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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThorgrinIronhide View Post
    Then perhaps you should have placed this caveat in your initial post instead of being largely dismissive of people who were trying to contribute to your thread and help you out for being admittedly lazy.
    but how would he know it was the concensus until AFTER the replies came in...

    and as for "ignoring" it... im gonna go ahead and speak FOR him and say, ingore in the sence of the info not directly applying to his playstyle. he didnt dismiss it as a viable option.

    maybe im not reading this right, but you seem to have brought a close-minded aproach to a very open-minded thread. this coming from one of the biggest nay-sayers in this here thread. again, maybe i just missed the issue (no, i dont think i am)


    edit/ps- what have you brought to this discussion? you bring up "contribution," then you dont... what is your agenda here? do you have a goal? do you want to help? dont mind the rhetorical questions, i know the answers.
    Last edited by SapienChavez; May 06 2013 at 03:41 PM.

  2. #27
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    I'm just gonna bring up the Helegrod armour again. Even if you think it's not that great, give it a try anyway. It's only two pieces of the six so it's not as noticable a drop to your stats as you think it is. (Additionally, a couple of the pieces have tac crit multiplier, which I believe does affect heals, though I could be wrong.)

    If you're not going to do PvP armour or Helegrod armour, I think you're probably still better off with another 2-piece set bonus. Throw in some bonus Shadow's Lament damage or a power return or something. The golds are decent, if you can get 'em, but good luck getting 'em. I've been extremely lucky to get the shield (arguably the second best gold) and the cloak (definitely second best gold if you're not a shield user) but even those took a ridiculous amount of runs. Well, the cloak did. I have two of those shields and they dropped pretty early on, but we'll just ignore that 'cause that was U9.

    Also, the chestpiece sucks. Like, it's terrible. It's barely good enough for tanking and even then there's quite a few better options for both set items and individual pieces (though if you look at absolutely nothing but the individual pieces themselves, and ignore set bonuses or how well your individual pieces are meshing with each other, the chestpiece is probably BiS).

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThorgrinIronhide View Post
    So you post a thread asking for advice on builds and the one thing that gains consensus as useful to a build (the 2 set perseverance bonus) you ignore? It seems you excel at taking in feedback.
    Why so snarky? Not wanting to PvP is a quite common sentiment (one I once shared pretty strongly). It is a reasonable enough restriction, just sadly gimps your Captain at this point somewhat. PvP remains a rather fringe activity...

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinDragon View Post
    If you're not going to do PvP armour or Helegrod armour, I think you're probably still better off with another 2-piece set bonus. Throw in some bonus Shadow's Lament damage or a power return or something.
    For tanking, I think it's no contest that I'll run 4-EreLeader/2-EreCharge for the power restore, as rarely as that will actually proc in a tank build.

    The golds are decent, if you can get 'em, but good luck getting 'em. I've been extremely lucky to get the shield (arguably the second best gold) and the cloak (definitely second best gold if you're not a shield user) but even those took a ridiculous amount of runs. Well, the cloak did. I have two of those shields and they dropped pretty early on, but we'll just ignore that 'cause that was U9.
    I'm not big on shields, TBH, but recent itemisation trends seem hell-bent on changing that. Now that we have shields specifically tailored for us, combined with the relative lack of DPS races in the current end game, the extra stats on the shields seem like a clear win. Can't say I'm a fan of that (I've always thought that shields feel un-Captainy), but it is what it is.

    Also, the chestpiece sucks. Like, it's terrible. It's barely good enough for tanking and even then there's quite a few better options for both set items and individual pieces (though if you look at absolutely nothing but the individual pieces themselves, and ignore set bonuses or how well your individual pieces are meshing with each other, the chestpiece is probably BiS).
    Duly noted. My current 4/2 combination uses Helm and Shoulders for the "2", so the chest piece wasn't something I gave a lot of consideration.

