Why pvp?

[vhamster]

Sapience quoted in a recent thread:

"This change will be live as part of Update 11 on Monday May 13th.

They are just ending something that people have been working years on.
Oddly enough this is exactly why it's being changed. It was never intended that any of these deeds take years. In fact this has been bugged a number of times by players and was very much a bug in need of fixing. The idea that one class can complete these easily while another takes years is the very opposite of the intent.

That said, it should be clarified that you will not get credit for simply being in the group. We realize much of the perception of this change is that we're making it work like kills in PVE. Unlike the way kills are counted in PvE, where you just need to be in the group to share XP and loot, for PvMP you will need to have contributed during the fight in one of two ways.

Contribute damage within 20 seconds of the death of their target.
Affect the vitals of one who is already on the contribution list by healing their morale or restoring their power.
There is no "go AFK and farm deed credit" ability. No contribution means no credit."

peace out!

[Leksi]

"Citation needed."

GFY

oh and

[myforumacc2]

peace out!

cya moorz

[Redbeaver]

Your feeling is quite mutual and agreeable. PVE is really not what it used to be.

Primary example of that could be seen in the Watcher/DN/DG progression threads. Look at how many kins/pugs participated and now, I can barely count the kins who are successful in PVE on my right hand. The rewards are mediocre and the feeling of accomplishment is just not there.

That engaging effect of PVE is gone, at least to me. Recently, I've been just doing it out of necessity to acquire relatively better gear rather than enjoyment of content. Not a single element of the new raids gave me the same drive as killing the Blind One or any of the DG bosses back in the day.

just my 2cs

agree.

PvE isn't as epic as it used to be. I took a 1.5yr hiatus and was expecting to be floored by Rohan....

...not.

the only thing that REALLY excites me with Rohan? The music.

the rest is "good".

the other thing excites me with getting back to the game? Meeting you guys, you old coots.

Slither, come back!!!!

dear Lord, no.

just... no.


LOL JK, SLITHER I wuv you too... hey champ can be a total "chank" build now with morale up to 24k!!! you'd LOVE that!

Sapience quoted in a recent thread:

"This change will be live as part of Update 11 on Monday May 13th.

They are just ending something that people have been working years on.
Oddly enough this is exactly why it's being changed. It was never intended that any of these deeds take years. In fact this has been bugged a number of times by players and was very much a bug in need of fixing. The idea that one class can complete these easily while another takes years is the very opposite of the intent.

That said, it should be clarified that you will not get credit for simply being in the group. We realize much of the perception of this change is that we're making it work like kills in PVE. Unlike the way kills are counted in PvE, where you just need to be in the group to share XP and loot, for PvMP you will need to have contributed during the fight in one of two ways.

Contribute damage within 20 seconds of the death of their target.
Affect the vitals of one who is already on the contribution list by healing their morale or restoring their power.
There is no "go AFK and farm deed credit" ability. No contribution means no credit."

peace out!

that kinda ease the pain. kinda.

a wee bit.

[Gladgilrian]

I don't understand why the leaderboards are going down, BUT I also don't know why its a big deal. There are 3rd party sites that will run the show now. The black appendage is the biggest example of this. I mean i rarely use leaderboards because The Black Appendage has more features too. If there is something im missing PLEASE tell me.

The thing that i dont enjoy in the update is the kills replaces deeds. The deeds really help me find fun while trying to rank.
kills count for deed KB change I support crushing that idea and ripping it up.

IN SHORT: I don't mind removing the leaderboards and I hate the idea of replacing kbs for standard kills.

From what I understand by reading the "alternative" LOTRO forums, leaderboards are going away because of the rebuilding of these forums, and the API that gathers the data is being shut down. That means no more leaderboards for Black Appendage also, since they use turbines data scrape.

No one got their panties in a wad about the P2W aspect that the store would bring. Very few of you cared about the rank farming, but take away your titles and it's the end of the world, not that I don't agree with you. My point is, you all saw the warning signs and you choose to mock and troll, so if you'll excuse me I'll just sit back and laugh, with a very smug "I told you so" smile on my face.

