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  1. #1

    Spider Strats vs Freeps

    I'd like to hear what other spiders use as strats for specific classes in 1vs1s. I'll try and compile the different strats people post into a user friendly format after we get some good ones. This is simply as a resource for those of us looking to fine tune skills.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    I'd like to hear what other spiders use as strats for specific classes in 1vs1s. I'll try and compile the different strats people post into a user friendly format after we get some good ones. This is simply as a resource for those of us looking to fine tune skills.
    Specifics will vary based on class, but for most classes this is very useful: If you open with an improved daze, most freeps will burn their stun pot. Wait 5 seconds after they clear the stun then apply latent poison. This will ensure that the diminishing returns reset and the stun will be full duration (5 seconds if they are in audacity gear). As soon as this stun ends you can reapply your improved daze; it goes right through red dot stun immunity and the way diminishing returns works, they will be locked down for an additional 5 seconds. Depending on the class you're fighting you can use this time to DPS, debuff or move out of their preferred range.


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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    I'd like to hear what other spiders use as strats for specific classes in 1vs1s. I'll try and compile the different strats people post into a user friendly format after we get some good ones. This is simply as a resource for those of us looking to fine tune skills.
    what are you doing playing creep class man!! stick to your warden dood anyway spiders are super easy to 1v1 with noob. dot, dot, burrow, call in the zerg, wait for them to kill the freep, unburrow and corpse jump. win! works everytime.

    .

  4. #4
    Though not for a 1v1, if you are alone and several noob freeps spot you, Lie in Wait and go get a drink and laugh as they way for your long burrow.

    Pretty much CC, dot, kite, rinse and repeat. All else fails, call in a zerg!

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by ushalnotpas View Post
    what are you doing playing creep class man!! stick to your warden dood anyway spiders are super easy to 1v1 with noob. dot, dot, burrow, call in the zerg, wait for them to kill the freep, unburrow and corpse jump. win! works everytime.

    .
    Holy &&&&. Dafuq you been! Check your inbox scrub.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by vertigo07 View Post
    I'd like to hear what other spiders use as strats for specific classes in 1vs1s. I'll try and compile the different strats people post into a user friendly format after we get some good ones. This is simply as a resource for those of us looking to fine tune skills.
    Here is a list of what I do in 1v1s vs the average player-------Disclaimer* may not work based on build, play style, or your opponent*. What there are some fights that I do not use all I have(skills) because they are not needed.

    Burg: Your easiest opponent. Basically just make sure you keep/stack poison spray up at all times then do any combination of TK, MK, PA, LK, DD, Virulent that you could ever want. Notes: I do not use reflect or catch prey against the average burg; against the strongest burgs I will use 1 or the other and it will change depending on my mood. Also, save your stun pot for startling twist.

    Champ: Try to start with your mez, put up necrosis, clinging, entangling, and catch prey. (Note: you now have 3 ensnared). I also like to put up venemous haze with melee pet debuff for +5% damage. Stack up to 5 pips making sure you always have TK, MK, and PA bleeds up when at 5 pips for max dps. At this point you should be down about 2k morale yourself, use drink deep as often as you can to keep morale up. Then immediately hit envenom and reapply your dots at full pips. At this point due to rank, I like to try and gain some ground so I lay down webbing (normally they his sprint which is fine). Continue through your rotation using drink deep, and so on. Make sure you apply latent whenever you will get the full benefit 5s after your previous mez/stun to bypass 20s DR. Use reflect when they pop bubble and continue do slowly burn them down. Use mez and latent to reapply entangling/clinging and rebuild ensnared.

    Guardian: No explanation needed, just kill it and be done.

    Loremaster: Tricky one, you can either win or you have no chance at all. Make sure your induction debuff is on AT ALL TIMES. I use the melee pet as it's more durable and the poison cloud helps ever so slightly. Basically just try to avoid inductions by running through the LM, If you notice SI is going to be down you MUST time your CC perfectly. <15s on SI put on latent, if they pot the stun or it doesn't go off, use shadows bite to interrupt(especially water lore whenever you can). If they dont have SI just try to CC lock them as much as you can while keeping as many dots on as you can. Once they put ancient craft on you, wait 1-2 seconds to see what they do with it, then depending hit toxic carapace at full pips. I have killed a R11 LM with his own lightning storm by 1 shotting himself with it.

    Minstrel: It's really up to the minstrel whether or not you win. 1. Their heals far outheal your dps. 2. If they want they can just heal and run or slowly kill you. 3. If you have the faintest possibility of beating even an average mini, it will be through CC locking and a drink deep crit for 2.4k+.