    My own blue build is Valiant Strike-centric, so I might do 4-HytHealer, then try for the gold shoulders from Erebor. Since there's no gold helm for Captains, as far as I can tell, maybe I'd try to fill that out with the GB legs. Or else wear 2-EreLeader, since that build wouldn't need power cost reduction or a power restore proc, but it could benefit from some morale and an (admittedly minor) Tact Mit buff.
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

  5. #30
    I didn't have any malicious agenda nor do I care if someone doesn't want to pvp. I was just merely pointing out that if you know you are not interested in pvp, given the current climate of the utility of the set bonuses there, it would behoove the OP to mention that he is not interested in feedback regarding pvp gear. I am guessing for most people use their other slot items to offset what they see as deficiencies in their armor stats for their playstyle; thus making a lot of these suggestions moot when they are wearing pvp gear and the OP rejects this as possibility for him.

  6. #31
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    The great question about "not wanting to PvMP" is; what does that mean?

    Not going into etten ever, or not participating in PvP?

    Getting comms without killing i single creep/freep is quite easy, there's lots of quests out there, and many (if not all?) of the quest items can be bought off the AH. Yes, you probably will be in danger for a few minutes while handing in quests, but pick the times of the day you do it right and you won't be in anymore danger than when questing near a warband in rohan.

    Comms grinding on creepside (just quests & deeds) will easily give you ~1000 comms/h, if it's not changed since I last tried it. So that's just 8 hours of grind for two pieces (the two cheapest). Quite a lot less than the grind for the Hytbold armour...

    Last resort is ofcourse the Helegrod set, wouldn't worry about the drop in stats, the reduced cd on not only RC, but also the other Defeat Event skills more than makes up for it...

    EDIT: Ontopic: Blue+HoH with S&B for erebor T2 raids (except perhaps Smaug)
    All 6-man & 3-man = Red + MoW & 2-h
    Nice Might+Crit bracelets coming in U11
    Last edited by vr00mie; May 07 2013 at 03:50 AM.

  7. #32
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    My stand alone raiding/group set is:

    2 Moors Pers + 4 Hytbold Healing
    With the jewellery set up of:
    2 x Easterling Sorcerors Golden Earing (150 Might, 211 + Morale, 768 Crit)(From Dale)
    1 x Critted Wrymfire Necklace of Strength (mainly for the high Might and Crit Defence)
    1 x Annuminas Captain's Bracelet
    1 x non critted Horselords Might Bracelet
    1 x Ring of the Abandoned Hall (150 Might, 382 Tact Mast, 384 Parry, and 970 Crit Defence)(From OD)
    1 x Confiscated Journal (113 might, 421 Morale, and 768 Crit)

    I also have the Malledrim Captain's Shield.

    I have just over 30k tact mast(50.8% outgoing healing) and about 21.2%(buffed) crit.

    I mainly run in HoH, mainly because I go in that many runs there isnt really much point in retraiting only to retrait back to HoH.

    Otherwise, in my bags, I have the Hytbold Charge, Hytbold Leader, and Moors Command armour sets in the event I need to switch armour on the fly. Also have the ToO Tognir set for the extra mit buff.

    Depending on the situation, I'll change jewellery as well.
    For Extra Tactical Mitigations I'll switch out and use Gregolin and the Wold's Iron Bauble(Rohan Rep vendor) to gain an extra 3k tact mit, as well as the Hytbold Leader's Shoulder's, and Im usually just over 50% tactical mitigation with virtues.

    I've found that with a little bit of Crit Defence, it makes a huge difference, also, I use a shield (even though I prefer a two hander, but that cappy shield is too insane not to use), I also have 20% block. Even with a high Might and Crit build, my cappy isn't really squishy. Though that can come down to positioning or group make up as well.

    Bear in mind I've unlocked the t2 Erebor Armour sets as well, but I cant seem to bring myself to barter for any of them, mainly because well... I personally don't think that the Erebor Armour isn't that all fantastic... thats a personal opinion, however. The only one that looks interesting is the Greater Erebor Charge, but since the current raids isnt a dps race, the OB reset is a waste, 1) because for Flight and BfE, its safer to run FellowBro, HoH and Shield, and 2) For Smaug, by the time its time to use OB's on the Grim, you would have been off cooldown, and a second OB comes from the other cappy in the raid group, and the majority of the time the cappy is usually elected to run up and down the mountain anyhow...

