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  1. #1
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    Why did Elros choose as he did?

    So Elrond chose to be numbered among the elves, along with his mother and father, and the sons of Fëanor who basically raised him, until the War of Wrath. Why in Arda did his brother choose differently? I wrote a possible explanation, but maybe others have better ones.
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  2. #2
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    I am not aware if ages were given of Elros and Elrond when they were taken by Maglor and his elder brother. It could be they were older than some readers think and was closer to his father, who would have chosen the Gift of Men had his wife not chosen the life of the Eldar. I think I read somewhere can't remember now that said Elros and Elrond may not have been twins. If someone has that source feel free to correct me.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferdinanda View Post
    So Elrond chose to be numbered among the elves, along with his mother and father, and the sons of Fëanor who basically raised him, until the War of Wrath. Why in Arda did his brother choose differently? I wrote a possible explanation, but maybe others have better ones.
    Before lore-masters come up with philological data to explain things, or lore-trolls appear with their hammers and thongs to shatter all sense and sensibility, may I say that your approach is very feasible and totally Tolkien-esque*, while your writing is simply beautiful

    * Contrast with the choice of Aegnor
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  4. #4
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    Wraarh! Lore Troll! (I like the writing too, by the way)

    -I suspect the answer is pretty straight forward, if you look at the family trees of the half-elven.

    As far as I am aware the Edain were governed by 3 major houses: the House of Bëor, the House of Haleth, and the House of Hador. As fate would have it, at the end of the war against Morgoth, 2 of the 3 houses were largely wiped out, leaving very few heirs. But as another interesting twist of fate, the houses had intermarried over the past generations in such a way, that the remaining heirs to the houses were actually legitimate heirs to all three.

    And the legitimate heirs to all 3 houses were the twins Elrond and Elros.

    When the Edain were rewarded for their efforts against Morgoth with the Kingdom of Númenor, I guess it made a lot of sense to look to a common leader, and there was no choice more obvious than to look to Elros and Elrond. But it would also stand to reason, that one could not declare oneself an Elf, and then legitimately lead a Kingdom which by its very nature is a celebration of Mankind. So whichever one of them decided to take up the crown of Númenor, would need to choose a mortal life, for the sake of common decency. It was a sacrifice, to consolidate the new Kingdom of Man.

    ...from that perspective, one might even want to turn the question 180-degrees: Why did Elrond decide to be an Elf, when there was a need for someone to lead the newly formed Kingdom to glory? He could have done much good for Númenor, but chose instead to spend his time as a military commander under Gil-Galad.

  5. #5
    Great question ferdinanda and one I’ve pondered as well. I think your theory could be a valid one.

    Another perspective on this would be that the Doom of Men as it was later referred to, or their mortality, was originally known as the Gift of Men. I believe it was known as a gift because the elves were bound to Arda, and due to the marring of the world by Melkor, their long lives would eventually leave the elves filled with sorrow (hence all the ‘grey is the shadow upon my heart’ stuff you hear from elves). From this perspective, it was considered a blessing or a gift to be released from Arda through death and to no longer carry these burdens.

    Therefore, we can speculate that Elros wanted to labour for a while longer in Arda, and then be able to pass out of it. Immortality sounds great at first but I think that actually living that long in a fallen world would certainly take it’s toll and be much less glamorous after a few centuries.
    "I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend," Faramir in TTT by JRRT.

  6. #6
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    Both very good alternative approaches Sternwood (no sir, your name suggests rather a legitimate lore-Ent and your style complies with it) and Wilros
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  7. #7
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    I always assumed it was simply because he desired to become a king.

    Great writing BTW
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jewl_of_the_lake View Post
    I am not aware if ages were given of Elros and Elrond when they were taken by Maglor and his elder brother. It could be they were older than some readers think and was closer to his father, who would have chosen the Gift of Men had his wife not chosen the life of the Eldar. I think I read somewhere can't remember now that said Elros and Elrond may not have been twins. If someone has that source feel free to correct me.
    According to the Timeline of Arda (I don't have access to the books at the moment), Elros and Elrond were born in 532 of the Years of the Sun in the First Age. Eärendil started his long voyages only two years later, and the Third Kinslaying happened in 538. So the twins would have been only six years old when they last saw their mother, and even younger when they last saw their father.

    That's why I speculate that, raised by Maedhros and Maglor, they would both be naturally drawn to the elf race.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sternwood View Post
    When the Edain were rewarded for their efforts against Morgoth with the Kingdom of Númenor, I guess it made a lot of sense to look to a common leader, and there was no choice more obvious than to look to Elros and Elrond. But it would also stand to reason, that one could not declare oneself an Elf, and then legitimately lead a Kingdom which by its very nature is a celebration of Mankind. So whichever one of them decided to take up the crown of Númenor, would need to choose a mortal life, for the sake of common decency. It was a sacrifice, to consolidate the new Kingdom of Man.

