the class in general, but now and then I run into an RK. And the amount of damage/heals/bubbles and stuns are too much. There is no point for me personally to try fight an RK. I just think their "OP" state ruins it for me and many others.
    Nerf healing in PvMP and just maybe it will be worth it again.

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    196
    Quote Originally Posted by Witch0King View Post
    I'd like to say that the RK class should get an overhaul. I try to avoid the class in general, but now and then I run into an RK. And the amount of damage/heals/bubbles and stuns are too much. There is no point for me personally to try fight an RK. I just think their "OP" state ruins it for me and many others.
    RK's are easily killable by wargs. (I refer to 1v1 balance, of course).

    I have to gimp myself by not using certain skills on my warg in order to keep the fight competitive. And I play on Elendilmir, against some of the most skilled and best geared players in the game.

    Of course, this is mostly due to player skill, not class ability. The stalker class is very weak right now in most situations. However, a skilled stalker player (of which there are ~3 on Elendilmir, and probably fewer than 5 others across all other servers combined) can do wonders with the class. Since you brought up Runekeepers, a truly skilled stalker should be able to dominate a runekeeper (solo v solo, of course) with ease.

    Please don't tinker with wargs too much, as you will probably end up severely breaking it instead. Just buff our crit defence and mitigations outside of flayer. Flayer, of course, is a whole separate issue...it shouldn't exist. The warg is a stealth class, and attempting to turn it into something else is pure lunacy. Take away stealth from the stalker class and it is nothing. Flayer wargs make everyone lol.
    Last edited by SuperCoolGuy23; May 15 2013 at 03:43 PM.

  10. #110
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    Then where did everyone go?
    I hesitate to post this but... http://dailystats.theblackappendage....al-pvmp-trends

    Based on the only information we have, there are more individual freeps and creeps logging in and earning points nowadays compared to Moria (obviously, this data only extends to the beginning of the leaderboards). And the ratio of said players is fairly steady. This of course is not unique account logins, as Sapiance has said previously it has to be taken with HUGE grains of salt.

    Are you specifically asking where specific players are from 5 years ago? MMOs age. Many players leave as the game is no longer the newest prettiest game on the market. The game attracts new players to replace these. I am not at all surprised that many old friends from SoA are no longer playing! But this is pretty much off the topic and into the weeds. We should keep the discussion focused on the actual current state of affairs.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  11. #111
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    In-game
    Posts
    3,706
    Quote Originally Posted by SuperCoolGuy23 View Post
    RK's are easily killable by wargs. (I refer to 1v1 balance, of course).

    I have to gimp myself by not using certain skills on my warg in order to keep the fight competitive. And I play on Elendilmir, against some of the most skilled and best geared players in the game.

    Of course, this is mostly due to player skill, not class ability. The stalker class is very weak right now in most situations. However, a skilled stalker player (of which there are ~3 on Elendilmir, and probably fewer than 5 others across all other servers combined) can do wonders with the class. Since you brought up Runekeepers, a truly skilled stalker should be able to dominate a runekeeper (solo v solo, of course) with ease.

    Please don't tinker with wargs too much, as you will probably end up severely breaking it instead. Just buff our crit defence and mitigations outside of flayer. Flayer, of course, is a whole separate issue...it shouldn't exist. The warg is a stealth class, and attempting to turn it into something else is pure lunacy. Take away stealth from the stalker class and it is nothing. Flayer wargs make everyone lol.
    Do you guys by chance have any 1v1 Rules to even it out?

    Well I play a BA and I cant really do anything against an RK. I use my "get a grip", get the morale, RK takes it away in less than a second. I could always ask a warg to assist, but that wouldnt solve the problem I have. However I dont want to ruin it for RKs. if they have a good time, thats fine. However it doesnt matter if they are skilled or unskilled. It seems to me that all they have to is start healing and I just run out of power and cooldowns. So in a way, It is ruined for me. The RKs were fine in RoI, now I dont bother trying anymore.
    Nerf healing in PvMP and just maybe it will be worth it again.