    Edit: Oh and these are the relics that I run on LI's

    True setting of the North:
    330 Morale, 646 Crit, 1616 Incoming healing (I noticed that alot of cappies don't run with Incoming healing, and before update 10 were getting one shotted alot. I'd also rather be easy to heal from any heal source)

    Eastemnet Gem of Charity:
    182 Tact Mit, 808 Tact Mast, 310 Power

    Eastemnet Rune of Power:
    182 Phys Mit, 646 Phys Mast, 646 Tact Mast, 30 Fate

    Crafted Emblem of Insight:
    30 Fate, 640 Crit, 640 Tact Mast

    Later Edit: Oh I just noticed that you don't PvP, in any case, the Hytbold Healing set is usually more than fine. Mainly because if the opening rotation include a WC, Valiant Strike, followed by a crit from Dev or Pressing and get a Rallying Cry, you can use Valiant again. 3 Large heals within 10 seconds, while throwing the odd WoC or Buff in between is a decent rotation and is enough to keep the group stable and strain of the healers until your RC cools down.
    Last edited by Dhalion; May 07 2013 at 04:46 AM.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by vr00mie View Post
    The great question about "not wanting to PvMP" is; what does that mean?

    Not going into etten ever, or not participating in PvP?
    Consider that not all of us are VIP. For my freeps, that puts me squarely in the category of "not going into etten ever". Moors armor is simply not an option for me.

    That's not to say I'm not interested to hear about pvp gear in others' builds, but since these items aren't available to me, I welcome the discussion of alternate builds that don't use them. (The advice regarding Helegrod armor is most interesting, thanks.)

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post
    But the problem with the proc rate is it only fires off of the usage of our skills, and our skill rate is about one ever 2-3 seconds or so (if I'm remembering the rate correctly), so in an absolute best case, we have 30 skills over the course of a minute, multiplied by .15, which is roughly 4.5 procs a minute ignoring the cooldown.

    And right about here is where I realize I've completely forgotten everything from my college stats class.... so can't go from the above to the average time it'd take to get it to proc once XD

    The average time to proc + cooldown would give us a better picture of how good this really is.... and sure, it's HPS to the group, but it's not terribly good HPS, since almost all of our skills are gonna blow it by.

    And touching on tactical mastery for a bit, it's got 122 might on it with 408 tactical mastery, so if tactical mastery is your big reason for choosing this ring, I'd consider Ring of the Abandoned Hall.
    I didn't actually say I run this ring because of the Tactical Mastery. I just don't see many alternatives out there that have truely superior stats. Thing is, that the ring is pretty much on par with other top options out there whilst additionally offering this free heal proc. Based on your numbers the ring potentially offers an additional 198 HPS (33.01667 * 6; if no pets/skirm soldiers are present), that's almost 200 HPS (considering that your fellows' inc. heal ratings will probably push this some more, we may actually be looking at even more HPS) for free. If we assumed that you average 4k HPS (which is not going to happen without 0s Rallying Cry Spam) that would be an increase of at least 5% (or 10% if you hover around the 2k HPS mark) - anyone would kill for a piece of Equip that directly offered 5% outgoing healing. I don't see the benefits of wearing the might proc ring over the mender's ring, as you only gain ~800 Mastery while the proc is active (when compared to the mender's ring) or almost no Mastery at all, if you wear another piece of equipment with a +113 Might proc (as the might procs don't stack). Even those 800 Mastery won't make up for 5% heal, let alone 10% heal.

  10. #35
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    Not to drag too far off-topic, but responding to vr00mie's question: for me, it means not entering the Ettens at all. If I were VIP again and had access to it, I'd prefer to participate in PvP than just grinding out a bunch of really boring quests. But I'd rather be raiding or running instances than even that, because that's my play style. I don't want to do something that goes 100% against how I would prefer to play the game just because there's a totally broken armour set over there.

    From my perspective, "just go do PvMP" is not that far different from "just go roll a Hunter". It's not how I want to experience the game at all, regardless of what rewards are available for doing it.

    Anyway, this should probably be the last word on PvMP. I'd still like to see more gear suggestions that didn't include Pers/Hele, but if that's what people are running, that's what they're running.
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

  11. #36
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    I updated the top post with the (IMO) best advice from the thread. Thanks, guys! If there's anything drastically new, I'll add it to the top as well.
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

  12. #37
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    Sorry furtim, I know you're trying to move the thread away from PvP but I want to hit on this really quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by banjolier View Post
    Consider that not all of us are VIP. For my freeps, that puts me squarely in the category of "not going into etten ever". Moors armor is simply not an option for me.