[Gladgilrian]

All the quick xfer top tier servers only seem to hold people for so long before they hop off onto the next big thing, JQ has been pretty steadily at the top since the servers opened I think. either way I've taken quite a long break from the game to level a new champ and start from scratch here, which is more time consuming than I really anticipated. However it's nice to get a fresh perspective on how bad this game still is and what the company continually does to it, but in the end I just missed the champion class so, y'know.

as for WvW I suspect JQ will almost always be tops, whoever has the strongest oceanic base will win because the keeps all flip when the meritards go to bed. after rank 30 arena just feels dull and the only real joy solo in wvw was ganking the jump puzzle. which though hilarious also gets old, for all its interesting features WvW to me still feels like 'moors, with more space and less mobility (ie just walking everywhere taking twice as long and after a death porting like 5 miles north just bothers me)

SoR has been fairly steady since we got a few refugees from JQ, mainly TW and Indo. We will probably never win tier one, but I doubt anyone will push us out of tier one in the near future, it's not like you get anything for winning.

I know what you mean about things getting old, but eventually even a good thing gets old. I have taken breaks here and there to play other games, but that's the beauty of no subs, I can always go back.

One of my most memorable 1v1's was killing a Guardian over and over on my Mesmer that just bounced the other Mesmer off the platform in the jumping puzzle when we were porting others up. So still ganking the gankers

[myforumacc2]

Ganging up on peeps was the funnest aspect of my tenure in that game. You can't believe the rage sometimes haha

Heh, I actually know 2 people who mostly play bots because of that. Mmm come to think of it, some one in creep OOC was talking about how immature lotro players became after f2p, and everyone started agreeing. I lol'd xD

[vhamster]

Is it me or they just threw everything under one section in world forums? lol at the clusterf***

[Isindar]

durdurdur

y meneldor y
y u do dis
come to e and kill goodly with me

Is it me or they just threw everything under one section in world forums? lol at the clusterf***

I find it interesting that PvMP isn't listed under the gameplay forums, or really at all unless you go to world specific forums first unless I missed something

[Jimeih]

I just read the forums and noticed this:

"Originally Posted by Sapience

Monsterplay
Quests and Deeds that require the defeat of Players or Monster Players will now advance for all contributors, not just the player who dealt the final blow."

Also, I heard they're evaporating leaderboards in attempt to enhance their website?

I died a little inside.

All those kb titles and hard work ( run through TA to kill Cream sitting up top) will soon be rendered useless.

That extra spice of getting a kb on Rusty, DD and Butta(in the old days), will soon be meaningless.

Why pvp?

Why? To have fun. The spirit of competition. You and others have been bemoaning the 'meaningless' of all the various pvp 'achievements' in lotro for so long. You don't need titles or a record of your kbs, etc, to pvp. You just need to get out there and pvp and have fun doing it for so long as it is fun; if it is not fun just pack up and do something else. Too many people care about all this meta pvp and statistics designed to suck you in. If that is what keeps you playing then you're not really in it for the pvp.

[Schmidster]

Curious - did something happen recently that made you want to respond?

I have tried PvP maybe twice and it was years ago. I went in as a "Freep" I believe, because I was my same character. I got a beat-down like nobody's business and the Kin mate who took me there thought it was very funny.

[vhamster]

Why? To have fun. The spirit of competition. You and others have been bemoaning the 'meaningless' of all the various pvp 'achievements' in lotro for so long. You don't need titles or a record of your kbs, etc, to pvp. You just need to get out there and pvp and have fun doing it for so long as it is fun; if it is not fun just pack up and do something else. Too many people care about all this meta pvp and statistics designed to suck you in. If that is what keeps you playing then you're not really in it for the pvp.

What spirit of competition is there if there is no balance? Since there was no balance to begin with, you tend to look for "fun" else where. I, for instance, found fun in accomplishments via deed acquisition and completion. I found it fun to race people for rank and kb achievements. If this is your idea of having fun and competition, by trivializing and dumbing down the content, then I have no further need for discussion.

[sp33dccm]

dumbing down the content

Isn't this the road we're going down already?

[vhamster]

Isn't this the road we're going down already?

Perhaps. Seems like PC supports it, at least this server's member anyway =(

[Jimeih]

Perhaps. Seems like PC supports it, at least this server's member anyway =(

You assume too much. I didn't comment on content -- I commented on gameplay. PvP should be its own end and reward; if it is unbalanced or unsatisfying then the issues that make it so should be addressed. Rank and deeds are more of a reflection of time invested than anything else. If you like that then more power to you but it isn't why everyone logs in to PvP.

[vhamster]

You assume too much. I didn't comment on content -- I commented on gameplay. PvP should be its own end and reward; if it is unbalanced or unsatisfying then the issues that make it so should be addressed. Rank and deeds are more of a reflection of time invested than anything else. If you like that then more power to you but it isn't why everyone logs in to PvP.