  12. #112
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    I hesitate to post this but... http://dailystats.theblackappendage....al-pvmp-trends

    Based on the only information we have, there are more individual freeps and creeps logging in and earning points nowadays compared to Moria (obviously, this data only extends to the beginning of the leaderboards). And the ratio of said players is fairly steady. This of course is not unique account logins, as Sapiance has said previously it has to be taken with HUGE grains of salt.

    Are you specifically asking where specific players are from 5 years ago? MMOs age. Many players leave as the game is no longer the newest prettiest game on the market. The game attracts new players to replace these. I am not at all surprised that many old friends from SoA are no longer playing! But this is pretty much off the topic and into the weeds. We should keep the discussion focused on the actual current state of affairs.
    I could've posted this response for you, but I didn't want to put words in your mouth, so to speak, er type.

    But if that's the case, then my argument holds even stronger, doesn't it? If after all the changes Turbine makes, they still lose players, then why make any changes at all? My suggestions didn't hold many actual changes, most were reversions back to past states. If, you will agree that Book 14 was the golden age, and I've heard from most vets that whatever was going on from Book 12-14 was this golden age, then by your own response, Turbine should not have made any changes at all!!

    Those that would've left would've left either way, those that would replace them would come out either way, and it would've left those that remain the happiest.

    /bow

  13. #113
    Sapience is offline Former Community Manager & Harbinger of Soon
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    9,519
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    I hesitate to post this but... http://dailystats.theblackappendage....al-pvmp-trends

    Based on the only information we have, there are more individual freeps and creeps logging in and earning points nowadays compared to Moria (obviously, this data only extends to the beginning of the leaderboards). And the ratio of said players is fairly steady. This of course is not unique account logins, as Sapiance has said previously it has to be taken with HUGE grains of salt.

    Are you specifically asking where specific players are from 5 years ago? MMOs age. Many players leave as the game is no longer the newest prettiest game on the market. The game attracts new players to replace these. I am not at all surprised that many old friends from SoA are no longer playing! But this is pretty much off the topic and into the weeds. We should keep the discussion focused on the actual current state of affairs.
    I'll throw you a bone here. The percentage of players who pariticpate in PvMP has not changed significantly in the last 6 years. Individuals may come and go, but as a percentage of the playerbase it's pretty stable.

  14. #114
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    I could've posted this response for you, but I didn't want to put words in your mouth, so to speak, er type.

    But if that's the case, then my argument holds even stronger, doesn't it? If after all the changes Turbine makes, they still lose players, then why make any changes at all? My suggestions didn't hold many actual changes, most were reversions back to past states. If, you will agree that Book 14 was the golden age, and I've heard from most vets that whatever was going on from Book 12-14 was this golden age, then by your own response, Turbine should not have made any changes at all!!

    Those that would've left would've left either way, those that would replace them would come out either way, and it would've left those that remain the happiest.

    /bow
    But they had to make changes. The game moved forward. The level cap raised. New skills were introduced on freepside. What was fun and balanced at level 50, was not going to be either at level 60. And applying the skills and mechanics that have accumulated since to the previous level 50 environment would be even more broken than it currently is.

    I've been over this ground with you before, MMOs have player churn. People move on, new people arrive.

    MMOs change. It's the defining characteristic of the genre, that the developers will continue development in an ongoing fashion. To wish for otherwise is to wish not to play an MMO.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  15. #115
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by Sapience View Post
    I'll throw you a bone here. The percentage of players who pariticpate in PvMP has not changed significantly in the last 6 years. Individuals may come and go, but as a percentage of the playerbase it's pretty stable.
    I think actually seeing the numbers would be FASCINATING from a numbers nerd standpoint... but I certainly understand why you guys keep things like account numbers and whatnot CLOSE to your vest.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  16. #116
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sapience View Post
    I'll throw you a bone here. The percentage of players who pariticpate in PvMP has not changed significantly in the last 6 years. Individuals may come and go, but as a percentage of the playerbase it's pretty stable.
    This continues to prove my point. If we come to the forums demanding changes, or suggesting them, whatever it is that all we pvp'ers do.. To what purpose? I'll agree with what Sapience is saying... I agreed when you said it too Sticks.