    That's not to say I'm not interested to hear about pvp gear in others' builds, but since these items aren't available to me, I welcome the discussion of alternate builds that don't use them. (The advice regarding Helegrod armor is most interesting, thanks.)
    Comms are significantly easier to earn on creepside and are available to both freeps and creeps, no matter what side you earn them on. Since reavers are free to everyone (no need to be VIP or even premium) you can just launch a freaver, do the quests (don't even bother with PvP) and earn enough comms in a couple days of questing.

    It may still leave the problem of actually obtaining the armour though, I can't remember if they've fixed that or not. I know those under the minimum level for Moors (80) can still be summoned by a captain, but I can't remember if non-VIPs can still be summoned like they used to be able to. Anyone have any knowledge about how it's currently functioning?

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinDragon View Post
    Comms are significantly easier to earn on creepside and are available to both freeps and creeps, no matter what side you earn them on. Since reavers are free to everyone (no need to be VIP or even premium) you can just launch a freaver, do the quests (don't even bother with PvP) and earn enough comms in a couple days of questing.

    It may still leave the problem of actually obtaining the armour though, I can't remember if they've fixed that or not. I know those under the minimum level for Moors (80) can still be summoned by a captain, but I can't remember if non-VIPs can still be summoned like they used to be able to. Anyone have any knowledge about how it's currently functioning?
    Assuming that the workaround fails, one approach is to earn the comms creepside at whatever pace you want, then go VIP for a while to get the armor and other side benefits. I've got a lifetime account, so I tend to ignore this stuff, didn't even occur to me that Furtim might be F2P.

    That said, having best in game stuff in moors might make $ense to turbine after all give the requirement for a paying subscription.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vodomir View Post
    Based on your numbers the ring potentially offers an additional 198 HPS (33.01667 * 6; if no pets/skirm soldiers are present), that's almost 200 HPS (considering that your fellows' inc. heal ratings will probably push this some more, we may actually be looking at even more HPS) for free.
    I did not make this clear, that was an absolute best case for proc times, that is, it procs, goes off coldown and immediately procs again. This is an unrealistically optimistic portrayal of how good this ring is going to work - in other words, that number is NOT one to wave around as fact.

    Ironically, I have forgotten that part of my stats class from college (years ago), and I'm no where near my home library to look it up in the text book - so I can't do the calculation to determine an average time to proc, which is going to give us a better idea on how good the ring really is.

    tl-dr: While I calculated 33 HPS/target for the ring, that is an overestimate.
    Maley Oakensage, Captain of Elendilmir

    Alas Elendilmir, may you *jingle jangle* forever in the Forgotten West

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhalion View Post
    My stand alone raiding/group set is:
    2 Moors Pers + 4 Hytbold Healing
    With the jewellery set up of:
    2 x Easterling Sorcerors Golden Earing (150 Might, 211 + Morale, 768 Crit)(From Dale)
    1 x Critted Wrymfire Necklace of Strength (mainly for the high Might and Crit Defence)
    1 x Annuminas Captain's Bracelet
    1 x non critted Horselords Might Bracelet
    1 x Ring of the Abandoned Hall (150 Might, 382 Tact Mast, 384 Parry, and 970 Crit Defence)(From OD)
    1 x Confiscated Journal (113 might, 421 Morale, and 768 Crit)

    Depending on the situation, I'll change jewellery as well.
    For Extra Tactical Mitigations I'll switch out and use Gregolin and the Wold's Iron Bauble(Rohan Rep vendor) to gain an extra 3k tact mit, as well as the Hytbold Leader's Shoulder's, and Im usually just over 50% tactical mitigation with virtues.

    Eastemnet Gem of Charity:
    182 Tact Mit, 808 Tact Mast, 310 Power

    Eastemnet Rune of Power:
    182 Phys Mit, 646 Phys Mast, 646 Tact Mast, 30 Fate
    Grats on the post. More items for my gear compendium: Gregolin and wold iron bauble! Together with Sarchol that's an impressive +4500 tact mitigation. Even so i would like to make a few suggestions to improve your build:

    Critted Wyrmfire Necklace of Strength- I found this one to be surpassed by the Shiny Wyrmfire Necklace of Defence. You lost 400 morale/40 Might for 81 Vitality/827 tactical mitigation.