    ...from that perspective, one might even want to turn the question 180-degrees: Why did Elrond decide to be an Elf, when there was a need for someone to lead the newly formed Kingdom to glory? He could have done much good for Númenor, but chose instead to spend his time as a military commander under Gil-Galad.
    I like this idea of him doing it as a sacrifice, out of a sense of pity for the Edain and a desire to help them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilros View Post
    Another perspective on this would be that the Doom of Men as it was later referred to, or their mortality, was originally known as the Gift of Men. I believe it was known as a gift because the elves were bound to Arda, and due to the marring of the world by Melkor, their long lives would eventually leave the elves filled with sorrow (hence all the ‘grey is the shadow upon my heart’ stuff you hear from elves). From this perspective, it was considered a blessing or a gift to be released from Arda through death and to no longer carry these burdens.

    Therefore, we can speculate that Elros wanted to labour for a while longer in Arda, and then be able to pass out of it. Immortality sounds great at first but I think that actually living that long in a fallen world would certainly take it’s toll and be much less glamorous after a few centuries.
    This is a good idea, too, if you consider that Elros (even though he was not 100 years old yet) might have been touched by the tragic events he had experienced, namely the Kinslaying and the War of Wrath.

    Thank you all for the discussion, and for your kind words about my writing!
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  9. #9
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    Perhaps because he was one of the Race of Men before being given the choice. He would need a reason to change.
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  10. #10
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    For the sake of humanity!

    Also he was more like a man than an elf, possibly proud of the human race

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferdinanda View Post
    So Elrond chose to be numbered among the elves, along with his mother and father, and the sons of Fëanor who basically raised him, until the War of Wrath. Why in Arda did his brother choose differently? I wrote a possible explanation, but maybe others have better ones.
    Earendil considered himself as belonging to the race of Men, and Elros felt likewise. The Edain kind of get the short end of the stick in the Legendarium, But Hurin, Turin, Beren and Tuor are all great heroes in their own right and perhaps Earendil and Elros felt that worth honoring.

  12. #12
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    What is up with all these question which is clearly written in the book.

    Elros chose to be human for the sake of humanity, for the sacrifizes of Beren and Luthien and Edains struggles in the wars.
    [CENTER][COLOR=#008080]Chains of insanity [/COLOR][COLOR=#fff0f5]- [/COLOR][COLOR=#800080]Doom of GY Reborn [/COLOR]-[COLOR=#ff0000] FOTM[/COLOR] - [COLOR=#0000ff]WotGE[/COLOR] -[COLOR=#40e0d0] The [/COLOR][COLOR=#00ffff]Fancy Lads
    [/COLOR][COLOR=#ee82ee]Retired from LOTRO[/COLOR]

    [/CENTER]

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiorEluchil View Post
    What is up with all these question which is clearly written in the book.

    Elros chose to be human for the sake of humanity, for the sacrifizes of Beren and Luthien and Edains struggles in the wars.
    I *think* the passage you are referring to is this:

    Then Eärendil said to Elwing: 'Choose thou, for now I am weary of the world'. And Elwing chose to be judged among the Firstborn Children of Ilúvatar, because of Lúthien; and for her sake Eärendil chose alike, though his heart was rather with the kindred of Men and the people of his father. -The Silmarillion, 1977 American ed., pp. 249-50.

    I guess I didn't make my point very well. Yes, Eärendil felt closer to his Man heritage than to his Elven one, and yes there were great heroes of the Edain that Elros no doubt admired. But in the end Eärendil chose to be counted with the Elves for love of his wife, his family-- my question is why Elros didn't choose like his father did.

    In The Silmarillion it merely states Elros' choice, with no discussion. I guess my question comes from being a member of a family with pretty strong ties to each other. So just to say, "Elros felt more like a Man" doesn't persuade me. But of course, that's all the Professor wrote, so the rest is just speculation.
    Last edited by ferdinanda; May 17 2013 at 11:10 AM.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by ferdinanda View Post
    I *think* the passage you are referring to is this:




    I guess I didn't make my point very well. Yes, Eärendil felt closer to his Man heritage than to his Elven one, and yes there were great heroes of the Edain that Elros no doubt admired. But in the end Eärendil chose to be counted with the Elves for love of his wife, his family-- my question is why Elros didn't choose like his father did.

    In The Silmarillion it merely states Elros' choice, with no discussion. I guess my question comes from being a member of a family with pretty strong ties to each other. So just to say, "Elros felt more like a Man" doesn't persuade me. But of course, that's all the Professor wrote, so the rest is just speculation.
    Ah the luthien part i got from that but Im pretty sure I read something about elros choice in one of Tolkiens letters...
    [CENTER][COLOR=#008080]Chains of insanity [/COLOR][COLOR=#fff0f5]- [/COLOR][COLOR=#800080]Doom of GY Reborn [/COLOR]-[COLOR=#ff0000] FOTM[/COLOR] - [COLOR=#0000ff]WotGE[/COLOR] -[COLOR=#40e0d0] The [/COLOR][COLOR=#00ffff]Fancy Lads
    [/COLOR][COLOR=#ee82ee]Retired from LOTRO[/COLOR]

    [/CENTER]

 

 

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