    The changes have made no difference. It hasn't grown the popularity of pvp, it hasn't lent to retention of players, it hasn't reduced either also. If the population line is flat, and the changes line is full of peaks and valleys, then you've got a real issue with either a) your overall system, b) the quality of the changes; which begs a critical eye aimed toward how you're gaining feedback, or c) long term vision.

    Or some combo of the three.

    So if the changes have made no difference, then the best play is to make the fewest changes possible because you're bound to make someone happy.
    Last edited by ColorSpecs; May 15 2013 at 05:06 PM.

  17. #117
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    This continues to prove my point. If we come to the forums demanding changes, or suggesting them, whatever it is that all we pvp'ers do.. To what purpose? I'll agree with what Sapience is saying... I agreed when you said it too Sticks.

    The changes have made no difference. It hasn't grown the popularity of pvp, it hasn't lent to retention of players, it hasn't reduced either also. If the population line is flat, and the changes line is full of peaks and valleys, then you've got a real issue with either a) your overall system, b) the quality of the changes; which begs a critical eye aimed toward how you're gaining feedback, or c) long term vision.

    Or some combo of the three.
    Waaay into the weeds so I'll say it just once: This is only true if you assume no natural decay over time.

    What was your favorite non-MMO computer game 6 years ago? How much do you play it now as compared to then?

    We gamers are a fickle bunch, we chase the next big thing, we grow bored of what we have and move on. That is the natural life cycle of computer games and why big titles like call of duty release new versions in rapid succession. If you simply stop advancing you lose players over time to boredom.

    That the percentages interested in monsterplay have stayed roughly the same proves that the developers have kept the natural decay rate from happening.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  18. #118
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    Waaay into the weeds so I'll say it just once: This is only true if you assume no natural decay over time.

    What was your favorite non-MMO computer game 6 years ago? How much do you play it now as compared to then?

    We gamers are a fickle bunch, we chase the next big thing, we grow bored of what we have and move on. That is the natural life cycle of computer games and why big titles like call of duty release new versions in rapid succession. If you simply stop advancing you lose players over time to boredom.

    That the percentages interested in monsterplay have stayed roughly the same proves that the developers have kept the natural decay rate from happening.
    These are forums, it doesn't get much more weedy than this.

    No, you can still assume natural decay over time. Your assumption is that you are making changes to arrest the decay. You are saying that without the changes to CC, without the implementation of Audacity, the rearranging of the moors etc etc that by now it would be empty.

    I don't share that assumption, though I believe Turbine does. I believe when all else fails the IP will carry it through so it has a unique position in MMO theory maybe. I don't think the player that joined last month and decides to MP is any more or less likely to quit because of an unpottable CC any more than they are because of any other inequality that exists out there. But, I do think, assuming that Books 12-14 were the period that people liked best, where they still around it would help retain more players.

    When you say "gamers" is where the heart of our disagreement is. I think there's a large section of Turbine's customer base that aren't "gamers" at all. They're LOTR fans first. So all you have to do is basically not driver them away as compared to entice them to stay. Turbine has it all backwards.
    Last edited by ColorSpecs; May 15 2013 at 05:19 PM.

  19. #119
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    891
    Let me put it this way... If Turbine opened a new server where it had all the content (landmass, instances & epic) the game has now, but the rest of the game followed SOA rules in looting, crafting, class roles (damage, healing, tanking, CC), pvmp, and itemization.. which would mean:

    1) No RK's & Wardens
    2) No skirmishes
    3) No Legendary Items
    4) No crit or mastery stats
    5) No critting on crafting before mastering the tier
    6) No radiance or audacity
    7) No multiple trait paths
    8) No Mounted Combat
    9) No Overpower or War Speach
    10) No Wardrobe
    11) No Shared Storage
    12) store
    13) No F2P
    14) No uncapped stats
    15) No Fate revision

    Do you think people would want to go there if given a free transfer?