Those deeds/titles/etc. are content. I'm sorry you don't see it that way. How would you know why everyone logs in to pvp?
You assume too much.

[sp33dccm]

Perhaps. Seems like PC supports it, at least this server's member anyway =(

Most likely because it caters for the 'casual' players. You can't keep everyone happy and sadly since that population outweighs the hardcore players, they'll make Turbine/WB more money. Hence the changes. Moving off topic.. but anyway

[Stepbrother]

What spirit of competition is there if there is no balance? Since there was no balance to begin with, you tend to look for "fun" else where. I, for instance, found fun in accomplishments via deed acquisition and completion. I found it fun to race people for rank and kb achievements. If this is your idea of having fun and competition, by trivializing and dumbing down the content, then I have no further need for discussion.

It's relative I guess. I lost interest in deeds, titles, rank, years ago when they changed the raid infamy/renown rules and I watched every laughable raid baby vault past me in rank just sitting in the middle of a pile of bodies doing squat. No offense, you were one of them at one time and (gasp) you're the highest ranked player on the server. So I say, meh, at least they're finally just blowing it up real good now. Enjoy your titles everyone!

[vhamster]

It's relative I guess. I lost interest in deeds, titles, rank, years ago when they changed the raid infamy/renown rules and I watched every laughable raid baby vault past me in rank just sitting in the middle of a pile of bodies doing squat. No offense, you were one of them at one time and (gasp) you're the highest ranked player on the server. So I say, meh, at least they're finally just blowing it up real good now. Enjoy your titles everyone!

None taken Milt, I'll admit I didn't know better at the time.There were people who showed me the flip side of the coin then.I doubt there are many,if any,left to open alternatives to the population.

[Jimeih]

Those deeds/titles/etc. are content. I'm sorry you don't see it that way. How would you know why everyone logs in to pvp?
You assume too much.

I don't need to know why everyone logs in to know that not everyone logs in so they can chase deeds/titles, etc. Nice try.

[vhamster]

I don't need to know why everyone logs in to know that not everyone logs in so they can chase deeds/titles, etc. Nice try.

Again,another assumption. Can I assume,then,that you really couldn't give a **** about pvp on this server?

[myforumacc2]

I watched every laughable raid baby vault past me in rank just sitting in the middle of a pile of bodies doing squat

Welll if you sit around watching them, nobody would really know. Might as well throw your voice out there, like volo's thread. Atleast he tries to change turbine's bad updates.


Otherwise they'd probably just guess you liked the update

snip everything he said

Hey guys, this is the representative of the community, isnt that brilliant? They literally picked people who were on the 5% minority as representatives for everyone


I love this game xD

[myforumacc2]

If that is what keeps you playing then you're not really in it for the pvp.

I dont know why i came back but ohhh myy goodd this is hilarious



Do you even pvp?

[Gladgilrian]

You assume too much. I didn't comment on content -- I commented on gameplay. PvP should be its own end and reward; if it is unbalanced or unsatisfying then the issues that make it so should be addressed. Rank and deeds are more of a reflection of time invested than anything else. If you like that then more power to you but it isn't why everyone logs in to PvP.

While I do agree with you that PvP should be it's own reward I. E. that you should do it because it's fun. Many people don't see it that way, they want progression. Taking away earning KB's, titles etc. takes away meaningful progression. They diminished, arguably, the best and hardest to earn titles in the game. Maybe your lack of time PvPing, councilmen, blinds you to that fact.

GW2's WvWvW had literally no progression, it was only for fun. Guess what? They added titles and ranks, hence progression, and it's basically exactly like LOTRO's, you get credit for everyone that dies just for doing damage (you do get badges for doing the most damage, or being the one that actually "downed" the players, there are no KB's in GW2, but that's been part of the game since launch). The difference? GW2 added something, LOTRO took something away.

If LOTRO was like that from the start we wouldn't be having this argument. People don't like having things taken away. And turbine continues to shoot themselves in the foot with every single update. Just pull the plug already

[myforumacc2]

Again, im still on a different footing about rewards i think. Pvp isnt for fun, its a competition that literally pushes you out there to win, and thats the part thats fun about pvp. Think of the olympics, pvp is actually a sport that gives you a trophy like rank and titles to hang up proudly and look at how shiny it is every morning.


Which is not this game. Like Milt said, sit in a raid and start farming rank without any skill, Kb titles will soon be nothing, i should insert something about balance but everyone knows about that. Its a fight zone without trophies, and the thrill of victory doesnt come too often because of number/balance issues