    Eastemnet Gem of Charity. The Fate+ Critical Rating Gem would free 2 Critical slots on your build. So you can use a pocket/earring/bracelet/cloak without critical and still be overcap on Criticals.

    Eastemnet Rune of Power. I use this rune on the emblem, but the one-hander goes with the "tank rune". Using the "Tank" rune would add a lot of BPE without hurting much your Healing or DPS potential.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by furtim View Post
    Anyway, this should probably be the last word on PvMP. I'd still like to see more gear suggestions that didn't include Pers/Hele, but if that's what people are running, that's what they're running.
    My thoughts on the 2-perseverance: I have them, I sometimes use them, but I don't think they're the end-all master set piece, even when people on my server ridicule me for not wearing them. The -20% defeat response sets have been around for years, but honestly, very rarely do I find the 6-second rallying cry to be necessary. I instead find that by the time something dies, my rally cry is already back off cooldown. If it's not, then it's likely that my war cry duration is about to expire, and I had better get ready to throw that one back up. I notice a lot of captains I raid with seem to forget about war cry entirely, especially when they're pumping out heals, but it's a powerful buff that should be kept up as often as possible.

    So what do I do? Well, I have the perseverance and hytbold healing, but as others have stated, almost everyone runs this. So I decided to invest some tokens into the hytbold DPS set as well. The 2-piece is meh, but 4-piece adds an extra 5% to revealing mark. It's not much, but why not? Every little bit helps, and if you're not focused on popping off rallying cries, then at least the group will have one captain with the revealing mark buff. Couple that with the 2-piece bonus off the healing set and you've still got yourself a pretty strong and versatile captain.

    I haven't looked over the Erebor sets /too/ much in detail. I haven't been playing much as of late because of Turbine's poor quality of content, but when I saw the sets and set bonuses on Bullroarer, versus the time and grind it would take to acquire them, I felt the end result was going to be a little lackluster. I don't think the difference between hytbold and erebor gear is half as great as it was between draigoch and isengard armor for captains.

    My advice: If you're just starting out again, get yourself a nice set of hytbold gear (since you can't PvP) and then start focusing on jewelry to compliment it. I don't plan on grinding out a lot more than that for my captain until we see the class revamps and what they have in store for us in Helm's Deep later this year.
    Last edited by Krindus; May 07 2013 at 01:01 PM.
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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krindus View Post
    My thoughts on the 2-perseverance: I have them, I sometimes use them, but I don't think they're the end-all master set piece, even when people on my server ridicule me for not wearing them. The -20% defeat response sets have been around for years, but honestly, very rarely do I find the 6-second rallying cry to be necessary.
    6s Rallying Cry is highly desirable in some fights, particularly the ones with swarms of mobs like Road to Erebor.

    And bear in mind that perseverence also shortens Shadow's Lament. Between that and the 6s Rallying Cry, it is really really nice in LtC. And it ALSO shortens Routing Cry, making it a nice 2 piece to splash into LoM -- making the AOE force taunt 36 seconds instead of 45 is a win. Basically for a 2 piece bonus it is incredibly hard to beat and very versatile. IMHO of course.

  18. #43
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    It occurs to me that the best setup for BfE T1 or T2 is probably not Perseverance. Thinking back on when I've run it, very rarely do I fire off a Rallying Cry more than twice a minute at best. More than every 15 seconds is practically impossible. (For T2, I'm usually blue, so it's a drop in crit rating. Usually only around 24 as opposed to my normal capped 30. Even with a high crit rating, defeat responses don't seem to trigger all that often though.) Using 4 Hytbold Charge and 2 Hytbold Healer may be the best combination. Since it's not a DPS race, oftentimes both captains will be using the Revealing Mark, and you could swap to an extra 2 pieces of Hytbold Healer right before hitting your Rallying Cries, or for T1 just sticking with 4 HHealer and 2HCharge if you're not using Revealing.