    RK: Healing RK, not possible. DPS RK, doesn't exist on Vilya.

    Warden: I have found wardens to be fairly easy if they aren't blue traited, if they are-you will not win if they are anything but afk. Mez, entangling, clinging, catch prey. If they are in ranged stance move into melee range, if they are in tanking stance, immediately hit webbing and get out of melee range (call back pet if you have to) keep them at range with CC and keep highest tier dots up at all times.

    Hunter: Get into melee range and you win

    Captain: Same as guards

    If anyone would like me to elaborate on any area or specifics let me know and I will edit.

    Ultimately, the best way to get strats is for you to try and develop your own because it's what you are comfortable with that will help you succeed. You must be familiar with your rotation based on class and even alter if based on your opponent.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    GoodStuff
    Can you also elaborate on trait setups for each strategy and possible variances with explinations?
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Exion_Blade View Post
    Can you also elaborate on trait setups for each strategy and possible variances with explinations?
    What I have mainly been running around with is a dps build because freep mits are high, their healing is high, and you will not out live them even traited survivability.

    That being said, I modified a full dps build for a little more survivability with morale: 3 crit rating boosts, Health for Power 2, 1 mastry, and 1 Damage for Power 2. At R13 this puts me at 16,500 morale. It is a squishy build, but dots do crit quite often and for a good amount. I run this build virtually all the time solo and since U10 all I have done is solo. This build can do everything explained in my strat, but I'm sure other builds can still be just as good depending how you wish to play.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    What I have mainly been running around with is a dps build because freep mits are high, their healing is high, and you will not out live them even traited survivability.

    That being said, I modified a full dps build for a little more survivability with morale: 3 crit rating boosts, Health for Power 2, 1 mastry, and 1 Damage for Power 2. At R13 this puts me at 16,500 morale. It is a squishy build, but dots do crit quite often and for a good amount. I run this build virtually all the time solo and since U10 all I have done is solo. This build can do everything explained in my strat, but I'm sure other builds can still be just as good depending how you wish to play.
    This is very similar to my favorite build.

    I will say, the crit protection traits are broken in terms of how little they help.


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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    More Good Stuff
    Thank you.
    +rep
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    good stuff
    What would you do against a burg with not top tier aud (have 7 atm) and pots are not used in 1v1 situations?
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  12. #12
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delmore View Post

    I noticed your rk section was a little lacking.

    Your 20m ideal range is a bit misleading, not a bad idea but generally only useful if you can get VH to stick. Being in melee range is honestly just as effective as being at range for the most part (again unless you get VH to stick).

    Some notes, CC against an rk is important, it keeps their atunement off balance, fears, latent, and the mezz are crucial as it gives you some space to dps and the rk will be forced to pop off a few healing skills in order to bring things in order, thus throwing off their atunement. In most scenarios you should have more than enough health to survive the onslaught after perfect imagery once they reach that point, I would suggest popping TC (preferriably the full 15s) if you can't get the full 15s utilize your mezz and fear to run out the duration of PI and your pet heal if need be (if its still alive) and reflecting the dmg back if they don't notice TC go up, otherwise enjoy a session of free DPS if they notice TC and do not attack.

    Clinging webs is also important as a rks dps is based off how quickly they build attunement. The extra attack duration is a noticeable difference and the extra stack of entangle helps to bring back your venom pips when you TC for perfect imagery.

    Pet: I would suggest the ranged pet as it stays out of perfect imagery's range and does not get mezzed (pets receive full duration mezzes and roots) and could become a problem if you need the heal asap. I usually hide my pet off to the side somewhere if i get the opportunity before the fight and bring it in later once their attention is focused on me or i need the heal. If they turn on the pet once i bring it in, i usually go ahead and snag the heal, which is another reason i hide it, to make the most use of the heal if the options become the rk killing it or myself consuming it. Also having the pet in the fight from the beginning allows them to build their atunement while not building up your mits from born of shadow, once the pet is dead they can turn on you and hit their big dps skills doing a considerable amount more damage.

    If you run into an rk that spams scribe a new ending, fear not because this is off setting their atunement by a large amount and most of your skills have pretty short CDs.

    If you need to burrow I wouldnt suggest waiting the full duration, about 10s should be more than enough to bring your health back to a respectable level. If you wait to long then the rk will have themselves back at full health and you'll be starting the fight all over, minus your pet, any pots or brands you've used.

