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Thread: Mini Maxing

  1. #1

    Mini Maxing

    Hey all! I play a minstrel as my main and since he's my only toon my kin uses in raids, I decided to "mini-max" him this update rather than split my time up over four 85 toons. I figured if I'm only going to raid with him, I might as well deck him out as much as possible.

    I'm wondering how many others are doing the same with their minis and what might I be missing out on. I'm not on the right computer at the moment (at school) but I'll load up some screenshots of my build and swap books, armor sets, etc. once I get home and take the screenshots and update this post with my build . I'm also interested in other people's mastery, crit, mits (though most people's are capped or close), resistance and things like relics and legacies. Did you choose the 4 Hytbold/2 Erebor set, maybe the 2 Erebor/2 Greater Erebor/ 2 gold items? I wanna know it all



    The pic above shows my swap books, the rings I wear when I am healing, the CtG set from OD and my healing book and sword. My healing sword is still a 75 2nd ager but I'll be upgrading it soon. I gotten into swapping LI's around so I've put all my CD legacies on my swap items to make room for other things (sometimes only stat legs but every little bit helps). I've also put the inc healing debuff settings on both for pvp since they stack and put on mastery relics to mitigate the losses in healing on hots that pop up while swapping.




    Above is the basic build I run around with. I've turned my brain to mush trying to get the school/library ring (300+ runs so far) and haven't had any luck. I'm also trying to get the Horse-Lord's gold pocket item. As for the items I didn't link in the pic (for lack of room) they are as follows:

    Bracelets: 162 Will 463 Morale 816 Crit
    Pocket:150 Will 75 Vitality and 384 Crit
    Rings Sunbrand Sage and Wyrmfire Sage
    Shield Malledhrim Minstrel's Shield

    All the screenshots are without external or internal buffs.
    Last edited by xmorzan; Apr 19 2013 at 01:44 PM.
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

    SnH Landroval

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    174
    Im not home aswell, but will post my build when im back home..

    What i aim for is high morale, high crit raiting with mitigations maxed out.
    Tactical mastery is just bonus comming with all the will gear.

    Im running 4 hytbold, with the reversed gloves (OD gloves) and the horse-lord helm

    atm i am around these numbers:

    11,300 morale
    34000 Tactical Mastery (around 53\54% outgoing healing)
    9300 Critical raiting
    36% Physical Mitigations
    40% Tactical mitigations
    2800 Will
    1000 Vitality

    Gear:

    2x Blackened Silver Earringhttp://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item...Silver_Earring
    2x Willfull Horse-lord bracelet http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item...he_Horse-lords
    1x Ring of the honorable minstrel http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item...rable_Minstrel
    1x Mooncandle Menders ring of rohan http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item..._Ring_of_Rohan
    1x Glimmering beryl prism http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item...ng_Beryl_Prism
    1x Unearthed Iron shield http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item...ed_Iron_Shield

    Reserved minstrel`s gloves http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Item%3ARevered_Minstrel's_Glov es
    Ancient circlet of the horse-lord
    Shoulders: Shoulderpads of the Erebor Watcher
    Chest: Jacket of the Hytbold Watcher
    Legs: Leggings of the Hytbold Watcher
    Feet: Boots of the Erebor Watcher
    Last edited by NImlonda; Apr 19 2013 at 06:32 AM.

  3. #3
    I'll be eagerly awaiting your screenshots, my minstrel has been 85 for a while now but I've had little time to play her and have a low amount of knowledge regarding gear for will classes.

    Mastery/Mitigations/Crit comes very easily with even low end gear however I am slacking greatly on my morale, I do need to finish my relics though which should help a lot.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    252
    Stats (completely unbuffed):
    HP: 7.4k
    Will: 2517
    Vitality: 733
    Crit: 8.6k (18.8%)
    Tact. Mastery: 33.7k (62.2% OH)
    Phys. Mitigation: 7.7k (34.4%)
    Tactical Mitigation: 10.3k (39.5%)

    Stats (self buffed):
    HP: 8.2k
    Will: 2500
    Vitality: 1011
    Crit: 8.6k (18.8%)
    Tact. Mastery: 34.5k (62.9% OH)
    Phys. Mitigation: 11.4k (41%)
    Tactical Mitigation: 15.8k (40%)

    Gear:
    Head: Helm of the Hytbold Watcher
    Shoulders: Shoulderpads of the Erebor Watcher
    Chest: Jacket of the Hytbold Watcher
    Hands: Gloves of the Hytbold Watcher
    Legs: Leggings of the Hytbold Watcher
    Feet: Boots of the Erebor Watcher
    Back: Cloak of Hidden Knowledge
    Shield: Weathered Oak Buckler

    Pocket: Charred Armour Fragments
    Necklace: Tactical Necklace of Eomer
    Ear 1: Blackened Silver Earring
    Ear 2: Blackened Silver Earring
    Wrist 1: Uloga's Golden Bangle
    Wrist 2: Uloga's Golden Bangle
    Finger 1: Mooncandle Sage's Ring of Rohan
    Finger 2 : Wyrmfire Sage's Ring of Rohan

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    Norway
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    how can u have that high outgoing healing with the same amount of tactical mastery as i have ?
    Are u adding the 10% from hytbold over your outgoing healing ?
    As there are dimishing returns and so on.. u wont actually get +10%, its nearly 6-7% extra.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    252
    Quote Originally Posted by NImlonda View Post
    how can u have that high outgoing healing with the same amount of tactical mastery as i have ?
    Are u adding the 10% from hytbold over your outgoing healing ?
    As there are dimishing returns and so on.. u wont actually get +10%, its nearly 6-7% extra.
    Yes I'm adding the Hytbold Watcher bonus.