    Personally, I'd balk at losing my RK. But otherwise? After all the changes over the years, I would rather just go back to what it was before.

  20. #120
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,803
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    These are forums, it doesn't get much more weedy than this.

    No, you can still assume natural decay over time. Your assumption is that you are making changes to arrest the decay. You are saying that without the changes to CC, without the implementation of Audacity, the rearranging of the moors etc etc that by now it would be empty.

    I don't share that assumption, though I believe Turbine does. I believe when all else fails the IP will carry it through so it has a unique position in MMO theory maybe. I don't think the player that joined last month and decides to MP is any more or less likely to quit because of an unpottable CC any more than they are because of any other inequality that exists out there. But, I do think, assuming that Books 12-14 were the period that people liked best, where they still around it would help retain more players.

    When you say "gamers" is where the heart of our disagreement is. I think there's a large section of Turbine's customer base that aren't "gamers" at all. They're LOTR fans first. So all you have to do is basically not driver them away as compared to entice them to stay. Turbine has it all backwards.
    I would not expect the moors to be empty, but I would expect gradually lower player activity due to stagnancy.

    And while I would agree that LOTRO has fewer players who are "gamers", I would argue that the single digit percentage of players most active in the moors are the onese most likely to be "gamers".

    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    Let me put it this way... If Turbine opened a new server where it had all the content (landmass, instances & epic) the game has now, but the rest of the game followed SOA rules in looting, crafting, class roles (damage, healing, tanking, CC), pvmp, and itemization.. which would mean:

    1) No RK's & Wardens
    2) No skirmishes
    3) No Legendary Items
    4) No crit or mastery stats
    5) No critting on crafting before mastering the tier
    6) No radiance or audacity
    7) No multiple trait paths
    8) No Mounted Combat
    9) No Overpower or War Speach
    10) No Wardrobe
    11) No Shared Storage
    12) store
    13) No F2P
    14) No uncapped stats
    15) No Fate revision

    Do you think people would want to go there if given a free transfer?

    Personally, I'd balk at losing my RK. But otherwise? After all the changes over the years, I would rather just go back to what it was before.
    Ah... nostalgia.

    Look, this is perhaps your first MMO? I'm not asking to insult or demean you. I've been playing MMOs since 1997 when Ultima Online launched. In EVERY single MMO I have ever played, this exact sentiment is put on the various forums used to communicate about the games (In the case of UO I was guilty of posting something along these lines myself!). It's just something in human nature.

    I won't go into how impossible your hypothetical is (the stat system used in SOA would not have handled scaling to additional levels well, to say the least!... the sheer work in rescaling EVERYTHING, etc). The gulf between the modern game and SOA is vast, there is no going back.

    Let's keep the discussion focused on the future, rather than the past.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  21. #121
    Please be respectful and keep posts meaningful to the original intent so that those of us wanting to continue this discussion may continue to do so. Thank you

    --------------------

    The argument against buffing creeps is valid, but is easily fixed imho if we can address the issue of population imbalance. As I've said before, a scaling buff for whomever is outnumbered should (at least in theory) help with any problems in that regard. The severity and numbers necessary for buffs is something I think would be interesting to discuss and test out. If population balance was addressed and became a non issue, then you could easily focus on things like creep dps vs the healing freeps can do and so on. I'm a firm believer that you fix what you know you can fix and move on. With each fix the next one becomes easier to nail down (I would hope).

    I'd also like to say that I think our goal should not just be to improve the experience for those of us out there on both sides, but to get more people out there. A primary problem for new players is audacity. They want to come out and be competitive, but without full audacity it is very difficult imho to do so. Add to that the cost of audacity gear compared to how long it takes to acquire commendations and I think you see why a number of things are occuring. Most importantly -> 1) People come out to the moors with no audacity on freep/creep and get destroyed until the point they get discouraged and no longer want to come out.