    I'm sure all of that could be worded better but have to get the work, but the advice is there take it as you will
    Last edited by Daec; Apr 13 2013 at 05:56 PM.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerglor View Post
    What would you do against a burg with not top tier aud (have 7 atm) and pots are not used in 1v1 situations?
    If I were a spider with 7 aud it would make the fight significantly more difficult. As I stated though, make sure poison sprat is up at all times, and you use it whenever you can as the dots stack. I would go more of a kiting strat as once the burg gets you in melee you will probably be toast. If it's an unorganized 1v1 meaning the burg jumps you from stealth-a burg with max aud and hits somewhat hard, you will probably die, but your best bet is to get up poison spray, lay down webbing early so you have a good chunk of your morale to work with, put up TK, MK, necrosis. Normally I would add piercing attack, but as long as you can strafe around your webbing I would avoid melee. I wouldn't spend time using entangling or clinging, that'll probably get you killed. Use morale pot and eat pet if you have to. Use brand to gain some distance, use your reflect if you need(do it during his large dps burst). Obviously use catch prey for the whole fight. I would also use drink deep as much as you can if you are in melee range to keep morale up and if the burg isnt using evade, otherwise(range and/or has evade up) use virulent.

    If pots are not used in 1v1 situations then pigs must be flying or your server is completely @$$ backwards than mine...my strats are not for ORGANIZED 1v1s, but general strats should you come upon a class while running around.
    Last edited by tnak; Apr 13 2013 at 06:12 PM.
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  15. #15
    Have you got any more tips for a r6 spider(10 aud,2 crit cors HfD2 DfP1 DfP2 HfP2) vs r12 champ(12k morale full aud) who keeps breaking your cc with blood rage and continues to dps during reflect as he can full heal afterwards? pretty meh fight but anyway
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadeslayer_withywindle View Post
    Have you got any more tips for a r6 spider(10 aud,2 crit cors HfD2 DfP1 DfP2 HfP2) vs r12 champ(12k morale full aud) who keeps breaking your cc with blood rage and continues to dps during reflect as he can full heal afterwards? pretty meh fight but anyway
    First; get your audacity maxed. Expecting anything close to a fair fight before having this is misguided.

    Second, your rank is a handicap. Especially now that the champ in question is getting a significant boost to his morale and damage from his rank.

    Once you are higher rank, you will be able to fight him on more even footing. Having Shadow's Bite (melee ranged fear on an extremely short cooldown) will help you immensely.


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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    If I were a spider with 7 aud it would make the fight significantly more difficult. As I stated though, make sure poison sprat is up at all times, and you use it whenever you can as the dots stack. I would go more of a kiting strat as once the burg gets you in melee you will probably be toast. If it's an unorganized 1v1 meaning the burg jumps you from stealth-a burg with max aud and hits somewhat hard, you will probably die, but your best bet is to get up poison spray, lay down webbing early so you have a good chunk of your morale to work with, put up TK, MK, necrosis. Normally I would add piercing attack, but as long as you can strafe around your webbing I would avoid melee. I wouldn't spend time using entangling or clinging, that'll probably get you killed. Use morale pot and eat pet if you have to. Use brand to gain some distance, use your reflect if you need(do it during his large dps burst). Obviously use catch prey for the whole fight. I would also use drink deep as much as you can if you are in melee range to keep morale up and if the burg isnt using evade, otherwise(range and/or has evade up) use virulent.

    If pots are not used in 1v1 situations then pigs must be flying or your server is completely @$$ backwards than mine...my strats are not for ORGANIZED 1v1s, but general strats should you come upon a class while running around.
    Your server's burglars are slower on the uptake I guess. On my server, the pet gets instagibbed from stealth while we're riddled at the opening of the fight. If the burg is willing to burn cooldowns, he will beat a spider these days I'd say 80% of the time. This is primarily because of the current bug on web the earth robbing us of an extra 10s of the burglar slowed by 50%.


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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadeslayer_withywindle View Post
    Have you got any more tips for a r6 spider(10 aud,2 crit cors HfD2 DfP1 DfP2 HfP2) vs r12 champ(12k morale full aud) who keeps breaking your cc with blood rage and continues to dps during reflect as he can full heal afterwards? pretty meh fight but anyway
    What you have to realize is there may not be a "winning" rotation as a r6 spider vs r12 champ. Just as there is no chance for myself r13 to beat even a r0 mini who knows how to play somewhat...inferring the mini has audacity.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    Your server's burglars are slower on the uptake I guess. On my server, the pet gets instagibbed from stealth while we're riddled at the opening of the fight. If the burg is willing to burn cooldowns, he will beat a spider these days I'd say 80% of the time. This is primarily because of the current bug on web the earth robbing us of an extra 10s of the burglar slowed by 50%.
    My server used to have good burgs; now possibly 2 even only 1 really comes to mind when thinking of "good burg." But as stated in my original post, those strats were for the average skill player(freep). Not the elite. That being said, I still really have no issue vs any single burg or even 2 burgs...only way they win is if they hips, leave combat, eat, and attack again.