    Isn't it +10% outgoing healing that stacks with your current outgoing healing? Diminishing returns only affect rating-based stats, not direct % increases. If it doesn't stack that means it works differently from every other bonus in the game...

    But I haven't actually used that set yet, since I only completed Smaug yesterday (was wearing 4 Song-Protector + 2 Watcher until now). But it's what I plan on buying this afternoon once I get home.
    Last edited by Rhaphael; Apr 19 2013 at 06:58 AM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    Norway
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    It does not add directly upon the outgoing healing.

    (Example: If u have 40% outgoing healing, and then u slot 4 pieces. U dont automaticly get 50% outgoing healing)
    Done alot of testing and the diffrence i have seen is a 6-7% gain in each skill. Which ofcourse is a nice set-bonus still.

    For BfE t2 challenge i run with 2 lesser and 2 Greater erebor armour to gain 10% crit chance. Guess there is some kind of dimishing return here aswell, tho i cant really sort that one out

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    252
    Quote Originally Posted by NImlonda View Post
    It does not add directly upon the outgoing healing.

    (Example: If u have 40% outgoing healing, and then u slot 4 pieces. U dont automaticly get 50% outgoing healing)
    Done alot of testing and the diffrence i have seen is a 6-7% gain in each skill. Which ofcourse is a nice set-bonus still.

    For BfE t2 challenge i run with 2 lesser and 2 Greater erebor armour to gain 10% crit chance. Guess there is some kind of dimishing return here aswell, tho i cant really sort that one out
    So you look at your skill tooltips and see a 6-7% increase? That means it DOES add directly to your outgoing healing.

    Say you have a skill with a base healing of 1000
    With 40% OH this skill will do 1000 x 1.4 = 1400 healing
    If the Hytbold set adds directly to your OH, your OH should become 50% and the skill should do 1000 x 1.5 = 1500 healing
    1500/1400 = 1,07 or a 7% increase

    In my case my OH would go from 52% to 62% so 1620/1520=1,065 or a 6.5% increase.

    Conclusion: When looking at your tooltips you see an increase of 6-7% which is expected if the set works as advertised and adds directly to your OH. Although from your posts I understand the set doesn't update the OH stat on your char sheet, which can be confusing.
    Last edited by Rhaphael; Apr 19 2013 at 09:57 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by NImlonda View Post
    It does not add directly upon the outgoing healing.

    (Example: If u have 40% outgoing healing, and then u slot 4 pieces. U dont automaticly get 50% outgoing healing)
    Done alot of testing and the diffrence i have seen is a 6-7% gain in each skill. Which ofcourse is a nice set-bonus still.

    For BfE t2 challenge i run with 2 lesser and 2 Greater erebor armour to gain 10% crit chance. Guess there is some kind of dimishing return here aswell, tho i cant really sort that one out
    Your slightly confused I think. the out going healing stacks, 40% from tactical mastery + 10% from Hybold, is exactly the same as a straight up 50% from tactical mastery. The diminishing returns comes from the fact OGH multiplies the base heal. Example:

    Your base heal is 100.
    You have an OGH of 85% (50% tactical mastery, 20% ballads, 5% 2set bonus, 10% 4 set bonus), so the applied heal is 185.
    You equip the Hybold armour
    You have and OGH of 95%, so the allied heal is 195.

    The real terms increase to your healing is 100 x (195-185)/185 which is 5.4%.

    FYI the general formula for OGH and OGD:

    real terms %increase = change_%Mod/(100+current_%Mod)

    For crit chance its a bit more complicated (and only works for healing, which doesn't deverstate):

    real terms % increase = 100 * crit_chance_mod(crit_multiplie r - 1)/(1 - crit_chance_original + [crit_chance_original * crit_multiplier])

    where everything is in decimal form, so a 20% crit chance is 0.2 and if a crit does an extra 50% healing the crit_multipier is 1.5.
    Last edited by 00CloughRN; Apr 19 2013 at 10:12 AM.
    “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Norway
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    When u hoover over the tactical mastery in your character panel it does not add the 10% outgoing healing.
    It applies the +10% healing rather as a buff. Same rate as your ballads adds healing.

    My way of explaining myself is abit confusing from time to time, so sorry for that
    Last edited by NImlonda; Apr 19 2013 at 10:45 AM.