    This may or may not be true for any group using Reinforcements, whether that's your method for T2 or whether you're doing T2C. As my group usually avoids Reinforcements on T2 (and I haven't raided in a couple weeks, so I don't know if they've tried T2C recently) I don't know how vital the extra Rallying Cries would be, though I have a feeling they'd be significantly more important since not everyone is hitting the same targets anymore and since you're actually getting defeat responses. The 6s Rallying Cry definitely wins out for Flight. In theory it'd win out for Smaug as well, but I've noticed that I don't actually tend to be near anyone taking damage when adds are dying, as I'm the one usually running the valves.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by furtim View Post
    I find myself getting too squishy when I build Might/Crit. Right now, I'm wearing 4 Hyt-Healer/2 Hyt-Leader to pick up the slack. How are you guys dealing with that?
    In my experience - if you are building your captain to be a main-healer - you are going to be somewhat squishy no matter what since you are generally going to lack in avoidance. Probably the most effective way to off-set this would be to wear a shield in my opinion, but that will hurt your offense some. It's those fights with lots of adds that will probably give you the most trouble - because without high avoidance it's almost impossible to survive against swarms of adds bearing down on you, and all that AoE healing we do makes us very tantalizing to the enemy.

    But a good tank helps more than anything else. It's amazing the difference a skilled tank can make. It can literally be the difference in me being barely scratched on a fight and a fight I can't stay alive on no matter what I try. So in short: Nothing beats having a good tank.

    Otherwise, using your hope banner to boost your morale on fights you are having trouble staying alive on can make a difference. Muster Courage helps too. So can boosting your morale, vitality, and mitigation stats.

  20. #45
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    Back to the statiscs model presented for the ring and why it's wrong...

    To accurately calculate an average HPS for the ring, you will need to know roughly how many skills it will take to proc the ring on average with a proc chance of 15 seconds. Once the number of skills is known, that needs to be converted into a duration of time, assuming an average skill duration can be found. This will give us the average time to proc.

    By taking that duration, and using it with the cooldown (of 30s) AND the average HPS (which is 990.5) and plugging it into the equation:

    HPS = healing/(cooldown + procTime)
    = 990.5/(30 + ?????)

    You will get an average HPS per target to be expected from the ring when you are spamming healing skills..

    So where did the 33.0167 HPS/target come from? I wanted an upper ceiling, so I set the procTime in the prior calculation to zero, which is completely unrealistic, thus the number. This is an absolute maximum that the ring will produce, but it cannot be reasonably achieved over a long period of time.

    So unless someone wants to step in and show the math for how many skill usages it'd take (on average) to get a proc at 15% rate, I'm stuck because it's been half a decade since I've been in college, I've completely forgotten everything from the stats class, and can't find the text book XD

    What makes this all the more frustrating - I swear I've solved this exact same problem in the class....

    That said, here's an HPS table with proctime increasing in steps of 5 seconds:

    procTime HPS/target
    0 33.0167
    5 28.3000
    10 24.7625
    15 22.0111
    20 19.8100
    25 18.0091
    30 16.5083
    35 15.2385
    40 14.1500
    45 13.2067
    50 12.3813
    55 11.6529
    60 11.0056

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremi View Post
    In my experience - if you are building your captain to be a main-healer - you are going to be somewhat squishy no matter what since you are generally going to lack in avoidance. Probably the most effective way to off-set this would be to wear a shield in my opinion, but that will hurt your offense some. It's those fights with lots of adds that will probably give you the most trouble - because without high avoidance it's almost impossible to survive against swarms of adds bearing down on you, and all that AoE healing we do makes us very tantalizing to the enemy.

    But a good tank helps more than anything else. It's amazing the difference a skilled tank can make. It can literally be the difference in me being barely scratched on a fight and a fight I can't stay alive on no matter what I try. So in short: Nothing beats having a good tank.

    Otherwise, using your hope banner to boost your morale on fights you are having trouble staying alive on can make a difference. Muster Courage helps too. So can boosting your morale, vitality, and mitigation stats.
    Um.... when talking about raid builds, it's generally assumed that it's all about T2 HM strats, so it's assumed that the tank is competent and the captain is not main healing.
    Last edited by Almagnus1; May 07 2013 at 08:45 PM.
    Maley Oakensage, Captain of Elendilmir

    Alas Elendilmir, may you *jingle jangle* forever in the Forgotten West

  21. #46
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    I can main heal any 3/6 man content in the game (even heal my fellow through some 12 mans) and i dont see the point in stacking TM and crit so high at the expense of your mits, when you can get good mits, good crit and decent TM without going crazy in might

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almagnus1 View Post
    So unless someone wants to step in and show the math for how many skill usages it'd take (on average) to get a proc at 15% rate, I'm stuck because it's been half a decade since I've been in college, I've completely forgotten everything from the stats class, and can't find the text book XD
    IIRC: For repeated trials, the chance of getting exactly one positive result (to account for the cooldown, in this case) would be Pn = (Pproc)*n - (Pproc)^n. From there, you set the desired value for Pn and solve for n. Of course, the algebra for this particular formula is not fun. So, if you were doing it by hand, you'd just plug in successive values of n, starting with a rough guess.