    ^^you may have seen his vids, Agonize is the only "good burg" i would say currently plays on vilya.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    My server used to have good burgs; now possibly 2 even only 1 really comes to mind when thinking of "good burg." But as stated in my original post, those strats were for the average skill player(freep). Not the elite. That being said, I still really have no issue vs any single burg or even 2 burgs...only way they win is if they hips, leave combat, eat, and attack again.

    ^^you may have seen his vids, Agonize is the only "good burg" i would say currently plays on vilya.
    We have a couple of burgs who start most arranged 1v1s out of stealth to make the fight more interesting for themselves.

    Well played burgs that gear swap are a holy terror this update. I do think the eventual web the earth fix will help. For arranged fights I highly recommend parking your pet 15-20m away from you before the fight starts so that they actually pay a price for blowing it up first.


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  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    We have a couple of burgs who start most arranged 1v1s out of stealth to make the fight more interesting for themselves.

    Well played burgs that gear swap are a holy terror this update. I do think the eventual web the earth fix will help. For arranged fights I highly recommend parking your pet 15-20m away from you before the fight starts so that they actually pay a price for blowing it up first.
    In 1v1s, our burgs also 1 shot my pet at the start while insisting on starting in stealth. I have yet to beat a good burg while he starts in stealth (which is always). I have tried parking my pet at a distance, but as you said with the WtE bug, it doesn't help much. They one shot my pet, break any root, mez, and are on top of me too soon after I break mez. At that point I am already slowed and soon to be stunned. Throw in gear swaps and I am dead quickly while barely damaging them. I'm currently traited dps, but I may try a survival build against them. I'm also going to try popping one of those anti slow/stun/root pots right before the fight starts. As a general rule for me, I do not pop TC in 1v1s. Against burgs, I may have to.
    .
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  22. #22
    Has it been confirmed that WtE is a bug? Is it not just working as intended?
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    Has it been confirmed that WtE is a bug? Is it not just working as intended?
    I've had it confirmed as a bug in a forum message. I would paste the message to the forums, but that is against the forum TOS without having prior permission from the person who sent the message. But it is indeed a bug, caused when they were updating the tech of ground based AOE effects.


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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by shark1979 View Post
    In 1v1s, our burgs also 1 shot my pet at the start while insisting on starting in stealth. I have yet to beat a good burg while he starts in stealth (which is always). I have tried parking my pet at a distance, but as you said with the WtE bug, it doesn't help much. They one shot my pet, break any root, mez, and are on top of me too soon after I break mez. At that point I am already slowed and soon to be stunned. Throw in gear swaps and I am dead quickly while barely damaging them. I'm currently traited dps, but I may try a survival build against them. I'm also going to try popping one of those anti slow/stun/root pots right before the fight starts. As a general rule for me, I do not pop TC in 1v1s. Against burgs, I may have to.
    Park the pet away from yourself.
    Not WHICH version of riddle you're being hit with. If it's normal riddle, you can break it with a root pot after 2 seconds, if it is improved you must wait 5. After you break the riddle, your pet is likely dead and the burg is either very close to you or on his way. Do not try to CC him. Catch prey him, Venomous haze him (for the fast pips) then work on keeping him facing your front side and try to mix in your melee fear as you can.

    You CAN make it a fight, as long as he doesn't burn TNG or KO. It just won't be easy. Expect to lose more than you win, and remind yourself that this is not a balanced update and hopefully U11 will be a bit better.


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  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by tnak View Post
    What you have to realize is there may not be a "winning" rotation as a r6 spider vs r12 champ. Just as there is no chance for myself r13 to beat even a r0 mini who knows how to play somewhat...inferring the mini has audacity.
    I didn't really ask for a rotation or a cookie cutter build or something.I was just hoping to read something along the lines of what it is suggested at the 2nd post; tactics and tips that highranked spiders have developed and would like to share,something that I,with my limited play time on spider havent thought yet.

    P.S Thx for the responses.Im aware how important audacity and rank are,or how OP freeps are in this update.having had to max audacity on 5 creeps and buy their skills,traits and pots makes my wallet empty most of the time.
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