  11. #11
    Think we're all on the same page really

    Stats Fully Buffed (from memory).
    HP: ~11k
    Will: ~3000
    Vitality: ~750
    Crit: ~11k (22%)
    Tact. Mastery: ~(56% OGH)
    Phys. Mitigation: 40%
    Tactical Mitigation: 40%
    Crit Defence: 30%

    Gear for a typical erebor raid cluster T2:
    Head: Greater Helm of the Erebor Watcher
    Shoulders: Shoulderpads of the Erebor Watcher
    Chest: Annúminas Minstrel's Robe
    Hands: Revered Minstrel Gloves
    Legs: Greater Leggings of the Hytbold Watcher
    Feet: Boots of the Erebor Watcher
    Back: Sheer Spider-silk Cloak (scuttledens)
    Shield: can't remember.

    Pocket: Majestic Alabaster Figurine (OD disease, so good for crit defence)
    Necklace: Erebor gold recipe
    Ear 1: Blackened Silver Earring
    Ear 2: Blackened Silver Earring
    Wrist 1: Uloga's Golden Bangle
    Wrist 2: Uloga's Golden Bangle
    Finger 1: Mooncandle Sage's Ring of Rohan
    Finger 2 : Wyrmfire Sage's Ring of Rohan

    For easier stuff I switch out some of my crit defence gear. If I remember... Really the only thing on my wish list is the Arthedain Scholar's Tattered Cloak.
    “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  12. #12
    Very nice builds What about swap sets though? Do you guys have any others that you like to use? For me the Call to Greatness set from OD is a must and I'll sometimes use the Moors healing set to remove debuffs off of fellowship members. Other than that I can't really think of much else.
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

    SnH Landroval

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by xmorzan View Post
    Very nice builds What about swap sets though? Do you guys have any others that you like to use? For me the Call to Greatness set from OD is a must and I'll sometimes use the Moors healing set to remove debuffs off of fellowship members. Other than that I can't really think of much else.

    Yeah, OD is very nice. Alas I think somebody said 2 OD, 4 GEreborSP is broken
    There are a few other potentials although no real stand outs:
    2 Thelin + (2 Ettenmoors) OP SoS, I think works. 50% healing is better than 10% Healing/5%crit (shock) + condition removal.
    4 Thelin proactive. IF is a 30s buff, on a 5s cooldown, so you can get an extra 2% damage reduction quite easily.
    2OD + 2 Hytbold - 10s piercing cry(assuming WS), very niche usage given I think you are sacrificing too much DPS with the OD set to make sense for damage, but potential usage as an interrupt spam, putting you up there with the best of them. Not so good for stun spam given 5s stun + 10s resulting immunity means you want a 15s cooldown.
    “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by 00CloughRN View Post
    Yeah, OD is very nice. Alas I think somebody said 2 OD, 4 GEreborSP is broken
    There are a few other potentials although no real stand outs:
    2 Thelin + (2 Ettenmoors) OP SoS, I think works. 50% healing is better than 10% Healing/5%crit (shock) + condition removal.
    4 Thelin proactive. IF is a 30s buff, on a 5s cooldown, so you can get an extra 2% damage reduction quite easily.
    2OD + 2 Hytbold - 10s piercing cry(assuming WS), very niche usage given I think you are sacrificing too much DPS with the OD set to make sense for damage, but potential usage as an interrupt spam, putting you up there with the best of them. Not so good for stun spam given 5s stun + 10s resulting immunity means you want a 15s cooldown.

    The Thelin set is interesting, but it'd require a lot of swapping around that I would fail at (no macros). I'm still adjusting to swapping out my book and sword for the CD's.

    When I'm dpsing in pve I use the 2 set moors for the 7% ballad damage, the 2 set Hytbold song protector for 5% ballad and coda damage and the gold helm and chest pieces. I should look for a good set bonus to replace the gold pieces but just haven't done it yet. :/
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

    SnH Landroval

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    4
    One little question on the side: why would you choose gear (e.g. the Annuminas Golden Robe or golden Rohan rings) with a bonus, which procs only on harmful skills? Is there something obvious that I'm missing?

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamortin View Post
    One little question on the side: why would you choose gear (e.g. the Annuminas Golden Robe or golden Rohan rings) with a bonus, which procs only on harmful skills? Is there something obvious that I'm missing?
    The reason I do it is I've found that I have the bonuses up quite a lot of the time even when healing, thanks to CoV and NC/HS and a fair number of damaging ballads I use.

    That said I'm still not sure they are the best option. Certainly I should attempt to get the gold ring from sch/lib, but the thought doesn't enthuse me.
    “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    GV camping
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    Hm, seems like most people use OD gloves in their main builds. I use 4 hytbold, 2 greater erebor (10% healing, 5% crit) and swap OD golves in along with my buff book when ever I use AoW.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by alpha1445 View Post
    Hm, seems like most people use OD gloves in their main builds. I use 4 hytbold, 2 greater erebor (10% healing, 5% crit) and swap OD golves in along with my buff book when ever I use AoW.
    If I had to guess, I'd say that your 4 hytbold and 2 erebor is probably the best for healing. I have erebor/greater erebor for the 10% crit healing and then conveniently have 2 gold for the other pieces. However, in good hands, most of the setups here can perform whatever healing is needed for this raid cluster so I think there's a lot of room to customize a build you like and succeed.
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

    SnH Landroval

 

 

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