    Or, if you're lazy and on the internet, you just ask Wolfram-Alpha to solve the above for a Pn of 0.95 and get a result of 6.33337. Round up to 7, of course, because we're using discrete trials.

    That's the sort of hacky I'm-not-a-real-mathematician way. For the real method, see here. Short version is that running successive, independent trials until a desired result is achieved is a geometric random variable, and the number of trials needed to achieve x "successes" given a probability of success p is simply x/p. In this case, 1/.15 or 6.66... Practically speaking, again because we're talking about discrete trials, treat this as 7.

    (For the curious: The two answers are different because one used what's effectively a 95% confidence level, while the other used a discrete calculation. Ultimately, 0.95/.15 is 6.33.... Don't ask me why the Wolfram-Alpha equation solver spat out something non-repeating, though.)
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

  23. #48
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    Following off of what Furtim said...

    Using a skill time of 2 seconds, it's roughly 12-14 second time duration between procs, whereas a skill time of 3 seconds is 18-21 seconds. Going off of the chart, (and to simplify the math), I'm gonna say it does 20 HPS/target - so the following math is easy.

    For a 3 man, that means the ring adds 60 HPS, for full fellow (and raid) content, it's 120 HPS. I don't see the value of the proc for 3 mans (where captains heal the most), because the additional healing is essentially a rounding error.

    For raids, it's somewhat useful, but not something I'm going to go out of my way for.
    Maley Oakensage, Captain of Elendilmir

    Alas Elendilmir, may you *jingle jangle* forever in the Forgotten West

  24. #49
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    May 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by warwalker View Post
    I can main heal any 3/6 man content in the game (even heal my fellow through some 12 mans) and i dont see the point in stacking TM and crit so high at the expense of your mits, when you can get good mits, good crit and decent TM without going crazy in might
    That is a line of reasoning that i have been bringing up here for the last months. As we grind for items it becomes easier to reach critical rating cap. The Rohan gold crit ring makes me reach crit cap even without using critical on my cloak, pocket or necklace.

    I advocate that it is good to have Might when you are DPSing or tanking, but going all might while healing won't increase your heals that much, but will certainly turn you in a glass cannon.
    Or in other words a squishy fake mini that can't heal us much as a true mini.

    For the guy who said that Perseverance is overrated: perhaps you should try run content with and without Perseverancemore often to realize how night and day it is. Even in single target fights Perseverance gives you the ability to fire back to back RC. And back to back RCs are good when every RC resets VS. BfE T2 has reinforcements waves every 30s. Believe me- 2 pers helps a LOT there because the VS HoTs are required by most reasonable strategys.

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nascephor View Post
    That is a line of reasoning that i have been bringing up here for the last months. As we grind for items it becomes easier to reach critical rating cap. The Rohan gold crit ring makes me reach crit cap even without using critical on my cloak, pocket or necklace.

    I advocate that it is good to have Might when you are DPSing or tanking, but going all might while healing won't increase your heals that much, but will certainly turn you in a glass cannon.
    Or in other words a squishy fake mini that can't heal us much as a true mini.
    This is kind of what I mean when I say that my current build feels too squishy. Obviously, I still have more morale and much better mitigations than a Minstrel, but I also feel like a glass cannon build is not appropriate for a raid Captain. A lot of our strength in a raid comes from being the one who doesn't go down until the end, no matter how bad it gets, so we have a chance to use all of our "oh &&&&" skills and hopefully recover the group before a wipe happens.

    It's an tough balance to strike, I think.
    Cainwen Ciaphas, Captain of Crickhollow, HERO OF MIDDLE EARTH!!!
    I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered! My opinions are my own!

 

 
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