    With that in mind I pose a question to you all...... How can we make the moors more attractive to new players and keep them there?

  22. #122
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    GW2.
    Posts
    178
    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    With that in mind I pose a question to you all...... How can we make the moors more attractive to new players and keep them there?
    A new map where rank and gear do not matter. Everyone enters with standardized stats, and can gain commendations + renown/infamy. Perhaps smaller with population caps, to prevent zerging.
    This "new map" doesn't even have to be new; it could simply be the current Moors map, or sections of it (Grams, TA, GLC, EC, OC et cetera).
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0220400000025661a/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    Happy LotROing!

  23. #123
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Castle Wars
    Posts
    476
    Quote Originally Posted by ColorSpecs View Post
    you can still assume natural decay over time. Your assumption is that you are making changes to arrest the decay.

    I don't share that assumption, though
    ^^^How many times have yall gone into the moors thinking "Yep, same old moors" and how many times has a change actually affected anything? The only times are aud&comms and new map, both have huge downsides imo
    Mirkwoodian - Savior of the Ettenmoors

    Squishy sacrificial tank 2012ish

  24. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by PureWorgNakh View Post
    If you think they're not, you really should l2p.
    Feailuve - Aeviternus - Vesanus
    Brandywine

    The important thing about life is the struggle, not the triumph... Said no winner ever.

  25. #125
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Eriador
    Posts
    763
    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    Please be respectful and keep posts meaningful to the original intent so that those of us wanting to continue this discussion may continue to do so. Thank you

    --------------------

    The argument against buffing creeps is valid, but is easily fixed imho if we can address the issue of population imbalance. As I've said before, a scaling buff for whomever is outnumbered should (at least in theory) help with any problems in that regard. The severity and numbers necessary for buffs is something I think would be interesting to discuss and test out. If population balance was addressed and became a non issue, then you could easily focus on things like creep dps vs the healing freeps can do and so on. I'm a firm believer that you fix what you know you can fix and move on. With each fix the next one becomes easier to nail down (I would hope).
    This.

    The scaled outnumbered "buff" is about the only suggestion I've seen (or made) that addresses the numbers imbalance issue directly. Altering individual character power is a static solution to a dynamic problem. It's also easier for them to adapt quickly, and won't affect characters outside the Moors.

    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    I'd also like to say that I think our goal should not just be to improve the experience for those of us out there on both sides, but to get more people out there. A primary problem for new players is audacity. They want to come out and be competitive, but without full audacity it is very difficult imho to do so. Add to that the cost of audacity gear compared to how long it takes to acquire commendations and I think you see why a number of things are occuring. Most importantly -> 1) People come out to the moors with no audacity on freep/creep and get destroyed until the point they get discouraged and no longer want to come out.
    One of the core problems that's always been hard to address is the massive range of power between individual Freeps. There is a huge difference between a fully geared, all raid weapons/jewelry, 1st agers, and moors armor, and a "moderately equipped" or even "only marginally equipped" Freep. We see it in PvE land all the time.

    The devs have to balance the moors Creeps against some baseline, which means that if they're balanced to high end Freeps, they slaughter moderate to low equipment ones. If they are balanced to the middle of the range, the high end Freep slaughter them. That's inherent in the game design, and a fix isn't going to be easy.

    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    With that in mind I pose a question to you all...... How can we make the moors more attractive to new players and keep them there?
    Without any character mods: Implement a dynamic, scaled, O.N. "buff" to deal with the numbers.

    Use the Monster Play "buff" to bring some of the wildly overpowered DPS and healing numbers in line to make the fights more balanced.

    Bring up the capability of Greenies so they're not quite so squishy.

    Adjust the Keep/NPC/OP buffs.

    Free Wargie Snax(tm) for everyone.
    Hobbits . . .
    Now them's good eatin'!

 

 
Page 5 of 11 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload